isale_gan2:

Keith Olberman (MSNBC) can be such a blowhard, I swear.    I can take only so much of him.  But he is totally in his element, putting the "right-wingers" on the defensive.  He just mentioned O'Reilly by name.  Crazy Irishman will be out for blood come Monday.

O'Reilly is on, since the shooting.  He is really trying to keep his temper.  It's all bubbling under though.  Just watch him work himself up into thermonuclear condition.  Hehehehehe.  In 30 minutes, he'll be at his redfaced firebreathing best!  There better be a meltdown.  Otherwise I've watched Fox News for nothing.

Update: O'Reilly was fine. He must be more sad than mad.

@topic,

This is why it is good for someone to be able to analyse and properly understand what is going on.  At no point did I say or infer that both Parties advocate violence as a means of political discuss.  You came to that conclusion all by yourself.  Despite all the phrases used by Obama and the DNC, nothing from their statement suggest they were promoting violence. 

Since you said you don't understand english, let me do some public service by helping you a little here.  To understand what someone says, you will need to understand the context of their statement.  This is why I do not fault Obama, Palin, Bachman or the DNC for the phrases people are highlighting.  The reason is simple.  When those words, phrases or sentences are placed in proper context, one sees that they are by no means advocating an armed conflict.  People like you, and the Left in this country are losing credibility fast because every reasonable person can see through this politically motivated rhetorics, and frankly it is disgusting.

You guys have now mastered the art of trying to capitalise on people's pains and suffering for political gain.  This is why a Democratic Polster and Strategist, Mike Penn could come on a national TV program like "Hard-Boil" with Chris Matthews to declare that Obama needs a tragedy to further his political fortune.  This is disgraceful.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjO6NFLLE04

Tada!!!! Still awake

ok, democratic pollster said something, (sorry I didn't watch ur video, I never do) but
republican CONGRESSWOMAN " armed and dangerous"
republican VP CANDIDATE " don't retreat, reload" then put up crosshairs which you now try to spin as surveyors sign

why did the gangsterbitch quickly remove the crosshairs after the shooting. She didn't even wait for a day later. I thought it was harmless.

Ok, gotta sleep now,my flight is tomorow, let me get out of America before righties slam me with surveyors crosshair
David Cameron here I come.

@topic,

Here we go again.  Even after being lectured to learn to read any phrase within the context it was used, we are back again demonising opponents for political gain.  A leopard they say, can never change its spots. 

I see no point in accusing Obama or any Democrat for that matter of encouraging violence even though there is enough ammunition (I hope I won't be called a terrorist for using this word) to pick from their words if I choose to be intellectually dishonest like some are. Neither Democrats nor Republicans remotely encourage or approve the dastardly action of that lunatic.  I don't know the politics of the guy and frankly I don't care.  Historically, Republicans and Democrats alike have been victims of such heinous crime - Reagan and JFK easily come to mind.

Bottomline, Republicans don't encourage violence.  Likewise, Democrats do not call for killing people (except for babies in the womb of course  ).  Let that 'baby~fat' go bunkers here for all I care!!!!

Ok that's it, 2moro I'm going to go out and I'm killing the closest Republican/Conservative/ I can find. I am being fuelled by all this negative rhetoric Na joke o

@mystikal,

Ok that's it, 2moro I'm going to go out and I'm killing the closest Republican/Conservative/ I can find. [b]I am being fuelled by all this negative rhetori[/b]c  Na joke o

The funny thing is that you don't even need to prove that you are influenced by the rhetoric.  Afterall, no one has come up with any proof that the bobo has ever visited Palin's website, talkless of being influenced by her.  In these days of political desperation on the Left, accusations are all that matter, proofs are not.

Arizona has been at the epicenter for inflammatory rhetoric for quite a while. The immigration debate in Arizona were quite nasty, in which Arizona enacted a few laws that targeted Hispanic immigrants.

The economic meltdown in Arizona was pretty bad as well.

And let us not forget the health care debate. The Tea Party was quite active in Arizona in order to get Democrats out of office. And the rhetoric that they used was quite nasty.

The U.S. is so hyper-partisan and I feel the blame falls on the Republicans. They enjoy fueling the hatred for elected officials and the U.S. government in general.

