is there really anything like pentecostal christians? what has pentecostalism gat to do with christianity? i have search the bible and find out that there is nothing like pentecostal christians. so why do we have pentecostal christians of nigeria (pfn)!

TELL ME WHERE THERE IS METHODIST OR RICE AND BEANS IN THE BIBLE

OR

BETTER STILL TELL ME WHERE DOES THOU SHALL NOT SMOKE IS IN THE BIBLE?

I KNOW MAN OF GOD THAT PREACHED ABOUT THIS AND I WAS SAD.

THE DAY OF PENTECOST IS A DAY THAT IS VERY IMPORTANT AMONG CHRISTIANS BECAUSE THIS WAS THE DAY THE COMMANDER OF THE HEAVENLY HOST WAS RELEASED.

Hi backslider (ur name speaks volume abt u). Yeah the day of pentecost was ok and I am fully persuaded about the person of the Holy Spirit. Pentecost itself was a feast of the Jews even until this day, pentecost really means 50-50 (do u know abt that?) further more if u study ur scripture as you should, u will see that those that were celebrating the pentecost on that they did not recieve the Holy Spirit, they were outside while the disciples that recieved the Holy Spirit were in d upper room. Get this right my line of discussion is that of trying to teach the church of Christ that the pentecostal christians are those that are filled with the Holy Spirit and tongue talking. Between you and I, for example if Jesus enters a village on a day they were celebrating "sango day" and some people decide to give their lives to Him and follow Him, does that make them "sango day" christians? (just an analogy!) So how come we have Christian saying they are pentecostal Christians even forming association like Pentecostal Fellowship of Nigeria(PFN), imagine PFN do not even have Christianity in their name, just pentecostal fellowship! We need to change all these and live the live of a true superman that Christ has made us!

@phronesis
so your problrm is with the name abi?
ok. lets change it to Spirit filled Christians Fellowship of Nigeria. [SCFN]

@Phronesis

Thank u for telling me that my name speaks louder. You have just replayed back the Exact tape I heard on a tV In Ghana here.

I can tell you that there is no need to bother The day is a day regarded a day that the holy Ghost was released because you have an occasion because of some Christian group you attack the day in which the holy Ghost was released.

You are trying to move out completely because of hate in your heart please purge this.

THE DISCIPLES THAT RECEIVED THE HOLY GHOST ON THAT VERY DAY OF PENTECOST WERE [b]JEWWWWWWSSSSSSSSS [/b]SO PLEASE IF THEY WERE REFERRING TO THE DAY THAT SOMETHING VERY SPECTACULAR HAPPENED WHAT IS THE BIG DEAL. WHAT SHOULD THEY REFER TO? The day of Pentecost is not worshiped and there nothing evil about it.

You live in days that were named after Demon Gods and you write in down everyday. What about that ?

If I say I am a pentecostal means I believe in the event that happened on that day and not the Jewish Traditions of the day. DON'T YOU KNOW THAT SALVATION IS UNTO THE JEWS FIRST.

Some of our brother believe that they are the first African Christians please on this continent Christianity has been practiced for 2000 years the Holy Ghost left us because of materialism and our own ways please don't let us do so again.

Let us live in love amongst ourselves and think on Righteousness and holiness for this without no man shall see the lord.

I guess its just a way for denominations to identify themselves as being different in some aspects of things. I don't have a problem with that at all. As Seventh-day Adventists we often say we are SDA christians. We use our trade name so to speak to indicate that we are either unique, or complete, or that we have something that others don't have.

Pentecostals believe that they have the whole truth, and so do all denoms. None is exempt. As to whether each making the claim can substantiate it, is quite another story.

Bobbyaf, I've been suspecting that u are an Adventist for quite sometime now from Your contributions. I am one too and I'm glad meeting one of my own on this forum. Keep up the good work.

dear brethren

That nameth the name of the lord take heed lest ye be reprobate cast away. We should worship the Lord of the Sabboath instead of the day Sabath.

Lots of Love from

THE LORD OUR REST

It matters by what name you are called because God is interested in names. When he wanted to bless Abraham, He had to change his name. The same with Jacob. Our names go a long way in determining our destinys.

