Cire80:
As I'm typing this right now, I'm in a flat with up to 8 Ika people and two Igbo people from two different States and they don't understand what we're speaking. I asked them if they understood and honestly they don't. They're like strangers in our midst.

Our worldview and idiosyncrasies is very different.

That's becos u r a minority Bini in ika land... U r speaking Bini with stints of borrowed Igbo words

Chysler:
As for the origin of Obi which is even my surname from my great great grand father... You just did what everybody expected u to do... Whip up sentiments with no ideological backing to suit ur antagonism.

U claim obis are only used in Anioma influenced part of igboland and it is laughable cos in my part we are not in any way close to any of the river line Igbo or had any stint with Bini or Anioma... But our king is known by the obi title and we answer it as names in its kingship meaning form.

Debating this with you only makes one look stupid ...it is tantamount to debating wether the person posting this is alive or dead... It makes no sense

Don't mind him,
I'm from Etiti Imo State which is far from river line area, the halls or headquarters of every villages where titled/elder Igbo men gather to discuss village issues is called "Obi-ama"

Cire80:
well, I'm from Agbor and I don't understand what you mean by a priest in Ikwerre or Enugu being respected and feared in Agbor.

Every communal spiritual stuffs done in Agbor and all Ika is towards Edo especially the Esan area. If someone dies mysteriously, the family or community go for divination to know the cause of death. And many occasions too. Some Ika communities like Owa and others are good at necromancy as well. Even when someone is intimidated or offended and they want to report in a shrine, it's usually within Ika or Edo and nobody ever goes to the East for this.

All our major deities are originated from Edo. From Ogun(Idigun) to Olokun and several others. The Olokun priestesses are called Ohenre or Ihenre for plural Edo is Ohen. The major festivals are Edo. Where do you guys get your fables from?

In Urhobo-Isoko, such is called "Orhenre".

Cire80:
What's the meaning of Obi in Igbo then. I'm sure you know quite well that every word must not be translated word for word. OK, assuming Obi is an Igbo word, translate it let's see. The Last time I checked, I didn't see any reasonable meaning of Obi in Igbo that relates it to kingship. No non Anioma king uses the Obi title. Only recently I started seeing some writing something like Eze of so so and so, then something like Igwe then Obi on bracket before the name and this is because of the prestige attached to the Obi title. Then you And are you going to ignore the Ovie title which was also corrupted from Ovbie?

Point of correction! The title "OVIE" did not originate from '"OVBIE", rather it came from the Edo word "OGIE" meaning "KING".

Kirigidi:

In Urhobo-Isoko, such is called "Orhenre".

Yes, I've stayed in many Urhobo towns and it's the most significant and powerful cult in all Edo and Delta groups. The mode of worship in Urhobo and Anioma is exactly the same. They play the same role in the Kingdoms, the same dance pattern, the same Ododo color and white chalk. I've personally gone to watch the Ihenre Olukun in many Edo and Delta ethnic groups and they're all exactly the same thing. The same everything

Kirigidi:

Point of correction! The title "OVIE" did not originate from '"OVBIE", rather it came from the Edo word "OGIE" meaning "KING".

Yes, we've settled that. That postulations was made by an Edo man. He probably didn't know, I can't tell. But the Ogie version makes more sense.

Cire80:
As I'm typing this right now, I'm in a flat with up to 8 Ika people and two Igbo people from two different States and they don't understand what we're speaking. I asked them if they understood and honestly they don't. They're like strangers in our midst.

Our worldview and idiosyncrasies is very different.

It's important to know that a lot of Bini people/Edoid groups migrated to Anioma and settled with the original Igbo of these places, hence the occurrence of some Bini names and few remnants.

Oduduwaa:



You are saying this and another igbo guy is saying another..... Which do we believe now?

