@ Inedi , Thanks for the long epistle Youve said my heart to a great extent. but i think i know the problem here.

@ Marlbron

You should avoid giving private interpretation to scriptures, the bible explains itself

2 Peter 1:20
Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.

But i think I know where you got it wrong. It was 1 thes 4

1 Thes. 4:17
Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Since the bible says after rapture we shall forever be with the lord, most christians ignorantly claim we shall be in heaven forever. I agree with you that they are wrong . We shall not be in heaven forever but only for seven years.
but need to recognise that the scripture here only said ever be with the lord but didnt mention the place. either in heaven or earth , because after rapture,the church will no longer be separated from Christ, wherever he is we shall be, Seven years in heaven we shall be, a thousand years on earth, we shall be, On the new earth forever also we shall be. Since Jesus said the meek will inherit the earth.

Matthew 5:5
Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.

This will take place after a thousand years!

Rev. 20:3
And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

Heaven is a material place as well as spiritual place. People have material bodies there

.Rev. 8:10
And the third angel sounded, and there fell a great star from heaven, burning as it were a lamp, and it fell upon the third part of the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters;

Avoid reading your own meaning to scriptures. If the bible says we shall meet him in the air , dont say it is earth.
Of course we will live on earth forever, but you must understand that after rapture, we will be in heaven for a period of 7years while the nation of Israel and those on the earth go through the tribulation under the regime of the antichrist.At the end of the 7 years We will come down with christ to fight for israel when they finally acknowledge him as king in the battle of armageddon. Satan will then be arrested and bound for a thousand years. This is called the milleniial reign. We will reign with christ over nations on earth for a thousand years. Then after that satan will be released from the bottomess pit for a season. he will go and decieve many again. This will lead to the final battle between good and evil ,the battle of Gog and Magog. Evil will finally be defeated. Then there will be the white throne judgement. The wicked will be cast to lake of fire. death and hell will be cast to lake of fire also.

It is after all this that God will make a new earth where we will live forever, God himself will come down to the new earth to stay forever. This old heaven and earth will pass away.

Sir, I m not. All I am saying is that the air, does not mean the sky or the clouds. Please read it very well. The verse says we shall be with him in the air, forever. Am saying that the air is the earth. You have the air on earth. That is why we shall be together with him. Is there no air where you are? So who is the one reading meanings to scripture? You or I? Judge. The lost garden of eden would then have been fully rstored. The whole point of christ coming was to bring back the kingdom of God back to earth - a cause he preached and had to die for.

All this talk about rapture etc are false doctrines or product of misunderstood scripture.

The 1000 years has already been fulfilled. Christ ruled in the heavens with the righteous dead for about 1000 years. Read your Rev with understanding.

Jo,

Since the bible says after rapture we shall forever be with the lord, most christians ignorantly claim we shall be in heaven forever. I agree with you that they are wrong . We shall not be in heaven forever but only for seven years.
but need to recognise that the scripture here only said ever be with the lord but didnt mention the place. either in heaven or earth , because after rapture,the church will no longer be separated from Christ, wherever he is we shall be, Seven years in heaven we shall be, a thousand years on earth, we shall be, On the new earth forever also we shall be. Since Jesus said the meek will inherit the earth.

Lets treat the 7years etc. Can you pull out the bible quote?

Rev. 8:10
And the third angel sounded, and there fell a great star from heaven, burning as it were a lamp, and it fell upon the third part of the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters;


This is a spiritual depiction. It shows that there will be a period where the rivers and waters will be poisoned as part of the tribulations. But notice that in all of these, the throne of God and the Lamb are already set up on earth during these events.

Finally:

1 Thes. 4:17
Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

The words "caught up", should not be taken literally, no. Notice that it was used again in Rev 12: 5

5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne


It means being in one spiritual accord with God.

Good, but where does it insinuate that we will be in the clouds or in heaven for 7 years,I am assuming you are interpreting the 1 week as 7 years? This just confirmed what Christ told them will happen, which mostly were fulfilled about 40 years after his death and ascension.The Revelation detailed clearly the end time events, For better understanding you combine Ezekiel, Daniel and Revelation.

The rapture or taking up of the church preceeds the beginning of the tribulation,which will last 7 years, The church will be with christ in heaven those 7 years. which will be broken to 2 parts of 3 and half years each.

Daniel 7:25
And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

The church will be in THE THIRD heaven with christ while israel goes through the tribulation. At the end of the 7 years, the blindness upon Isarel will go and they will acknowledge Christ as messiah and call upon him. Christ then will come to the earth with us to fight for israel and deliver them.This marks the beginning of the millenial reign of christ and saints on earth.

Our heaven is not cloud. There are three heavens the bible acknowledged :
First heaven is The clouds or atmophere,
Second heaven is The space and galaxy
Third heaven is where God is

ATMOSPHERIC HEAVEN

Genesis 1:20
And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven.
PLANETARY HEAVEN

Matthew 24:29
Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

Psalm 8:3
When I consider thy heavens, the work of thy fingers, the moon and the stars, which thou hast ordained;
GOD'S HEAVEN

Psalm 115:16
The heaven, even the heavens, are the Lord's: but the earth hath he given to the children of men.

2 Cor. 12:2
, such an one caught up to the[b] third heaven[/b].

Daniel 7:25
And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

The church will be in THE THIRD heaven with christ while israel goes through the tribulation. At the end of the 7 years, the blindness upon Isarel will go and they will acknowledge Christ as messiah and call upon him. Christ then will come to the earth with us to fight for israel and deliver them.This marks the beginning of the millenial reign of christ and saints on earth.

