If you believe in freedom of labour (whatever that is),

Though agreeably a nebulous concept,it refers to the discretion which the owners of companies should have to hire whosoever they wish.

If a company decides to hire only Indians, that is discrimination and it goes against your "freedom of labour". You contradict yourself and have no clue what you're talking about i.e., you're an idiot. Another dumbass that has no clue what freedom means!

You presume here,that I view such employment practices as discrimination.That presumption marks you out as the idiot.I don't believe that the concept of freedom from discrimination encompasses a duty on the part of employers to refrain,in their hiring,  from "discrimination" on the grounds of nationality,race,sex,religion,e.t.c.

To that extent,there is no contradiction,for while I support  the principle that employers should hire whoever they wish.I do not support the principle that freedom from discrimination applys to the aforementioned employer's right.That is blatantly implicit in my post to any rational person apart from the irredeemably  idiotic.

To reiterate,the thread asks ,why Indians are taking "our jobs" .To the extent,that  a company is owned by an Indian,it is fair to say that such jobs won't exist in the first place but for that particular Indian owned company's investment.So the idea that they are taking "our jobs" is risible.Those jobs exist by virtue of the enterpreneur's efforts,he and only he alone should decide who gets it

Those jobs exist by virtue of the enterpreneur's efforts, he and only he alone should decide who gets it     

I disagree with you here my friend. Why do you think there are labor laws against job discrimination in place ?

If an indian company (operating in Nigeria) has 10 open slots for computer programmers and over 100 well qualified Nigerian programmers (with experience and everything) apply for these positions first, but the indian firm goes and brings in the 10 programmers from india - that is outright discrimination.

But based on your quote above, as long as indians own the firm, they can hire however way they please. I completely disagree with that.

GNature:


I disagree with you here my friend. Why do you think there are labor laws against job discrimination in place ?

Let me reiterate for the umpteenth time,I am against such laws for the reason I provided.I know for a fact that in Nigerian companies,nepotism is the order of the day.Complaints here are directed against a particular group of enterpreneurs who are doing what is common practice in the Nigerian corporate world.There is no need to single Indians out.

@Big B1 and the supporters of his philosophy.

You people have come again in your long and arduous search for handouts. So now it's not government, it is now Indians. God please deliver Nigerian youths. May they be able to make something for themselve. O lord, even as they continue to misdirect their energies at blaming hardworking foreigners, may you not miraculously provide them with jobs of their own, but give them the energy to create jobs for themselves and employ other fellow Nigerians. Amen.

Ehen back to the issue, there is no Indian taking any job away from a Nigerian. If an Indian builds a company from scratch and decides to employ his fellow Indian, that is his own wahala.
It's just the same as Obalende Suya in Jand will definitely employ more Nigerians.

Then also some multinationals prefer foreigners because of their high standard of work ethics. When the whole world pursuing and achieving perfection, Nigerians are still claiming that nobody is perfect.

By the time we start using nuclear energy in Nigeria, you put a Nigerian there and tell him to increase water levels in the reactor chamber by exactly 2 litres, at exactly 2 hours interval, and we're all dead!

There are some Nigerian perfectionists though, and nobody is taking any job away from them.

I don't get it.
Where is your head? This is Nigeria, it definitely the responsibility of the government to provide job opportunities for the citizens or at least embrace a nation with job opportunities for the citizens. The introduction of the topic is straight forward. The topic asks for us, the youth to identify why employers in Nigeria (not Indian businesses in Nigeria) prefer to hire foreigners instead of the hungry citizens of Nigeria. This topic also asks all to recommend solutions to correct this jobless epidemic that is killing the new generation, the future of Nigeria.
Instead of trying to be a super star and trying to pick a fight, I think we should all focus more on the subject or topic and rescue the future of our country.
You may not be currently affected, but sooner or later the shit will hit the fan and the nation, our pride will be sold at a very cheap price. And nobody but ourselves will be blamed.

Graduate youths from everywhere in Nigeria are constantly seeking for opportunity to leave the country because there is no decent job opportunities for them. But on the other hand, foreigners from other countries, at a very large scale continue to relocate to Nigeria because of a better life and job opportunities.


Does this make any sense to anybody?


This is why we must get the attention of the government to lookout for the citizens. Either by improving the educational standard or providing job training for these kids or do anything to lift up the spirit of the future of Nigeria.

denex:

@Big B1 and the supporters of his philosophy.

