Dear Igbo brothers,
You do not have to blame our brothers of the south for all they've said, denying any sort of link or relation to us, except but, the language they speak.

Let's start with the ikwerre people of the delta area of Nigeria.
Long before, Nigeria was made, there had been absolute harmony between all tribes of the south east and southern states. The Igbos had no ardent pleasure to the southern states at such times, because of its riverine nature; this made farming highly hard or impossible in such areas at such times. Especially, farming the root crop, called YAM in such period, that was held in high esteem by the Igbo tribe.

The exodus had started based on intense population density in the south eastern region, thereby bringing the effect of what I call Igbo great trek. The Igbos began to spread out of their main location or as they call Ala. This had brought the former Igbo group, now humbly called the ikwerre in such areas of the extreme south, but not too extreme, because importance was still laid on farming root crops, especially by this Igbo groups. ( Farming was the main source of income in such periods).

The exodus kept on spreading even to the western areas of the east, in which our most esteemed Aniomas and Aniochas were made, coupled with the exodus from Edo states, thereby influencing mixed tribes and traditions in once indigenous tribal regions, either of Edo or Igbo stock.

The Igbos had high population density but low land space, because in such times the Igbos were known to be influencers in the south. We have the likes of Arochukwu( the priest and ibunkapi), Nri and the rest, that greatly influenced the south east and southern states in such times. And the low land space as can be seen in tribes that have high land space, was caused by apathy by the Igbo tribe in acquiring foreign lands. Perhaps I'm not sure it was either on traditional purposes or economical purposes that they had failed to acquire more lands at the south in such periods. But one thing I'm sure is, there was harmony between these tribes. The Igbos respected all tribes, but Arochukwu was the proud lot, based on its strong influence to such regions then.

Ikwerre people are believed to be Arochukwu descedents, but there haven't been any veritable proof for such claims( and please it's just a suggestion). So the said denial started when resources, where seen as the greater weight for prosperity.

The riverine areas were in such streak of grace, that the demanded resource was in abundance in the once rejected lands of the south. The Igbos, although had had mischievous and unscruplous leaders that ruled Nigeria in the past, also had genuine people of such tribe( Igbo) that wanted a form of collective benefit based on the harmony they once shared with their southern neighbors in the past.

The civil war of 1963 had arrived, and there was such disintegration by leaders of Non south east and south-south stock, who had seen unity as a strong support for a people, especially in the south east and south-south regions. Thereby making such people who claimed the tribe called Igbo, suffer such inhumane treatment like, closing bank accounts, reducing circulation of money in the economy of such communities, destruction of businesses and food shortages. Then the only option for this hapless tribes of the Igbo sub group, resorted to one thing, denial. This denial had stayed with their past fathers till present, only desiring to escape the ill treatment they had faced in such a country at such a time.

So dear Igbo brothers, let's leave our neighbourly Igbos in peace and accept their decisions. It isn't their fault, they only hold to what their fore fathers had taught and passed on to them. In my opinion, they'll only know we love them if it's seen from our actions and not by imposing our tribe on them. I've even heard that some of them know they're Igbos, but don't you think our forceful imposition on them can make them have second thoughts, like thinking the Igbo tribe are a set of imposing tribe, as some will say "searching for other land space, because our land is limited", in which we Igbos know ourselves, that it isn't true. But respect and love is gradually acquired and not forcefully taken.
Take for example the LORD JESUS CHRIST, he died for us and his a God of everything, and I mean everything you can think of. If he wanted to force us to be born-again he would have, but he gives us time to choose and love him, so that he can manifests himself in every area of our lives. God bless you.

DNA does not lie.

All communities that claim non Igbo origins should all take genetic tests and provide proof. Folk tales are not facts.

A Zulu man is genetically differentiable from a Senegambian man.

Some of these things might be correct about Ikwerre but Ika has never had Igbo consciousness in them from the beginning.

Stephench:
Some of these things might be correct about Ikwerre but Ika has never had Igbo consciousness in them from the beginning.

Even as recently as 100 years ago, no Igbo group even in the SE had an Igbo consciousness.

bigfrancis21:


Even as recently as 100 years ago, no Igbo group even in the SE had an Igbo consciousness.

But today they have? and you want to foist it on others?

Stephench:
But today they have? and you want to foist it on others?

