kayfra:
You can't use eurocentrism to shade Soyinka's achievement. Knock it off

the Nobel club themselves aren't denying their Eurocentrism, its their prize after all.

superlightning:


my brother, its NOT about who is brave or who is a coward (if that's what you mean).

its about approach. Achebe was forward and assertive while Soyinka was cunning and persuasive.

You don't have to make wrong assumptions.

Nobel prize is about "creativity", not attributes.

superlightning:


the Nobel club themselves aren't denying their Eurocentrism, its their prize after all.

The award is not given posthumously. There will never be a Nobel Prize for Achebe.

Every part of the world accepts Nobel Prize as a measure of excellence, except Achebe people who see it as irrelevant. Very funny.

MetaPhysical:


The award is not given posthumously. There will never be a Nobel Prize for Achebe.

Every part of the world accepts Nobel Prize as a measure of excellence, except Achebe people who see it as irrelevant. Very funny.

again, I have never downplayed Soyinka's Nobel prize. save yourself the insecurity my brother.

MetaPhysical:

Nobel prize is about "creativity", not attributes.

yes you are right, Eurocentric creativity.

superlightning:


again, I have never downplayed Soyinka's Nobel prize. save yourself the insecurity my brother.

You are the insecured one. Achebe wrote good books...he was a good storyteller but he was not a creative artist. Period!

Nobel is looking for innovators...those who break the barriers of human knowledge in literature. Soyinka did that!

Ill ask you again, name one work of classic that Achebe created. Just one!

Abeg let your hero rest, stop ridiculing him on internet. You all should have told Reno to regard Achebe as untouchable, you did not do that and allowed him to desecrate his honors on social media. Let the man rest.

superlightning:


yes you are right, Eurocentric creativity.

The text Achebe used to compose and tell stories to his readers, were they not Eurocentric letters?

MetaPhysical:


You are the insecured one. Achebe wrote good books...he was a good storyteller but he was not a creative artist. Period!

Nobel is looking for innovators...those who break the barriers of human knowledge in literature. Soyinka did that!

Ill ask you again, name one work of classic that Achebe created. Just one!

Abeg let your hero rest, stop ridiculing him on internet. You all should have told Reno to regard Achebe as untouchable, you did not do that and allowed him to desecrate his honors on social media. Let the man rest.

poetry and prose are both works of creativity.

quit the reverse psychology, nobody is desecrating anybody. thanks for your concern though.

superlightning:


poetry and prose are both works of creativity.

quit the reverse psychology, nobody is desecrating anybody. thanks for your concern though.

Soyinka was judged the best in the world. He defeated literaries greater than Achebe. Who is Achebe where Soyinka is ? Knock it off!

MetaPhysical:


Soyinka was judged the best in the world. He defeated literaries greater than Achebe. Who is Achebe where Soyinka is ? Knock it off!

you are digressing the intent of this thread. again, there is no such thing as "best in the world" with regards to literature. thank you.

MetaPhysical:


The text Achebe used to compose and tell stories to his readers, were they not Eurocentric letters?

again and again, speaking or writing English does not make you eurocentric. pls get the right meaning of "eurocentric".

MetaPhysical:


The award is not given posthumously. There will never be a Nobel Prize for Achebe.

Every part of the world accepts Nobel Prize as a measure of excellence, except Achebe people who see it as irrelevant. Very funny.

can u just imagine.
If it goes their way, its merit if not its nepotism /marginalization
What do we call all ds now?
How can/why shd u pull down someone just to make urself better?

las_las these clowns will still take this (Nobel laureate) matter to ICC with d look of things.

richie240:

can u just imagine.
If it goes their way, its merit if not its nepotism .
What do we call all ds now?
How can/why shd u pull down someone just to make itself better?

las_las these clowns will still take this (Nobel laureate) matter to ICC with d look of things.

Its looking like that to be honest.

They are already giving it attributes..Achebe was denied because he was assertive, but we cant find anything of his assertiveness in creation. Contrary, Soyinka was the one assertive by breaking stereotypes of Europeans as a civilized and noble society above the black race. Soyinka proved to them with his works that he comes from a cultural background that is peerage...and in some instances superior....to their hyped Greek. After review they agreed. The award signifies their judgement that Soyinka, and indeed Yoruba, is among the circle of great masters and civilizations of works of art....in this case written art!

superlightning:


the Nobel club themselves aren't denying their Eurocentrism, its their prize after all.

