tomtos88:


If not u, others are reading

OK, that's true. Others reading abeg no vote Atiku o. Na barawo bansa. Vote Sowore for a better Nigeria.

wirinet:

Quality of life in Rwanda, Ghana are better than Nigeria? I hope you are not smoking the weed Sowore is hoping to export.
Rwanda with a GDP of less than $10bullion and Ghana with GDP of less than $50 billion is better than Nigeria, the biggest economy in Africa with a GDP of over $1.1 trillion?
These places in real terms are poorer, dirtier and more impoverished than Nigeria. The problem is Nigerian population, the high number of urban areas and the high taste of Nigerians. Most of those countries have less than 10 highly urban cities. Nigeria has 10 urban areas in every state. Rwanda simply shows you Kigali and gbam, you feel the whole of Rwanda is living in wealth. Same with Ghana, they showcase Accra and Kumasi and gbam Ghana is neat, rich and beautiful. Go to the villages where majority of the people live to see real poverty.




What is the total civil servant population of Ghana and Rwanda? I am sure it is not up to the civil servant population of small Bayelsa or delta state. If you ask Bayelsa to pay N100k, then the FG must be ready to perpetually pay bail out funds to enable it pay salaries (assuming the FG can pay it's own).
At N18,000 states require federal bail outs to pay salaries, at N100k, they would need IMF loan to pay salaries

I have lived in Rwanda for months and Ghana for a while too, I have been to Europe and the Americas. I have lived there, Have you?

I know that Rwanda has a per capita income of 800 usd and Nigeria has about double of that, but go check it out yourself, their money has more value in terms of buying power and quality of life.

In Kigali and other cities around, it is cleaner, more secure, and there is round the clock electricity. But the point is that the little that civil servants get is quite enough for them. In Nigeria, no adult with a family can live under 18,000 or 30,000.

So if you consider their PPP (purchasing power parity) with Nigeria, 200 Rwanda franc in Kigali will buy more than it can buy in Nigeria. And there is less pressure on civil servants, unlike in Nigeria.

In Rwanda, they don't have any big income earner as we have in Nigeria such as oil, which is where our per capital of 1,800 USD derives mainly. But they do have a thriving technology, hospitality, education and services sector.

Most importantly, they are not the poverty capital of the World, and the number of impoverished people there, although is high is nothing compared to Nigeria.

Olumyco:


Sir what is the different between Value and Volume in terms of money in an economy?

Also you mentioned human capital. Is human capital a function of earning alone. Where do you put skill acquisition, education, capacity and so on.

It seems you guys are just looking for different things to justify this 100k min wage. Even Sowore the person who has the idea did not say all these to justify the idea. Sowore has plan to invest into education and all sorts which will help human capital dev. in the country but Sowore is not saying he will pay 100k min wage to dev human capital. You guys should chill and listen to him. See Sowore knows that in human capital investment you dont start or base on earning alone...you first invest in skill, education, capacity and other labour attributes so that the human resource can be very productive. You dont just start paying humans that huge in the name of human capital dev. It will have a boomerang effect in productivity. You risk productivity if you start human capital development from the angle of huge payment. Go and check out Japan, Singapore and co you will understand what human capital development is. Truly the staffs will be motivated but the expected productivity might not be there because of other human capital development factors that are lacking and that will lead to another problem. We should learn how to solve problems without creating another. See this is the truth... Sowore made that mistake because he looked at it microscopically... he needs to look at it macroscopically. He needs to pass the idea through economic intelligent factory. I support him and wish he enters but my advise for him is to assemble an economic team that will help him package that 100k min wage very well. No one is perfect. You can either be right or wrong. That's why you are human. Sowore is the most qualified for the job but he needs assistance on the area of economic. His other plans are top notch... and I love the way he talks and his boldness. May God help me. But the truth is the truth.

The problem you are making and which many analysts like you are making is that you are thinking that N100K is a policy on its own.

I have read the AAC manifesto, and I didn't see that. I have heard Sowore many times and that is not the case.

N100K is part of an overarching strategy to reduce corruption by public officials, to invest in people and improve human capital and to eradicate poverty.

He has said many times without number that if he gives N100K living wage, he would invest about a billion USD in housing and make all federal workers access a mortgage of 2 million, of which they will pay around 20 percent of their salaries per month towards their mortgage.

He has also said times without number that he would invest a lot in training and technology, in the civil service. If investments are made into technology, don't you think that people will be trained constantly to manage and operate it? Will there be no skills acquisition from there?

He has said it times without number that our civil servants are still living in the past and he will invest in upgrading their skills and ensuring that he attracts the best people to government from the private.

I know you support him and don't have to support all of his ideology. No one should follow blindly. I have my reservation too regarding some of his policies, but on the issue of living wage. He is right on the money and I am totally in support of that. Gradualism is no solution at all and it is the same that we've had for ages.

You can't be paying your people 70 dollars per month when the cost of living is 10x. And I do not think that he will be able to implement the policy next day after becoming President anyway. It could be in the next budget year so that he improves revenue first, stabilize the economy and prepare in earnest.

The World is now talking about Universal Basic Income.

idid:


I have lived in Rwanda for months and Ghana for a while too, I have been to Europe and the Americas. I have lived there, Have you?

I know that Rwanda has a per capita income of 800 usd and Nigeria has about double of that, but go check it out yourself, their money has more value in terms of buying power and quality of life.

In Kigali and other cities around, it is cleaner, more secure, and there is round the clock electricity. But the point is that the little that civil servants get is quite enough for them. In Nigeria, no adult with a family can live under 18,000 or 30,000.

So if you consider their PPP (purchasing power parity) with Nigeria, 200 Rwanda franc in Kigali will buy more than it can buy in Nigeria. And there is less pressure on civil servants, unlike in Nigeria.

