SEFAGO:

Every Yoruba eats Amala is a pretty good generalization. I am sure if I made a good generalization of igbo people you would probably not care. But when I make bad generalizations you guys get indignant.

Nation-states cannot work in such a way. No nation state in the world is communal or truly democratic, even the origin of democratic thought- the United States cannot claim true democracy. Such types of democracy can only work in small villages or small towns. Get with it- we are in the 21st Century. The West won, and we gotta do things like the West. Exploitation is the rule of the game- every tribe for themselves, this is not christmas  

mekuszyx:

You give too much credit to the hausa fulani. We have seen how united they are with the incapacitation of Yaradua and eventual death and all the undercurrent. We have seen how united they are, yet Atiku and Buhari cannot form a credible opposition party.

SEFAGO:

Every Yoruba eats Amala is a pretty good generalization. I am sure if I made a good generalization of igbo people you would probably not care. But when I make bad generalizations you guys get indignant.

Nation-states cannot work in such a way. No nation state in the world is communal or truly democratic, even the origin of democratic thought- the United States cannot claim true democracy. Such types of democracy can only work in small villages or small towns. Get with it- we are in the 21st Century. The West won, and we gotta do things like the West. Exploitation is the rule of the game- every tribe for themselves, this is not christmas  

mekuszyx:

I look toward the West, I see no leadership. I look toward the North, none can be found.

I do not believe in generalizations that are either positive or negative. This is something that I stand by. I do not look at the group, I look at the individual. Now I will remark on cultural traits, such as competition among Igbo families to produce children who are highly educated. This is something that I have noticed among the Igbos in the United States. I cannot talk about another group that I do not know personally.

How do you know a nation-state cannot work in such a way? Just because it was never tried before does not mean it will not work. The United States was an experiment that apparently worked. I do not believe in such zero-sum games either. If people learn to work together and stop being greedy, the world would be a much better a place. We do not have to live in a Hobbesian state of nature.

You give too much credit to the hausa fulani. We have seen how united they are with the incapacitation of Yaradua and eventual death and all the undercurrent. We have seen how united they are, yet Atiku and Buhari cannot form a credible opposition party.

If people learn to work together and stop being greedy, the world would be a much better a place. We do not have to live in a Hobbesian state of nature.

EzeUche:

Flat head?    I am not even full Igbo. I am a mixture of Ibibio and Kalabari, maybe that is why I do not have this flat head you speak of. U find that from among the Anambra guys.  

SEFAGO:

Because so many factors would get in the way. The theory I propose: The larger a political unit, the more susceptible it is to decay. You can see that is socialist theory- all good as theory, but not really good when trying to apply it to large states like the former USSR. The supposed communal democracy would not even likely work if all the igbo come together to form Biafra. i dont know the various divisions with igbo people but I am sure problems would arise from the diversity with the igbo people.

The Hausa are one of the most unified groups because they have a strong Caste system. The Fulani elite in the leadership realm and the Hausa at the core masses. This has been solidified for centuries with the common islamic faith, and the Islamic structure. Infact the Hausa Fulani had the closest paradigm of a nation state- makese sense that they can play politics with superior skills well.


Olodo. Atiku is not Hausa-fulani, and I doubt Buhari is one too. Infact most of Nigerian presidents from the North have not being Hausa Fulani. Abacha was Kanuri too. The fulani-Hausa influence stuff in the background.

Katsumoto:

@ SEFAGO
Your analyses and posts are very good. You understand the reality of whats on ground but I hope you will agree with me that the current reality does not serve us (Nigerians) well.

Katsumoto:


Republican as a term in the US is just a party, not political ideology and not to be confused with Igbo republicanism.

Onlytruth:

I always avoid going into arguments over definitions because they tend to derail threads. I've seen some good threads derailed by long arguments over definitions and I won't fall for that here.
For now, you must accept the most basic form of this "republican" definition, which means a system that works only when all agree. In order words, every man or woman is entitled to hold a position (no matter how idiotic) or else the group can never come together to act. Summary -unbridled individualism.

I believe that this system may have worked for us in the olden days when we had no need to come together. Igbo never fought off any organized external aggressor until the British showed up. The few Igbo clans that were organized were very tough to subdue by the British. The British simply appointed "warrant chiefs" to organize the rest.

Bottomline is that in those days (prior to British and Nigeria) Igbo republicanism was okay. Today, it is outdated and irrelevant, almost threatening our survival as a people. Today, you see Igbo businessmen being hounded all over Nigeria and Africa with no one to intercede on their behalf. The little respect we have in Nigeria is because of Biafra and Ojukwu's leadership, because frankly that was the first time Igbo would come under one leader and by God we were powerful!  So, Igbo republicanism is counter productive in our contemporary Nigeria. We won't survive long if we continue with it. When Ralf Uwechue assumed the leadership of Ohanaeze Ndi Igbo, that was the first thing he complained bitterly about. There is NO WAY everyone can be king at the same time. Just no way!

If I had fought in the Biafran war, I would have ensured that our gains as a people are sustained even if we had to surrender. We made some gains and I believe single Igbo leadership was that gain. Anyone attacking that is attacking my chances of survival.

I don't believe that "Igbo has no king" mantra. It is OUTDATED and IRRELEVANT. If you don't have leaders, then, be prepared to serve others, or worse, go extinct! 

ChinenyeN:

Onlytruth, it isn't a matter of everyone being king at the same time. It is only a matter of there not being a king in the first place. Instead, it would be people-appointed/selected representatives (either for a term, or case-specific :: I prefer a functional mixture of both). That is how it should be. We can still exhibit republicanism, to an extent, but it must never be overdone.

There should be NO Igbo king, ever.

ChinenyeN:

You seem to be erroneously assuming that a lack of[b] king [/b]means lack of strong leadership. We Igbo do NOT need a king (and like hell we want one). Aside from that, such a suggestion (laughable 'Eze Igbo') can simply NOT work. It is a pure waste of thought. It does not though mean that we cannot have good, strong leadership. Of course we can, but it musn't and simply cannot be centralized.

Just because[b] kingship[/b] worked out for others does not at all mean it will work for us. We can have something else other than kingship (or whatever other centralized system). That is my only argument.

Onlytruth:

Today, a British Prime Minister is more powerful than the Queen. So let's get that part straight.

ezeagu:

Well officially, and even then she can declare war on whichever country she wants because she's the head of armed forces and the prime minister has to ask her permission for anything war-related, but I understand what you mean.

ChinenyeN:

I use "king" both literally and symbolically, to refer to actual kingship (literal) and centralized government/leadership (symbolic). It isn't necessary, and besides, it can't/won't work.

ChinenyeN:

Onlytruth, where has it worked before? Where did we have a "king"? Help me out an enlighten me.

Udezue, no. I cannot and simply will not give it up. I do not thoroughly identify with the rest of Igbo, the way I identify with Ngwa. So do not expect me to fall in line like others. Also I am more than flexible. Being Ngwa has not hindered me from associating and dealing with other Igbo, both informally and professionally. I do not have to identify like you to work alongside you. Simple.

UcheUwadi_:

Interesting discussion. Yes, I agree that we Igbos have to get rid of our clannish sentiment, but our mini republics is what makes our people great. I'll be damn if we have a king. I am ok with a military or political leader who can channel Igbo interest, but hell no to any king. Excuse my language. Yes, I believe in a strong unified Igbo state, but I only support a state that recognizes our differences as well. Case in point, look at how Germany is unified, but at the same time, there are regional differences among the Germans. Bavarians consider themselves Germans just like the Prussians, but there are still differences among them.