You people have come again in your long and arduous search for handouts. So now it's not government, it is now Indians. God please deliver Nigerian youths. May they be able to make something for themselve. O lord, even as they continue to misdirect their energies at blaming hardworking foreigners, may you not miraculously provide them with jobs of their own, but give them the energy to create jobs for themselves and employ other fellow Nigerians. Amen.

Ehen back to the issue, there is no Indian taking any job away from a Nigerian. If an Indian builds a company from scratch and decides to employ his fellow Indian, that is his own wahala.
It's just the same as Obalende Suya in Jand will definitely employ more Nigerians.

Then also some multinationals prefer foreigners because of their high standard of work ethics. When the whole world pursuing and achieving perfection, Nigerians are still claiming that nobody is perfect.

By the time we start using nuclear energy in Nigeria, you put a Nigerian there and tell him to increase water levels in the reactor chamber by exactly 2 litres, at exactly 2 hours interval, and we're all dead!

There are some Nigerian perfectionists though, and nobody is taking any job away from them.

denex have you ever left the shores of this country b4 and more importantly have you ever been to india ? or have u ever asked someone that live Indian how Nigeria are treated in terms of being employed ? have you ever asked yourself why Nigerian professionals are working in countries like Malaysia , Singapore and other Asian countries but never in india?
i understand you post according to what you know, i was like u until i came and saw things with my eyes .

My friend, what is the matter with you? If you go to a company owned by Nigerians in India and they refuse to employ you, is that not a Nigerian problem?
The Indians working here are they not mostly working in companies started by Indians?
Artee Group, Cakes n Bakes, High Point, Millenium Interiors are they not employing Nigerians here? You should realise that it is impossible for these Indian companies in Nigeria not employ Nigerians at all. Their top execs have to be Indians because I cannot have a hardworking brother looking for work, then I will give you the job because I'm in your country. Go and start your own business in their country and employ your own people. It is your human right: freedom of association.

Mr Denex, you keep on going off track, please read the introduction of the topic again. No one is picking a fight, it's about saving tomorrow for each and everyone of us.
This is still one of the best topics I've come across on this forum.

Is this I-man an idiot?. . .Does he think discrimination is a "RIGHT" or what?

Listen man, look for another line of argument, the one you're on just makes you look like an extremist slowpoke. Not even the most conservative humans will say employers have the "right to discriminate", because that's what your reasoning amounts to. Every human being has the right to work wherever they want as long as they're qualified for the job, country of origin or race has nothing to do with your performance on the job.

I suppose back in the day where low class jobs were meant for blacks alone were goot times for you?

To that extent,there is no contradiction,for while I support the principle that employers should hire whoever they wish.I do not support the principle that freedom from discrimination applys to the aforementioned employer's right.That is blatantly implicit in my post to any rational person apart from the irredeemably idiotic.

The only thing implicit in your post is that you definitely came out from the womb head first and straight onto the floor. Ofcourse employers have the right to hire whoever they want as long as they're qualified for the job performance, but they're not supposed to judge qualification based on skin colour or country of origin. When they judge qualification based on that (factors which are not neccessary for performance on the job), that is discrimination and nobody has the right to that.

Is this I-man an idiot?. . .Does he think discrimination is a "RIGHT" or what?

If you weren't so immersed in idiocy,you would have realised by now that I don't view such practices as discrimination.You think it is,I don't.

So what exactly do you call selecting employers based on skin colour and country of origin?

How is that any different from admitting students based on skin colour and country of origin?. . .Or maybe you do not see this one as discrimination, in which case, that's cool bro

denex:

My friend, what is the matter with you? If you go to a company owned by Nigerians in India and they refuse to employ you, is that not a Nigerian problem?
The Indians working here are they not mostly working in companies started by Indians?
Artee Group, Cakes n Bakes, High Point, Millenium Interiors are they not employing Nigerians here? You should realize that it is impossible for these Indian companies in Nigeria not employ Nigerians at all. Their top execs have to be Indians because I cannot have a hardworking brother looking for work, then I will give you the job because I'm in your country. Go and start your own business in their country and employ your own people. It is your human right: freedom of association.

The matter is not with me , but with your rather very limited information about the topic at hand , i would suggest that you ask around to understand why a company like Guiness is not allowed to operate in india , then might be able to know what you don't know yet about the Indians, i say again your problem is that you have limited knowledge about the Indians you try to defend , when you become living witness of their " Indian jobs for Indians'' attitude then you would be in better position to understand that this is a very serious issue .