In Rwanda, they don't have any big income earner as we have in Nigeria such as oil, which is where our per capital of 1,800 USD derives mainly. But they do have a thriving technology, hospitality, education and services sector.

Most importantly, they are not the poverty capital of the World, and the number of impoverished people there, although is high is nothing compared to Nigeria.

I have been to the UK and the US, so I have an idea of how things work in the West. Have not been to other African countries except Benin though, so I only gleam, my info from what I read and friends who travels to these countries.

You still don't get what I am saying. The defining index between Nigeria and Rwanda us population. Nigeria has a population of about 200 million, Rwanda has 13 million. Obviously we will have more poor people than Rwanda. Also we will have more rich people than Rwanda, we will have more mad people than Rwanda.

The most important factor that affect the value of our currency and thus the purchasing power of our currency is our reliance on foreign goods. We eat imported food, wear imported fabrics and clothes, depending on imported fuel to move around and drive our industries, etc. In fact we have a chronic a addiction to imported items. This means the value of our currency will keep going down.

Although I must admit that Nigerians lack management sense and skills, as we are unable to manage our environments or surroundings. It still boils down to population. Kigali has a population of about 1 million. FESTAC alone in lagos has a population more than that. So naturally it would be easier to manage Kigali than lagos. The civil service population of Rwanda would not even be up to the staff strength of some companies like PZ or Dangote.

You can believe whatever you want to believe. Let me correct a few things. India’s population is six times the population of Nigeria.
Why do you doubt Nigeria has more poor people than India? People don’t just wake and say Nigeria has more poor than India. Or do they?

You asked how many cities in have electricity? Every city in Ghana has electricity. The national coverage is more than 70 percent. Do you live in Ghana? Have you ever been to Ghana? Fuckeduppedness I live in Ghana and I am in a position to tell you what is happening here. I don’t need any stvpid report to tell me about what is happening in Ghana.

I am still waiting to know from you life expectancy in Nigeria. How many people have access to electricity and clean water, employment rate, access to education, access to health care?

Have you heard of the UN Human Development Index? Fuckeduppedness

wirinet:

Nigeria has more poor people in the world mainly due to our ballooning population (although I doubt we have more poor people than india). Ghana has a population of about 28 million. That is just a little over the population of Lagos. Nigeria has a population of 200 million. Even if 12% of Nigerians are poor, that's more than the total population of Ghana.

How many cities in Ghana has electricity. Electricity is mainly restricted to the urban areas, rural areas still live like precolonial times. Poverty in Northern Ghana is worse that that of Nigeria.

Read this report to get an insight of poverty in rural northern Ghana;

idid:


I have lived in Rwanda for months and Ghana for a while too, I have been to Europe and the Americas. I have lived there, Have you?

I know that Rwanda has a per capita income of 800 usd and Nigeria has about double of that, but go check it out yourself, their money has more value in terms of buying power and quality of life.

In Kigali and other cities around, it is cleaner, more secure, and there is round the clock electricity. But the point is that the little that civil servants get is quite enough for them. In Nigeria, no adult with a family can live under 18,000 or 30,000.

So if you consider their PPP (purchasing power parity) with Nigeria, 200 Rwanda franc in Kigali will buy more than it can buy in Nigeria. And there is less pressure on civil servants, unlike in Nigeria.

In Rwanda, they don't have any big income earner as we have in Nigeria such as oil, which is where our per capital of 1,800 USD derives mainly. But they do have a thriving technology, hospitality, education and services sector.

Most importantly, they are not the poverty capital of the World, and the number of impoverished people there, although is high is nothing compared to Nigeria.

Well you are correct on money has more value in terms of purchasing power. Infact to me the value of money is its purchasing power and not exchange rate and that is why GDP (PPP) is more revealing than GDP (Nominal).

I was expecting you to talk about Ghana the way you have talked about Rwanda. I would have been able to know your interpretation of your understanding about the matter on ground. I have not been to Rwanda... I quite understand what you are saying about the buying power which is what I tell people when comparing two countries currencies. Well I don't know much about Rwanda but I am not fully convinced if what you said is what is obtainable there saying their money has more purchasing power than our own. Since you tagged Ghana along side with Rwanda I can tell you that of Ghana.

Nigeri

idid:


I have lived in Rwanda for months and Ghana for a while too, I have been to Europe and the Americas. I have lived there, Have you?

I know that Rwanda has a per capita income of 800 usd and Nigeria has about double of that, but go check it out yourself, their money has more value in terms of buying power and quality of life.

In Kigali and other cities around, it is cleaner, more secure, and there is round the clock electricity. But the point is that the little that civil servants get is quite enough for them. In Nigeria, no adult with a family can live under 18,000 or 30,000.

So if you consider their PPP (purchasing power parity) with Nigeria, 200 Rwanda franc in Kigali will buy more than it can buy in Nigeria. And there is less pressure on civil servants, unlike in Nigeria.

In Rwanda, they don't have any big income earner as we have in Nigeria such as oil, which is where our per capital of 1,800 USD derives mainly. But they do have a thriving technology, hospitality, education and services sector.

Most importantly, they are not the poverty capital of the World, and the number of impoverished people there, although is high is nothing compared to Nigeria.

Well you are correct on money has more value in terms of purchasing power. Infact to me the value of money is its purchasing power and not exchange rate and that is why GDP (PPP) is more revealing than GDP (Nominal).

I was expecting you to talk about Ghana the way you have talked about Rwanda. I would have been able to know your interpretation of your understanding about the matter on ground. I have not been to Rwanda... I quite understand what you are saying about the buying power which is what I tell people when comparing two countries currencies. Well I don't know much about Rwanda but I am not fully convinced if what you said is what is obtainable there saying their money has more purchasing power than our own. Since you tagged Ghana along side with Rwanda I can tell you that of Ghana.