In all my years of being a christian, i never saw myself as being penticostal. As a matter of fact, the name penticostal really does not make sense in Christianity as according to the bible the penticostals did not recieve the Holy Ghost on that day of penticost. I would rather be called catholic, Anglican, methodist, or even baptist as these appear to be more meaningful names. Besides, from that group of christians(penticostals) have proceeded certain teachings which unknown to many are presently troubling the church. Where did the teaching of using the DOVE symbol to represent the Holy Spirit come from. It does not matter for how long this teaching has been, it has to leave the church. The Holy Ghost is not a dove and does not resemble a dove. The Holy Spirit looks just like YOU (if u r a christian) for He looks like Jesus the one whom you were born after. Why will God's people be prevented from knowing this mighty, precious Holy Ghost for who He really is? How come you are now turning to the very things you were once opposed to? Why do you carry around(and even sell) bottles of oil, crosses, hankies and so on and preach that these items will bring their users deliverance. While you claim to be the ones who have experienced the Holy Ghost, your words and actions tell otherwise. I do not intend to continue mentioning these things as my only purpose is to show you the result of relying on sense knowledge above God's Word. Jesus is coming soon and every tree which the Lord hath not planted shall be uprooted. Jesus is enough; the ultimate sacrifice for the salvation of mankind. And we are complete in Him. Glory to God.

Acts 2

1And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.

2And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.

3And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.

4And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

You have pentecost in the bible ok!

@ Oluchia

Bobbyaf, I've been suspecting that u are an Adventist for quite sometime now from Your contributions. I am one too and I'm glad meeting one of my own on this forum. Keep up the good work.

I am glad to meet you too. Look forward to more of your contributions.

Shalom.

@donnie
As for the dove symbol.It means no harm,its just Christian symbology.
Remember when John baptised Jesus,a dove came over Jesus(representing The Holy Spirit) & God's voice was heard from heaven approving Christ as his son whom he is very pleased.
So thats where the dove comes in.

@donnie

There is an attempt to attack the Holy Ghost this last days. The spirit of Truth. It says Yea The shall gather yet they shall not gather in my name.

There is alot of people gathering they are not gathering in his name. Flee the Judgment the spirit of Love and Truth will restore.

Selah

Po Deep:

@donnie
As for the dove symbol.It means no harm,its just Christian symbology.

Did you say it means no harm. That is what satan will have you believe my dear.

Are you aware that the Holy Spirit is God Himself?
Take a look at this:

Exodus 20:4
Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.

And this is the cry of the Spirit today:

Jeremiah 8:19 
Behold the voice of the cry of the daughter of my people because of them that dwell in a far country: Is not the LORD in Zion? is not her king in her? Why have they provoked me to anger with their graven images, and with strange vanities?

Is the Lord not among you? Does He not dwell on the inside of You? Why do you provoke Him with these images and with strange vanities?

Po Deep:

Remember when John baptised Jesus,a dove came over Jesus(representing The Holy Spirit) & God's voice was heard from heaven approving Christ as his son whom he is very pleased.
So thats where the dove comes in.

That is not true. A dove did not come upon Jesus. The Holy Spirit came upon Him according to the bible, IN BODILY FORM like a dove would. Those words were carefully chosen by the writter as the greek Word used for the Holy Spirit is pnuma meaning air.

So He is trying to communicate to you the fact that he took a form(not just as air) when he decended on Jesus. He did not say that He took the form of a dove but that He descended upon Jesus the same way a dove would descend.

So this is actually where the dove comes in.

Matthew 3:16
And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:

Mark 1:10
And straightway coming up out of the water, he saw the heavens opened, and the Spirit like a dove descending upon him:

Luke 3:22
And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.

John 1:32 
And John bare record, saying, I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and it abode upon him.

In case you are unaware, this false teaching has led believers to see the Holy Spirit as a lesser personality than the father and the Son. They paint Him in their pictures as a dove flying above the father and the Son. Some think that the reason He is called the third person of the Godhead is that He is the lesser of the three persons. This teaching is like a veil upon the eyes sheilding the true personality of this precious comforter without whom we cannot live the Christian life.

I wish you could see the expression of His face. If you only knew that He was the forth man in the fire with the three Hebrew Children. If you only knew that He was that mighty cloud that followed the Isrealites by day and that pillar of fire that gave them light by night.  The one who blew over the red sea dividing it and holding it up until over 6 million Jews went across; You will not call Him a gentle dove(as some do call him).

No wonder His power is absent from their lives. No wonder they have trouble when they see His presence manifested in signs wonders and miracles; attributing such manifestations to satan.

No wonder they attack such manifestaions but are at peace with those who sprinkle water and oil all over the place.

Come out from among them and be ye seperated. Turn from your vanities and recieve the Word with meekness.

I did not intend to say this much on this issue even though there is a lot more to say.

God be with you all.