Self actualization does not require fabricating one's "obvious" origins.

morpheus24:


Self actualization does not require fabricating one's "obvious" origins.

Yes of course. Do you have an evidence of any fabrications? The last time I checked, igbos are the one all over the internet fabricating and concocting people's history.

Stephench:
Yes of course. Do you have an evidence of any fabrications? The last time I checked, igbos are the one all over the internet fabricating and concocting people's history.

The evidence is in the linguistic, proximal and genetic evidence of these groups who deny the obvious "founder populations" that MOST LIKELY originate from the same founder populations that make up all the groups of igbo's today.

A simple DNA test of an IKA man and an IGbo man would confirm this genetic similarities between the two peoples even if one group seeks to identify ethnically as something else.

DNA does not lie nor does it require an affirmation of "IGBO consciousness". It will clearly show that these two groups are of the same stock.


Are you afraid of the truth. GO and take a DNA test. 23 and me is a good one, it will break down what ethnic group you belong to in Africa

morpheus24:


The evidence is in the linguistic, proximal and genetic evidence of these groups who deny the obvious "founder populations" that MOST LIKELY originate from the same founder populations that make up all the groups of igbo's today.

A simple DNA test of an IKA man and an IGbo man would confirm this genetic similarities between the two peoples even if one group seeks to identify ethnically as something else.

DNA does not lie nor does it require an affirmation of "IGBO consciousness". It will clearly show that these two groups are of the same stock.


Are you afraid of the truth. GO and take a DNA test. 23 and me is a good one, it will break down what ethnic group you belong to in Africa

This is a very dumb reply. So you base everything on something as dynamic as language? Have you heard of language shift, languages going extinct, acculturation? These things are dynamic and doesn't make sense to be fixated on them. They're considerable factors quite all right. But if you're not knowledgeable in these stuffs it's good you stand aside and watch. Do you know anything about Ika language how it was spoken few centuries ago, few decades ago and presently? Are you aware of many factors that contributed in this changes?

And you sound dumb again about DNA. Ika WOULD bla bla bla. And you think all Ikas have the same DNA? Why are you commenting on something you're just so ignorant about

Autodidact1:
This is a very dumb reply. So you base everything on something as dynamic as language? Have you heard of language shift, languages going extinct, acculturation? These things are dynamic and doesn't make sense to be fixated on them. They're considerable factors quite all right. But if you're not knowledgeable in these stuffs it's good you stand aside and watch. Do you know anything about Ika language how it was spoken few centuries ago, few decades ago and presently? Are you aware of many factors that contributed in this changes?

And you sound dumb again about DNA. Ika WOULD bla bla bla. And you think all Ikas have the same DNA? Why are you commenting on something you're just so ignorant about

Please my boss, be courteous and no insult we are all learning, God bless you.

The solution is to stop treating it like an identity crisis, because it actually isn't.

Autodidact1:
This is a very dumb reply. So you base everything on something as dynamic as language? Have you heard of language shift, languages going extinct, acculturation? These things are dynamic and doesn't make sense to be fixated on them. They're considerable factors quite all right. But if you're not knowledgeable in these stuffs it's good you stand aside and watch. Do you know anything about Ika language how it was spoken few centuries ago, few decades ago and presently? Are you aware of many factors that contributed in this changes?

And you sound dumb again about DNA. Ika WOULD bla bla bla. And you think all Ikas have the same DNA? Why are you commenting on something you're just so ignorant about

1. About Language. Acculturation and language shifts have little to do with phonetics, lexicon and sentence formation in particular of the IKA LANGUAGE. It is without a doubt that languages that are similar to each other within a given proximity point to high probabilities of a "source" founder population, butressed with DNA evidence, it is safe to assume that the two groups are SIGNIFICANTLY related to one another in comparison to other surrounding groups.



This is very evident in many African examples with many southern African and Bantu groups exhibiting this particular linguistic phenomena.

Case in Point. Ndebele, Zulu, Swati and Xhosa are all distinct languages of their own but without a doubt emanate from an original source Language from Nguni, their founding father. Most of these Nguni languages are also heavily influenced by the click sounds of the Khoi speakers, further pointing to the fact that the Khoi were heavily absorbed genetically into these aformentioned gropus. DNA evidence corroborates this hypothesis.


