stanluiz:
lies!

Throwback:


Why not approach the questions with courage?

stanluiz:
Àll those things you type are complete trash.

Reelectbuhari:


maybe sorry though

just feel no more for such sugar coating of words
sorry for the mix maybe my guess u wasn't the right person
no offence

Tripleclick:
I agree with you...

Since after the war .. Nigeria govt hv swore nva to gv igbos another chance to rise up.. Because of fear of unknown.... There is absolute plan to keep igbos down...and that's one reason Nigeria can nva progress...

stanluiz:
Despite all their evil policies on the SE we are still excelling and progressing.

Xander85:
Personally, i've given up on this country called Nigeria! It feels like a cage!

SashaBanks:


Nnam I know what am telling you when I say that we don't! Am not saying East is empty. Nope.

Am only saying there is no place in the East you have a high concentration of human beings like Kano or Lagos. Maybe PH. Igbo land is populated but not highly concentrated.

I know what am telling you when I say high concentration. My only grievance is that the people that form a huge number of that population in the places mentioned are Igbos.

If the Igbos in places like Ibadan, Kano, Lagos, Sokoto and Abuja should come back... You will understand what am talking about.

But its a pity that most of them bought the propaganda that nothing is happening in the East. Which is a pure lie!

maestroferddi:
The Igbos are at times their own worst enemies...

Commonsense dictates that the Igbos would attract envy and hatred because of their entrepreneurial and enterprising spirit.

The big question is whether the Igbos have answers to the reality of co-existing with many negative people intent on ensuring that the pervasive mediocrity remains the common lot.

The answer is that the Igbos appear to have no clue about the precarious situation they found themselves.

The Igbos are still bogged down sundry pettiness that keep stultifying their re-awakening and self-discovery. They allow such vices as discrimation and intolerance to exist among themselves.

....

Throwback:



Yet you do not have the knowledge or courage to prove it so?

Lets start from the very beginning.

What moved the Igbos out of their land upon realising that they have free access to a land mass that dwarfed the old perimeter of their known existence?

Why wasn't there mass immigration into Igbo land instead of emigration at the start of the 20th century (1914 to 1940)?

Xander85:


Looks like you're just looking for an argument just for the heck of it! Ask any neutral today who the most daring and most widely travelled group in Nigeria are and chances are 8 times out of 10 you'd come up with Igbo as the answer!

Because of our daring, independent, republican and mercantile nature, Igbos are not afraid to seek out new challenges, new opportunities or to broaden their horizon. This stands in stark contrast to those who generally chose to be insular and preferred to play it safe by sticking to already known and defined borders (remember you accused only Ndigbo of travelling, so don't blame me for the assertion made in this paragraph).

Because of their republican and democratic society, during the period of the empires Igbo interaction with her neighbours was more by way of trade, whereas for others at the time it was more by way of conquest to expand their empires. The Sokoto Caliphate, Oyo Empire and Benin Empire were examples of such. If Ndigbo had been interested in territorial conquest and expansion, it's most likely you'd not have had the many other languages in the south Eastern part of Nigeria as you have today...they'd all probably be speaking Igbo like you have in the western part (minus Edo and Delta states) where they all speak Yoruba. If you check the old map of the Oyo Empire you'd see it stretched into present day kwara and Kogi states...hence the Yoruba influence and Yoruba speaking groups. Same influence can be found in the way almost all the northern part of Nigeria speaks Hausa, due to the influence of the Sokoto Caliphate and the later Sokoto Oligarchy.

So what i'm saying is that the Igbo, even though they are a widely travelled people, had a different kind of relationship with her neighbours than was the case with the other big two.

Another daring and widely travelled people were the British, Spanish, Portuguese and the Germans. You can't say their travels were borne out of a serious case of inferiority complex can you?

You mentioned the dates 1914 to 1940. I don't know why you chose that particular period, but any noticeable spike in the emigration of Igbo to other parts of Nigeria during this period would be as a consequence of the interplay of two factors: 1) the daring, mercantile and independent-minded nature of Ndigbo; 2) and the coming into being of Nigeria (first Southern Nigeria and then the amalgamation of the two protectorates in 1914 by Lugard). Remember that at the time Lagos had the gravitational pull both for administrative and political purposes, and it says something that a people can travel from so far and still be able to make their mark in a far off place like Lagos was at the time. Same scenario played out after 1914 in the North when the Igbo were found there in their numbers playing key roles aiding the British colonials in their administration of the region. Both Zik and Ikemba were born in Zungeru. I hope you remember the part Zungeru played during the Norths colonial period?

