lawani:

I have deduced that the Oduduwa ruling family must have come from Egypt but at the time Egypt was ruled by a dynasty originating from Sumerian hence the mention of Nimrod by the prince that was crowned in Ile Ife. There is a good possibility that Ife was in Kogi state when Oduduwa came because there are some Ifes in Igala land till now and the Onu ife there does not bow to the Attach Igala. My belief is that the Jukun sacked that Ife or troubled them a lot and they relocated to Igbomokun in Osun state which they renamed Ife. I believe the bronze work found in Ugbo Ukwu is of Ice origin and it should be Ife Igala as Igala land is also in Anambra state with ethnic Igalas. The Igala as they are now are being ruled by a Jukun origin dynasty but their political system is still of the Ife. I think the human being ruling does not matter since many monarchs inside Yoruba land are also of varying origin. They have the equivalent of Ogboni which they call Oboni and the Attah Igala us under such a council called Igalamela meaning The nine elders of Igala. They are the ones actually in charge of Igala land but the dynasty is Jukun origin while the language is Yoruboid and they have at least two ancient Ifes on their land whose kings are definitely descended from ancient Ife royalty.

Monarchy system in Yoruba land do not have different origin per see. The model use in Yoruba kingdoms are fashioned after the ancestral lineage at iléifẹ. So, I strongly hold unto this belief system. Obáship system with little modification.

Egypt as it was had different groups lived inside her at the time in the past but the Oduduwà name factoring didn't exist except other names being answered by clans among Yorùbas.

Besides, Oduduwà has two different personalities;the oduduwà(Ìwà),the one who cannot die,ruler of the world that descended from Ọrún and the other one who died and was the pioneer unifying king of the land occupied by thirteen communities in the ancient Iléifẹ. He was of the descendants of Ògún the Aarẹ Crown owner.......

Obalufon:
Good

Can you verify who was Daudu in praise song of Obátasa,Obátálá ?

Olu317:
Monarchy system in Yoruba land do not have different origin per see. The model use in Yoruba kingdoms are fashioned after the ancestral lineage at iléifẹ. So, I strongly hold unto this belief system. Obáship system with little modification.

Egypt as it was had different groups lived inside her at the time in the past but the Oduduwà name factoring didn't exist except other names being answered by clans among Yorùbas.

Besides, Oduduwà has two different personalities;the oduduwà(Ìwà),the one who cannot die,ruler of the world that descended from Ọrún and the other one who died and was the pioneer unifying king of the land occupied by thirteen communities in the ancient Iléifẹ. He was of the descendants of Ògún the Aarẹ Crown owner.......

Everybody in Yoruba land is related and if you see the corpse of a Yoruba person anywhere in the world, it can be determined to be a Yoruba person. However anybody can become Oba and a large number of beaded crowns in Yoruba land are not patrilineally descended from the new dynasty that was established 51 kings ago in Ile Ife. The person that established the dynasty was given an Ifa name. Oduduwa is an Ifa name while Lamurudu is not. No Yoruba person was ever named Lamurudu which is Nimrod a Sumerian.
No one needs to be told that Oduduwa was originally female. ODU demotes feminity and the Ofun meji story where Ogbaragada was divined for Oduduwa where he was mentioned as the creator of all IWA whose conduct will never be questioned is still feminine since the source of creation concept has to be feminine but there have been male Oduduwas. Awujale, Olowu, Oluwo, and many others are not descended patrilineally from Oduduwa and even many kings are only institutionally descended from him being from a line of a Princess. However the man is the founder of the current dynasty what Williams the conqueror is to England

lawani:


Everybody in Yoruba land is related and if you see the corpse of a Yoruba person anywhere in the world, it can be determined to be a Yoruba person. However anybody can become Oba and a large number of beaded crowns in Yoruba land are not patrilineally descended from the new dynasty that was established 51 kings ago in Ile Ife. The person that established the dynasty was given an Ifa name. Oduduwa is an Ifa name while Lamurudu is not. No Yoruba person was ever named Lamurudu which is Nimrod a Sumerian.
No one needs to be told that Oduduwa was originally female. ODU demotes feminity and the Ofun meji story where Ogbaragada was divined for Oduduwa where he was mentioned as the creator of all IWA whose conduct will never be questioned is still feminine since the source of creation concept has to be feminine but there have been male Oduduwas. Awujale, Olowu, Oluwo, and many others are not descended patrilineally from Oduduwa and even many kings are only institutionally descended from him being from a line of a Princess. However the man is the founder of the current dynasty what Williams the conqueror is to England

Who told Oduduwa was a female personality? Show such in Ifá stanzas that A crown wearing Adé Arẹ is a female entity or Save me this information of yours.

Irè o o

Olu317:
Who told Oduduwa was a female personality? Show such in Ifá stanzas that A crown wearing Adé Arẹ is a female entity or Save me this information of yours.

Irè o o

Oduduwa worshipped among the Awori is female. Obatala is rendered as female and mother of Esu and etc. ODU itself connotes feminity. The Ofun meji story of Oduduwa mentioned that it was Odu that made the sacrifice and after the sacrifice was renamed Oduduwa. Is there any doubt that Odu is female?. The Odu in the Osa meji that was given the power of the Iya mi eleye was female. Wasn't she?. And it was Odu that was renamed Oduduwa

lawani:


Oduduwa worshipped among the Awori is female. Obatala is rendered as female and mother of Esu and etc. ODU itself connotes feminity. The Ofun meji story of Oduduwa mentioned that it was Odu that made the sacrifice and after the sacrifice was renamed Oduduwa. Is there any doubt that Odu is female?. The Odu in the Osa meji that was given the power of the Iya mi eleye was female. Wasn't she?. And it was Odu that was renamed Oduduwa

Lol. Odudua never worshipped under Awori. He was a king that fused three foundational kingdoms that later turned thirteen pre and during Oduduà era.

So, update with facts and not assumption! Can you inform when Awori was founded and by who ? Will you ever reference Awori without Òógúnfúnmínírè ? The same foundational prince Òógúnfúnmínírè who was ancestrally Oduduwa male descendant. Get yourfact right

The Adé Aare itself was worn by the man identified as Òogún "Oduduà" and belong to his dynasty . His descendants both male and female are the ones that married into former dynasty andotherrelatedYoruba groups and beyond to form the Necleus families Yorùbá have. So equip yourself with fact and not fiction.

Even when the man died, the Adé Aare still remain within the purview of the family that owns it despite other families had worn it.

Olu317:
Lol. Odudua never worshipped under Awori. He was a king that fused three foundational kingdoms that later turned thirteen pre and during Oduduà era.

So, update with facts and not assumption! Can you inform when Awori was founded and by who ? Will you ever reference Awori without Òógúnfúnmínírè ? The same foundational prince Òógúnfúnmínírè who was ancestrally Oduduwa male descendant. Get yourfact right

The Adé Aare itself was worn by the man identified as Òogún "Oduduà" and belong to his dynasty . His descendants both male and female are the ones that married into former dynasty andotherrelatedYoruba groups and beyond to form the Necleus families Yorùbá have. So equip yourself with fact and not fiction.

Even when the man died, the Adé Aare still remain within the purview of the family that owns it despite other families had worn it.

You are always more reactionary than academic in your analysis. I have noticed that.