@pres elect - You're really trying o. That you can carrying on the back and forth with some people for so long. You are a much better man than I.

The sad thing is that these republican thugs were warned. Over and over and over again, that someone would get hurt. They ignored and continued to say and allege the absurdest things. They appeal to the basest elements and then when the violence they so crave occurs, they hide behind the "it was one crazed loon" rhetoric. Some of them have already started saying the gunman was a disgruntled democrat sef and the congresswoman was madly against the Pelosi agenda.

Then they persist with this silly "equivalence" argument. "See! See!!, the left is just as bad as us". "We got our Limbaugh but look look Olbermann is just as bad as him". Never mind that the fat sod take offensive and inflamatory speech to stratospheric levels.

The day a right wing pol gets shot in the head, please come back and let's continue the debate. Till then, can I respectfully ask that you shut up and reflect! (not that you would take my advice sha.)

@topic,

All these depressed Leftists are back!  Having received their marching orders from base, they cannot retreat even in the face of logic.  Political opportunism has become the order of the day on the Left. 

After a highly placed Democrat called for an Oklahoma City bombing (with the consent of Chris Matthews if I may add), we have had such incident as the Major Nidal Hassan rampage in Fort Hood as well as the failed Times Square bombing.  If the Right were as desperate and devoid of intellectual honesty as the Left, we would have tied the Democat rhetoric to the incident.  I am glad that such base political opportunism is the sole preserve of the Left.  Thank God Americans have seen right through them.  The process of consigning all of them to the dustbin of history has already begun.

Onwards Conservatives, No Retreat, No Surrender!  We shall not Retire, we shall instead Reload and Refire!!  No, I did not just say that!!

I'm at Dayton airpot. Heading to UK today

republicans have tried to deny he rhetoric from them.
Gangsterbitch took down the crosshairs soon after the shooting
then they spin it that it ain't crosshairs after all

Roger Ailes orders fox news presenters to tone down the rhetoric
but they have not admitted to any vile rhetoric yet( wonder what they are toning down)
then they say it's bilateral, digging up democratic rhetoric from 2004.

Top republicans use language of violence and someone wants to compare with a democratic pollster and makes a false equivalent of vitriol.

The congresswoman personally complained of palin the gangsterbitch using crosshairs on her

6 people are dead, GOP congressmen won't hear of gun control

My JUdgement, within a few months, the rhetoric will go up again, anger and hatred will be watered by the agents of violence, then, it will happen again. America will never learn. I just learnt that there are over 270 million guns in America. Too late for gun control.
I'm off to London. A poorer but more sane society.

^^ We'll welcome you with open arms in good ol Blightey. The weather's usually crap but we aint got no guns.

The last prime minister that was shot, happened at a time before records were kept. We civilised like that! 

What this sad event has to do with

a) abortion
b) major hassan
c) times square bomber

somebody a lot cleverer than I would have to tell me?

I would bet my last dime however that the last two options on that list have to do with a vile and repugnant strain of (poorly disguised) islamophobia.

Omofat and Prez,

Do you both honestly believe that only the right is guilty of otherwise innucuous catch-phrases and buzz-words that suddenly seem 'vitriolic' when something tragic happens? Only the right employs the use of lingo of this nature?

Please do not reply yes. Because I may be forced to deploy Dr. Dre and his entourage to force feed you both with a strict regimen of concentrated doses of reality.

---

And pres calling Palin a gangsterB . . . no matter how 'offensive' you may find another politics, going personal like that is never justifiable - and this is the what we're seeing in today's political climate. Has Palin ever stolen your lunch money that you insult her on a personal level? You proselytized earlier on this thread on the feverish consumption political controversiality by the country . . . look no further than yourself to see one of its biggest consumers - and victims. I mean, what else would inspire you to call her a bee?

Go to the corner and kneel down.

Tayo, I haven't had the chance to greet you properly . . . oga Happy New Year oh! I hope our family is fine and doing exceptionally well . Please greet them for me.

Tayo-D:

@topic,

All these depressed Leftists are back! Having received their marching orders from base, they cannot retreat even in the face of logic. Political opportunism has become the order of the day on the Left.