Throwback:
Kettyking said more than this while campaigning for his Igbo brothers to leave Lagos and move their businesses to the East so that Lagos will perish and finally afford the SouthEast an opportunity to grow from a wealth that would be supposedly generated from Igbos by Igbos, until he eventually revealed years later that he too was sitting tight in Lagos and paying N1.5m rent to his Yoruba landlord.

The day Igbos all over Nigeria return to their regional enclave, is the day they will realise that a market needs customers, and without the customer there is no income, so profit, wealth and boasts will not exist. That is the day the arrogance will fall flat and perish.

At the end of the day, those who will happily occupy the space they exited, will still pay that tax for having benefited from that location.

A question the Igbos have never bothered to answer is what wealth or enterprise or commerce was ever associated to any Igbo community before they found themselves in Nigeria?

What geographical feature do they have for their own benefit like Lagos or Port-Harcourt?

What cultural ties do they have with nearby international neighbours that could make a vast commercial city develop from such human interrelations like Kano came to be?

Why is it that right from the onset of Nigeria, decades before independence, the migratory pattern was more prone to movement to the North and West? At least all Igbos were within their own enclave at that onset, so why didn't they stay home to grow wealth from within instead of make an escape to the outside to make wealth?

What vast natural resources do they have for the economic benefit of the state?

When the SouthEast is described as landlocked, it does not mean just landlocked like the many European countries that apologists love to reference without correlation, but landlocked and trapped within the greater Nigeria and at the mercy of economic policies of Nigeria.

Xander85:


Looks like you're just looking for an argument just for the heck of it! Ask any neutral today who the most daring and most widely travelled group in Nigeria are and chances are 8 times out of 10 you'd come up with Igbo as the answer!

Because of our daring, independent, republican and mercantile nature, Igbos are not afraid to seek out new challenges, new opportunities or to broaden their horizon. This stands in stark contrast to those who generally chose to be insular and preferred to play it safe by sticking to already known and defined borders (remember you accused only Ndigbo of travelling, so don't blame me for the assertion made in this paragraph).

Because of their republican and democratic society, during the period of the empires Igbo interaction with her neighbours was more by way of trade, whereas for others at the time it was more by way of conquest to expand their empires. The Sokoto Caliphate, Oyo Empire and Benin Empire were examples of such. If Ndigbo had been interested in territorial conquest and expansion, it's most likely you'd not have had the many other languages in the south Eastern part of Nigeria as you have today...they'd all probably be speaking Igbo like you have in the western part (minus Edo and Delta states) where they all speak Yoruba. If you check the old map of the Oyo Empire you'd see it stretched into present day kwara and Kogi states...hence the Yoruba influence and Yoruba speaking groups. Same influence can be found in the way almost all the northern part of Nigeria speaks Hausa, due to the influence of the Sokoto Caliphate and the later Sokoto Oligarchy.

So what i'm saying is that the Igbo, even though they are a widely travelled people, had a different kind of relationship with her neighbours than was the case with the other big two.

Another daring and widely travelled people were the British, Spanish, Portuguese and the Germans. You can't say their travels were borne out of a serious case of inferiority complex can you?

You mentioned the dates 1914 to 1940. I don't know why you chose that particular period, but any noticeable spike in the emigration of Igbo to other parts of Nigeria during this period would be as a consequence of the interplay of two factors: 1) the daring, mercantile and independent-minded nature of Ndigbo; 2) and the coming into being of Nigeria (first Southern Nigeria and then the amalgamation of the two protectorates in 1914 by Lugard). Remember that at the time Lagos had the gravitational pull both for administrative and political purposes, and it says something that a people can travel from so far and still be able to make their mark in a far off place like Lagos was at the time. Same scenario played out after 1914 in the North when the Igbo were found there in their numbers playing key roles aiding the British colonials in their administration of the region. Both Zik and Ikemba were born in Zungeru. I hope you remember the part Zungeru played during the Norths colonial period?

selemempe:
the thing u have to know about the dude Throwback is that he is the perfect definition of an Igbo hater. And what makes it worst is that he seems educated....so he can throw big words around and promote lies that ppl use as truths.

B4 the coming of the whiteman Aba and onitsha were already big cities. Iron works, palm produce, slaves, artifacts and livestock were all sold in these big cities. Ppl migrated from ibibio and ejeagham into these cities to be part of the trade.

The hausas were also coming down south ward...they gave our merchants horses and cows in exchange for slaves and iron weapons...we never went up north at the time...until the game changed and we all became one country.

The fg has denied igbos things like international airports, good federal highways and a friendly police (like u have in the north).

