mkmyers45: Are you saying the real moses is diffrent as painted in the biblical account?

plaetton:

Absolutely.
The clues are in the bibles.
His so-called miraculous birth by unanyimous parents, his rescue by an unnamed pharoah's daughter, his adoption as a prince in the royal house of Egypt(an imposibility), his exile from Egyptian royalty after killing an egyptian guard(another absurdity).
You can see that it sounds too much like a hastly made up fairy tale.

If you read genesis carefully, you would also notice that Moses never ever refered to Yahweh and the isrealites as his god and people respectively. Rather, when talking to Yahweh about the Isrealites, he would use the phrase "your people", [/b]and when talking to the Isrealites about yahweh, he would use the phrase [b]"Your god" . This clearly shows that he never considered himself to be an Isrealite.

Again, it strikes as strange that Moses was not allowed to lead the Isrealites into the promised land.I would guess beacause he was a foreigner who was forbiden to do so.

However, most shocking to me, even at a tender age, was the fact the sons of Moses were not automatic inheritors of the preisthood as would have been expected. After the death of Moses, all mention of his children and lineage completely dissapear in the bible.

So, you can say that the bible stole moses from his Egyptian heritage, mainly because the hebrews wanted to obfuscate the Egyptian origins of their religion and culture.

plaetton:

Absolutely.
The clues are in the bibles.
His so-called miraculous birth by unanyimous parents, his rescue by an unnamed pharoah's daughter, his adoption as a prince in the royal house of Egypt(an imposibility), his exile from Egyptian royalty after killing an egyptian guard(another absurdity).
You can see that it sounds too much like a hastly made up fairy tale.

If you read genesis carefully, you would also notice that Moses never ever refered to Yahweh and the isrealites as his god and people respectively. Rather, when talking to Yahweh about the Isrealites, he would use the phrase "your people", [/b]and when talking to the Isrealites about yahweh, he would use the phrase [b]"Your god" . This clearly shows that he never considered himself to be an Isrealite.

Again, it strikes as strange that Moses was not allowed to lead the Isrealites into the promised land.I would guess beacause he was a foreigner who was forbiden to do so.

However, most shocking to me, even at a tender age, was the fact the sons of Moses were not automatic inheritors of the preisthood as would have been expected. After the death of Moses, all mention of his children and lineage completely dissapear in the bible.

So, you can say that the bible stole moses from his Egyptian heritage, mainly because the hebrews wanted to obfuscate the Egyptian origins of their religion and culture.

Good work Jantavanta

jantavanta:                                      'In Egyptian, "Adhon means Aten".'

"A young pharaoh comes to power in Egypt in 1379 B.C.E. and it will change the world and its effects are seen today the world over. Like his father he is called Amenhotep/Amenophis (IV) (Amenhotep='Amon is satisfied') in the beginning. Later on he changes his name to Akh-en-aten.

He tries to impose a new belief system on his Egyptian subjects, which is in contrast with the traditions and habits of thousands of years. This new belief system is an orthodox monotheism, the first example of its kind in history. Amenhotep's rule lasted 17 years (1379-1362 BC.). Following his death this new belief system meets its end abruptly, and anything and everything that belonged to this 'heretic' ruler is banned.Unlike the previous Egyptian religious system, the religion imposed by Amenhotep IV, the Biblical Moses,

frosbel:



For starters , Moses was never Pharoh - Fact 1





Stop racing to the Internet to copy articles, verify them first.

I will be back to debunk the rest in their rightful historical and biblical context.

mkmyers45:

MR FROSBEL

We are looking at Egyptian records here and not some event....

Egyptians keep record detail of everything.....So his biblical story (Moses) must be cross-checked with ancient Egyptian records which is what he did.....

Hint: They was a pharaoh that did drown in the nile

mkmyers45:

Please can you historically pin-point who moses was in Egyptian mythology?

Thanks

plaetton:

All clues point to Pharaoh Amenhotep 111, who later changed his name to Anhk-Aten and 17 yrs later was forced to abdicate his throne by the power army and preisthoods of Amen Ra. Thereafter, all records relating to Amenhoteb were erased from Egyptian records.
It is most likely that after many years in the sinai area, he came back to Egypt with his half brother Anhk[b]-Ara-On[/b] to reclaim his throne and family dynasty after his heir, Tutenkhamun(the famous boy king Tut) had been murdered (probably) in a palace coupe.