Leave the Indians alone, Nigerians are all over the world working,the citizens of those country are not complaining.Hard work,dedication,sincerety,honesty,and punctuality,these are what get you a job not merely been a nigerian.

Believe me, I'm not deny that it is Indian jobs for Indians. That is even small compared to French jobs for French. It wasn't till a multi-ethnic French team won the world cup that the eased off a little. It is still very bad sha in France.
What am saying is that if Indians create jobs and give it to Indians, it is their right. They created the jobs. If Nigerians produce jobs and refuse to give Indians, it's our right. The company I work with, it is owned by a Nigerian here in Lagos and he doesn't employ any Indian and is not even willing to, because he doesn't see how being Indian can move his company forward.

Indians this topic is here!

it is the most unfortunate thing in Nigeria and it not just about the indians but whites irrespective of your nationality
sometimes i am tempted to think that every average Nigerian is a racist!

in my company, we have over 500 staff but most key position are occupied by Europeans

the most annoying part is that they enjoy the kind of privilege that we Nigerians only dream of

they have accommodation
are paid both in local currency and foreign currency
have car and driver attached to them 247
have lunch
they lowest salary is about my annual salary
they dont pay tax
all this for nothing!

there are so many Nigerians that are quite capable of doin this job to perfection
it is really sad!


even the way we all clamour for foreign coach and globacom's readiness to pay the coach upfront while our local coaches are still being owed says a lot about us!

this is the only aspect that i respect Mugagbe (though i wish he is a Little civil about it)

if we can travel out and be slaves and things are no different down here;sad!

viee:

[b]Indians this topic is here!

it is the most unfortunate thing in Nigeria and it not just about the indians but whites irrespective of your nationality
sometimes i am tempted to think that every average Nigerian is a racist!

in my company, we have over 500 staff but most key position are occupied by Europeans

the most annoying part is that they enjoy the kind of privilege that we Nigerians only dream of

they have accommodation
are paid both in local currency and foreign currency
have car and driver attached to them 247
have lunch
they lowest salary is about my annual salary
they don't pay tax
all this for nothing!

there are so many Nigerians that are quite capable of doin this job to perfection
it is really sad!


even the way we all clamour for foreign coach and globacom's readiness to pay the coach upfront while our local coaches are still being owed says a lot about us!

this is the only aspect that i respect Mugagbe (though i wish he is a Little civil about it)

if we can travel out and be slaves and things are no different down here;sad! [/b]

Viee, I love you so much! God bless you for that post.

You just hit the nail on the head.

That is exactly what happens in my company and many other companies.

Razorr,

it is really sad
even when due to some operational problems our salary is delayed by a day or two
theirs must be paid as and when do
they are given first class treatment
we provide siren and special security to take them round (when they are not in Niger Delta,may be there,we provide FBI )

the case of the indians and lebanese is even worse
they arrive here with nothig and through some irresponsible govt official establish one company
they pay thrash and treat the staff like thrash
the NLC that should have been concerned i think is relcutant due to the unemployment situation in Nigeria

sad thing is that we have no end in sight!

Viee, it's very funny that you are descibing the situation in my company.

These Lebanese and indian people threat Nigerians like shit and make terrible comments about Nigerians, yet they do not have any better qualifications than we do. Some of them are not even graduates.

Many of them do not even have working permits and what they do is bribe some officials to hide their nonsense.

Guys , this is a very Serious issue that is not getting any attention right now ! But i hope we will never regret this in the future.

Graduate youths from everywhere in Nigeria are constantly seeking for opportunity to leave the country because there is no decent job opportunities for them. But on the other hand, foreigners from other countries, at a very large scale continue to relocate to Nigeria because of a better life and job opportunities.


Does this make any sense to anybody?


This is why we must get the attention of the government to lookout for the citizens. Either by improving the educational standard or providing job training for these kids or do anything to lift up the spirit of the future of Nigeria.