Throwback:



Thank you for admitting that at the onset, Igbos chose to leave their own land to move elsewhere for their own economic benefit and not because the system was rigged to make their own lands underdeveloped, hence the need to move towards development.

The whole thread had been filled with posts that were alluding to the known fallacies that the Igbos only seek opportunities outside because they had been deliberately starved of internal development by Nigeria, so they had to move out to the greater Nigeria land space to survive.

Simply put, from the onset, you chose to exploit what opportunities laid outside for your own good.

For your own good alone. Nobody forced you, or underdeveloped the East at the onset of Nigeria.

Throwback:



Thank you for admitting that at the onset, Igbos chose to leave their own land to move elsewhere for their own economic benefit and not because the system was rigged to make their own lands underdeveloped, hence the need to move towards development.

The whole thread had been filled with posts that were alluding to the known fallacies that the Igbos only seek opportunities outside because they had been deliberately starved of internal development by Nigeria, so they had to move out to the greater Nigeria land space to survive.

Simply put, from the onset, you chose to exploit what opportunities laid outside for your own good.

For your own good alone. Nobody forced you, or underdeveloped the East at the onset of Nigeria.

Xander85:


You're being clever by half!

The dynamics at play that determined the reasons for emigration of Ndigbo during the two periods (pre and post independence) are largely different. You're playing smart in not making a distinction between the two periods.

Like i stated earlier, during the pre-independence era the Igbo emigration was determined largely by the British colonial gov't. The political, administrative and economic gravitational pull of Lagos and Zungeru at the time was largely responsible for Ndigbo moving to these places.

Now post-independence, the mode and reason for migration amongst Nigerians was not expected to mirror the pre-independence period. After 1st Oct' 1960, we had a new order at play, a new constitution that was birthed from the 1957 and 1958 constitutional conferences** in London between the founding fathers of the country and the British gov't.

With this new order, ethnic groups and regions had more control of their destiny, resources and economic fortunes. There was fiscal federalism at play, little meddling in the affairs of the regions from the centre, and these regions even had their own separate regional constitutions. This was the Nigeria we all signed up for. If we still had that order in place today, the migration pattern would be totally different....Ndigbo and other ethnic groups would be in control of their resources and their destiny and would not be held down by wicked, leeching, 'one-Nigeria' bigots bent on grabbing everything to their regions, controlling and siphoning our resources, and scheming to prevent anyone but themselves from becoming president of the country!

This is why you have separatist and agitation groups like IPOB today. Nobody would tolerate the nonsense and wickedness Ndigbo have been put through in this country without fighting back at some point....certainly not the Hausa/Fulani!

The way out of the quagmire we find ourselves in today is to return to the 1960 constitution (with slight adjustments given the political and economic realities of today). It's either we do that or we all agree to go our separate ways! We are all born equal and free and nobody is a slave to anybody else!


**https://passnownow.com/1957-1958-constitutional-conference/

stanluiz:
Despite all their evil policies on the SE we are still excelling and progressing.

1beat:
God bless ur wisdom ...

Igbo's are the one bumming Lagos economy they occupied large population in notable market in Lagos. such as Alaba, Ladipo,Computer village and Supper market. they're just working for Lagos government and her people

Throwback:


So you are saying Igbo traders that populated the North and West and Lagos, went there to take up colonial jobs with the British?

Ethnic groups already had more control over their regions since 1952, but the Igbos were more interested in political power in the West, and economic opportunities and regional government jobs in the North.

Till today, the Igbos still wail over the Northern Premier's decision to protect and preserve Northern regional jobs that would be made available to Northerners who were soon graduating from universities.

The Nigeria you claim we all signed up for, was truncated by Igbos who were so greedy they wanted more in other regions and total domination of the federal space where Igbos only should be the ones qualified for federal positions.

You continually fail to acknowledge that your migration attitude helped to create rich Igbo men who either made wealth outside of their region or who exploited the human movement to become rich transporters.

The irony is that you then despise the places you made this wealth and claim to be the ones developing such places, when it is not recorded that the Igbo man brought the wealth of his village to develop the foreign soil he found himself. Rather the money made from foreign soil was sent back home to develop the East and empower many waves of emigrants to also depart the East as paupers but to return as high chiefs.

If any Igbo has made money in a location, it is only proper you should be happy paying taxes in a place where you have amassed the wealth that eluded you at home.

If you choose to leave where you were not forced to come to, you should remember why you had to seek refuge there initially, even when you were not marginalised by any other tribe at a time your regional destiny and development was in your own hands, and at a time the federal government was in your pocket to define federal merit as Igbo only.