What you need to understand is that Oduduwa is a primordial deity in the Yoruba pantheon as basic as Ogun or Oya, Osun and etc and it's attribute is perfection in character. Ogun is innovation, Osun is increase, Oya is sudden change like ruling the stock exchange as someone said, Obatala is government, Orunmila is wisdom etc etc. Then Olodumare himself is Oduduwa if perchance you can defend all your actions then like Olodimare you are Oduduwa. Obatala is Oduduwa, Orunmila is Oduduwa etc. You can be so named at birth or given to you as an alias. Obatala, Oduduwa were both portrayed as women in the corpus. Ogun is always male and Oya is referred to as the female version or the closest to Ogun that a female can be. Obatala and Oduduwa can be approached either as male or female but the basic Odu the first Odu is female. Odu is always female and never male. It was ODU that was given the Eye to become Iyami Osoranga and she was the only female that initially accompanied the irunmales to Earth according to Osa meji where she got the Eye from Olodumare.
So till now some people still approach Oduduwa as a female and go to the extent of having unrestricted sex in her temple during special festivals according to an account I read that I can not find online anymore.

Then succession in Yoruba land is institutional. It is always rotational among ruling families who are founded by the sons of the founder of the dynasty. The ones in Ile Ife presently were founded by the first Ooni who was born of a bond woman owned by Oduduwa. The ruling families in Ile Ife are descended from that son who was a baby when his older brothers were already grandfathers. His title was changed to Ooni from Olofin to reflect that he is not their father but he was left to take care of rituals, songs, history etc. I hope you understand now?. Among the ruling families in any Yoruba city, a princess can become the monarch not impossible, also possible for a son of a princess to become the monarch but he belongs to the house of his mother or do you think he will be allowed on the throne if he is claiming to be from another lineage?. If you are claiming the title belonging to your mother's family then you will identify with that family while remembering the history of your father but your reign belongs to your mother's family and you will be greeted as such. All monarchies are related to the new Oduduwa but not all are directly patrilineal descendants of the man. The Awujale, Olowu are descended from Oduduwa but not patrilineally, their monarchies stretched back centuries before Oduduwa. In Ile Ife there are royal families derived from princess but they are institutionally Oduduwa princes. Same in Ijesa but in Benin all are patrilineal. Ijesa and Ife have had female kings that had sons. I myself have evidence of descent from Oduduwa but not patrilineal. All Yoruba are connected to the Oduduwa one way or the other.

There are still Orunmila descended dynasties in Yoruba land Ajero, Alara, Olowo and many others are by their titles descendants of Orunmila. In Ijesa are many beaded crowns that preceded the formation of Ijesa, they are all most probably descendants of Orunmila or even earlier than Orunmila. Owalare Elerinmo and some others. In Ile Ife itself many chiefs like Obalufe, Obaloran, Obadio etc must be descendants of Orunmila or earlier because Orunmila is maybe 5000 years ago. Nobody is saying Oduduwa is not the father. Anybody can be the father and everybody recognize the current Ife but history for the sake of posterity should be presented properly. There 8s however nothing wrong with differing accounts. Let everybody keep their accounts but in the past the Oyo empire was to Ile Ife what the USA now is to Ireland or the UK even moreso because Ife was totally under protection. According to Ijesa account Ife was once under the protection of Ijesa.
https://journeyingtothegoddess./2012/12/27/goddess-odudua/

lawani:


You are always more reactionary than academic in your analysis. I have noticed that.

What you need to understand is that Oduduwa is a primordial deity in the Yoruba pantheon as basic as Ogun or Oya, Osun and etc and it's attribute is perfection in character. Ogun is innovation, Osun is increase, Oya is sudden change like ruling the stock exchange as someone said, Obatala is government, Orunmila is wisdom etc etc. Then Olodumare himself is Oduduwa if perchance you can defend all your actions then like Olodimare you are Oduduwa. Obatala is Oduduwa, Orunmila is Oduduwa etc. You can be so named at birth or given to you as an alias. Obatala, Oduduwa were both portrayed as women in the corpus. Ogun is always male and Oya is referred to as the female version or the closest to Ogun that a female can be. Obatala and Oduduwa can be approached either as male or female but the basic Odu the first Odu is female. Odu is always female and never male. It was ODU that was given the Eye to become Iyami Osoranga and she was the only female that initially accompanied the irunmales to Earth according to Osa meji where she got the Eye from Olodumare.
So till now some people still approach Oduduwa as a female and go to the extent of having unrestricted sex in her temple during special festivals according to an account I read that I can not find online anymore.