Nigeria Naira has more purchasing power than Ghana Cedis

In the exchange rate 1 cedis = 75 Naira

1 cedis will buy 5 sachets of pure water. Our 75 Naira here will buy 7 sachets of pure water. You can see the difference. Same applies to many of the goods and services. I understand Ghana economy very well. And from what I think is happening, Nigeria should be one of the cheapest country to live in Africa. And our money has a very high purchasing power. Travel to other African countries you will understand. For that of Rwanda I doubt what you have said here considering their wars in the past and their economy. But if it is the truth then it means Rwanda might actually be the cheapest with the highest purchasing power in Africa.

Now back to Sowore matter. I asked you the difference between the Value and Volume of money in an economy.

I would have loved you to answer the question. Because I could see you reference purchasing power in your post. I have been saying it that it is not the volume of money that matters but the value. I said if we have 247 light in this country cost of production of goods and services will drop and our more will appreciate in value. If we have 2 or 3 refineries working in this country meaning we will no longer export crude oil and import back into the country refined oil, prices of goods and services will drop and our Naira will gain value. At the end 30k min wage in an economy of 247 light, 3 working refineries etc might end up tallying with 100k min wage of an economy of no electricity, no working refineries and so on.

When you fix all these problems and also develop human capital then production of goods and services will increase, our GDP will shoot up and human productivity too will shoot high. With these, min wage can be increased. Japan and co did not start with high min wage. They didn't start with raising Landlords. They didn't start with building liabilities ...houses and co. They started with fixing these infrastructures and development of human resource capital. You build a strong economy on assets and not liabilities. Houses and co will follow easily when the economy is well built, strong and good.

Olumyco:


Well you are correct on money has more value in terms of purchasing power. Infact to me the value of money is its purchasing power and not exchange rate and that is why GDP (PPP) is more revealing than GDP (Nominal).

I was expecting you to talk about Ghana the way you have talked about Rwanda. I would have been able to know your interpretation of your understanding about the matter on ground. I have not been to Rwanda... I quite understand what you are saying about the buying power which is what I tell people when comparing two countries currencies. Well I don't know much about Rwanda but I am not fully convinced if what you said is what is obtainable there saying their money has more purchasing power than our own. Since you tagged Ghana along side with Rwanda I can tell you that of Ghana.

Nigeri

Good we are on the same page concerning GDP (PPP) compared to GDP (Nominal).

If we agree on that, then, we can argue too that quality of life is quite better in Ghana and when I say quality, I do not refer to the whole of Ghana, I know that poverty is still rife. But if you go to the market and compare a plate of rice with Nigeria or a bowl of fruit, you will see that you can buy more for the same price in Ghana than Nigeria.

Though, I have to admit that they are becoming expensive too.

You can rent a flat cheaper compared to Nigeria. I am not talking about in high brow areas but even so, you can rent a nice 3 bed in Accra for 4-5 million and the standard of the house is what you get in VI, Lekki or GRA for 10-12 million.

But it's not only about PPP. Ghana has stable electricity, their roads are becoming better and there is security. It also appears that in Ghana, interest and exchange rates are not that erratic as in Nigeria. I's easy to employ people and to do business, the risks are less.

I guess the reason is not only because they are improving on policies but also because they are attracting investments. But I know that expatriates get 6x in Nigeria than Ghana. That is why it looks like Nigeria is better. You know we have all the oil, gas and the rest.

This year in Ghana is called, the year of of the return, to attract people from the diaspora, many of those people are going to bring investments, expertise and knowledge. These are the reasons I am putting my money on Ghana. At the rate that Nigeria is going, in four years, Ghana will leave us behind big time.

I know that if Nigeria is to wake up from our sleep, it will take less than one year to put Ghana, Rwanda and all of them combined behind us.

idid:


I have lived in Rwanda for months and Ghana for a while too, I have been to Europe and the Americas. I have lived there, Have you?

I know that Rwanda has a per capita income of 800 usd and Nigeria has about double of that, but go check it out yourself, their money has more value in terms of buying power and quality of life.

In Kigali and other cities around, it is cleaner, more secure, and there is round the clock electricity. But the point is that the little that civil servants get is quite enough for them. In Nigeria, no adult with a family can live under 18,000 or 30,000.

So if you consider their PPP (purchasing power parity) with Nigeria, 200 Rwanda franc in Kigali will buy more than it can buy in Nigeria. And there is less pressure on civil servants, unlike in Nigeria.

In Rwanda, they don't have any big income earner as we have in Nigeria such as oil, which is where our per capital of 1,800 USD derives mainly. But they do have a thriving technology, hospitality, education and services sector.

Most importantly, they are not the poverty capital of the World, and the number of impoverished people there, although is high is nothing compared to Nigeria.

The bolded sentence above from you, I want to believe you are just exaggerating. True the money is not enough because of lack of basic amenities and some other infrastructure but if you are a Nigerian who lives in Nigeria you will know that people live under that amount.

I still don't fully subscribe to the fact that Nigeria is the poverty capital of the world. Because if poverty threshold according to UN is $1.9 dollar then in Nigeria that threshold does not apply. In US and other countries it might be hard for people to live under $1.9 dollars a day... I doubt in the US if $1 can even buy a plate of rice.

$1.9 = N684

Now in Nigeria one can accurately eat 3 square meals a day with 600 naira. I am just talking about feeding which is the UN yardstick. So what are we saying. There are many Nigerians who get more than 600 naira a day.
Lets look at people who are low in the society based on what they do... Agberos, farmers, private school teachers, free roll/freelance guy hustling at computer village or any phone and laptop market directing people to where they will buy stuffs, cleaners, gate man, traders, boli sellers, corn sellers, okada riders, wheel barrow pushers etc. Now Nigerians tell me how many of these people make less than 600 naira a day? I quite understand the private school teachers case where some of them get 10k, 15k a month but some of them have small businesses they involve in. Some of them in the evening goes out to hustle. So to me in Nigeria many people live above 600 naira a day and with this they still feed themselves, rent house and even send their children to school. So to me that Nigeria being the poverty capital of the world looks somehow with what we Nigerians know that is fully on ground. We all know that only lazy people will become poor in Nigeria.
Like someone said, Nigeria is a place where everyone is hustling. Even our govt. dey hustle.