Our heaven is not cloud. There are three heavens the bible acknowledged :
First heaven is The clouds or atmophere,
Second heaven is The space and galaxy
Third heaven is where God is

ATMOSPHERIC HEAVEN

Genesis 1:20
And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven.
PLANETARY HEAVEN

Matthew 24:29
Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

Psalm 8:3
When I consider thy heavens, the work of thy fingers, the moon and the stars, which thou hast ordained;
GOD'S HEAVEN

Psalm 115:16
The heaven, even the heavens, are the Lord's: but the earth hath he given to the children of men.

2 Cor. 12:2
, such an one caught up to the third heaven.
[color=#000099][/color]


Where does it say that you will live in heaven for 7 years? When Paul was caught up to the 3rd heaven, did he physically go to the 3rd heaven? You only live in heave if you translate the earth, not with your physical body. The heaven is a spiritual plane with stages o doubt.

You should try click "insert quote" on the reply page so as to paste the previous post of others , instead of the labour ot retyping them.

Marlbron:

Where does it say that you will live in heaven for 7 years? When Paul was caught up to the 3rd heaven, did he physically go to the 3rd heaven? You only live in heave if you translate the earth, not with your physical body. The heaven is a spiritual plane with stages o doubt.

Heaven is a plane higher than earth, There are materials in heaven, Heaven is not imagination,illusion or dream, it is a real material place, the book of revelation attest to that fact. so it is not a hard thing to have phisical body. We dont seem to see the spiritual things on this plane because of the limitations of our senses. The fact that we dont see angels on this plane of life does not mean they dont exist. The spiritual realm is more real than this realm of life.

Joagbaje:

You should try click "insert quote" on the reply page so as to paste the previous post of others , instead of the labour ot retyping them.

Heaven is a plane higher than earth, There are materials in heaven, Heaven is not imagination,illusion or dream, it is a real material place, the book of revelation attest to that fact. so it is not a hard thing to have phisical body. We dont seem to see the spiritual things on this plane because of the limitations of our senses. The fact that we dont see angels on this plane of life does not mean they dont exist. The spiritual realm is more real than this realm of life.

Are those materials visible to your earthly eyes? Suppose they are not, in which case, you are right to say it is a higher plane. Agree it is not an illussion, nor imagination. But if it is a spiritual abode, then its residents must have spiritual bodies, simple.

Who told you that you cannot see angels? Who talked with Mary and Zacharia? Who left Abraham to destroy a neighbouring city Sodom? Who appeared unto the Galileans that were gazing on the sky? In the heaven angels are spiritual beings, on earth, they can take human bodies. That is why Hebrews 13;2. specified the need to entertain strangers.

Marlbron:

Are those materials visible to your earthly eyes? Suppose they are not, in which case, you are right to say it is a higher plane. Agree it is not an illussion, nor imagination. But if it is a spiritual abode, then its residents must have spiritual bodies, simple.

Who told you that you cannot see angels? Who talked with Mary and Zacharia? Who left Abraham to destroy a neighbouring city Sodom? Who appeared unto the Galileans that were gazing on the sky? In the heaven angels are spiritual beings, on earth, they can take human bodies. That is why Hebrews 13;2. specified the need to entertain strangers.

Angels have physical bodies, in heaven , they may be inisible to optical eyes here, But they may choose to appear like man. Jesus walked through walls, after resurrection, Philip disappeared ,These are all powers of the world to come.Heaven is more real than here

Whoa so much arguments. In the spiritual plane nothing is physical, can you explain out of body experiences and that such stuff in sleep.
We have a gland in our brain called the pineal gland, and it has been cast ou of science, and humanity for the mainstream media, and sheeple today
it is sensitive to light, and produces a chemical called melatonin, then changed into seratonin. It is a small endocrine gland in the vertebrate brain. It produces the serotonin derivative melatonin, a hormone that affects the modulation of wake/sleep patterns and seasonal functions, in other words.

Jesus was reincarnated many times can't you see similarities. Jesus, Horus, Dionysus, and many, many others. The cross has been derived from any other religions.
God is "Everything" so " Everything is God." We have to be careful here about the phrase ‘are we human and divine.’ To say we “are” something deals with our nature, our essence. Our nature does not change and become divine when the Holy Spirit lives in us. Rather, we are humans who have the divine Lord dwelling in us. There is a huge difference between having the Divine Lord live in us and being divine. There is even a verse for extra proof, I will find it.

A plane is, other than the physical plane is conceived as a subtle state of consciousness that transcends the known physical universe.


Humanity is an illusion, and we as sheeple have been controlled for to long, its time to save your soul people. Illuminati, and all those other satanic, and evil stuff have been controlling us for 3000 years and going. Fro Sumerian times, to Egyptian, and now Christianity.

There is no hell, or is there probably its on another plane. The whole thing is karma. Jesus even teached karma. Here is some verses, alot of verses:

Galatians

Do not be deceived: God is not mocked, for whatever one sows, that will he also reap.

Job

As I have seen, those who plow iniquity and sow trouble reap the same.

2 Corinthians

For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may receive what is due for what he has done in the body, whether good or evil.

Hebrews

And just as it is appointed for man to die once, and after that comes judgment,

Luke

“But I say to you who hear, Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you,

Ephesians

For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

Ezekiel

The soul who sins shall die. The son shall not suffer for the iniquity of the father, nor the father suffer for the iniquity of the son. The righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself.

Galatians

For the one who sows to his own flesh will from the flesh reap corruption, but the one who sows to the Spirit will from the Spirit reap eternal life. And let us not grow weary of doing good, for in due season we will reap, if we do not give up.




The first mistake Adam made lead to Jesus the opposite, and that is good karma. There is two types of karmas. Good karma, and Bad Karma.

Oh and depending on your karma you will go either to ghost realm, hell realm, heaven realm, reincarnation. An animal realm, plants.