Bros there's an adage that says " igbo enwerro eze" no king in igbo land ,If I make good money today and the particular king of my village is no longer alive ,I can contest for the post of king ,nothing like royal blood in the east ,its based on influence

God forbid.
Let me make something clear edo has nothing to do with those people. They are simply conquered people and yes some if not most were slaves to the Benin kingdom so it's normal for them to adopt our cultural dressings and history. It irritates me to watch them dress like us and bear our names but what can I do?
Ika, anioma, igbanke or whatever, they're all igbos to me. Same with onitsha people they are igbos to me. The obi of onitsha however has Benin blood in him, he can claim Benin descent but not his people whom he met there, those ones are igbos.
Igbos now dress like Benin oba, they even say "ise" as amen thanks to Benin influence. They have no culture and no king, no history either. Our bronze snail shell dug up in abia state is what they have as proof of their civilisation, not knowing abia was a conquered land and was under the Benin kingdom you can research on that.

How I wish they can stop trying to assert themselves into our history. Same with that yoruba idiot that thinks you're a Benin man when you're obviously yoruba. I've never heard a Benin man call himself yoruba unless he is drunk.

Let Nigeria quickly dissolve so my people can be free. It was a curse to place civilised people in the midst of animals.

Monkeydeychop:
God forbid.
Let me make something clear edo has nothing to do with those people. They are simply conquered people and yes some if not most were slaves to the Benin kingdom so it's normal for them to adopt our cultural dressings and history. It irritates me to watch them dress like us and bear our names but what can I do?
Ika, anioma, igbanke or whatever, they're all igbos to me. Same with onitsha people they are igbos to me. The obi of onitsha however has Benin blood in him, he can claim Benin descent but not his people whom he met there, those ones are igbos.
Igbos now dress like Benin oba, they even say "ise" as amen thanks to Benin influence. They have no culture and no king, no history either. Our bronze snail shell dug up in abia state is what they have as proof of their civilisation, not knowing abia was a conquered land and was under the Benin kingdom you can research on that.

How I wish they can stop trying to assert themselves into our history. Same with that yoruba idiot that thinks you're a Benin man when you're obviously yoruba. I've never heard a Benin man call himself yoruba unless he is drunk.

Let Nigeria quickly dissolve so my people can be free. It was a curse to place civilised people in the midst of animals.

This lunatic again? You should be in a psychiatry.

Monkeydeychop:
God forbid.
Let me make something clear edo has nothing to do with those people. They are simply conquered people and yes some if not most were slaves to the Benin kingdom so it's normal for them to adopt our cultural dressings and history. It irritates me to watch them dress like us and bear our names but what can I do?
Ika, anioma, igbanke or whatever, they're all igbos to me. Same with onitsha people they are igbos to me. The obi of onitsha however has Benin blood in him, he can claim Benin descent but not his people whom he met there, those ones are igbos.
Igbos now dress like Benin oba, they even say "ise" as amen thanks to Benin influence. They have no culture and no king, no history either. Our bronze snail shell dug up in abia state is what they have as proof of their civilisation, not knowing abia was a conquered land and was under the Benin kingdom you can research on that.

How I wish they can stop trying to assert themselves into our history. Same with that yoruba idiot that thinks you're a Benin man when you're obviously yoruba. I've never heard a Benin man call himself yoruba unless he is drunk.

Let Nigeria quickly dissolve so my people can be free. It was a curse to place civilised people in the midst of animals.

Hahahahaha dunno why but I love this post!!

RedboneSmith:


Sigh.

If you had translated 'Ime Obi' for me, it would have aided this discussion. The 'obi' in 'Ime Obi' is not a person, is not 'a king'; it is a geographical location, and that is a very relevant point to note in all this. But I will come back to that.

Now to Ovbie. As far as I can ascertain, there is no word like that in Bini. The word is Ovbi, and it has nothing to do with kingship. It means child; no connotations of royalty whatsoever.