2. If you are so confident about your NON IGBO lineage why don't you take the test and come post the results here. 23 and me is a great one. It will break down the results of your ethnic affinity in Nigeria. When you confirm you can come back and call me S.T.U.P.I.D I will accept.

You can dance around acculturation, folk tales, My grandfather told us we are from here and there, etc etc etc, However DNA does not lie.!

Stephench:
But today they have? and you want to foist it on others?

That's not the point. Imagine the height of confusion the world would have been in today if everyone speaks one language and claims another ethnicity. For example, you come across De Santos Rivera who speaks Spanish as first language and practices Hispanic culture but he tells you he's not Hispanic but French because 100 years ago his great-grand father came from France. De Santos speaks no lick of French neither has he been to France before but claims he's a French man. Then you go to France and everyone is denying being French but claiming Portuguese, English etc over some migrations that occurred hundreds of years back.

In reality it doesn't work that way. This issue of migrations into/out of Igboland is not unique to the Igbo people. A LOT of migrations occurred in the past, amongst different ethnic groups. People crossed language borders and settled in new-found lands and adopted their new identity. Living in the identity of the past of over 500 years ago, especially given that the migrating ancestors willingly left their original origins and adopted new ones for reasons best known to them then but forgotten/unknown to us today, would be considered folly. For simplicity's sake, the culture/ethnicity you identify with today is what you are classified with.

Reverting to my original comment, the preference for some Ikas and Ukwuanis to maintain their sub-clan identity obtained all over Igboland as recently as 100 years ago. The Awka man was Awka, not Igbo. The Aro man was Aro not Igbo. The Owerri man was Owerri, not Igbo. Infact Igbo-speaking slaves, upon being shipped to the Americas between the 1600s and 1800s, were surprised to arrive here and were called 'Ibo', most of them admitted that they had never heard of such name or country back home and all they knew was their village names. Slave ship manifests show Igbo-speaking slaves arriving from the Port of Bonny or Calabar giving their respective clan names as their 'identity', i.e oquelle (okwelle in Imo state), aqoqua (akokwa in Imo state), aeche (Etche in Rivers state), Isigue (Isigwe), esuotchi (isuochi) etc. No slave mentioned 'Ibo' as their identity. Looking at us from a vantage point of view the British, upon arrival, discovered that we all spoke variations of basically the same language, regardless of prior origins and the umbrella name for all bia-speaking clans is Igbo. Yes, in Anioma many migrants came in from Bini to settle and totally adopted their new culture and language, however there were Igbo-speaking natives already present in Anioma, which ensured that Igbo language prevailed over the migrants' language (s). The theory that 'Igbos crossed the Niger and displaced our original language, that's why we speak Igboid-based dialects' is as laughable as it comes. Even in the world of academia and taxonomy, there's a general name for everything and then sub-names. Chicken, Duck, Parrot, Turkey etc are all birds but it doesn't stop each sub-category of the bird category to have/maintain their respective names.

I guess the question we should be asking is, why did many fleeing members from other tribes head east to Igboland in times of trouble? Igboland experienced tons of influx of migrants from neighbouring tribes than vice versa. For example, migrants from Igala (in Nsukka), Idoma (Ebonyi state), Yoruba (Delta/Olukwumi), Esan (Delta state), Ibibio (Abia state), etc. Was Igboland in the past relatively peaceful, obviously due to a lack of a central kingship system, with plentiful arable land for cultivation that it attracted an influx of fleeing/migrating members from other tribes?

bigfrancis21:
n

That's not the point. Imagine the height of confusion the world would have been today if everyone speaks one language and claims another ethnicity. For example, you come across De Santos Rivera who speaks Spanish as first language and practices Hispanic culture but he tells you he's not Hispanic but French because 100 years ago his great-grand father came from France. De Santos speaks no lick of French neither has he been to France before but claims he's a French man. Then you go to France and everyone is denying being French but claiming Portuguese, English etc over some migrations that occurred hundreds of years back.

In reality it doesn't work that way. This issue of migrations into/out of Igboland is not unique to the Igbo people. A LOT of migrations occurred in the past, amongst different ethnic groups. People crossed language borders and settled in new-found lands and adopted their new identity. Living in the identity of the past of over 500 years ago, especially given that the migrating ancestors willingly left their original origins and adopted new ones for reasons known best to them then but unknown to us today, would be considered folly. For simplicity, the culture/ethnicity you identify with today is what you are classified with.