Read through this thread and see where the same people claiming to be sufferers of Nigeria's attempt to hold them to the ground, are equally boasting that they are doing so well, which is majorly in the Nigeria that is beyond the confines of the SouthEast.

SashaBanks:


Nnam I know what am telling you when I say that we don't! Am not saying East is empty. Nope.

Am only saying there is no place in the East you have a high concentration of human beings like Kano or Lagos. Maybe PH. Igbo land is populated but not highly concentrated.

I know what am telling you when I say high concentration. My only grievance is that the people that form a huge number of that population in the places mentioned are Igbos.

If the Igbos in places like Ibadan, Kano, Lagos, Sokoto and Abuja should come back... You will understand what am talking about.

But its a pity that most of them bought the propaganda that nothing is happening in the East. Which is a pure lie!

Throwback:
Kettyking said more than this while campaigning for his Igbo brothers to leave Lagos and move their businesses to the East so that Lagos will perish and finally afford the SouthEast an opportunity to grow from a wealth that would be supposedly generated from Igbos by Igbos, until he eventually revealed years later that he too was sitting tight in Lagos and paying N1.5m rent to his Yoruba landlord.

The day Igbos all over Nigeria return to their regional enclave, is the day they will realise that a market needs customers, and without the customer there is no income, so profit, wealth and boasts will not exist. That is the day the arrogance will fall flat and perish.

At the end of the day, those who will happily occupy the space they exited, will still pay that tax for having benefited from that location.

A question the Igbos have never bothered to answer is what wealth or enterprise or commerce was ever associated to any Igbo community before they found themselves in Nigeria?

What geographical feature do they have for their own benefit like Lagos or Port-Harcourt?

What cultural ties do they have with nearby international neighbours that could make a vast commercial city develop from such human interrelations like Kano came to be?

Why is it that right from the onset of Nigeria, decades before independence, the migratory pattern was more prone to movement to the North and West? At least all Igbos were within their own enclave at that onset, so why didn't they stay home to grow wealth from within instead of make an escape to the outside to make wealth?

What vast natural resources do they have for the economic benefit of the state?

When the SouthEast is described as landlocked, it does not mean just landlocked like the many European countries that apologists love to reference without correlation, but landlocked and trapped within the greater Nigeria and at the mercy of economic policies of Nigeria.

Strikethem:
So there is igbo in Ibadan, your acclaimed slum of africa

enemybulldozer:
yorubas no dey tire for lies and propaganda at all haba!!
OK, let me ask you a question, before the emergence of the white men what were your tribe known for??
Was there anything like lagos, ogun, Abuja and kano before the white men came to this part of the world??
You want us to believe that if the igbos should sumorn courage and go back to their land to do their business that no body will patronize them??
If that is the case, why is it that the likes of innoson motors, chikason group, cutix plc, ibeto group, cento group of companies and many others are still in business till today??
You Afonjas should know that your lies and propaganda can no longer fly because of what kanu did.

Xander85:


I just knew you'd bring up that 'greedy Igbo truncated the first republic' line! It's hilarious! Care to point out when and where Ndigbo mandated Nzeogwu and co to carry out a coup? You do realise that Ndigbo in particular and the Eastern Region in general had no reason to change the status-quo seeing as they were doing quite well economically. The choice of planning and executing the coup should be placed squarely at the door mouth of Nzeogwu and co, and last i checked they were not all Igbo. So i don't get why you people keep on propagating this lie of 'Igbo coup'.

Besides, isn't it your kind that say Igbo are only found within the confines of the South East? Or is it a case of changing the ethnic make up of the Aniomas depending on the argument at any point in time and depending on which side of the bed you get up from in the morning?

You see, i blame the likes of Zik for not seeing the insecure, tribal and bigoted type of people he was intent on coupling us with! The jobs ndigbo got in the north and south west, did they get them by holding a gun to anyones head? If guys like you made up the generality of the population of places like the US or the UK, they'd still be backwards uncivilised cesspools of mediocrity and ethnic strife! You listen to the argumant a so called founding father of Nigeria made, and you have no problem with it solely because his fire was aimed at Ndigbo! All his assertions were all subjective and libelous....a so called founding father, yet you have no problem with what he said!

If a people settle anywhere, they're free to vote and be voted for at the place of their abode! Any position to the contrary should be backed by the constitution and not by the whims and prejudices of hateful, insecure bigots!