Then succession in Yoruba land is institutional. It is always rotational among ruling families who are founded by the sons of the founder of the dynasty. The ones in Ile Ife presently were founded by the first Ooni who was born of a bond woman owned by Oduduwa. The ruling families in Ile Ife are descended from that son who was a baby when his older brothers were already grandfathers. His title was changed to Ooni from Olofin to reflect that he is not their father but he was left to take care of rituals, songs, history etc. I hope you understand now?. Among the ruling families in any Yoruba city, a princess can become the monarch not impossible, also possible for a son of a princess to become the monarch but he belongs to the house of his mother or do you think he will be allowed on the throne if he is claiming to be from another lineage?. If you are claiming the title belonging to your mother's family then you will identify with that family while remembering the history of your father but your reign belongs to your mother's family and you will be greeted as such. All monarchies are related to the new Oduduwa but not all are directly patrilineal descendants of the man. The Awujale, Olowu are descended from Oduduwa but not patrilineally, their monarchies stretched back centuries before Oduduwa. In Ile Ife there are royal families derived from princess but they are institutionally Oduduwa princes. Same in Ijesa but in Benin all are patrilineal. Ijesa and Ife have had female kings that had sons. I myself have evidence of descent from Oduduwa but not patrilineal. All Yoruba are connected to the Oduduwa one way or the other.

There are still Orunmila descended dynasties in Yoruba land Ajero, Alara, Olowo and many others are by their titles descendants of Orunmila. In Ijesa are many beaded crowns that preceded the formation of Ijesa, they are all most probably descendants of Orunmila or even earlier than Orunmila. Owalare Elerinmo and some others. In Ile Ife itself many chiefs like Obalufe, Obaloran, Obadio etc must be descendants of Orunmila or earlier because Orunmila is maybe 5000 years ago. Nobody is saying Oduduwa is not the father. Anybody can be the father and everybody recognize the current Ife but history for the sake of posterity should be presented properly. There 8s however nothing wrong with differing accounts. Let everybody keep their accounts but in the past the Oyo empire was to Ile Ife what the USA now is to Ireland or the UK even moreso because Ife was totally under protection. According to Ijesa account Ife was once under the protection of Ijesa.
https://journeyingtothegoddess./2012/12/27/goddess-odudua/

To be candid, I am reactionary because information you find on google are not always factual. This doesn't mean, good information aren't on google, so do not misunderstood me.

Albeit if you have to go along the pantheon,then I can assure you there lot of hidden information just because of secrecy of Yorùbá understanding of society which has done us badly.

So, the oduduwa you think, is feminine was a creativity of samuel Ajayi crowther who tilted the information given to him more from ọyọ́'s court falsified history and the wrong Ado Odò version.

Interestingly at iléifẹ, every family know their strength and limit. While Oduduwa fought against Obatala( the human ones though fought against each other).He was accepted and crowned.Ajibosin was Paternally of Obátalá and was Oduduwa's daughter's son. Where is the false Oduduwa female at Iléifẹ ? Ask Owu people who AJibosin was!

Infact Obámeri was killed for this war because he supported Oduduwa, which Oduduwa eventually won as a male warrior. This was what culminated to the establishment of the unification dynasty under the pioneer Ogún descendants identified as Odù tíó dá ìwà, the young able character man who descended from Orà hill.

From the oral and factual point with regalias as symbols which each family house at iléifẹ distinctively separates each household from the other that existed till tomorrow . If so, how can you talk about the feminism of a male king?

The Atiba Ọyọ́ linked family which Samuel Ajayi crowther hinged his all and all information on is even a mother side to the throne. This is the basis for your arguement,which is flawful.