Reverting to my original comment, the preference for some Ikas and Ukwuanis to maintain their sub-clan identity obtained all over Igboland as recently as 100 years ago. The Awka man was Awka, not Igbo. The Aro man was Aro not Igbo. The Owerri man was Owerri, not Igbo. Infact Igbo-speaking slaves, upon being shipped to the Americas between the 1600s and 1800s, were surprised to arrive here and were called 'Ibo', most of them admitted that they had never heard of such name or country back home and all they knew was their village names. Slave manifests show Igbo-speaking slaves arriving from the Port of Bonny or Calabar giving their respective clan names as their 'identity', i.e oquelle (okwelle in Imo state), aqoqua (akokwa in Imo state), aeche (Etche in Rivers state), Isigue (Isigwe), esuotchi (isuochi) etc. Looking at us from a vantage point of view, the British upon arrival, discovered that we all spoke variations of the same language, regardless of prior origins and the umbrella name for all bia-speaking clans is Igbo. Yes, in Anioma many migrants came in from Bini to settle and totally adopted their new culture and language, however there were Igbo-speaking natives already present in Anioma, which ensured that Igbo language prevailed over the migrants' language (s). The theory that 'Igbos crossed the Niger and displaced our original language, that's why we speak Igboid-based dialects' is as laughable as it comes. Even in the world of academia and taxonomy, there's a general name for everything and sub-names. Chicken, Duck, Parrot, Turkey etc are all birds but it doesn't stop each sub-category of the bird category to have/maintain their respective names.

I guess the question we should be asking is, why did many fleeing members from other tribes head east to Igboland? Igboland experienced tons of influx of migrants from neighbouring tribes than vice versa. For example, migrants from Igala (in Nsukka), Idoma (Ebonyi state), Yoruba (Delta/Olukwumi), Esan (Delta state), Ibibio (Abia state), etc.

Wow, I'm really impressed, I really learnt a lot and it's quite coherent.

bigfrancis21:


The theory that 'Igbos crossed the Niger and displaced our original language, that's why we speak Igboid-based dialects' is as laughable as it comes.

Please tell them o!

morpheus24:



1. About Language. Acculturation and language shifts have little to do with phonetics, lexicon and sentence formation in particular of the IKA LANGUAGE. It is without a doubt that languages that are similar to each other within a given proximity point to high probabilities of a "source" founder population, butressed with DNA evidence, it is safe to assume that the two groups are SIGNIFICANTLY related to one another in comparison to other surrounding groups.



This is very evident in many African examples with many southern African and Bantu groups exhibiting this particular linguistic phenomena.

Case in Point. Ndebele, Zulu, Swati and Xhosa are all distinct languages of their own but without a doubt emanate from an original source Language from Nguni, their founding father. Most of these Nguni languages are also heavily influenced by the click sounds of the Khoi speakers, further pointing to the fact that the Khoi were heavily absorbed genetically into these aformentioned gropus. DNA evidence corroborates this hypothesis.


2. If you are so confident about your NON IGBO lineage why don't you take the test and come post the results here. 23 and me is a great one. It will break down the results of your ethnic affinity in Nigeria. When you confirm you can come back and call me S.T.U.P.I.D I will accept.

You can dance around acculturation, folk tales, My grandfather told us we are from here and there, etc etc etc, However DNA does not lie.!

Another dumb one. You seem to know very little or nothing about Ika language. Although Ika language is an IGBOID language, it has a very different intonation and the inflection is edoid. Do you know about Ika language formation? I doubt you don't. Ika language syntax is very different from other Igboid group. Talk about lexicon and I agree Ika lexics is very Igbo presently. and you actually didn't make any point your reply. If language shift doesn't have much with everything you listed up there, what then does it have something to do with? Common sense should tell you the first part of the language that language shift should attack is the lexicon.

Within the last century, do you have any idea how many ika words that have been replaced with Igbo words? Even within the last few decades, I witnessed the death and replacement of hundreds of Ika words which I can list here if I have time. Most of these words are Edo/Edoid or exclusively Ika words which today nobody uses them in ikaland. The Igbo variant of it is now being used. I believe you're intelligent enough to understand some of the factors that is contributing to the shifting of Ika words from the original Edo/Ika variant to the Igbo variant.