Ovie is not a corruption of this Ovbie (which is not even a true word to begin with; like I said the word is Ovbi.) Rather Ovie in Urhobo/Isoko is cognate with Ogie in Bini and Ojie/Oje in Esan. They all mean the same thing. Ovbie/Ovbi is not in the picture at all.

Note that I said 'cognate'. There was no borrowing involved. All these languages are related (Edoid languages), and as such inherited certain words in common from their common ancestor language (Proto-Edoid). Of course due to the linguistic phenomenon of sound shifts over the course of centuries, the 'j' in the Esan version of the word now varies as 'g' in Bini and 'v' in Urhobo and Isoko.


Coming to Obi. Based on this, if you want to claim that Obi came from Bini, then ovbi (child) is a very very weird source --- it did not even serve as the source in the Ovie example as you thought.

An Igbo origin for Obi is most plausible, although I will still give Anioma (more specifically Aniocha) credit for semantic innovation in the way the word came to be used in the Anioma area.

'Obi' (same intonation, same everything with Anioma 'Obi' ) in Igboland means the central building or court from which the head of a household, or the head of a kindred or a quarter or a clan lords it over his dependents. In loose terms, 'Obi' is a palace. Seeing any relationship with kingship yet? Referring to someone by something it is closely associated with is a common metonymic device, eg. Pharaoh = Great House.

When you understand that 'Obi' started out as a fixed place/location before it became a person, 'Ime Obi' begins to make sense.

man! you are intelligent, you really have strong knowledge of Edo languages and groups to understand these things

Oba of Bini is tantamount to village headmaster. Ordinary Eze Igbo of Jalingo is far more prominent that that small stool called oba of bini.

Cire80:
Are these kings Monarchies? And why is the Obi title only in Anioma and Kingdoms affiliated with Anioma. Could it be this?

If the Ovie title of the Urhobos was corrupted from this Edo word Ovbie, then it makes lots of sense that Obi was also from this same word. The Urhobos eliminated the letter B while the Aniomas eliminated the letters B, E

How can Ovbi be the same thing as Obi ? Na wa These Ika peeps sha !

Cire80:
It doesn't because all the parts of Anioma that has the Obi title don't use Obi in the sense you just elaborated it. All parts of Anioma that use the Obi title ie. Ika and Aniocha use Ogua, an Edo word, and not Obi. Which means if they wanted to use Palace as a title of their kings, they would automatically adopt Ogua as title. Obi means heart in Anioma but if the Edo word Ovbi which means child is not plausible as the origin of the title, if you consider the role the Oba played in the institution of Obi title, I don't see how see how heart will be. And the fact you elaborated on many possible meanings shows you're not sure of what you're saying. You're only guessing which one would be the possible origin of the title.

So you mean that "Obi (Ovbi)" of Onitsha translates to "Child" of Onitsha?
don't u think that the word Obi is a corruption of the word Oba?

AshiwajuFoward:


Ode Oshi. Look here Bini boy, I have no problem with you worshipping your useless oba of bini or whatever, but you DON'T have to PRETEND to be Yoruba to do that. There are enough of your fellows on here already doing same so you don't need a misleading moniker to get attention. REAL Yorubas are too proud to be promoting foreign kings like that useless oba of bini. The Ooni, Alaafin, Awujale, Owa Obokun, e.t.c are far greater than that useless bini king. Don't be ashamed to use an edo or bini moniker to promote your king. It's o.k, really.

Na wao, this one wan die for jealousy ooh

RedboneSmith:


Sigh.

If you had translated 'Ime Obi' for me, it would have aided this discussion. The 'obi' in 'Ime Obi' is not a person, is not 'a king'; it is a geographical location, and that is a very relevant point to note in all this. But I will come back to that.

Now to Ovbie. As far as I can ascertain, there is no word like that in Bini. The word is Ovbi, and it has nothing to do with kingship. It means child; no connotations of royalty whatsoever.