Infact, this doesn't mean, there are no core father side to the throne till forever of Ọrànmiyàn descendants. But they are just being sidelined due to dismantled system brought about by Western world.

And why should we be surprised when minute Ọlọ́yọ́ descendants of female lineage call his ancestor son as a slave in Iléifẹ? I am no surprised.

If you want fact, go visit people at iléifẹ and stop overemphasising pseudo Wikipedia's information on the history of Yorùbá cum Odùà dynasty.

If you ask the google or majority of people who the founder of Iléifẹ is ? Most often it is Obátala but the founder of Iléifẹ was Orúnmilà while the oldest deified personality in Yorùbá land is Orà in Iléifẹ.

For further information on it consult each family house at iléifẹ to know that most post or facebook or google do not represent the reality of Yorùbá Race.

Cheers

Olu317:
To be candid, I am reactionary because information you find on google are not always factual. This doesn't mean, good information aren't on google, so do not misunderstood me.

Albeit if you have to go along the pantheon,then I can assure you there lot of hidden information just because of secrecy of Yorùbá understanding of society which has done us badly.

So, the oduduwa you think, is feminine was a creativity of samuel Ajayi crowther who tilted the information given to him more from ọyọ́'s court falsified history and the wrong Ado Odò version.

Interestingly at iléifẹ, every family know their strength and limit. While Oduduwa fought against Obatala( the human ones though fought against each other).He was accepted and crowned.Ajibosin was Paternally of Obátalá and was Oduduwa's daughter's son. Where is the false Oduduwa female at Iléifẹ ? Ask Owu people who AJibosin was!

Infact Obámeri was killed for this war because he supported Oduduwa, which Oduduwa eventually won as a male warrior. This was what culminated to the establishment of the unification dynasty under the pioneer Ogún descendants identified as Odù tíó dá ìwà, the young able character man who descended from Orà hill.

From the oral and factual point with regalias as symbols which each family house at iléifẹ distinctively separates each household from the other that existed till tomorrow . If so, how can you talk about the feminism of a male king?

The Atiba Ọyọ́ linked family which Samuel Ajayi crowther hinged his all and all information on is even a mother side to the throne. This is the basis for your arguement,which is flawful.

Infact, this doesn't mean, there are no core father side to the throne till forever of Ọrànmiyàn descendants. But they are just being sidelined due to dismantled system brought about by Western world.

And why should we be surprised when minute Ọlọ́yọ́ descendants of female lineage call his ancestor son as a slave in Iléifẹ? I am no surprised.

If you want fact, go visit people at iléifẹ and stop overemphasising pseudo Wikipedia's information on the history of Yorùbá cum Odùà dynasty.

If you ask the google or majority of people who the founder of Iléifẹ is ? Most often it is Obátala but the founder of Iléifẹ was Orúnmilà while the oldest deified personality in Yorùbá land is Orà in Iléifẹ.

For further information on it consult each family house at iléifẹ to know that most post or facebook or google do not represent the reality of Yorùbá Race.

Cheers

Until I have evidence to the contrary I believe the new Oduduwa became Olofin without any incident of struggle though naturally many will not fully support him. This is because there was a prophecy and they were already waiting for him. Not different much from what happened in Benin. Once I get evidence to the contrary I will discard the conclusion. I will further posit that the ceremonies of plays showing Obatala and Odudua followers duelling predates the new Oduduwa and was in place 10068 years ago. The odun Olojo was in place that far back with the same depiction of struggle between Oduduwa and Obatala but I am hopeful to be out debated with logic and facts. Then nobody said Ooni is a slave but the mother of the first Ooni was a bond woman. Mother of Aare Afonja was a bond woman as well and he contested for the Alaafin. What they say is that the Ooni is junior to them in rank but senior by traditional duty of record keeping. They are all valid princes of Oduduwa institutionally

lawani:


Until I have evidence to the contrary I believe the new Oduduwa became Olofin without any incident of struggle though naturally many will not fully support him. This is because there was a prophecy and they were already waiting for him. Not different much from what happened in Benin. Once I get evidence to the contrary I will discard the conclusion. I will further posit that the ceremonies of plays showing Obatala and Odudua followers duelling predates the new Oduduwa and was in place 10068 years ago. The odun Olojo was in place that far back with the same depiction of struggle between Oduduwa and Obatala but I am hopeful to be out debated with logic and facts. Then nobody said Ooni is a slave but the mother of the first Ooni was a bond woman. Mother of Aare Afonja was a bond woman as well and he contested for the Alaafin. What they say is that the Ooni is junior to them in rank but senior by traditional duty of record keeping. They are all valid princes of Oduduwa institutionally

Which New Oduua ?
The only man identified as odua is a descendant of Oogún and not father to son but a later male descendant. He was young,and the one that was the pioneer unifying king. No female Ooni identified as oduduwa though he had daughters. One of Odua's daughter gave birth to Ajibosin, of Ora nfẹ descendants etc. interbreeding has always being the order of the day. So, if you need fact concur to my advise that you should visit iléifẹ to clear your doubt

Olu317:
Which New Oduua ?
The only man identified as odua is a descendant of Oogún and not father to son but a later male descendant. He was young,and the one that was the pioneer unifying king. No female Ooni identified as oduduwa though he had daughters. One of Odua's daughter gave birth to Ajibosin, of Ora nfẹ descendants etc. interbreeding has always being the order of the day. So, if you need fact concur to my advise that you should visit iléifẹ to clear your doubt

Not only the regurgitation of facts is important in history. Mathematics is also important. The Oduduwa that established the current dynasty lived 51 kings ago max and there were some kings that died the same day they were inaugurated. Give them thirty years each and you have 1550 years ago out of 10068 years that Ife Ooyelagbo was established. Therefore the current dynasty did not originate from the beginning. Even Kemitic Egypt was established thousands of years after the establishment of Ife Ooyelagbo. Therefore your calculation is wrong.

lawani:


Not only the regurgitation of facts is important in history. Mathematics is also important. The Oduduwa that established the current dynasty lived 51 kings ago max and there were some kings that died the same day they were inaugurated. Give them thirty years each and you have 1550 years ago out of 10068 years that Ife Ooyelagbo was established. Therefore the current dynasty did not originate from the beginning. Even Kemitic Egypt was established thousands of years after the establishment of Ife Ooyelagbo. Therefore your calculation is wrong.

No, such calculations is flawful as some researchers have done in the past. What do you think, Obálùfọn Ogbógbódirín means ? How many years did Obálùfọn Ogbógbódirín lived on earth since your calculations is based on 51 personalities on the throne ?

Olu317:
No, such calculations is flawful as some researchers have done in the past. What do you think, Obálùfọn Ogbógbódirín means ? How many years did Obálùfọn Ogbógbódirín lived on earth since your calculations is based on 51 personalities on the throne ?

Whatever it means, he did not reign for up to 100 years. In Oyo they claim one Alaafin ruled for centuries but I will say the reign would have been that of many people without the people knowing due to the fact that the Alaafin was always behind a veil of beads and could be replaced without the knowledge of the generality of the people. No indication that any human being can live up to 200 years at least not in the past few thousand years. Ife also claim to have had 90 kings before Oduduwa arrived. If you say the earlier ones of that set lived longer, I might be inclined to agree it can be possible.

Wow amazing i never knew this before now

lawani:


Whatever it means, he did not reign for up to 100 years. In Oyo they claim one Alaafin ruled for centuries but I will say the reign would have been that of many people without the people knowing due to the fact that the Alaafin was always behind a veil of beads and could be replaced without the knowledge of the generality of the people. No indication that any human being can live up to 200 years at least not in the past few thousand years. Ife also claim to have had 90 kings before Oduduwa arrived. If you say the earlier ones of that set lived longer, I might be inclined to agree it can be possible.