@ Donnie

Why have you decided to war with the Holy One God?

The sign of the Dove is as far as Noah. I will explain if you have read the bible and the account of Noah and the Ark you will see that The Dove is a simple Bird it is a bird that has one partner if its partner dies it will not take another partner Similar like the holy Ghost?

Another thing Remember that Noah Sent A raven The Character of a Raven is that it eats flesh. The raven was sent and saw a lot of dead bodies and Never returned

The Dove was sent returned because it does not eat flesh[/b]The Holy Ghost does not work with canal selfish man.

The Dove is easily Offended another Likeness of the Holy Ghost? Dont Grief the Holy Ghost

Luke 3:22
And the Holy Ghost descended in a [b]bodily shape like a[b] dove[/b] upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.

The bible says LIKE THE DOVE NOT AS THE DOVE.

No one has worshiped the dove so what is your point

War? If there is a war here it is definitely not against God but against all forms of religiocity(if there's a word like that). The truth must be told my brother. Why don't you use the lamb to symbolize God? The lamb does not eat flesh, it is not stubborn. It is gentle. Jesus was even called the lamb of God. Why are you struggling to keep the dove emblem. Has it become your God? Why is it difficult for you to let it go? Whether it is LIKE OR AS the truth remains that the Holy Spirit is not a dove, neither does he look like one. And talking about the dove having only one partner; so how many does God have? The Holy Ghost is not fire, oil or smoke. He is Himself God. He looks, loves, laughs, weeps, heals, prays, comforts, provides, teaches etc like Jesus. Jesus said, I will send you another comforter(allous paracletos: allous- meaning one that is exactly the same in kind and quality and paracletos- meaning comforter) why is it not easier for you to use the man Jesus in describing the Holy Ghost? It is that attachment to the dove that i have come to make war against. No wonder when Jesus spoke of the Holy Spirit He said, the world cannot recieve Him because they see Him not. The world lives and functions in th realm of the senses. They always want to relate with God through their senses and that's the reason for the idols and images they make. And did you say they do not worship this dove? Well, look around carefully once more; and mind you, that was the same thing they said concerning statues of mary and all them saints at a certain catholic church the last time i checked. God is spirit and they that worship Him must do so in Spirit and in truth.

Well My brother You can call Jesus the Lamb of God but you can call the Holy Ghost the Dove of God? I don't Get it?
This is Another Attack from Hell Fire. God Help Us.

May be YOU will soon say you Should never call Jesus Lamb of God and you should never call Him Lion of the tribe of Judah. Do we Bcause that worship Lambs and Lion

What is your Agenda? To Denigrate The Holy Might Spirit Of The Lord. He is called Captain of The host of Heaven. Flee from Evil and leave the holy Ghost out of this. Jesus has many names The Holy Ghost has many names.

Dont get your Greek Wrong Your Theology you learnt from sinful men without salvation the Holy Spirit of God That Descended in a bodily shape like a dove

Love from God

The bible called Jesus the lamb of God because He was offered as a sacrifice to take away the sin of the world. The Holy Spirit was never, any where in scripture, called a dove. I think you are beginning to show what your true color is. It does not matter how many scriptures you quote, if you are not born again, you are a child of the devil. There is no middle ground. To the pure in heart, all things are pure the bible says. Did you say i learnt my theology in sin and from sinful men who do not have salvation? Well, i leave you to God. Wrong theology is the reason for many of the problems we face as christians. Do you know that some christians in this penticostal group still pray and fast for days (sometimes with beatings and deliverance sessions) in order to recieve salvation and be born again? Those who have the truth should not hold back. Speak out and let the devil be ashamed!

@Brother Donnie

No offense meant but if you think Pentecostals Worship A Dove then it is your belief. I have Quoted Scripture nothing Else Used Scripture to Explain Scripture and you still say I qoute the bible. Well Qoute yours.

Let God be true and every man a liar. In the days of ignorance God overlooked, but now commands all men everywhere to repent.

the main difference between pentecostals and other protestant churches is that pentecostals believe the gifts of the Holy Spirit are still around today and use them.


phronesis, do u attend Christ Embassy?

I am Happy that you did not say that I said the Dove was the Holy fire. ME I CALL IT THE HOLY DOVE OF GOD WHATEVER YOU LIKE GO ON.

HE IS THE COMMANDER IN CHIEF OF THE ARMED GUARDS OF HEAVEN I WORSHIP HIM I BOW BEFORE HIM. I HAVE KNOWN HIM NOT BY HIS NAME ALONE BUT BY HIS RIGHTEOUSNESS AND BY HIS WORK.

