babaearly:

Please can someone tell me why Jesus told his disciples to sell what they have and buy swords? I think its in Matthew i read that!

stimulus:

Luke 22:36 - 'Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.'

Can you tell us why Jesus told them to buy swords?

olrotimi:

hey dnt be too too literal here ehn, he was jus trying to make them realis that they and the xtians in general had a lot of battles to fight in a conflicting world as we see today.personal opinion though.

But Jesus told them to buy swords! At least Peter showed u proof i think its u who's been literal.

hey dnt be too too literal here ehn, he was jus trying to make them realis that they and the xtians in general had a lot of battles to fight in a conflicting world as we see today.personal opinion though.

Brother, firstly, was Jesus a christian and do you have any proof that his disciples are same.

Secondly why did he tell them to buy sword in the first place and I wwant to refreshen your memory that when in one the gospels, one of disciples showed him the physical and Jesus said it was ok.

olrotimi:

hey dnt be too too literal here ehn, he was jus trying to make them realis that they and the xtians in general had a lot of battles to fight in a conflicting world as we see today.personal opinion though.

Why do you Muslim apologists persist in asking such stupid questions??

Are two swords enough to defend twelve men?

How did Jesus react when Peter used his sword in the Garden of Gethsemane?

Think about if - if indeed you are serious about knowing the truth - then you may realise the inadequacies of a literal translation of the said text.

Olrotimi is right, this portion of scripture (like many others) is not meant to be taken literally.

Jesus was simply telling them that things were about to change and they needed to be prepared for the upcoming trials and tribulations they would face.

 
The disciples did not understand what he meant at this point and hence answered literally "we have 2 swords"

  Jesus answered "it is enough" why? when obviously 2 swords were not enough for 11 men to use to fight. He answered "it is enough" as in "you don't understand my point now, but you will later. For now, I've said enough"

If you read further when Jesus was arrested

"Then the men stepped forward, seized Jesus and arrested him. With that, one of Jesus' companions reached for his sword, drew it out and struck the servant of the high priest, cutting off his ear. "Put your sword back in its place," Jesus said to him, "for all who draw the sword will die by the sword.

  If Jesus had wanted them armed with actual swords, why would he ask His disciple to put down His sword here?

This shows that Jesus had previously not been talking about a "physical sword" but something else they misunderstood. And His negative reaction here to the use of a sword proves it.

Luke 22:37

37 For I say unto you, that this that is written must yet be accomplished in me, And he was reckoned among the transgressors: for the things concerning me have an end.
KJV

Jesus himself answered your question in the next verse . . .

Quote
Luke 22:37

37 For I say unto you, that this that is written must yet be accomplished in me, And he was reckoned among the transgressors: for the things concerning me have an end.
KJV

for the things concerning me have an end.

Every thing concerning his death had been prophesied and he knew it must all be fufilled.

He also knew about his betrayal, sufferings and death but didn't stop those. All that was prophesied about him had to be fulfilled.

He was only trying to tell them to tighten their belts spiritually.

You know the incarceration of Paul and Silas and the death of John the disciple

@All,

When people like babs787 and His hordes of blood-thirsty believers in allah try endlessly to associate Jesus with violence, one can't but wonder why this is so. In any case, it doesn't take a degree in rocket science to realise that their faith cannot stand on its two legs without a reference to Christianity or Judaism. Afterall, every fake product out there always find a way to atach itself to the authenthic product, either through its name or by repacking the same product though using inferior materials.

In a desperate attampt to justify Muhammad's blood-thirstyness, babs787 is trying to make us believe that Jesus was an advocate of armed conflict. How can He be an advocate of armed conflict when He taught that we should turn the other cheek when we are struck? How can He be blood thirsty when He stopped one of His overzealous Disciple from continuing bloodshed, and rather healed him that was hurt?

Luke 22v 36-38
36 Then he said to them: “But now let the one that has a purse take it up, likewise also a food pouch; and let the one having no sword sell his outer garment and buy one.

37 For I tell you that this which is written must be accomplished in me, namely, ‘And he was reckoned with lawless ones.’ For that which concerns me is having an accomplishment.”

38 Then they said: “Lord, look! here are two swords.” He said to them: “It is enough.”

My question to babs787 is this: Why didn't this same Jesus use a sword when the crowd were going to throw Him over a cliff?

Why would He need a sword when just by a spoken word from Him, the army that came to arrest Him fell back.

Is it not the same Jesus who said if he so wished, he could have called on His Father to send Him legions of Angels at that point in time to deliver Him (and not men with swords)?

So you see, it takes a man with an agenda to deny these truths and try to pin the unpinnable to him whom the scriptures refer to as the Prince of Peace.

Can you serve me the verse please?

I don't have much time for a rejoinder now. But here is the scripture you asked for:

John 18: 4 Jesus therefore, knowing all things that should come upon him, went forth, and said unto them, Whom seek ye? 5 They answered him, Jesus of Nazareth. Jesus saith unto them, I am he. And Judas also, which betrayed him, stood with them. 6 As soon then as he had said unto them, I am he, they went backward, and fell to the ground. 7 Then asked he them again, Whom seek ye? And they said, Jesus of Nazareth. 8 Jesus answered, I have told you that I am he: if therefore ye seek me, let these go their way: 9 That the saying might be fulfilled, which he spake, Of them which thou gavest me have I lost none. 10 Then Simon Peter having a sword drew it, and smote the high priest's servant, and cut off his right ear. The servant's name was Malchus. 11 Then said Jesus unto Peter, Put up thy sword into the sheath: the cup which my Father hath given me, shall I not drink it? 12 Then the band and the captain and officers of the Jews took Jesus, and bound him,

yes Jesus asked his followers to buy a sword, they understood the sword to be the sword of the Spirit but guess what?
Muhammad and his followers instead bought literal swords and went a-slashing

The rest of the story can be found in www. mohammed slash slash slash.come AKA koran and hadiths

Tayo-D, which do I hold on to? Jesus showing himself or Judas betraying him with a kiss?