And you're referring to DNA evidence like you already have a DNA evidence at hand. Who's denying any relationship between Ika and Igbo? Yoruba, Edo, Igala and Igbo are from the same parent so what exactly is your point here?

So I should discard my folktales (which are basically Edo based stories of Ogiso and Adhuaran/Aruans giant sons of Ogiso) and other ancient factors and dwell solely on the language factors which I'm sure you know nothing about? And how ignorant you appear here still talking about DNA. Do you think an Agbor man from a certain quarter would have exactly the same DNA with another from a different quarter? Height of ignorance.

We are Ika people. We know our history and where each clan came from. Each clan knows where the Ogbes that makes up the clan came from and each ogbe know the origin of all the Idumus and Ebons that makes up that Idumu.

Autodidact1:
Another dumb one. You seem to know very little or nothing about Ika language. Although Ika language is an IGBOID language

This statement just nullifies the rest of the rant below.

Autodidact1:

it has a very different intonation and the inflection is edoid. Do you know about Ika language formation? I doubt you don't. Ika language syntax is very different from other Igboid group. Talk about lexicon and I agree Ika lexics is very Igbo presently. and you actually didn't make any point your reply. If language shift doesn't have much with everything you listed up there, what then does it have something to do with? Common sense should tell you the first part of the language that language shift should attack is the lexicon.

The point here that you are trying to present is that in the past it was Edoid and got "replaced' by Igbo. Laughing in IKA language. How did it get replaced and by "whom". The best you can get out of your ranting here is that as Ika people you are a hybrid "race" of peoples between Igbo and Edo immigrants which does not negate my initial assertion, therefore if IGBO claim you, they are correct in doing so.

Autodidact1:

Within the last century, do you have any idea how many ika words that have been replaced with Igbo words? Even within the last few decades, I witnessed the death and replacement of hundreds of Ika words which I can list here if I have time. Most of these words are Edo/Edoid or exclusively Ika words which today nobody uses them in ikaland. The Igbo variant of it is now being used. I believe you're intelligent enough to understand some of the factors that is contributing to the shifting of Ika words from the original Edo/Ika variant to the Igbo variant.

The sentence formation and Lexicon is very Igbo so much so that an average Igbo person would probably understand about 50% of what an IKA person is saying and vice versa. Your language was not replaced it mutated from an original Igbo dialect that was isolated for a good period of time.

Autodidact1:

And you're referring to DNA evidence like you already have a DNA evidence at hand. Who's denying any relationship between Ika and Igbo? Yoruba, Edo, Igala and Igbo are from the same parent so what exactly is your point here?

The onus is not on me to prove you descend from direct Igbo migrants or settlers but for you to disprove it. My assertions are based on comparisons to other such phenomena in Africa and a probability of likely hood.

All Southern Nigerians are likely related to each other genetically. The point is to prove that the IKA are related to the Igbo far more so than any other surrounding group in the area including Edo peoples. Tell your people to take the tests so we can resolve this issue. Stop telling us about folktales your old people have been passing around as origin stories.

Autodidact1:

So I should discard my folktales (which are basically Edo based stories of Ogiso and Adhuaran/Aruans giant sons of Ogiso) and other ancient factors and dwell solely on the language factors which I'm sure you know nothing about? And how ignorant you appear here still talking about DNA. Do you think an Agbor man from a certain quarter would have exactly the same DNA with another from a different quarter? Height of ignorance.

Yes, you should because there are now more sophisticated and modern methods of determining origins outside of folktales or better stil reexamine them using new information that is obtainable. Linguistics is just one indicator, DNA is indisputable.

As regards the single Agbor man's DNA results, well it will depend on his place of immediate origin, his family origins etc, however if you take a general DNA sample of all or most Agbor men there will be a definitive cluster of genetic relationship enough to determine with certainty their affiliation or non affiliations with groups around them.

DNA is like that it can trace how close or far away your ancestors are, but unfortunately you will continue with this socio-political commentary about your identity because you really deep down inside do not want to know the truth.

Self determination does not require fabrications of origins.



We are Ika people. We know our history and where each clan came from. Each clan knows where the Ogbes that makes up the clan came from and each ogbe know the origin of all the Idumus and Ebons that makes up that Idumu.