He was obviously unsuccessful and probably negotiated the release of the Hebrews as a condition of his acquiesence.

The greaful Isrealites saw him as their leader and called him the "Mosis" or the rightful king.
However, later on intheir history, the decided to obfuscate the egyptian origins of their reliion and culture by hiding the real identity of Moses and his lineage.

The fairy tale of the birth and rescue of moses in the river is borrowed from the legend of king Sargon the great, King of Akkad. pls google it.

jantavanta:                                      'In Egyptian, "Adhon means Aten".'

"A young pharaoh comes to power in Egypt in 1379 B.C.E. and it will change the world and its effects are seen today the world over. Like his father he is called Amenhotep/Amenophis (IV) (Amenhotep='Amon is satisfied') in the beginning. Later on he changes his name to Akh-en-aten.

He tries to impose a new belief system on his Egyptian subjects, which is in contrast with the traditions and habits of thousands of years. This new belief system is an orthodox monotheism, the first example of its kind in history. Amenhotep's rule lasted 17 years (1379-1362 BC.). Following his death this new belief system meets its end abruptly, and anything and everything that belonged to this 'heretic' ruler is banned.

Unlike the previous Egyptian religious system, the religion imposed by Amenhotep IV, the Biblical Moses, was a fairly simple one, albeit radically different in character. In place of a pantheon of gods (neteru), God being separated into each of His attributes, characters, and features, each with separate functions and forms, they were all grouped under a single diety - to the exclusion and denial of all other dieties and attributes of this One God. Now, instead of God being thought about as different manifestations of the Divine He is understood as the "All in the One"; a Divine Unity of all that exists. This god was Aten or Aton, the Intelligent Life-giving Force or Energy of the Universe that was symbolized by the the disk of the sun (the physical example of the Cosmic Energy that exits behind all matter). Quite simply, Aten was the supreme God of all creation, responsible for all existing life regardless of place or culture. No longer would mankind be divided over this "understanding of God" or "that understanding of God"; now all mankind could come together under the One God of All. Mankind could finally be "one brotherhood".

Furthermore, besides the very obvious image of the sun, Atenism was basically a religion without any image for its God; it assigned no mythological visual representation to Aten. Aten was never represented in the form of either man or beast, simply the [i]impersonal [/i]disk of the sun."

http://www.egyptcx.netfirms.com/adonai.htm    http://www.egyptcx.netfirms.com/aten_ankh_hands2.jpg