To me the North is the problem most especially the almajiris and the lazy people. Truly there are many poor people in Nigeria... but might not be up to the number of the statistics UN and other bodies are quoting. I doubt if UN and all those foreign bodies understand what Agbero is or a freelance guy directing people at phone and laptop shops not to talk of understanding how they get money.

Well God will help Nigeria and overcome our problems for us.

Olumyco:


Well you are correct on money has more value in terms of purchasing power. Infact to me the value of money is its purchasing power and not exchange rate and that is why GDP (PPP) is more revealing than GDP (Nominal).

I was expecting you to talk about Ghana the way you have talked about Rwanda. I would have been able to know your interpretation of your understanding about the matter on ground. I have not been to Rwanda... I quite understand what you are saying about the buying power which is what I tell people when comparing two countries currencies. Well I don't know much about Rwanda but I am not fully convinced if what you said is what is obtainable there saying their money has more purchasing power than our own. Since you tagged Ghana along side with Rwanda I can tell you that of Ghana.

Nigeria Naira has more purchasing power than Ghana Cedis

In the exchange rate 1 cedis = 75 Naira

1 cedis will buy 5 sachets of pure water. Our 75 Naira here will buy 7 sachets of pure water. You can see the difference. Same applies to many of the goods and services. I understand Ghana economy very well. And from what I think is happening, Nigeria should be one of the cheapest country to live in Africa. And our money has a very high purchasing power. Travel to other African countries you will understand. For that of Rwanda I doubt what you have said here considering their wars in the past and their economy. But if it is the truth then it means Rwanda might actually be the cheapest with the highest purchasing power in Africa.

Now back to Sowore matter. I asked you the difference between the Value and Volume of money in an economy.

I would have loved you to answer the question. Because I could see you reference purchasing power in your post. I have been saying it that it is not the volume of money that matters but the value. I said if we have 247 light in this country cost of production of goods and services will drop and our more will appreciate in value. If we have 2 or 3 refineries working in this country meaning we will no longer export crude oil and import back into the country refined oil, prices of goods and services will drop and our Naira will gain value. At the end 30k min wage in an economy of 247 light, 3 working refineries etc might end up tallying with 100k min wage of an economy of no electricity, no working refineries and so on.

When you fix all these problems and also develop human capital then production of goods and services will increase, our GDP will shoot up and human productivity too will shoot high. With these, min wage can be increased. Japan and co did not start with high min wage. They didn't start with raising Landlords. They didn't start with building liabilities ...houses and co. They started with fixing these infrastructures and development of human resource capital. You build a strong economy on assets and not liabilities. Houses and co will follow easily when the economy is well built, strong and good.

Honestly, there is no much difference in what we are both saying, you are merely echoing my views and that is why I am putting my money on Sowore.

If we can get 24/7 electricity, address corruption, get our infrastructure and schools working, tidy up our labour laws and improve on the ease of doing business, we will do just fine. As you said, all of this will improve the value of our currency.

But even at that, we will still need to improve human potential and attract the best people to work for the state. We can only achieve that if we pay people well and give them a take home that can allow them to get a mortgage, have savings, go on holiday, transport themselves and look away from corruption.

But even if the value of naira is to improve drastically today 2X in case we have all of the above, civil servants will still struggle with 30k per month as salary because they will still need 3x or more to survive. So even when the value is good, people will need a rational pay to survive. Take the US and Britain for example, the pound and dollar have good value but there are still millions trapped in poverty, even despite their minimum wage regulations. Value alone cannot do it, we will also need a combination of rational policies to lift people out of poverty.

Another issue is this. If we improve on all of those things you've mentioned and don't pay well enough, you know what will happen?

Foreigners will troop in and come here to enjoy and do business, and we will be what China was 13-16 years ago. A lot of foreign investments, people can eat and live quite alright, but cannot fulfil their potential, they cannot go on holiday, they cannot save, they cannot buy or build their own house. Even China too has now moved away from there because it was a mistaken economics that we should have everything working and all the tourism and luxury of our land should only be patronised by the well off or foreigners bringing dollars.

So why Sowore is right is because he is saying that he will pay more money and also improve on all those areas that you and I are talking about. Honestly, if it can work like that, Nigeria will be one of the most sought after countries in Africa because people will be lifted out of poverty immediately.

This approach is also the best way to accelerate growth, which is what we need. If it happens, I see us growing at 8-12 percent per annum.
Our issue then will have to be that we must manage our growth anflation threats once in a while but that will be secondary. What is sure is that we will lift tens of millions out of the dungeon.

idid:



Good we are on the same page concerning GDP (PPP) compared to GDP (Nominal).

If we agree on that, then, we can argue too that quality of life is quite better in Ghana and when I say quality, I do not refer to the whole of Ghana, I know that poverty is still rife. But if you go to the market and compare a plate of rice with Nigeria or a bowl of fruit, you will see that you can buy more for the same price in Ghana than Nigeria.

Though, I have to admit that they are becoming expensive too.

You can rent a flat cheaper compared to Nigeria. I am not talking about in high brow areas but even so, you can rent a nice 3 bed in Accra for 4-5 million and the standard of the house is what you get in VI, Lekki or GRA for 10-12 million.

But it's not only about PPP. Ghana has stable electricity, their roads are becoming better and there is security. It also appears that in Ghana, interest and exchange rates are not that erratic as in Nigeria. I's easy to employ people and to do business, the risks are less.

I guess the reason is not only because they are improving on policies but also because they are attracting investments. But I know that expatriates get 6x in Nigeria than Ghana. That is why it looks like Nigeria is better. You know we have all the oil, gas and the rest.