My brother, veil covering started with Ooni and not Ọlọ́yọ́. The name Aláafin started as a title in 1837.

Yes, Olú-Ọyọ́ was a powerful kingdom which later turned to Empire much later in 16th century without a veil. The crown with the bead roundabout it made it much of veil with covering of the mouth aswell.

While, that is out of it, Oduduwa reigned after the unification of the three ancestors families were submerged under him. Before his time, it was a rotational government among the lords of the distinctive pioneer families of the thirteen settlements .

So,a lot information have been wrongly passed by people who are associated with Ileifẹ but without venturing into the original fact in Iléifẹ. There is no doubt that all people in Iléifẹ are not patrilineal descendants of his but a lot are maternally linked to Him.

The same can be said about Oranfẹ descendants and otherLords which actually support the hybrids nature of Yorùbá Race.


Without mincing fact, it is important as researchers that we need do more to attain the truthful nature on Yorùbá unique Racial complexion.

Olu317:
My brother, veil covering started with Ooni and not Ọlọ́yọ́. The name Aláafin started as a title in 1837.

Yes, Olú-Ọyọ́ was a powerful kingdom which later turned to Empire much later in 16th century without a veil. The crown with the bead roundabout it made it much of veil with covering of the mouth aswell.

While, that is out of it, Oduduwa reigned after the unification of the three ancestors families were submerged under him. Before his time, it was a rotational government among the lords of the distinctive pioneer families of the thirteen settlements .

So,a lot information have been wrongly passed by people who are associated with Ileifẹ but without venturing into the original fact in Iléifẹ. There is no doubt that all people in Iléifẹ are not patrilineal descendants of his but a lot are maternally linked to Him.

The same can be said about Oranfẹ descendants and otherLords which actually support the hybrids nature of Yorùbá Race.


Without mincing fact, it is important as researchers that we need do more to attain the truthful nature on Yorùbá unique Racial complexion.

Somebody accepted as a father figure does not need to be the patrilineal ancestor of everybody but he is most probably related to everybody since he lived a long time ago. Whether patrilineal or matrilineal we are all descendants of the founder of the present dynasty. No child really is above the other, male or female and many princes are institutional and not patrilineal. Someone whose ancestor was a female king that birthed his grandfather who also was a King is a valid prince despite that he is far removed from the patrilineal line. Institutional is more important. Forget line of descent. That is not important.

lawani:


Somebody accepted as a father figure does not need to be the patrilineal ancestor of everybody but he is most probably related to everybody since he lived a long time ago. Whether patrilineal or matrilineal we are all descendants of the founder of the present dynasty. No child really is above the other, male or female and many princes are institutional and not patrilineal. Someone whose ancestor was a female king that birthed his grandfather who also was a King is a valid prince despite that he is far removed from the patrilineal line. Institutional is more important. Forget line of descent. That is not important.

Your personal opinion. patrilineal descendants can not reject maternal link to the throne because after some generation , they do marry aback. This does not mean, it doesn't exist.It does as a matter of fact.

This is the reason, it was easy to use praise name to identify people in Yorùbá land. If not because of certain challenges, Atiba of Ọyọ́ will never had been a king in Ọyọ́. And from Atiba till today,Ọyọ́ of Orànmiyàn descendants have changed ifá means of choosing crown king to Ọyọ́mésí pattern.

Ayway, certain changes may occur outside iléifẹ but tradition ought be obeyed to a large extent. And I exposure to Yorùbá ancient valuable tradition will not be lost outrightly.

Olu317:
Your personal opinion. patrilineal descendants can not reject maternal link to the throne because after some generation , they do marry aback. This does not mean, it doesn't exist.It does as a matter of fact.