You need to quit with this argument of Ndigbo needing to be grateful for some imagined benevolence accorded them by the 'owners of the land' where they went to 'seek refuge'! It smacks of a misplaced and unmerited sense of superiority, smugness and arrogance! Ndigbo are only taking advantage of opportunities accorded them by the constitution, and were not handed anything on a platter....which is more than i can say for those stealing our oil wealth in the name of 'one Nigeria' and questionable laws that place the ownership and control of the oyel and gas in my backyard in the hands of some far off leeching bigots!

You actually want to argue that if things are done on merit in Nigeria that Ndigbo would not come out second to none...that the Hausa/Fulani would still occupy all the 'juicy' and critical appointments and jobs in the civil/public service? You think the fact that Ndigbo economic and administrative capabilities were trusted by the British, and thus on the day of 'independence' in 1960 held a good number of critical positions in gov't, military, politics and the economy...you think all this was just a fluke and that the Brits didn't know what they were doing? Dude, get real!

You do realise the Yoruba and Hausa/Fulani have gained more from the Igbo than we've gained from you? Calculate the amount of money you lot have made from the exploitation of the hydrocarbons found in Alaigbo (note: i said Alaigbo and not the politically contrived South East)....you'd be amazed at what you find! I'm including all the hydrocarbon rich areas you conniving lot took from the East Central state (and later Imo and Abia states) and placed in Rivers state just so you could get easy access and control away from those 'pesky inyamiri/y'ibo/fla'theads'!

T9ksy:



@ bolded.......................that will be the day!!! Pigs (pun not intended) will fly first.

Even on the pain of death (at the onset of boko haram brouhaha), they still refused to leave the north.

Though they are found of tagging yorubas, igbophobic yet they litters yorubaland like locusts.

Tripleclick:
Shut up.... It is none of your concern.... We r there for business

enemybulldozer:
yorubas no dey tire for lies and propaganda at all haba!!
OK, let me ask you a question, before the emergence of the white men what were your tribe known for??
Was there anything like lagos, ogun, Abuja and kano before the white men came to this part of the world??
You want us to believe that if the igbos should sumorn courage and go back to their land to do their business that no body will patronize them??
If that is the case, why is it that the likes of innoson motors, chikason group, cutix plc, ibeto group, cento group of companies and many others are still in business till today??
You Afonjas should know that your lies and propaganda can no longer fly because of what kanu did.

Throwback:


Ahmadu Bello never cared about Nigeria, hence his decision to remain in the regional space to remain as premier and rather allow his deputy party leader Tafawa Balewa to proceed to the federal parliament and eventually become Prime Minister. Unlike Awolowo and Azikiwe, who like Bello were also pioneering regional premiers but had federal ambitions that bello never cared for.

Whatever policy he enacted for the good of his own region is apt if it serves the people and purpose of that region. No one dictated policy to the West or East, so no reason why anyone should dictate to the North what should be best and accommodating for migrants of other regions who had already fully occupied their own regional space and jobs before looking outside.

So indeed, I have no problem with what a regional premier that is well known to accommodate the culturally and religiously diverse tribes of his enclave, initiated for the benefit of his own region. Later history has already taught us that even within the same homogeneous ethnicity and religion, some states will lay off workers just because they are from a different state, while the other state too reply with same intra-tribal discrimination.

That you too bemoan that Northenization policy for its North first agenda, only suggest that I am right to say you Igbos left your own region having found the opportunities there limiting, and voluntarily proceeded to the greater land spaces Nigeria afforded you to make a better living. A Nigeria that was yet to "marginalize" Igbos as you all love to wail and whine about.

As for the oil and gas that has so much benefited Nigeria, most of it has remained outside of whatever you chose to call Alaigbo. For what you call Alaigbo, I could also mention the Yoruboid Itsekiris who have been commercially producing oil long before any Alaigbo tribe. If you mention Imo and Abia oil, then you should remember that Ondo has also been producing more oil than those 2 SouthEast states combined, and Lagos is now producing too.


I am not asking you to be grateful without reason, I am telling you to stop denigrating and disrespecting the places you found economic refuge for yourselves, for which you now try to claim you were forced to migrate because your own region under your control was denied development.

I am also telling you to remember what made your tribe depart the tribal enclave on an economic sojourn, as you now clamour to bring the lost sheep back into the same enclave they voluntarily departed and continue to flee from till today. Remember your economic condition when you dreamed of a life outside, and your economic condition now that you arrogantly claim and regret that you have developed a foreign place you arrived with no penny in your pocket, so you want to now return home to develop your origins.

Remember that the star that does not remain in the sky will only drop to the Earth and turn into dust, while the sky will ever remain shining with newer stars.