This year in Ghana is called, the year of of the return, to attract people from the diaspora, many of those people are going to bring investments, expertise and knowledge. These are the reasons I am putting my money on Ghana. At the rate that Nigeria is going, in four years, Ghana will leave us behind big time.

I know that if Nigeria is to wake up from our sleep, it will take less than one year to put Ghana, Rwanda and all of them combined behind us.

Lol... that is not what is obtainable in Ghana Sir. I am there. 1 cedis is 75 naira. 1 cedis will buy 5 sachets of pure water. Our 75 naira will buy 7 sachets of pure water.
In Ghana you will manage and struggle to eat 3 cedis food. Infact if you want to eat food normally

idid:



Good we are on the same page concerning GDP (PPP) compared to GDP (Nominal).

If we agree on that, then, we can argue too that quality of life is quite better in Ghana and when I say quality, I do not refer to the whole of Ghana, I know that poverty is still rife. But if you go to the market and compare a plate of rice with Nigeria or a bowl of fruit, you will see that you can buy more for the same price in Ghana than Nigeria.

Though, I have to admit that they are becoming expensive too.

You can rent a flat cheaper compared to Nigeria. I am not talking about in high brow areas but even so, you can rent a nice 3 bed in Accra for 4-5 million and the standard of the house is what you get in VI, Lekki or GRA for 10-12 million.

But it's not only about PPP. Ghana has stable electricity, their roads are becoming better and there is security. It also appears that in Ghana, interest and exchange rates are not that erratic as in Nigeria. I's easy to employ people and to do business, the risks are less.

I guess the reason is not only because they are improving on policies but also because they are attracting investments. But I know that expatriates get 6x in Nigeria than Ghana. That is why it looks like Nigeria is better. You know we have all the oil, gas and the rest.

This year in Ghana is called, the year of of the return, to attract people from the diaspora, many of those people are going to bring investments, expertise and knowledge. These are the reasons I am putting my money on Ghana. At the rate that Nigeria is going, in four years, Ghana will leave us behind big time.

I know that if Nigeria is to wake up from our sleep, it will take less than one year to put Ghana, Rwanda and all of them combined behind us.

Lol... that is not what is obtainable in Ghana Sir. I am there. 1 cedis is 75 naira. 1 cedis will buy 5 sachets of pure water. Our 75 naira will buy 7 sachets of pure water.
In Ghana you will manage and struggle to eat 3 cedis food. Infact if you want to eat food normally you will have to spend like 5 cedis to 10 cedis. I know what I am saying. In Nigeria you can eat nice food with 150 naira... that's like 2 Cedis.

Ghana economy is bad. They are just trying. Even Lagos GDP is twice that of the whole of Ghana. Many of their banks are even collapsing. Nigerian banks are the one flexing muscle there.
Ghana beat us in Electricity and Security. I admit that but in terms of economy and infrastructure forget it.
It was when I traveled out I discovered we Nigerians dont value our country. Infact the only country we can be comparing is SA and Egypt. May God help other African countries. If we go to other African countries apart from SA, Egypt, Morocco and probably Kenya you guys will know that those countries are really struggling.

Olumyco:


Lol... that is not what is obtainable in Ghana Sir. I am there. 1 cedis is 75 naira. 1 cedis will buy 5 sachets of pure water. Our 75 naira will buy 7 sachets of pure water.
In Ghana you will manage and struggle to eat 3 cedis food. Infact if you want to eat food normally

so why do you keep coming to Ghana if things are better in your country

idid:



Honestly, there is no much difference in what we are both saying, you are merely echoing my views and that is why I am putting my money on Sowore.

If we can get 24/7 electricity, address corruption, get our infrastructure and schools working, tidy up our labour laws and improve on the ease of doing business, we will do just fine. As you said, all of this will improve the value of our currency.

But even at that, we will still need to improve human potential and attract the best people to work for the state. We can only achieve that if we pay people well and give them a take home that can allow them to get a mortgage, have savings, go on holiday, transport themselves and look away from corruption.

But even if the value of naira is to improve drastically today 2X in case we have all of the above, civil servants will still struggle with 30k per month as salary because they will still need 3x or more to survive. So even when the value is good, people will need a rational pay to survive. Take the US and Britain for example, the pound and dollar have good value but there are still millions trapped in poverty, even despite their minimum wage regulations. Value alone cannot do it, we will also need a combination of rational policies to lift people out of poverty.

Another issue is this. If we improve on all of those things you've mentioned and don't pay well enough, you know what will happen?

Foreigners will troop in and come here to enjoy and do business, and we will be what China was 13-16 years ago. A lot of foreign investments, people can eat and live quite alright, but cannot fulfil their potential, they cannot go on holiday, they cannot save, they cannot buy or build their own house. Even China too has now moved away from there because it was a mistaken economics that we should have everything working and all the tourism and luxury of our land should only be patronised by the well off or foreigners bringing dollars.

So why Sowore is right is because he is saying that he will pay more money and also improve on all those areas that you and I are talking about. Honestly, if it can work like that, Nigeria will be one of the most sought after countries in Africa because people will be lifted out of poverty immediately.

This approach is also the best way to accelerate growth, which is what we need. If it happens, I see us growing at 8-12 percent per annum.
Our issue then will have to be that we must manage our growth anflation threats once in a while but that will be secondary. What is sure is that we will lift tens of millions out of the dungeon.

Great...I salute. I agree with you. Thanks

Nanatrendy:
so why do you keep coming to Ghana if things are better in your country

Sorry Nanatendy... Ghana is a great country. Infact in west Africa it is only Nigeria and Ghana or probably adding Ivory Coast to it that are trying. The rest are just there struggling. So Ghana is a very good country and have potential of booming in the future. We just have to eradicate corruption and develop our countries.