@ I-man and denex

This is another reason why the old school continue to recycle themselves to lead this nation while the youth, the new generation and the future of Nigeria are busy designing a better strategy to escape from the jungle (Nigeria).
I will not be surprised if DAVID MARK becomes our new president in 2011. Why?
We do not have enough new generation that have the political strength to compete with the old school. Why?
If you do not have a decent job to maintain in Nigeria, it means you're nobody. And if you're nobody, it means you're invisible. Job is one of the most important factors that promotes continuity of man kind, and it is the responsibility of a decent government to ensure job opportunities for the citizens.
It is also a great thing to be open or welcome the foreigners, but the citizens must eat first.
Remember that the old school will become older and gone one day. We will be the ones to deal with the outcome of this epidemic.
As the new generation of Nigeria We need to unite firmly, rise up and solidify the future of the youths or else the pride of our nation will be sold for nothing.
I predict that if nothing is done to immediately to correct this issue, in 20 years time our nation will have 10 governors, 5 senators and at least 1 presidential candidate whose parents are not from Nigeria. While the generation of today will have new homes else where all around the world, e.g Ghana, Togo, India, Liberia, Spain, China etc, sweeping floor.

@degoat

please go and create you own jobs and see whether the government will order you to give it to Indians or see whether the Indians will barge into your company and snatch the job from you.
Can anybody impose on Dangote the Nationality of staff to employ?
These Indians have worked for their reputation go to the UK and see the zeal in employing Indians and Pakistanis. It is because of their efficiency and dedication to work. No strings attached.
The case of Nigeria is even different when it is that it is these foreigners that create the jobs they have. Do you want these Indians and Lebanese to create jobs for themselves and their families only to relinquish it to you because you're a Nigerian. Before they came and started the business, where were you?

And you Nigerians that say government should give the private sector a freehand to self regulate. You want to go back and say government should dictate to companies who to employ? Haba Nigerians!
I know sometimes these Indians hire their relatives that don't have better paper qualification than the Nigerians looking for the same job. But what has paper qualification got to do with people like Bill Gates being efficient at what they do?
With all their nepotistic employment practices, how many of these Indian run companies have folded up?

You have not seen anything yet. Shebi China just discovered Nigeria. White Zimbabwean farmers are here too.

Nobody is obligated to give you a job. So hurry now and start a profitable business of your own so you can employ other Nigerians. There are different enterprises that have not been explored yet. Research now and start something before the Chinese come in and saturate every sphere.

Abeg O! By the time I start running my own firm if I see that there's a hopelessly dumb white guy, but because of his skin colour, doors open for us when we're pitching deals, I will employ that guy immediately and select the Nigerian applicant.

@denex
You still don't get it!
You continue to go around the circle. Nobody cares, all we're asking for is opportunities for the citizens to be able to function positively in our society.
The citizens and business owners will do their part, but with out the support of the government, you will be wasting your time. We must get the attention of the government to lookout for the citizens. This is our country and our government has the right to design better policies to regulate business activities and create employment opportunities for the citizens.

@denex
Do you know what it feels like to have masters degree for the past 7 years and never made 10 kobo with your degree?

@denex
Do you know what it feels like to have masters degree, but had to relocate to other countries to sweep floor and kiss ass?

@denex
Do you know what it feels like to have masters degree, but being managed in Nigeria by a foreigner that didn't even finish high school?

@denex
Do you know what it feels like to have a PHD in Nigeria and can't even afford to eat a meal a day?

@denex
Graduate youths from everywhere in Nigeria are constantly seeking for opportunity to leave the country because there is no decent job opportunities for them. But on the other hand, foreigners from other countries, at a very large scale continue to relocate to Nigeria because of a better life and job opportunities.


Does this make any sense to you?

We need to unite firmly and rise up to fight for our future. Together we must find a way to make things right, we must also encourage the federal government to improve our educational standard, so that our people could compete more with confidence.
We can not be the slaves in our fathers' land, we must get hold of the future and stay in control.
I rest my case!

degoat:

We must get the attention of the government to lookout for the citizens. This is our country and our government has the right to design better policies to regulate business activities and create employment opportunities for the citizens.

exactly my point! This country is heading in a direction that could ultimately lead to a situation where foreigners will be the movers and shakers of the economy, whilst our fat potted belly politicians and inefficient civil servants continue to chop money. Very soon they will outsource some government ministries to India or china sef!

The fundamental problem in this country is our mindset and values, we feel that anyone that doesn't have 'black' skin knows better (self indignation at another level!). We need to do something, debate but do something! If not our children will live in apartheid Nigeria!

Just to let you guys know very few Nigerians are given opportunity to get to the top in Oyinbo land . Unless you have your own Company it is very difficult to reach the top in Oyinbo Land. I understand if Companies owned by Indians are giving their Nationals priority. Let Nigerian companies do the same. Or else !!!! we are selling our birthright . I pity the coming generation. If we sell ourself short at home imagine what is going on all over the world where Nigerians are relocating to.