Salvation from hell fire.

Hi @donnie,

Let me draw attention to something in your posts:

donnie:

Where did the teaching of using the DOVE symbol to represent the Holy Spirit come from. It does not matter for how long this teaching has been, it has to leave the church.

Now that is quite queer. You should have known it came from the Bible itself    See am:

Matt 3:16 - "And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him."

Mark 1:10
"And straightway coming up out of the water, he saw the heavens opened, and the Spirit like a dove descending upon him."

Luke 3:22
"And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased."

John 1:32
"And John bare record, saying, I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and it abode upon him."

donnie:

The Holy Ghost is not a dove and does not resemble a dove.

Partly true - He is NOT a dove but was pleased to have come in bodily shape like a dove.

donnie:

The Holy Spirit looks just like YOU (if you're a christian) for He looks like Jesus the one whom you were born after.

This contradicts what you later posted quoting Exo. 20:4 ~~

donnie:

Are you aware that the Holy Spirit is God Himself?
Take a look at this:

Exodus 20:4
Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.

The Holy Spirit does NOT look just like you! He is pleased to reveal Himself in the various ways that He chose - and that goes far beyond gender or limitations. We are made in the image of God does not mean that God is like a man!

Further, while it has been easier for you to categorically denounce the understanding that the Holy Spirit descended in bodily shape like a dove; you made a few slips in referring to Him as a cloud --

donnie:

If you only knew that He was the forth man in the fire with the three Hebrew Children. If you only knew that He was that mighty cloud that followed the Isrealites by day and that pillar of fire that gave them light by night.  The one who blew over the red sea dividing it and holding it up until over 6 million Jews went across; You will not call Him a gentle dove(as some do call him).

So, where do you begin to draw the lines between others' idea that "the Holy Spirit IS a dove" and your own teaching that "He WAS that mighty cloud"? The Holy Ghost is neither a dove nor a cloud (however mighty that may be). He is NOT what you make Him out to be, donnie!

I would be grateful if you can show me from Scripture where it is written that the Holy Spirit WEEPS, as you said earlier:

donnie:

The Holy Ghost is not fire, oil or smoke. He is Himself God. He looks, loves, laughs, weeps, heals, prays, comforts, provides, teaches etc like Jesus.

Salvation from hell fire.

  what does that mean

The truth communicated here is that there should not be any reference to christians as the "Penticostals". The day of penticost happened to be the day the Holy Spirit came down on the apostles. hey, there were some events recorded in the bible after the penticost day that some christians were found who had not receieved the Holy spirit and these were not refered to as "non-penticostals".

We understand what people mean each time they say penticostals but it isnt scriptural and this is an awareness call. I know many have used this term to describe spirit filled christian all their lives and have never sat back to think about it. I for one, didn't realise it too until i heard and it makes sense.

As for the spirit and the dove issue, It is clear from all the references about Jesus' baptism that it didn't call the Holy Spirit
a dove but referred to the manner of the descension. If u doubt it, read it again, its in black and white. For the fact that man shares some of God's xteristics can not make man God. Human beings share some xteristics with plants but does not mean we are plants. Calling the Holy spirit a dove is reducing his person to common creature. He could move like a wind, burn like fire descend in the form of dove but he is non of these. He is the captain of the lord's host. That Spirit that proceeds from the Father. He looks like Jesus in everything. He could be grieved. The one that raised Christ from the dead and has come to dwell in us. The one that makes God real to us. He is gentle yet he is not a dove!

I am not against anointing with olive oil or handkerchiefs etc. I know that the spirit of God can work in any way he wishes.But I am against it when the heart of the people are directed to these things like what they can't do without. when people no longer depend on God and his word but look for these things. For example, If i want to minister to someone, and the spirit of God says pour water on this person, He did not use that to say, always pour water on people when u minister to them. Many people can not stay long in a place where they tell them to listen and depend on God's word, they feel its too slow but the minute they get hanky and stuff, they actually believe God has touched them.Christinaity has been stereotyped and this means carnality. If u ask me, this is where i see a problem.

Some churches just like the idea of selling symbol to people

lysaa:

Calling the Holy spirit a dove is reducing his person to common creature. He could move like a wind, burn like fire descend in the form of dove but he is non of these.

