MrMaestro:


I stopped reading after this because it just shows how ignorant you are about not only Africa, but human society as a whole. If you were a student of history, you'd understand that the main reason africa is in this mess, is because the african has refused to internalize the fact that the main driver of a society from primitive to civilization, is a recording and teaching of history.

It is because africans don't teach our history, that this thread is extremely popular, many people DON'T know about Queen Amina, or Moremi. African teachers didn't record who where the major artisans who created beautiful bronze castings, or who they depicted. They didn't record HOW these artisans were able to smelt metal for these castings. African teachers DIDN'T record HOW the Dogon tribe were able to map the sirius B star system thousands of years prior to the invention of the telescope. African teachers didn't record and teach HOW the breakthroughs the Egyptians developed in maths and science came to be. It is the primitive oral tradition, and lack of appreciation for written history, that has damned the progress of the african. I as an african can't even find a specific document on how ife bronze casting was executed step by step. Why?

So you'r telling me history is not important, would the german american Einstein have POSSIBLY been able to develop the theory of relativity if he wasn't taught about the English Isaac Newton's general relativity? Would Edwin Hubble have made breakthroughs in Cosmology if he wasn't taught in school that the Prussian Nicolaus Copernius proved the sun is the center of our solar system and not the earth? The west didn't develop overnight, and they certainly didn't develop having the mentality of not exploring the history of europe. They developed by learning about their historical achievements, learning from them and building upon them.

That's why I label your statements very shortsighted and ignorant, and just plain stupid. You say that "Exploring African history means absolutely nothing unless we develop", when you fail to realize that they exploration of history is precisely what allows a society to develop. If no one is taught anything about what people achieved and discovered in history, every generation effectively starts from scratch instead of building upon what the previous generation accomplished. Which is the MAIN problem Africa faces today, which is why we're not getting anywhere. You also mention the Ancient egypts development of pyramids while failing to realize that they were actually one of the only african civilizations that had a written history which was used to teach multiple generations. Which is precisely why they stand above other ancient african empires to today.

LordAdam16:


Everything Africa had in the 15th and 16th centuries were given to the black Africans by their Arab masters. All those universities were Arabic universities and learned people were all Muslims colonized and given new identities by the Arabs.

Before the Arabs brought Islamic civilization to Africa, the rest of sub-Saharan Africa was a wasteland. The only part of Africa that had a semblance of activity was Egypt and allied smaller North African city states. The Romans (Europeans) sacked Ptolemy of Egypt who was a descendant of one of Alexander's generals (another European).

Before the Islamic Moors marched on Spain and Portugal, the Europeans had already marched on the Moors, Berbers, and other Meditteranean people of North Africa. The Roman Empire sacked Egypt and Carthage (the foremost Empires in Africa at the time, none of these Empires were black dominated. In fact blacks were often slaves in these Empires).

After the fall of the Roman Empire, then the Byzantines, Europe fell into the dark Ages, while Arabia progressed to have the Islamic Golden Age. It was during this Age that the Arabs conquered the formerly Roman colonized African Empires and gave the people their the Arabic identity that they have to this day. It is those colonized Arabic blacks that are the Moors who won wars in Portugal and Spain.

Before the dark Ages, Europe was the shining star of the world. Europe found their feet again during the Renaissance period. What about the black Muslim African so-called civilizations? They effed themselves off when the Arabic Golden Age ended starting with the Crusades.

Bini and Ife are insignificant and contributed nothing significant to the known world. You want to call the Bini and Ife when we have the Chinese, Japanese, Indian, Aztec, Incan civilizations. People that did not have a written language and could not even build a formidable navy when they were close to the sea.

Give Bini and Ife 3,000 years, they would never have been like Carthage not to talk of the Ancient Egyptian empire.

What exactly did the Europeans disrupt? Killing of twins, burying of slave heads with kings, paddling with canoe when the ancient Persians had 10,000 ship navies?

The Arabs and Europeans shone the light on sub-Saharan Africa. The Moors were Muslims and carried over Islamic traditions to Spain and Portugal. Every black man in ancient civilizations answered names and practiced the culture of the civilizations they adopted.