After a highly placed Democrat called for an Oklahoma City bombing (with the consent of Chris Matthews if I may add), we have had such incident as the Major Nidal Hassan rampage in Fort Hood as well as the failed Times Square bombing. If the Right were as desperate and devoid of intellectual honesty as the Left, we would have tied the Democat rhetoric to the incident. I am glad that such base political opportunism is the sole preserve of the Left. Thank God Americans have seen right through them. The process of consigning all of them to the dustbin of history has already begun.

Onwards Conservatives, No Retreat, No Surrender! We shall not Retire, we shall instead Reload and Refire!! No, I did not just say that!!

ROTFLOL . . . I cannot even laugh again.

To be clear, if you're using this event to criticize the "rhetoric" of Mrs. Palin or others with whom you disagree, then you're either: (a) asserting a connection between the "rhetoric" and the shooting, which based on evidence to date would be what we call a vicious lie; or (b) you're not, in which case you're just seizing on a tragedy to try to score unrelated political points, which is contemptible. Which is it?

Answer this question to yourself before you start finger pointing.

Tayo-D:

@topic,

All these depressed Leftists are back!  Having received their marching orders from base, they cannot retreat even in the face of logic.  Political opportunism has become the order of the day on the Left. 

After a highly placed Democrat called for an Oklahoma City bombing (with the consent of Chris Matthews if I may add), we have had such incident as the Major Nidal Hassan rampage in Fort Hood as well as the failed Times Square bombing.  If the Right were as desperate and devoid of intellectual honesty as the Left, we would have tied the Democat rhetoric to the incident.  I am glad that such base political opportunism is the sole preserve of the Left.  Thank God Americans have seen right through them.  The process of consigning all of them to the dustbin of history has already begun.

Onwards Conservatives, No Retreat, No Surrender!  We shall not Retire, we shall instead Reload and Refire!!  No, I did not just say that!!

You Neocons are quite funny. Conservatives do not listen to logic, they are controled by their emotions and only understand policy in simplistic terms.

The radical right needs to be stopped. And the rhetoric that comes from people like Bill O'Reilly or Rush Limbaugh needs to muted as well. You all should be held accountable for the inflammatory rhetoric that many of your fellow Republican use to rile up the Tea Party.

The Tea Party is a RACIST party. If Obama was not president, there will not be any Tea Party. This Natavist organization needs to be called out for their ignorance.

JeSoul:

Omofat and Prez,

Do you both honestly believe that only the right is guilty of otherwise innucuous catch-phrases and buzz-words that suddenly seem 'vitriolic' when something tragic happens? Only the right employs the use of lingo of this nature?

Please do not reply yes. Because I may be forced to deploy Dr. Dre and his entourage to force feed you both with a strict regimen of concentrated doses of reality.

JS, this is where I take issue with your suggestions. This isn't a "sudden", retrospective judgement agaisnt Palin and the right. Sane people have been warning against this repeatedly. For instance, when the Palin gun sights first came out people complained, the same imagery appeared on the washington post, again people complained, then all the tea party vitriol and the language during the healthcare debate and people complained. I can't count the number of times these people are warned to tone it down whenever they pivoted towards the absurd. Please don't fall for this "the liberals are taking advantage of a tragedy" nonsense.

If you spend 3 years warning about the dangers of playing with matches near a fuel depot, I think you've earned the right to scream your lungs out when the depot then blows up and the innocent workers all die. Meanwhile the silly match box fiddler (1) manages to escape the tragedy and then (2) starts to insinuate that well shebi the other guy there too plays with sticks.

The general point about both sides using inflammatory rhetoric is a red herring. Any time a dem steps out of line, the comments are usually roundly criticized and walked back. Alan Grayson said some pretty rubbish things about his opponent the last time round and Anderson Cooper roundly and robustly called him out on it. Somebody brought up Obama's remarks earlier and the guy apologised for his choice of words and offered up what was a more civil representation of what he meant to say. The republicans simply deny any existence of foul language and huddle up together in their gang formations. Nevermind that Mr Ailes is now urging dialing back on the rhetoric. A republican comes out with silly racist inflammatory jargon and it's all fine because the other guys do it too?

It's always one crazy loon; incident after incident and the same apologists come out and say its just one crazy loon. Please tell me the last time in recent history that a republican politician got shot in the head?