[/quote]

morpheus24:

This statement just nullifies the rest of the rant below.



The point here that you are trying to present is that in the past it was Edoid and got "replaced' by Igbo. Laughing in IKA language. How did it get replaced and by "whom". The best you can get out of your ranting here is that as Ika people you are a hybrid "race" of peoples between Igbo and Edo immigrants which does not negate my initial assertion, therefore if IGBO claim you, they are correct in doing so.




The sentence formation and Lexicon is very Igbo so much so that an average Igbo person would probably understand about 50% of what an IKA person is saying and vice versa. Your language was not replaced it mutated from an original Igbo dialect that was isolated for a good period of time.


The onus is not on me to prove you descend from direct Igbo migrants or settlers but for you to disprove it. My assertions are based on comparisons to other such phenomena in Africa and a probability of likely hood.

All Southern Nigerians are likely related to each other genetically. The point is to prove that the IKA are related to the Igbo far more so than any other surrounding group in the area including Edo peoples. Tell your people to take the tests so we can resolve this issue. Stop telling us about folktales your old people have been passing around as origin stories.



Yes, you should because there are now more sophisticated and modern methods of determining origins outside of folktales or better stil reexamine them using new information that is obtainable. Linguistics is just one indicator, DNA is indisputable.

As regards the single Agbor man's DNA results, well it will depend on his place of immediate origin, his family origins etc, however if you take a general DNA sample of all or most Agbor men there will be a definitive cluster of genetic relationship enough to determine with certainty their affiliation or non affiliations with groups around them.

DNA is like that it can trace how close or far away your ancestors are, but unfortunately you will continue with this socio-political commentary about your identity because you really deep down inside do not want to know the truth.

Self determination does not require fabrications of origins.



We are Ika people. We know our history and where each clan came from. Each clan knows where the Ogbes that makes up the clan came from and each ogbe know the origin of all the Idumus and Ebons that makes up that Idumu.

I'll ignore you from now on since you're not ready to learn.

bigfrancis21:


That's not the point. Imagine the height of confusion the world would have been in today if everyone speaks one language and claims another ethnicity. For example, you come across De Santos Rivera who speaks Spanish as first language and practices Hispanic culture but he tells you he's not Hispanic but French because 100 years ago his great-grand father came from France. De Santos speaks no lick of French neither has he been to France before but claims he's a French man. Then you go to France and everyone is denying being French but claiming Portuguese, English etc over some migrations that occurred hundreds of years back.

In reality it doesn't work that way. This issue of migrations into/out of Igboland is not unique to the Igbo people. A LOT of migrations occurred in the past, amongst different ethnic groups. People crossed language borders and settled in new-found lands and adopted their new identity. Living in the identity of the past of over 500 years ago, especially given that the migrating ancestors willingly left their original origins and adopted new ones for reasons best known to them then but forgotten/unknown to us today, would be considered folly. For simplicity's sake, the culture/ethnicity you identify with today is what you are classified with.

Reverting to my original comment, the preference for some Ikas and Ukwuanis to maintain their sub-clan identity obtained all over Igboland as recently as 100 years ago. The Awka man was Awka, not Igbo. The Aro man was Aro not Igbo. The Owerri man was Owerri, not Igbo. Infact Igbo-speaking slaves, upon being shipped to the Americas between the 1600s and 1800s, were surprised to arrive here and were called 'Ibo', most of them admitted that they had never heard of such name or country back home and all they knew was their village names. Slave ship manifests show Igbo-speaking slaves arriving from the Port of Bonny or Calabar giving their respective clan names as their 'identity', i.e oquelle (okwelle in Imo state), aqoqua (akokwa in Imo state), aeche (Etche in Rivers state), Isigue (Isigwe), esuotchi (isuochi) etc. No slave mentioned 'Ibo' as their identity. Looking at us from a vantage point of view the British, upon arrival, discovered that we all spoke variations of basically the same language, regardless of prior origins and the umbrella name for all bia-speaking clans is Igbo. Yes, in Anioma many migrants came in from Bini to settle and totally adopted their new culture and language, however there were Igbo-speaking natives already present in Anioma, which ensured that Igbo language prevailed over the migrants' language (s). The theory that 'Igbos crossed the Niger and displaced our original language, that's why we speak Igboid-based dialects' is as laughable as it comes. Even in the world of academia and taxonomy, there's a general name for everything and then sub-names. Chicken, Duck, Parrot, Turkey etc are all birds but it doesn't stop each sub-category of the bird category to have/maintain their respective names.