J. K Rowlings, the author of the Harry Potter series, despite becoming the first billionaire writer, with her works being translated into several languages is yet to win a Nobel laureate. It might interest you to know that majority of the top 100 most popular book authors (including those with far more Eurocentric views) are not recipient of the nobel laureate and you're making a mountain out of Achebe's work (he's a very good novelist though).
Popularity doesn't determine the quality of literature and that's why laymen like you will forever argue in vain. Literature icons all over the world voted for Soyinka... who are you to disagree?

PVision2020:

J. K Rowlings, the author of the Harry Potter series, despite becoming the first billionaire writer, with her works being translated into several languages is yet to win a Nobel laureate. It might interest you to know that majority of the top 100 most popular book authors (including those with far more Eurocentric views) are not recipient of the nobel laureate and you're making a mountain out of Achebe's work (he's a very good novelist though).
Popularity doesn't determine the quality of literature and that's why laymen like you will forever argue in vain. Literature icons all over the world voted for Soyinka... who are you to disagree?

1. Nobel committee draws literary works from the pool of eurocentric works, so its understandable that not every Eurocentric work will win the prize. its just not possible.

2. secondly, harry potter series does not share the same literary theme with "things fall apart" though it being a work of fiction
. it rather shares the same theme with Amos tutuola's "palmwine drunkard" because they both are under fantasy subgenre of fiction.

superlightning:


1. Nobel committee draws literary works from the pool of eurocentric works, so its understandable that not every Eurocentric work will win the prize. its just not possible.

2. secondly, harry potter series does not share the same literary theme with "things fall apart" though it being a work of fiction
. it rather shares the same theme with Amos tutuola's "palmwine drunkard" because they both are under fantasy subgenre of fiction.

Gao Xingjian (2000) - Chinese,
Mo Yan - Chinese (2012),
Yasunari Kawabata - Japanese (1968),
Shmuel Yosef Agnon (1966) - Isreali.
Naguib Mahfouz (1988) - Egyptian (Arabic)
All the above mentioned won the noble laureate by not only being "non eurocentric" but they wrote in their native languages and still won. So your Eurocentric arguments is only good for the trash can.
Must of Achebe's appraisals, approvals and accolades came from this same Europeans. Just last week BBC listed him as one of the Top 100 Authors in history (Excluding Soyinka) with nobody shouting one Eurocentric nonsense.
I'm not surprised though, it's normal for our friends across the Niger to accept/chestbeat over anything that favours them but quick to cry foul, play down or or summarily claim persecution when it doesn't favour them.

PVision2020:

Gao Xingjian (2000) - Chinese,
Mo Yan - Chinese (2012),
Yasunari Kawabata - Japanese (1968),
Shmuel Yosef Agnon (1966) - Isreali.
Naguib Mahfouz (1988) - Egyptian (Arabic)
All the above mentioned won the noble laureate by not only being "non eurocentric" but they wrote in their native languages and still won. So your Eurocentric arguments is only good for the trash can.
Must of Achebe's appraisals, approvals and accolades came from this same Europeans. Just last week BBC listed him as one of the Top 100 Authors in history (Excluding Soyinka) with nobody shouting one Eurocentric nonsense.
I'm not surprised though, it's normal for our friends across the Niger to accept/chestbeat over anything that favours them but quick to cry foul, play down or or summarily claim persecution when it doesn't favour them.

pls do yourself a favor. Google through the "criticisms about Nobel prize". The prize being eurocentric has nothing to do with one using native language or not, neither does it affect the prestige of the prize.

https://m.dw.com/en/controversies-that-have-dogged-the-nobel-prize-for-literature-awards/a-40819676


Achebe is the principal critic of Joseph Conrad, one of Europe's finest literary icons.

I will say no more.

Thanks for your input regardless of its emotionally laden stance.

please just calm down and patiently read this through this link

https://m.dw.com/en/controversies-that-have-dogged-the-nobel-prize-for-literature-awards/a-40819676

nobel prize has since being known to be eurocentric. it doesn't change the fact that it is prestigious.

superlightning:


pls do yourself a favor. Google through the "criticisms about Nobel prize". The prize being eurocentric has nothing to do with one using native language or not, neither does it affect the prestige of the prize.

Achebe is the principal critic of Joseph Conrad, one of Europe's finest literary icons.