Akhenaten and Judeo-Christian monotheism
The idea of Akhenaten as the pioneer of a monotheistic religion that later became Judaism has been considered by various scholars.One of the first to mention this was Sigmund Freud, the founder of psychoanalysis, in his book Moses and Monotheism.Freud argued that Moses had been an Atenist priest forced to leave Egypt with his followers after Akhenaten's death. Freud argued that Akhenaten was striving to promote monotheism, something that the biblical Moses was able to achieve.Following his book, the concept entered popular consciousness and serious research.
Other scholars and mainstream Egyptologists point out that there are direct connections between early Judaism and other Semitic religious traditions. They also state that two of the three principal Judaic terms for God, Yahweh, Elohim (morphologically plural, lit. "gods", and Adonai (morphologically plural, lit. "my lords" ) have a connection to Aten. Freud commented on the connection between Adonai, the Egyptian Aten and the Syrian divine name of Adonis as a primeval unity of language between the factions; in this he was following the argument of Egyptologist Arthur Weigall. Jan Assmann's opinion is that 'Aten' and 'Adonai' are not linguistically related.
Akhenaten appears in history almost two centuries prior to the first archaeological and written evidence for Judaism and Israelite culture is found in the Levant.[citation needed] Abundant visual imagery of the Aten disk was central to Atenism, which celebrated the natural world, while such imagery is not a feature of early Israelite culture.However, pottery found throughout Judea dated to the end of the 8th century BC has seals resembling a winged sun disk burned on their handles. These are argued to be the royal seal of the Judean Kingdom.
Ahmed Osman has claimed that Akhenaten's maternal grandfather Yuya was the same person as the Biblical Joseph. Yuya held the title "Overseer of the Cattle of Min at Akhmin" during his life.[66]
He likely belonged to the local nobility of Akhmim. Egyptologists hold this view because Yuya had strong connections to the city of Akhmim in Upper Egypt. This makes it unlikely that he was a foreigner since most Asiatic settlers tended to cloister around the Nile Delta region of Lower Egypt.[67][68] Some Egyptologists,[69] however, give him a Mitannian origin. It is widely accepted that there are strong similarities between Akhenaten's Great Hymn to the Aten and the Biblical Psalm 104, though this form is found widespread in ancient Near Eastern hymnology both before and after the period[citation needed] and whether this implies a direct influence or a common literary convention remains in dispute.
Others have likened some aspects of Akhenaten's relationship with the Aten to the relationship, in Christian tradition, of Jesus Christ with God - particularly in interpretations that emphasise a more monotheistic interpretation of Atenism than henotheistic. Donald B. Redford has noted that some have viewed Akhenaten as a harbinger of Jesus. "After all, Akhenaten did call himself the son of the sole god: 'Thine only son that came forth from thy body'." James Henry Breasted likened him to Jesus, Arthur Weigall saw him as a failed precursor of Christ and Thomas Mann saw him "as right on the way and yet not the right one for the way".
Redford argued that while Akhenaten called himself the son of the Sun-Disc and acted as the chief mediator between god and creation, kings for thousands of years before Akhenaten's time had claimed the same relationship and priestly role. However Akhenaton's case may be different through the emphasis placed on the heavenly father and son relationship. Akhenaten described himself as "thy son who came forth from thy limbs", "thy child", "the eternal son that came forth from the Sun-Disc", and "thine only son that came forth from thy body". The close relationship between father and son is such that only the king truly knows the heart of "his father", and in return his father listens to his son's prayers. He is his father's image on earth and as Akhenaten is king on earth his father is king in heaven. As high priest, prophet, king and divine he claimed the central position in the new religious system. Since only he knew his father's mind and will, Akhenaten alone could interpret that will for all mankind with true teaching coming only from him.
Redford concluded:
Before much of the archaeological evidence from Thebes and from Tell el-Amarna became available, wishful thinking sometimes turned Akhenaten into a humane teacher of the true God, a mentor of Moses, a Christlike figure, a philosopher before his time. But these imaginary creatures are now fading away one by one as the historical reality gradually emerges. There is little or no evidence to support the notion that Akhenaten was a progenitor of the full-blown monotheism that we find in the Bible. The monotheism of the Hebrew Bible and the New Testament had its own separate development—one that began more than half a millenium after the pharaoh's death.
However, Greenberg argues that Judaism shows signs that in its early forms it had Henotheistic characteristics and that it later was refined into a monotheism around the time of King Josiah, relegating that which previously were considered gods, into gods that ought not be worshipped, i.e. angels.

mkmyers45:

It is seen as comparative mythology....anyway what happened to his blood-line?

plaetton:

No one is sure. The Hebrew scribes went to great lenghts to hide and completely erase it from their books.

mkmyers45: Jantavanta

Can you provide us more reliable source and write-up's?

mkmyers45: Jantavanta

Can you provide us more reliable source and write-up's?

plaetton:

There are tons of literature on this subject.

Notable among them is one written by Sigmud Freud, titled "Moses, King Of Egypt".

mkmyers45:

Ok, Which Pharaoh did drown in the Nile?

frosbel:

It is getting worse, the original article stated Moses was a Pharaoh and your Wikipedia source says he was a Priest , which is it Sir

frosbel:

It is getting worse, the original article stated Moses was a Pharaoh and your Wikipedia source says he was a Priest , which is it Sir

plaetton:


I have never heard that any of them did?
If you are referring the alleged miraculous crossing of the red sea, it never happened. If you read the bible and plot the movement of the Isrealites after they left Egypt, you will see that they never came remotely close to the red sea. They did cross a sea of reeds, a swampy marshland.

plaetton:


I have never heard that any of them did?
If you are referring the alleged miraculous crossing of the red sea, it never happened. If you read the bible and plot the movement of the Isrealites after they left Egypt, you will see that they never came remotely close to the red sea. They did cross a sea of reeds, swampy marshland.

mkmyers45:

Do you know any i can easily lay my hands on?

frosbel:


And this you heard from third hand sources , all conflicting with each other, you guys are hilarious, I wish you and your ilks all the best in your historical journey to nowhere

Bye ya