Which tesselates with:

shahan:

The Holy Ghost is neither a dove nor a cloud (however mighty that may be). He is NOT what you make Him out to be

Simply put: the Holy Spirit is God - and there's nothing and no one comparable to Him.

hmmmmmmmm

Soon they will stop calling JESUS THE LAMB OF GOD THAT TAKETH THE SINS OF THE WORLD.

OR

Watch carefully he will no more be called the lion of the tribe of Judah.



DO I hear some people are already saying he is not the son of God? Ah oh well

It appeared like a dove O tan Finish

This aspect has to do with Prophesy of the End times ( I will Not Expound this before have to type plenty to defend this)

And I can understand Why Satan is attacking this aspect of the true Character of the Holy Ghost.

Someone asked me to show him from the bible where it says that the Holy Spirit weeps. I might not be able to show you in black and white but comparing scripture with scripture you will understand. In my experience, sometimes in prayer, i have heard him weep for the world for sinners and for the afflicted and sick. I also hear him weep if i ignore Him and go doing things my own way. The bible tells us that Jesus wept at the grave of Lazarus. And remember He had said, 'i do what i see my father do'. The bible also says about Jesus that He is touched with the feelings of our infirmity. The bible lets us know that the Holy Spirit can be grieved. It is not strange therefore to hear that that gentle Holy Spirit weeps in compassion with and over us since the three persons- father son and Holy ghost are one. Jesus is the express image of the father's person and the fullness of the God- head dwells in Him. He said, 'if you have seen me, you have seen the father.' If you would read Isaiah 63:7-9 it talks about the angel of His presence (which is the Holy Ghost) who carried the Israelites through the wilderness, protecting them. It says in verse 9 that 'in all their distresses, He too was distressed'. And as for whether i look like the Holy Spirit? My answer is in the words of John. He said, 'as He is, so are we in this World'. Do Jesus and the holy spirit look alike? Emphatically yes! So?

Please people stop peddling all these petty teachings taught by some pastors somewhere that will not keep anyone from heaven nor transport them there otherwise.
That one uses the symbol of dove,fish sticker on their car,worship on Saturdays or Sundays,are called Pentecostals,washing feet,wearing flowing dresses,make up or no make up of what significance is all this?

I believe these are all tools of the enemy to sidetrack us from pursuing truth and living lives worthy of our calling.
I thank God that I am not a slave to denomination may be a great thing that emerged from my protestant upbringing,you are my brother and my sister if you name the name of Christ and accept his saving Grace as the ultimate plan for salvation.

These words of Christ should mean something to us and deliver us from useless doctrine

Jhn 17:22   "And the glory which You gave Me I have given them, that they may be one just as We are one:
Jhn 17:23   "I in them, and You in Me; that they may be made perfect in one, and that the world may know that You have sent Me, and have loved them as You have loved Me.
Jhn 17:24   "Father, I desire that they also whom You gave Me may be with Me where I am, that they may behold My glory which You have given Me; for You loved Me before the foundation of the world.
Jhn 17:25   "O righteous Father! The world has not known You, but I have known You; and these have known that You sent Me.
Jhn 17:26   "And I have declared to them Your name, and will declare it, that the love with which You loved Me may be in them, and I in them."

:


Let us learn brethren to spend time in His presence.He will give you love for every Christian around you and cast off the Spirit of criticisms and superiority.
That Spirit is not of God.

@donnie,

donnie:

Someone asked me to show him from the bible where it says that the Holy Spirit weeps. I might not be able to show you in black and white but comparing scripture with scripture you will understand. In my experience, sometimes in prayer, i have heard him weep for the world for sinners and for the afflicted and sick. I also hear him weep if i ignore Him and go doing things my own way. The bible tells us that Jesus wept at the grave of Lazarus. And remember He had said, 'i do what i see my father do'. The bible also says about Jesus that He is touched with the feelings of our infirmity. The bible lets us know that the Holy Spirit can be grieved. It is not strange therefore to hear that that gentle Holy Spirit weeps in compassion with and over us since the three persons- father son and Holy ghost are one. Jesus is the express image of the father's person and the fullness of the God- head dwells in Him. He said, 'if you have seen me, you have seen the father.' If you would read Isaiah 63:7-9 it talks about the angel of His presence (which is the Holy Ghost) who carried the Israelites through the wilderness, protecting them. It says in verse 9 that 'in all their distresses, He too was distressed'. And as for whether i look like the Holy Spirit? My answer is in the words of John. He said, 'as He is, so are we in this World'. Do Jesus and the holy spirit look alike? Emphatically yes! So?

Please find my rejoinder in the new thread you opened: Re: Pentecostalism and Christianity.