Olumyco:


The bolded sentence above from you, I want to believe you are just exaggerating. True the money is not enough because of lack of basic amenities and some other infrastructure but if you are a Nigerian who lives in Nigeria you will know that people live under that amount.

I still don't fully subscribe to the fact that Nigeria is the poverty capital of the world. Because if poverty threshold according to UN is $1.9 dollar then in Nigeria that threshold does not apply. In US and other countries it might be hard for people to live under $1.9 dollars a day... I doubt in the US if $1 can even buy a plate of rice.

$1.9 = N684

Now in Nigeria one can accurately eat 3 square meals a day with 600 naira. I am just talking about feeding which is the UN yardstick. So what are we saying. There are many Nigerians who get more than 600 naira a day.
Lets look at people who are low in the society based on what they do... Agberos, farmers, private school teachers, free roll/freelance guy hustling at computer village or any phone and laptop market directing people to where they will buy stuffs, cleaners, gate man, traders, boli sellers, corn sellers, okada riders, wheel barrow pushers etc. Now Nigerians tell me how many of these people make less than 600 naira a day? I quite understand the private school teachers case where some of them get 10k, 15k a month but some of them have small businesses they involve in. Some of them in the evening goes out to hustle. So to me in Nigeria many people live above 600 naira a day and with this they still feed themselves, rent house and even send their children to school. So to me that Nigeria being the poverty capital of the world looks somehow with what we Nigerians know that is fully on ground. We all know that only lazy people will become poor in Nigeria.
Like someone said, Nigeria is a place where everyone is hustling. Even our govt. dey hustle.

To me the North is the problem most especially the almajiris and the lazy people. Truly there are many poor people in Nigeria... but might not be up to the number of the statistics UN and other bodies are quoting. I doubt if UN and all those foreign bodies understand what Agbero is or a freelance guy directing people at phone and laptop shops not to talk of understanding how they get money.

Well God will help Nigeria and overcome our problems for us.

I wasn't exaggerating the above when I said that most people cannot live within 18-30,000 but I do not mean that it is not possible, I know that it is, but I mean that whoever does is still not living like a human being in the 21st century and is still living under poverty.

You are forgetting that a typical Nigerian worker has an average of three people in his family. It is even Nigerian to be at least five in your family but let's keep it at three for now.

Going by your calculated daily feeding N600 X 3= N1800 per day. Now let's multiply by 30 days = N54,000
Electricity 1500 per month. I am being conservative here
House rent. One bedroom apartment- 4000 x 12 = 48,000
Transport to work- 1500
Other bills: 5000 naira
Total: 110,000

Let's say I have exaggerated and we take 30,000 off. You still have 80,000 naira.

Even many people will say that my calculation without the 30k discount is ridiculous because I haven't added other miscellaneous expenses such as school uniform for your child, data for your phone, diesel for generator and so on.

Now if you are earning 30k, you will still be indebted unless you have some magic bullet. And that explains why civil servants are hungry and corrupt sometimes. People have to take bribes and do shady deals or have side hustle to survive. That is not how it is done in developed climes at all. Maybe 30k will be tenable if there is social housing and there is free education, free electricity, free travel, free medical when you get sick and so on.

Imagine if someone earning the above fall sick or has an accident, how will they pay their bills?

And remember that our purpose in life is not to work and pay bills alone as over 100 million Nigerians do. It is to fulfil the human potential.

Please let's forget the UN poverty indicator for now, we all aspire to travel someday, to go on holiday, to buy a house or build one, to go to University and earn a degree, to buy our desired car. Or even learn a new skill and marry a third wife .

That is how human beings should live and aspire and any good government should be there to support those aspirations. So, we should pay people well so that they can save money to achieve those things that they desire and live as human beings. If all this can happen, you will see that no one will be interested in leaving the shores of Nigeria ever again to work or live elsewhere.

And it is a sure way to eradicate corruption too..

You and I are indeed, some of the few lucky ones who can access the internet and post as much as we like without much complain about data, do you know how many people who cannot afford a broadband or data in Nigeria? This things should be affordable by everyone and in the latest definition of poverty, as long as you cannot afford basic needs such as data or broadband, you are still trapped under poverty.

Brother, we have to step it up and close the gap between us and westerners. It is high time for the ordinary Nigerian to live the kind of life that citizens in other countries live. It is not luxury, it is human right and you and I deserve it.

Nanatrendy:
so why do you keep coming to Ghana if things are better in your country

Nana please don't turn this into a Ghana vs Nigeria thing, we are only having a conversation here about aspects of Ghana that is positive. Nigerians come to Ghana a lot to do business because it is convenient and easy for us as we share the same language, culture and understand one another.

And by the way, Nigerians spend over 10 billion naira on Ghana each year, that is huge and will grow if there is improved relationship between us. We need more Ghanians in Nigeria by the way and you guys need us too. Immediately, Nigeria kick-starts it growth, Ghana will go exponentially too.

idid:


Nana please don't turn this into a Ghana vs Nigeria thing, we are only having a conversation here about aspects of Ghana that is positive. Nigerians come to Ghana a lot to do business because it is convenient and easy for us as we share the same language, culture and understand one another.

And by the way, Nigerians spend over 10 billion naira on Ghana each year, that is huge and will grow if there is improved relationship between us. We need more Ghanians in Nigeria by the way and you guys need us too. Immediately, Nigeria kick-starts it growth, Ghana will go exponentially too.

it was just a question I don't wish to start an argument. We all know you have a large population which is even better for business and things are relatively more cheaper in nigeria than in Ghana so I don't really understand why there's mass immigration of Nigerians to Ghana to be honest. The grass is not always greener on the other side

Nanatrendy:
it was just a question I don't wish to start an argument. We all know you have a large population which is even better for business and things are relatively more cheaper in nigeria than in Ghana so I don't really understand why there's mass immigration of Nigerians to Ghana to be honest. The grass is not always greener on the other side

Nana it is caused by citizens distrust of the current government, which has also increased the rate of poverty in some Nigerian cities.