I guess the question we should be asking is, why did many fleeing members from other tribes head east to Igboland in times of trouble? Igboland experienced tons of influx of migrants from neighbouring tribes than vice versa. For example, migrants from Igala (in Nsukka), Idoma (Ebonyi state), Yoruba (Delta/Olukwumi), Esan (Delta state), Ibibio (Abia state), etc. Was Igboland in the past relatively peaceful, obviously due to a lack of a central kingship system, with plentiful arable land for cultivation that it attracted an influx of fleeing/migrating members from other tribes?

Where is Igbo land? You better wake up and smell the coffee? Your expansionist dreams are dead on arrival. Why is this too difficult for you guys to understand? Ika and Anioma has much more to gain than lose if they adopt the Igbo tag, but we're not willing to sacrifice our identity over a pot of porridge. You guys need to know that you're on the offensive and this isn't good for our peaceful coexistence. You guys have to give up your expansionist agenda if you want peace in the South. Else I don't see the difference between you guys and the Fulani people still nursing the dreams of colonising their neighbors in this 21st century. And what you're doing can be likened to what the Russians are doing to the Ukrainians claiming that the Ukrainian language is not a language but a dialect of the Ukrainian language and derogatorily term the Russian language "peasant Russian". What you guys are doing is an infringement and I implore you guys to desist from it. This might breed bad blood. People's heritage is something very delicate you shouldn't toy with. You might think some ikas feign indifference or are pro Igbo when they're doing business with you, majority of Ikas are seriously against being given an identity he doesn't approve of.

Autodidact1:
I'll ignore you from now on since you're not ready to learn.

No you will ignore me because your reasoning capacity is limited to folktales and a persistence to ignore the obvious.

You do not want to know the truth, you simply want to create a truth that suits a certain ethno-socio-political agenda.

Because a White South African assumes a new identity and creates a language that is a derivative of an original tongue, he cannot disconnect himself genetically and linguistically from his DUTCH ancestors. (This analogy might fly over you head but I wouldn't be shocked if it did)


You can self identify as an IKA man all day, that's your prerogative and if the "words" in your language are simply replacements by "Igbo words" then your DNA will not have been tampered with since the intrusion is simply linguistic and you will cluster closer to your Edo brethren to the West of you. I highly doubt this though, best case scenario, you are a hybrid people.

DNA does not LIE!

Take the test and end the mystery.

Autodidact1:
Where is Igbo land? You better wake up and smell the coffee? Your expansionist dreams are dead on arrival. Why is this too difficult for you guys to understand? Ika and Anioma has much more to gain than lose if they adopt the Igbo tag, but we're not willing to sacrifice our identity over a pot of porridge. You guys need to know that you're on the offensive and this isn't good for our peaceful coexistence. You guys have to give up your expansionist agenda if you want peace in the South. Else I don't see the difference between you guys and the Fulani people still nursing the dreams of colonising their neighbors in this 21st century. And what you're doing can be likened to what the Russians are doing to the Ukrainians claiming that the Ukrainian language is not a language but a dialect of the Ukrainian language and derogatorily term the Russian language "peasant Russian". What you guys are doing is an infringement and I implore you guys to desist from it. This might breed bad blood. People's heritage is something very delicate you shouldn't toy with. You might think some ikas feign indifference or are pro Igbo when they're doing business with you, majority of Ikas are seriously against being given an identity he doesn't approve of.

The typical Nigerian way of argument, rather than come up with points against my previous post, he goes on a yelling rampage. Very indicative of one with low levels of IQ.

Autodidact1:
Another dumb one. You seem to know very little or nothing about Ika language. Although Ika language is an IGBOID language, it has a very different intonation and the inflection is edoid. Do you know about Ika language formation? I doubt you don't. Ika language syntax is very different from other Igboid group. Talk about lexicon and I agree Ika lexics is very Igbo presently. and you actually didn't make any point your reply. If language shift doesn't have much with everything you listed up there, what then does it have something to do with? Common sense should tell you the first part of the language that language shift should attack is the lexicon.