Black Africans have been running away from the poverty-, sickness-infested sub-Saharan Africa for over 6,000 years. They are still running away today. Go to the Sahara desert and the Mediterranean sea. Develop your land with resources available, don't form attache by force. Then claim to be superior to the people who gave you your identity.

Did the Europeans force your chiefs and kings to sell off POWs as slaves? Did any White man kidnap a black person in the villages to sell as slaves? What did the chiefs, kings, and slave merchants do with the money they were paid? This is how your black politicians steal and rob fellow black people, then you guys still have the guts to blame the West for under-development.

Black on Black violence has been a curse since the beginning of time. Even till this day and in advance America, black on black violence is higher than white on black violence. We hate ourselves. How do you hate yourself and ask someone to love you? Where is that done.

-Lord

Nowenuse:


Of course, i know Rosskii is trying to encourage us to wake up, increase our self esteem and believe we can make it.
I also think it is becoming more obvious that LordAdam16 and his likes are White people trying to dissuade/rubbish us or at least they are just some terrible self hating folks. They refused to acknowledge anything whatsoever not from anyone and continue their evil messages. I have challenged them and they cannot reply because they know they have ulterior motives.

I guess it's a challenge on us now. I think we may have to create an elightenment group or sort to drive our message to more black people. We have to form a school of thought to affect more of our people positively, cos i don't think debating and ending all these enlightenment here will make any substantial change in the real world. I myself was in complete darkness of this light of black history before and i must say i was liberated by the OP.

What do you say? Rosskii, Horus e.t.c

Nowenuse:


Of course i do believe you (or even say, believe in you).

I think we really need to teach our history more. It's just that there are 2 points of view pertaining to the possible outcome of emphasizing more on our history. You share one point of view and LordAdam16 and Braden2 share another point of view. Sadly, i can see reason with your own point of view and their own point of view and i think all we need to do is to strike a balance between both views, afterall we all want to see the progress of our race and people.

On your own part you feel that emphasizing on our great history will increase our black pride positively, give us a greater self esteem and cause us to wake up to our innate greatness and make the most of it for securing our future. I strongly agree with you.
WHILE on their own part they feel emphasizing on our history would be a slap on our face and a laughable irony considering the complete contradiction of our present state and the great history we wish to emphasize on. They feel that complacency or reliance on past glory could capture our minds and make us loose focus for the great task ahead and make us less productive or aspiring.
It's just 2 sides of the same coin which i do somehow agree with, hence my thought of us drawing a meeting point between both schools of thoughts.

LordAdam16 and Braden2, i hope you guys are hearing?

Pls guys, what we are all after at the end of the day is progress for our people, just that the approach differs.
The both of you however, you guys need to tone down your harshness a little bit, because i must confess (sorry to say) that a part of me is suspecting that you guys are not Black Africans because it seems like you guys feel the black race is so worthless and has never achieved anything since this world. Let's assume/agree that we have been the worst race since this world, does it mean at least that we have no single achievement to our name at all? It's just like always scolding a child whenever he goes wrong and never commending him when he does right. Thank you guys for your understanding.

LordAdam16:


Oga there is a sharp difference between achievement and supremacy.

Achievement is we did something. Supremacy is we are better than others.

Of course sub-Saharan Africans had beautiful art which is an achievement. But so did every other people around the world.

Supremacy is that we are better than others, and if that can be true for any race, it sure as hell is not black Africans. As individuals, black Africans are brilliant and rose to the pinnacle of several societies at different points in history. As a group, black supremacy is hogwash.

Let Africa develop, while we celebrate our achievements. Not start a stupid tirade called African Supremacy that is etched in lies.

Imagine these people saying China did not have an ancient civilization that was better than Bini and Ife. They tell obvious lies. That is how Hitler and Nazi Germany started. These people are racists. They are trying to start a black brand of KKK.