You may have noticed that the Nigerian population have grown exponentially in the last two years.

Nigerians have lofty aspirations and once the government of the day cannot fulfil it, they find a way out quickly. We are a country that should be doing 10-12 percent growth per annum but now, we are merely doing two and it is painful to most young, inspirational and enterprising Nigerians. This was also caused by our recent economic recession, which is over now.

Nigerians are also in Ghana because they believe Ghana is closer to home and that some things are cheaper over there, though, it is a double tragedy for Nigeria because most of the people living in Ghana are funded by either money from Nigeria or abroad. I have two cousins doing University there and the parents send nothing less than 10,000 dollars per year for example.

Many Nigerians are schooling there too because we produce too many secondary school leavers than our Universities accommodate.

That is all positive for Ghana because it keeps the local economy going.

I know that some of the Nigerians there will be causing nuisance, but it is only a matter of time before they all return home. If Ghana can understand and permit them though, Nigerians just want to be accommodated and given the opportunity to survive and do their own thing. Please do your best to accommodate and support ever Nigerian that you find. Ghanians and Nigerians are the heart of our continent.

I can bet you one thing and you should take this to the bank, once we are able to strengthen our democratic institutions after this election hopefully, we will back back on the positive trajectory and you will see them returning home.

idid:


Nana it is caused by citizens distrust of the current government, which has also increased the rate of poverty in some Nigerian cities.

You may have noticed that the Nigerian population have grown exponentially in the last two years.

Nigerians have lofty aspirations and once the government of the day cannot fulfil it, they find a way out quickly. We are a country that should be doing 10-12 percent growth per annum but now, we are merely doing two and it is painful to most young, inspirational and enterprising Nigerians. This was also caused by our recent economic recession, which is over now.

Nigerians are also in Ghana because they believe Ghana is closer to home and that some things are cheaper over there, though, it is a double tragedy for Nigeria because most of the people living in Ghana are funded by either money from Nigeria or abroad. I have two cousins doing University there and the parents send nothing less than 10,000 dollars per year for example.

Many Nigerians are schooling there too because we produce too many secondary school leavers than our Universities accommodate.

That is all positive for Ghana because it keeps the local economy going.

I know that some of the Nigerians there will be causing nuisance, but it is only a matter of time before they all return home. If Ghana can understand and permit them though, Nigerians just want to be accommodated and given the opportunity to survive and do their own thing. Please do your best to accommodate and support ever Nigerian that you find. Ghanians and Nigerians are the heart of our continent.

I can bet you one thing and you should take this to the bank, once we are able to strengthen our democratic institutions after this election hopefully, we will back back on the positive trajectory and you will see them returning home.

well we wish you the very best in your upcoming elections we hope you choose well, but none of the problems you mentioned above are excluded from ghanaian problems we have similar problems. As for accommodating nigerians it will depend on their attitude and whether they are able to assimilate. I don't think ghanaians in nigeria give you problems likewise if they comport themselves here no one will give them a hard time it's simple.

Nanatrendy:
well we wish you the very best in your upcoming elections we hope you choose well, but none of the problems you mentioned above are excluded from ghanaian problems we have similar problems. As for accommodating nigerians it will depend on their attitude and whether they are able to assimilate. I don't think ghanaians in nigeria give you problems likewise if they comport themselves here no one will give them a hard time it's simple.

Thanks, that is why some of us are here as well to educate our compatriots about making the right choice.

Whatever, the outcomes though, it will bode well for Nigeria in coming months and I wish Ghana well too.. we have had almost three years of recession and the coast is clearing now.

As per accommodating our people. Well, some of them may put on bad behaviours and attitudes and you should be quick to tell them to piss off. When you see the humble and good ones though, please accommodate as best as possible. We are truly in this together and you may not realise how much.

But the moment Nigeria is not sick again, the peace and prosperity will be felt in Ghana immediately.

Love Ghana. Peace out!

idid:


I wasn't exaggerating the above when I said that most people cannot live within 18-30,000 but I do not mean that it is not possible, I know that it is, but I mean that whoever does is still not living like a human being in the 21st century and is still living under poverty.

You are forgetting that a typical Nigerian worker has an average of three people in his family. It is even Nigerian to be at least five in your family but let's keep it at three for now.

Going by your calculated daily feeding N600 X 3= N1800 per day. Now let's multiply by 30 days = N54,000
Electricity 1500 per month. I am being conservative here
House rent. One bedroom apartment- 4000 x 12 = 48,000
Transport to work- 1500
Other bills: 5000 naira
Total: 110,000

Let's say I have exaggerated and we take 30,000 off. You still have 80,000 naira.

Even many people will say that my calculation without the 30k discount is ridiculous because I haven't added other miscellaneous expenses such as school uniform for your child, data for your phone, diesel for generator and so on.

Now if you are earning 30k, you will still be indebted unless you have some magic bullet. And that explains why civil servants are hungry and corrupt sometimes. People have to take bribes and do shady deals or have side hustle to survive. That is not how it is done in developed climes at all. Maybe 30k will be tenable if there is social housing and there is free education, free electricity, free travel, free medical when you get sick and so on.

Imagine if someone earning the above fall sick or has an accident, how will they pay their bills?

And remember that our purpose in life is not to work and pay bills alone as over 100 million Nigerians do. It is to fulfil the human potential.

Please let's forget the UN poverty indicator for now, we all aspire to travel someday, to go on holiday, to buy a house or build one, to go to University and earn a degree, to buy our desired car. Or even learn a new skill and marry a third wife .

That is how human beings should live and aspire and any good government should be there to support those aspirations. So, we should pay people well so that they can save money to achieve those things that they desire and live as human beings. If all this can happen, you will see that no one will be interested in leaving the shores of Nigeria ever again to work or live elsewhere.