Within the last century, do you have any idea how many ika words that have been replaced with Igbo words? Even within the last few decades, I witnessed the death and replacement of hundreds of Ika words which I can list here if I have time. Most of these words are Edo/Edoid or exclusively Ika words which today nobody uses them in ikaland. The Igbo variant of it is now being used. I believe you're intelligent enough to understand some of the factors that is contributing to the shifting of Ika words from the original Edo/Ika variant to the Igbo variant.

And you're referring to DNA evidence like you already have a DNA evidence at hand. Who's denying any relationship between Ika and Igbo? Yoruba, Edo, Igala and Igbo are from the same parent so what exactly is your point here?

So I should discard my folktales (which are basically Edo based stories of Ogiso and Adhuaran/Aruans giant sons of Ogiso) and other ancient factors and dwell solely on the language factors which I'm sure you know nothing about? And how ignorant you appear here still talking about DNA. Do you think an Agbor man from a certain quarter would have exactly the same DNA with another from a different quarter? Height of ignorance.

We are Ika people. We know our history and where each clan came from. Each clan knows where the Ogbes that makes up the clan came from and each ogbe know the origin of all the Idumus and Ebons that makes up that Idumu.

Ika Igbo is edoid in intonation because Ika land, by virtue of its location to Bini, experienced a huge amount of Bini/Esan settlers and in their attempt to learn the language of their new/host environment, they spoke it with their native Bini accent and when they passed what they learned to the next generation, a new dialect was formed and it stuck. That is how dialects form. An Igbo man born and bred in the East learning Yoruba will speak it with an Igbo accent and a Yoruba man speaking Igbo will add some Yoruba accent to it. If a group of 10 Yorubas migrate to the east and are given some lands to settle in, and in the process of learning Igbo (albeit with a Yoruba accent) they pass on what they've learned to the next generation, a new dialect of Igbo would have been formed, with a different intonation and the next generation would be native Igbo speakers and new speakers of this dialect, and so on. Same with the Hausas. Plenty Hausas living in Owerri speak fluent Igbo but with an obvious Hausa accent and back in the 16th or 17th century without the presence of modernization and English language, they would have entirely been absorbed in their new location and an entirely new dialect of Igbo would have been formed which would be passed on to the next generation of these Hausa migrants. Boom, a new dialect has been formed, who knows their community name would have been Umuarewa.

Ika land experienced a huge influx of Bini people, and they brought with them their accent and huge influence on the Ika Igbo dialect. If these Edoid words are being replaced with their Igbo equivalents nowadays, then Ika Igbo is only returning what it may have been originally before the massive Edoid influence between the 16th and 18th centuries. Thanks to Central Igbo (Igbo Izugbe) It is no brainer.

Autodidact1:
I'll ignore you from now on since you're not ready to learn.

Actually you ran out of cogent points. People like you have continuously failed to see the bigger picture and to stop limiting your perception/understanding of Igbo affairs to only 50/100 years ago.

Stephench:
Some of these things might be correct about Ikwerre but Ika has never had Igbo consciousness in them from the beginning.

Ikwere and Ndokwa are as Igbo and Nkwere and Ndoki.

igbodefender:
Ikwere and Ndokwa are as Igbo and Nkwere and Ndoki.

I gala di l'inya?

There is no such thing as Igbo or Ika DNA. We have the same genetic cluster in Southern Nigeria. You'd more variations with the same tribe and a lot of similarities across tribes. People jist throw DNA without the slightest clue

kayfra:
There is no such thing as Igbo or Ika DNA. We have the same genetic cluster in Southern Nigeria. You'd more variations with the same tribe and a lot of similarities across tribes. People jist throw DNA without the slightest clue

Point of correction my dear, there are in fact haplogroups that are distinct to certain ethnic groups in West Africa . Most of these DNA companies have collected data from each of these groups so much so that they are able to determine heritage from these specific groups using distinguishing subclades or specific mutations.

West African Men pass on specific variants of haplogroup Eb1b1a which is why we are able to determine if your male forbearers are indeed Ashanti or Yoruba.

It would therefore not be a hard task to determine at what frequency IKA males are descendant of "Igbo" or "Edo" men

Check out these interesting read on Male population differences in West Africa below

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/295943796_Genetic_population_study_of_Y-chromosome_markers_in_Benin_and_Ivory_Coast_ethnic_groups