I will say no more.

Thanks for your input regardless of its emotionally laden stance.

You're the one being emotional here. I'm yet to see anyone criticize Chimamanda Adichies' several European Award for being "eurocentric" despite are eurocentric feminism and liberal stance.
Achebe himself won several European Award and no one cried foul.
Just like every award body (Grammy, Oscar etc), criticism are meant to arise but that doesn't reduce their integrity.

PVision2020:

You're the one being emotional here. I'm yet to see anyone criticize Chimamanda Adichies' several European Award for being "eurocentric" despite are eurocentric feminism and liberal stance.
Achebe himself won several European Award and no one cried foul.
Just like every award body (Grammy, Oscar etc), criticism are meant to arise but that doesn't reduce their integrity.

pls follow this link....

https://newrepublic.com/article/145200/happened-nobel-prize-literature


it is a known fact that the Nobel prize is EUROCENTRIC despite being prestigious.

superlightning:


pls follow this link....

https://newrepublic.com/article/145200/happened-nobel-prize-literature


it is a known fact that the Nobel prize is EUROCENTRIC despite being prestigious.

I'll give you hundreds of links criticising Grammy, Oscar, Balon d'or and several other Awards of international repute.
Even if you have an Award body made up of angels, criticism will still arise. So your link(s) above is inconsequential.

superlightning:


pls do yourself a favor. Google through the "criticisms about Nobel prize". The prize being eurocentric has nothing to do with one using native language or not, neither does it affect the prestige of the prize.

https://m.dw.com/en/controversies-that-have-dogged-the-nobel-prize-for-literature-awards/a-40819676


Achebe is the principal critic of Joseph Conrad, one of Europe's finest literary icons.

I will say no more.

Thanks for your input regardless of its emotionally laden stance.

Oga, biko, why is ds thing peppering u 'phd' (pull him down) lots like ds?
When WS won d Nobel laureate in 1986, he won it as a result of his work, not as a Nigerian, and definitely not because he is an Omoluabi. Though I know where all ds craziness is coming from.

I could remember when he won it, ALL NIGERIANS (including ur 'clan') hailed him for making Nigeria (not Yoruba) proud!

Just 30 something yrs down d line, this unique feat is now seen as a 'Yoruba thing', 'our son vs their son' thing. So, so smh.

Nowadays, ur 'PhD' lots have conditioned d minds of d average Nigerian to first look at the tribe of anyone b4 commending/ rebuking his heroic feat/crime. If he's not 'our son', even if hes d first Nigerian to go to plànet Saturn, HE MUST GO DOWN!
Smh!

PVision2020:

I'll give you hundreds of links criticising Grammy, Oscar, Balon d'or and several other Awards of international repute.
Even if you have an Award body made up of angels, criticism will still arise. So your link(s) above is inconsequential.

my friend, the Nobel prize is a prestigious prize, arguably the most prestigious prize reward for literature. but its not a PERFECT AWARD. It has its own shortcomings. that is why you don't ALWAYS define a literary work by its award but by its global impact

richie240:

Oga, biko, why is ds thing [I]peppering[/i] u 'phd' (pull him down) lots like ds?
When WS won d Nobel laureate in 1986, he won it as a result of his work, not as a Nigerian, and definitely [b]not because he is an Omoluabi. Though I know where all ds craziness is coming from.

I could remember when he won it, ALL NIGERIANS (including ur 'clan') hailed him for making Nigeria (not Yoruba) proud!

Just 30 something yrs down d line, this unique feat is now seen as a 'Yoruba thing', 'our son vs their son' thing. So, so smh.

Nowadays, ur 'PhD' lots have conditioned d minds of d average Nigerian to first look at the tribe of anyone b4 commending/ rebuking his heroic feat/crime.
Smh!

I am not attacking soyinka . I am not. I just want to correct an impression about people's work being "superior" to other notable works because of a Nobel prize.

I have stated it from the beginning, Soyinka and Achebe are both greats. yet your kinsmen keep attacking that standpoint, citing Soyinka's Nobel prize as making him superior above Achebe.

superlightning:


my friend, the Nobel prize is a prestigious prize, arguably the most prestigious prize reward for literature. but its not a PERFECT AWARD. It has its own shortcomings. that is why you don't ALWAYS define a literary work by its award but by its global impact

Oga please tell us any "Perfect Award"?
If it's by global impact, then the Bible and Quran should be the permanent annual winners...lol

Basic123:
It shows you know nothing about LITERATURE and wole soyinka itself.
we are talking about literature not ordinary writing.