And it is a sure way to eradicate corruption too..

You and I are indeed, some of the few lucky ones who can access the internet and post as much as we like without much complain about data, do you know how many people who cannot afford a broadband or data in Nigeria? This things should be affordable by everyone and in the latest definition of poverty, as long as you cannot afford basic needs such as data or broadband, you are still trapped under poverty.

Brother, we have to step it up and close the gap between us and westerners. It is high time for the ordinary Nigerian to live the kind of life that citizens in other countries live. It is not luxury, it is human right and you and I deserve it.

First of all that 600 naira per day is an example for hustlers because many of them buys already made food and that example I gave is a fact because it is what is happening.
Now talking about a family, you can expect everyone in the family to be buying food like hustlers are doing. In Nigeria we have people who take home 20k in a month and feed their families. You and I might not understand how they do that but I can tell you it does exist. There are many families who get some food stuffs from their villages and just buy few additional food stuffs in the market and they are fine for a month. I am not saying life can't be better than that. But I am just trying to say that Nigeria Survival is quite different from what many people thinks because of all these white man statistics. Nigeria is a country where many of us don't understand. Its a country that when you analyze people dying of hunger or poor you discover they are people who dont have multiple sources of income or are just lazy or the almajiris. To me I want to believe Nigeria is the only country in the world in which her civil servants would survive even when her government refuses to pay salaries. What I am saying is that an average Nigeria survives better than if it were to be other countries like US and co.
Then the analysis you wrote is just of one of the thousand analysis obtainable in the country. If that analysis is true for more than 60% of the country's population then there is no way Nigeria citizens will survive. There are people who have like 2 kids, the wife might be a corn seller and the husband may be an okada rider. You see that in a month they might not spend more than 15k a month. And see any capital project they want to do they simply rely on "Ajo". So its just a function of how you package yourself. Some put their kids in a nearby schl so transportation is cut off. The woman sells may be in front of her house and so on. That your analysis fits a big city and even in big cities people still find a way round it. But like you said we should live better, aspire for big things... and you are right on that. And many people have that testimonies who started small and today are big.

Olumyco:


First of all that 600 naira per day is an example for hustlers because many of them buys already made food and that example I gave is a fact because it is what is happening.
Now talking about a family, you can expect everyone in the family to be buying food like hustlers are doing. In Nigeria we have people who take home 20k in a month and feed their families. You and I might not understand how they do that but I can tell you it does exist. There are many families who get some food stuffs from their villages and just buy few additional food stuffs in the market and they are fine for a month. I am not saying life can't be better than that. But I am just trying to say that Nigeria Survival is quite different from what many people thinks because of all these white man statistics. Nigeria is a country where many of us don't understand. Its a country that when you analyze people dying of hunger or poor you discover they are people who dont have multiple sources of income or are just lazy or the almajiris. To me I want to believe Nigeria is the only country in the world in which her civil servants would survive even when her government refuses to pay salaries. What I am saying is that an average Nigeria survives better than if it were to be other countries like US and co.
Then the analysis you wrote is just of one of the thousand analysis obtainable in the country. If that analysis is true for more than 60% of the country's population then there is no way Nigeria citizens will survive. There are people who have like 2 kids, the wife might be a corn seller and the husband may be an okada rider. You see that in a month they might not spend more than 15k a month. And see any capital project they want to do they simply rely on "Ajo". So its just a function of how you package yourself. Some put their kids in a nearby schl so transportation is cut off. The woman sells may be in front of her house and so on. That your analysis fits a big city and even in big cities people still find a way round it. But like you said we should live better, aspire for big things... and you are right on that. And many people have that testimonies who started small and today are big.

Don't forget my argument earlier, that it is not so much about survival I know that Nigerians are a special breed kind of and will survive no matter what, but it is about achieving the human potential and aspirations.

When we pay a well above survival salary or wage, our people will flourish, and will live up to their potentials. It will no more be about going to the village to get foods, or depending on your brother or cousins to cover your shortfalls or to send your kids to quality schools, it will rather be about self actualisation which is the birth right of everyone.

Look at the Maslow's hierarchy of needs below. It is sad that we are still at the purple stage beneath, i.e. meeting the basic needs of life. People in western countries have climbed the fifth ladder and that is where we deserve to be. Our conversations should be how we can achieve those potentials.

You are talking nonsense. Pure crap! You guys keep talking about GDP up and down. Look, GDP is not everything! You have a big GDP and yet life expectancy is a miserable 46 years? You have a large GDP and yet your people perpetually sleep in darkness, despite your oil and resource? You have a large GDP and yet your people are unemployed? You have a large GDP and yet your people eat from dustbins? You have a large GDP and yet your people cannot sleep with their two eyes closed? Fuckeduppedness you have a large GDP and yet there are more poor people in your country than in any other country in the world?

Olumyco:


Lol... that is not what is obtainable in Ghana Sir. I am there. 1 cedis is 75 naira. 1 cedis will buy 5 sachets of pure water. Our 75 naira will buy 7 sachets of pure water.
In Ghana you will manage and struggle to eat 3 cedis food. Infact if you want to eat food normally you will have to spend like 5 cedis to 10 cedis. I know what I am saying. In Nigeria you can eat nice food with 150 naira... that's like 2 Cedis.

Ghana economy is bad. They are just trying. Even Lagos GDP is twice that of the whole of Ghana. Many of their banks are even collapsing. Nigerian banks are the one flexing muscle there.
Ghana beat us in Electricity and Security. I admit that but in terms of economy and infrastructure forget it.
It was when I traveled out I discovered we Nigerians dont value our country. Infact the only country we can be comparing is SA and Egypt. May God help other African countries. If we go to other African countries apart from SA, Egypt, Morocco and probably Kenya you guys will know that those countries are really struggling.