Ovie is not a corruption of this Ovbie (which is not even a true word to begin with; like I said the word is Ovbi.) Rather Ovie in Urhobo/Isoko is cognate with Ogie in Bini and Ojie/Oje in Esan. They all mean the same thing. Ovbie/Ovbi is not in the picture at all.

Note that I said 'cognate'. There was no borrowing involved. All these languages are related (Edoid languages), and as such inherited certain words in common from their common ancestor language (Proto-Edoid). Of course due to the linguistic phenomenon of sound shifts over the course of centuries, the 'j' in the Esan version of the word now varies as 'g' in Bini and 'v' in Urhobo and Isoko.


Coming to Obi. Based on this, if you want to claim that Obi came from Bini, then ovbi (child) is a very very weird source --- it did not even serve as the source in the Ovie example as you thought.

An Igbo origin for Obi is most plausible, although I will still give Anioma (more specifically Aniocha) credit for semantic innovation in the way the word came to be used in the Anioma area.

'Obi' (same intonation, same everything with Anioma 'Obi' ) in Igboland means the central building or court from which the head of a household, or the head of a kindred or a quarter or a clan lords it over his dependents. In loose terms, 'Obi' is a palace. Seeing any relationship with kingship yet? Referring to someone by something it is closely associated with is a common metonymic device, eg. Pharaoh = Great House.

When you understand that 'Obi' started out as a fixed place/location before it became a person, 'Ime Obi' begins to make sense.

There is one thing u people will never know about Edo language, if u are not and Edo man u will never understand and is the reason u will continue to be ignorance of any words dat sounds Edo, all de worlds u type here, the name ovbi/ovbie are both Benin names de way u analyses it is so wrong cos u are not an Edo and dere is know way u will understand how dose names are been used e.g Ovbiedo/Ovbi-edo meaning Edo child, Ovbioba/Ovbi-oba meaning King son

Ovbi or Ovbie both are Edo names

U no be Edo man so I don't expect u to understand

GodIsBiafran:
Oba of Bini is tantamount to village headmaster. Ordinary Eze Igbo of Jalingo is far more prominent that that small stool called oba of bini.

you must be an idiot, how Benin is a small stool is what I don't understand you guys tend to ignorantly mistake the city for the kingdom. You are not aware that there are several other Benin speaking villages and towns that makes up Edo south which the Benins are overwhelmingly domiciled in. I wish to educate that Edo south is made up of seven local government and it is two times bigger than anambra with 10700kilometres2 stretch. Sometimes when you say Benin is small I wonder how!. Hate him or love him, HE is the biggest traditional ruler from the south of Nigeria, he controlled more territories precolonially, and he is the most respected ruler from the south of Nigeria. There are only two monarchs in Nigeria, the sultan of sokoto from the north and the Oba of Benin from the south. This is a statement of fact and history!.

[img]https://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/2867291145?profile=RESIZE_1024x1024[/img]

Ofunwa111:


How can Ovbi be the same thing as Obi ? Na wa These Ika peeps sha !

[img]https://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/2867291145?profile=RESIZE_1024x1024[/img]

Jackonory:



[img]https://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/2867291145?profile=RESIZE_1024x1024[/img]

Translate "Ime Obi"

UGBE634:
[s]you must be an idiot, how Benin is a small stool is what I don't understand you guys tend to ignorantly mistake the city for the kingdom. You are not aware that there are several other Benin speaking villages and towns that makes up Edo south which the Benins are overwhelmingly domiciled in. I wish to educate that Edo south is made up of seven local government and it is two times bigger than anambra with 10700kilometres2 stretch. Sometimes when you say Benin is small I wonder how!. Hate him or love him, HE is the biggest traditional ruler from the south of Nigeria, he controlled more territories precolonially, and he is the most respected ruler from the south of Nigeria. There are only two monarchs in Nigeria, the sultan of sokoto from the north and the Oba of Benin from the south. This is a statement of fact and history!.[/s]

Arrant propagandist nonsense!

Atopeye