Tribalism has eaten u up.

PVision2020:

Oga please tell us any "Perfect Award"?
If it's by global impact, then the Bible and Quran should be the permanent annual winners...lol

thank you, that's why its unwise to judge artistic greatness of a literary work through the lens of Nobel prize (or any prize) alone.

superlightning:


I am not attacking soyinka . I am not. I just want to correct an impression about people's work being "superior" to other notable works because of a Nobel prize.

I have stated it from the beginning, Soyinka and Achebe are both greats. yet your kinsmen keep attacking that standpoint, citing Soyinka's Nobel prize as making him superior above Achebe.

From the onset, you set out to settle a superiority contest which further reveals your inferiority complex.

superlightning:


I am not attacking soyinka . I am not. I just want to correct an impression about people's work being "superior" to other notable works because of a Nobel prize.

I have stated it from the beginning, Soyinka and Achebe are both greats. yet your kinsmen keep attacking that standpoint, citing Soyinka's Nobel prize as making him superior above Achebe.

Oga, if not for mischievousness, there's even no reason for comparison in d first instance. WS won d NP as a NIGERIAN and CA is a great NIGERIAN novelist. BOth have done Nigerian proud and they should be celebrated. In one breath u are saying WS is a great poet, in d same breath u are downgrading d Nobel prize.
Biko, life is not difficult, and we shdnt make it difficult for ourselves

PVision2020:

Oga please tell us any "Perfect Award"?
If it's by global impact, then the Bible and Quran should be the permanent annual winners...lol

As in ehn, .......even d Bible and Koran have critics.
You and I know why 'they' claim d NP isn't 'perfect'.

superlightning:
Just a few days back, Reno Omokri set the social media ablaze when he placed Achebe's works over Soyinka. It wasn't funny, especially among the Yoruba folks who were Soyinka's kinsmen. Reno's post, despite how flattering it was for achebe's enthusiasts, was uncalled for anyway.

There are facts however, that shouldn't be dismissed in this discussion.

1. Soyinka is an undisputed literary icon in the world, same goes for Achebe.

2. Soyinka's literary strength lies in poetic abstractions while Achebe's literary strength lies in simplifying complexities.

3. Soyinka is first a poet-playwright, while Achebe is firstly a novelist cum poet. They both have been recognized internationally in these subgenres.

4. The Nobel Prize for literature is an outstandingly prestigious prize, while honorifics like "father of modern African literature" are based on global impact of ones work about Africa.

5. No prize or honorific determines who is above who in literature.

6. Soyinka conveyed African literature through Eurocentric appeals while Achebe conveyed African literature through Afrocentrism.

7. Soyinka's work has this persuasive charm while Achebe's works was unapologetically assertive.

summarily, Achebes works are more popular than Soyinka's work because most nations on earth can relate to its themes of forced societal change through colonization, while Soyinka works aestheically compares Yoruba worldview to European worldview, no wonder Soyinka is a professor of comparative literature.


CBC: lalasticlala

superb info. very balanced write up. both are great writers though they approached literature in different perspectives

PVision2020:

Gao Xingjian (2000) - Chinese,
Mo Yan - Chinese (2012),
Yasunari Kawabata - Japanese (1968),
Shmuel Yosef Agnon (1966) - Isreali.
Naguib Mahfouz (1988) - Egyptian (Arabic)
All the above mentioned won the noble laureate by not only being "non eurocentric" but they wrote in their native languages and still won. So your Eurocentric arguments is only good for the trash can.
Must of Achebe's appraisals, approvals and accolades came from this same Europeans. Just last week BBC listed him as one of the Top 100 Authors in history (Excluding Soyinka) with nobody shouting one Eurocentric nonsense.
I'm not surprised though, it's normal for our friends across the Niger to accept/chestbeat over anything that favours them but quick to cry foul, play down or or summarily claim persecution when it doesn't favour them.

I am yet to see any area of human feat where Ibo outperforms Yoruba. It will never happen.

Weve been producing literary giants before Achebe was born. Did Achebe not go to UI, where he was taught and his eyes opened to writing?

Yoruba leads Ibo forever...in every area of life.