Thanks

babs787:

@Jesoul




Ok




What trials are you referring to that needed the use of p[hysical sword?


Hope you are aware that he told me to sell whatever they are having and use to buy sword.



Now sister, since you are saying that he was preparing them for trials, why didnt he rebuke them when they told him that they were having physical swords because he knew too well that they would use the swords for attack?






I did sister




Good but it happened because he never thought that so much people would come for his arrest. My question again; why didnt he caution them when they told him that they were having physical sword?



You get it wrong. If he was not interested in any fight whatsoever, he wouldnt have told them to sell what they were having to buy sword and when Peter showed him physical sword, he ought to have cautioned him against using it but had to tell Peter that it is enough



Please thou shall not twist Jesus' saying . If he was not talking about physical sword, why didnt he go against it when Peter showed him physical sword? Why did he tell them that it is enough if he was not interested in physical sword?

Thanks

No scripture can be rightly interpreted without looking at other verses. God Himself testifies of it that it is a little here and a little there, and there is no scripture without its twin. So you see, all those scriptures do not contradict but compliment each other. The authors' perspectives are different and so their stories come across differently. That is where the Bible differ from the Qu'ran, we do not gather and burn other writings to come up with a politically correct one like is done with the Qu'ran.

As to the story line, all the authors combined give us the full picture. While indeed Judas kissed Jesus to identify Him, the Soldiers asked Jesus to also identify Himself just to be sure that they are getting the right person. If I take the Police along with me to arrest someone, and I point out the person, it is only judicious of the Police to ask the accused to identify himslef also. This is only common sense.

In any case, you have tried to dance around the subject being discussed by coming up with this.

The bottom line is that Jesus had the power in His words alone to defend Himself as the scriptures here testified.

So there is absolutely no need for the sword.

That should get you to rethink your stance that Jesus needed swords to defend Himself.

Besides, the same passage said Jesus knew all that was coming to Him, and He rebuked Peter after Peter declared that Jesus' death and suffering must not be allowed to happen. You want scriptures for that too?

Do I really need to reply this?

Simple go getting the rented DVD gospel movie called "The Passion of the Christ", it tells everything from the begining through the Lord's Supper prayer, how Jesus is arrested, and why Jesus is crucified VERY CLEARLY!

You stylishly deflected the thread with the claim that you would respond to the issue of 'why Jesus tell his disciples to buy sword' but at I will still respond to your last.

Let me first educate you about the Quran before going into your bible that happened to be my first experience. Other writings might have been burnt but the fact remains, no two Quran, verses, chapter are different one completing each other as you have been deceiving yourself with that.

Thou shall not lie. Let me serve you the two verses and you will see that in the first one, they did not know Jesus and he had to tell them that he was the one while the other verses says that Judas showed Juses to them by betraying him with a kiss.

Are you for real? The fact that I provided you proof that Jesus does not need physical sword to defend himself is deflecting the thread? Do you know the meaning of that word or you just don't know how to reason out a matter?

Don't deceive yourself. It wasn't other writings that were burnt. It was the Qu'ran that was burnt. The stronger man burnt the copies of those who were weaker and presented his copy as the only valid one. What makes you think that it is his copy that is authentic? Of course there is no competition becuase in the spirit of islam, the stronger one has killed off the weaker one, and claiming himself to be right. Assuming the makers of the KJV Bible destroys other translations of the Bible, does that make the KJV right? Absolutely not. Same with the Koran.

Again, your iability to reason clearly has betrayed your judgment. Let me bring your attention to the narration int the book of John where jesus identified Himself. John 18:4 5 They answered him, Jesus of Nazareth. Jesus saith unto them, I am he. And Judas also, which betrayed him, stood with them. You should ask yourself the question, how did Judas betray Jesus? The answer is with a Kiss.

Now even though John did not mention the actual kiss, he clearly indicated that at the point that Jesus identified Himself, Judas had already betrayed Him and was now standing back with the troops. For those who are not blinded by allah, it is clear that the betrayal with a kiss was a separate event that already took place at the time Jesus identified Himslef. This is how all scriptures work together in tandem to create a clear understanding.

Going forward, we can see from the above that Jesus did not showed himself but Judas had to do that by kissing him.

No, he couldnt do that without the support of his creator.

You havent replied to why he commanded them to buy sword and if you are saying that he didnt mean physical sword, why didnt he rebuke Peter when he showed him physical sword.

He didnt want to die because he didnt come to die but to preach the gospel which God sent him to come and do

and read your bible where he hid for Jews when he learnt they wanted to kill him, he prayed to God to deliver him and cried to God, 'why has thou forsaken me'

He may be aware of things to happen because God might have showed him but he didnt come to die for you and there is nowhere in the OT where his death, crucifixion and resurrecting after three days was prophesised and if you think you have, let me have it.