This is the reason, it was easy to use praise name to identify people in Yorùbá land. If not because of certain challenges, Atiba of Ọyọ́ will never had been a king in Ọyọ́. And from Atiba till today,Ọyọ́ of Orànmiyàn descendants have changed ifá means of choosing crown king to Ọyọ́mésí pattern.

Ayway, certain changes may occur outside iléifẹ but tradition ought be obeyed to a large extent. And I exposure to Yorùbá ancient valuable tradition will not be lost outrightly.

Identical twins are not the same. Two brothers are not the same. Yoruba nations are not the same. They can do whatever they like on their own land. Without them, Ife will not be relevant. Ife is not the one to tell them what to do. They all have distinct characteristics peculiar to them. Ijesa by any means is not similar to Ife. They are separate states. There were female Owas in Ijesa and their children are still royalty. They are of course patrilineal but institutional descendants of Oduduwa. Even so called sons will have among them a good number of biological bastards. So institutional is the valid descent and patrilineal does not matter.

Olu317:
Your personal opinion. patrilineal descendants can not reject maternal link to the throne because after some generation , they do marry aback. This does not mean, it doesn't exist.It does as a matter of fact.

This is the reason, it was easy to use praise name to identify people in Yorùbá land. If not because of certain challenges, Atiba of Ọyọ́ will never had been a king in Ọyọ́. And from Atiba till today,Ọyọ́ of Orànmiyàn descendants have changed ifá means of choosing crown king to Ọyọ́mésí pattern.

Ayway, certain changes may occur outside iléifẹ but tradition ought be obeyed to a large extent. And I exposure to Yorùbá ancient valuable tradition will not be lost outrightly.

Identical twins are not the same. Two brothers are not the same. Yoruba nations are not the same. They can do whatever they like on their own land. Without them, Ife will not be relevant. Ife is not the one to tell them what to do. They all have distinct characteristics peculiar to them. Ijesa by any means is not similar to Ife. They are separate states. There were female Owas in Ijesa and their children are still royalty. They are of course patrilineal but institutional descendants of Oduduwa. Even so called sons will have among them a good number of biological bastards. So institutional is the valid descent and patrilineal does not matter. Matrilineal line is forgotten by the Yoruba once it can no longer be traced but patrilineal is institutional. All members of same agbo Ile are from the same male ancestor even if you have no idea of the relationship but matrilineal is soon forgotten except you identify with your mother's compound and relocate there. In most cases, they will still know you are not from their paternal line but I don't think it matters.

lawani:


Identical twins are not the same. Two brothers are not the same. Yoruba nations are not the same. They can do whatever they like on their own land. Without them, Ife will not be relevant. Ife is not the one to tell them what to do. They all have distinct characteristics peculiar to them. Ijesa by any means is not similar to Ife. They are separate states. There were female Owas in Ijesa and their children are still royalty. They are of course patrilineal but institutional descendants of Oduduwa. Even so called sons will have among them a good number of biological bastards. So institutional is the valid descent and patrilineal does not matter. Matrilineal line is forgotten by the Yoruba once it can no longer be traced but patrilineal is institutional. All members of same agbo Ile are from the same male ancestor even if you have no idea of the relationship but matrilineal is soon forgotten except you identify with your mother's compound and relocate there. In most cases, they will still know you are not from their paternal line but I don't think it matters.

Enjoy

lawani:


Whatever it means, he did not reign for up to 100 years. In Oyo they claim one Alaafin ruled for centuries but I will say the reign would have been that of many people without the people knowing due to the fact that the Alaafin was always behind a veil of beads and could be replaced without the knowledge of the generality of the people. No indication that any human being can live up to 200 years at least not in the past few thousand years. Ife also claim to have had 90 kings before Oduduwa arrived. If you say the earlier ones of that set lived longer, I might be inclined to agree it can be possible.

Power shift in Ule -Ufe Oranfe Baba Baba Yoruba Dynasty rule for thousands of years likewise Obatala Dynasty Alade sesefun before Aka Oduduwa Dynasty in ife ile