-Lord

Rosskii:
See what I said? You ignored how I destroyed your earlier claim that Asians developed first before embracing their history. After I mentioned their numerous cultural links to their past, you came up with this garbled response. I cannot debate you because you are dishonest and evasive. Regards.

Rosskii:
Honestly, you sound like you are on some sort of drugs. You need to go and learn how to participate in a debate. You seem to think that flooding the thread with loud, bombastic innuendo, and pompous but baseless and poorly researched assertions and lies, will somehow intimidate people into towing your line. But we are made of sterner stuff.

Nowenuse:


Of course, i know Rosskii is trying to encourage us to wake up, increase our self esteem and believe we can make it.
I also think it is becoming more obvious that LordAdam16 and his likes are White people trying to dissuade/rubbish us or at least they are just some terrible self hating folks. They refused to acknowledge anything whatsoever not from anyone and continue their evil messages. I have challenged them and they cannot reply because they know they have ulterior motives.

Braden2:
Everyone's laughing at Rossikki ,Rosskii .

i'll bookmark this thread and come back whenever I feel like laughing.

Rosskii:
Honestly, you sound like you are on some sort of drugs. You need to go and learn how to participate in a debate. You seem to think that flooding the thread with loud, bombastic innuendo, and pompous but baseless, poorly researched assertions and lies, will somehow intimidate people into towing your line. But we are made of sterner stuff.

Braden2:
My dad is from Oron Nigeria,my mom is white . I can pass for Italian. But you know, you're a delusional morron. Rosskii is a clown with low self esteem. I'm only trying to help.
can you refute the facts presented?

Nowenuse:


I admire your point of view. I also share your school of thought on Nigeria being the trail blazer or pace setter. However, with the structure of Nigeria today, it would be quite difficult for Nigeria to set such an example.
The colonial settings of Nigeria left it in such a way that it would be very easy for divisions to arise.

If i may ask you, can you exactly name one factor that unites the whole of Nigeria? Or one single reasonable shared heritage which Pan-Nigerians can propagate radically to convince all Nigerians the need for our sustained unity and promote our oneness? I seriously doubt there is, we have no linguistic, cultural, religious, geographical, ideological oneness.

Had it been Nigeria has a single large majority group, it would have been somewhat better where the majority would be expected to lead and others follow or at least dominated to follow, but no, Nigeria was formed on a tripod majority stand where 3 different majority groups are always seeking for domination and exaltation of their own group, not to talk of the 2 major opposing religious group who equally want to be in control at the same time and one exalts itself over the other, just like having many captains on one boat.
Sadly, this is almost the same situation in most other African countries, the reason why you see endless ethnic/religious clashes and contests for superiority and this is why i advocate for a united Black Africa or at least a united West Africa where there would be no reasonable or sellable forms of division by the agents of division to divide the people, nothing like majority or minority ethnic or religious groups and there would be a uniting factor (Black/African nationalism).

LordAdam16:


Seriously, he could simply have opened this thread with a more innocuous title like When the Moors conquered Spain and Portugal and Art depicting black people in pre-modern Europe. We'll understand and I'll be cheering him up.

But when they start bringing sh*t like African Supremacy when the same Moors that did the invasion was not answering a core African name like Adekunle but bearing an Arabic name Zayed, then they'd bring a lot of shot.

Look at the names of the black people he's sharing outside Spain and Portugal in pre-modern Europe, most of them are European names. You conquered people and you started answering their names. Why did the Europeans living in Nigeria not answer Nigerian names like Emeka, Musa, and Adewale.

Very soon he'll say English is an African language because the Knights of the Round table were all black.

Just look how they switched something so beautiful to something so hideous with lies and false narratives.

-Lord

LordAdam16:


Seriously, he could simply have opened this thread with a more innocuous title like When the Moors conquered Spain and Portugal and Art depicting black people in pre-modern Europe. We'll understand and I'll be cheering him up.

But when they start bringing sh*t like African Supremacy when the same Moors that did the invasion was not answering a core African name like Adekunle but bearing an Arabic name Zayed, then they'd bring a lot of shot.

Look at the names of the black people he's sharing outside Spain and Portugal in pre-modern Europe, most of them are European names. You conquered people and you started answering their names. Why did the Europeans living in Nigeria not answer Nigerian names like Emeka, Musa, and Adewale.

Very soon he'll say English is an African language because the Knights of the Round table were all black.

Just look how they switched something so beautiful to something so hideous with lies and false narratives.

-Lord

TheStronghold:


I've reached the same conclusion from my observation as well. LordAdam already stated that "Africans are filth", and braden2 stated he's also white. So on top of them saying baseless things, these just confirmed that they are to be ignored. So i've just chosen to ignored anything they say henceforth, and I advise others to do the same.

From 1931 to 1956, the Griaule studied the Dogon in field missions ranging from several days to two months in 1931, 1935, 1937 and 1938[29] and then annually from 1946 until 1956.[30] In late 1946, Griaule spent a consecutive thirty-three days in conversations with the Dogon wiseman Ogotemmêli, the source of much of Griaule and Dieterlen's future publications.[31] They reported that the Dogon believe that the brightest star in the sky, Sirius (sigi tolo or "star of the Sigui"[32]), has two companion stars, pō tolo (the Digitaria star), and ęmmę ya tolo, (the female Sorghum star), respectively the first and second companions of Sirius A.[33] Sirius, in the Dogon system, formed one of the foci for the orbit of a tiny star, the companionate Digitaria star. When Digitaria is closest to Sirius, that star brightens: when it is farthest from Sirius, it gives off a twinkling effect that suggests to the observer several stars. The orbit cycle takes 50 years.[34] They also claimed that the Dogon appeared to know of the rings of Saturn, and the moons of Jupiter.[35]

Griaule and Dieterlen were puzzled by this Sudanese star system, and prefaced their analysis with the disclaimer, "The problem of knowing how, with no instruments at their disposal, men could know the movements and certain characteristics of virtually invisible stars has not been settled, nor even posed."[36]

In 1976, Robert K. G. Temple wrote a book called The Sirius Mystery arguing that the Dogon's system reveals precise knowledge of cosmological facts known only by the development of modern astronomy, since they appear to know, from Griaule and Dieterlen's account, that Sirius is part of a binary star system, whose second star, Sirius B, a white dwarf, is however completely invisible to the human eye (just as Digitaria has the smallest grain known to the Dogon) and that it takes 50 years to complete its orbit. The existence of Sirius B had only been inferred to exist through mathematical calculations undertaken by Friedrich Bessel in 1844.

LordAdam16:


Oga the only person giving baseless, poorly researched assertions and lies is you.

Were the Moors colonized by Islamic Arabs? Yes or No?

Did the ancient Roman Empire in all its glory exist before the Moors were colonized by Islamic Arabs? Yes or No?

Did Ife and Bini Empires exist before the Persian Empire? Yes or No?

Did the Ife and Bini Empire have navies that rival the Persian and Greek Empire navies? Yes or No?

khalids:


Have you noticed that whenever Nigeria is playing in the world cup, nations cup or any soccer event, there is always unity at that point.
I believe what we need is a common rally point, a common enemy so to speak. We need to sink it into the subconscious of our populace, the importance of lifting ourselves on to greatness.....And if we can sell that, that will be our rallying point, our point of unity and then we can leave all the pettiness and move forward because they will all suddenly be of little importance, all previous points of division will appear insignificant compared to the goal and dreams ahead of us........

khalids:


Are you sure its they that were answering European names and not the other way round

slurryeye:


Alright we get you, stop taking this too personal. If a black guy decide to write something inspiring about his race in a black african forum, you got no right to tell him how he should present it. The last time I checked, spain and Portugal are part of Europe, hence the op starting a thread that says when black african ruled Europe is very right. The name or religion they practised is not part of discussion here. If you are uncomfortable with the info in the thread, just swerve aside and ignore.
I won't be surprised if you a Mulatto or pure white like your brother braden2

TheStronghold:
Just ignore them. They are derailing the entire thread. If they truly disagree with this thread, they'll just leave eventually. So how best do you think we can continue to promote such images to african children?