Yes there are crazies on both sides but should the leadership be feeding them? - Prez keeps asking how a normal somebody can compare the actions of a dem pollster with a leader in the republican establishment ? - where are the grown ups ?

I know it is generally good practice in most debates to take positions that tend towards the mean, appear reasonable and concilliatory. "You know, let's compromise", "Johnny, what you did was wrong but Mike you too you shouldn't have taken his lunch" kind of thing. But sometimes, one has to take a firm stand against evil.

This rhetoric has ALWAYS been vitriolic. It didn't suddenly become so last saturday

---

And pres calling Palin a gangsterB . . . no matter how 'offensive' you may find another politics, going personal like that is never justifiable - and this is the what we're seeing in today's political climate. Has Palin ever stolen your lunch money that you insult her on a personal level? You proselytized earlier on this thread on the feverish consumption political controversiality by the country . . . look no further than yourself to see one of its biggest consumers - and victims. I mean, what else would inspire you to call her a bee?

Go to the corner and kneel down.
[quote][/quote]

omo~fat:

JS, this is where I take issue with your suggestions. This isn't a "sudden", retrospective judgement agaisnt Palin and the right. Sane people have been warning against this repeatedly. For instance, when the Palin gun sights first came out people complained, the same imagery appeared on the washington post, again people complained, then all the tea party vitriol and the language during the healthcare debate and people complained. I can't count the number of times these people are warned to tone it down whenever they pivoted towards the absurd. Please don't fall for this "the liberals are taking advantage of a tragedy" nonsense.

If you spend 3 years warning about the dangers of playing with matches near a fuel depot, I think you've earned the right to scream your lungs out when the depot then blows up and the innocent workers all die. Meanwhile the silly match box fiddler (1) manages to escape the tragedy and then (2) starts to insinuate that well shebi the other guy there too plays with sticks.

The general point about both sides using inflammatory rhetoric is a red herring. Any time a dem steps out of line, the comments are usually roundly criticized and walked back. Alan Grayson said some pretty rubbish things about his opponent the last time round and Anderson Cooper roundly and robustly called him out on it. Somebody brought up Obama's remarks earlier and the guy apologised for his choice of words and offered up what was a more civil representation of what he meant to say. The republicans simply deny any existence of foul language and huddle up together in their gang formations. Nevermind that Mr Ailes is now urging dialing back on the rhetoric. A republican comes out with silly racist inflammatory jargon and it's all fine because the other guys do it too?

  Call me crazy, but I could almost swear that this is the same allegation Republicans constantly levy against the Dems all the time. Who is right Omofat? Everyone needs to look in the mirror and see the problem.

Like I said to pres, maybe I'm naive or don't pay enough attention, but I don't think either left or right is winning in the category caustic rhetorical language. We tend to see less wrong in the side that we take - and I am learning this of myself too.

It's always one crazy loon; incident after incident and the same apologists come out and say its just one crazy loon. Please tell me the last time in recent history that a republican politician got shot in the head?

  I don't want to go down this path . . . but what are the statistics? how many republican political figures have been physically assaulted vs. democrat? I think Tayo touched on this earlier.

Yes there are crazies on both sides but should the leadership be feeding them? - Prez keeps asking how a normal somebody can compare the actions of a dem pollster with a leader in the republican establishment ? - where are the grown ups ?

  And this is where I think there is a disconnect. You see a severe problem with republican leadership - because you are liberal/democrat . . . think you not that the opposite is also true? that republicans see a severe problem with words coming from the democratic leadership? There's two sides to every coin.

If all you're saying is all leadership needs to be more responsible with their tongue, then I salute you completely sir. But if you're trying to say this is a trend unique to only the right, then I must rescind my salute oh. Personally I think politics is politics. It will get heated and passions will run high - I personally do not have a problem with tough language - a crosshair is just a cross inside a circle - to rational people. A lunatic will be a lunatic with or without the 'aid' of crosshairs - I believe this not just in regards to politics but also other aspects of life. But I make this concession, that if this is the new climate we live in today, then political leadership should adjust accordingly.

And I agree, pointing at the faults of others does not excuse your own. Saying "well democrats do it too" does not exculpate the republicans - and vice versa. Me my own be say I see all of dem are spewing the same ol' stale kool-aid - donkeys and elephants alike.

Let's all continue down this equivalence path and see where it all ends up.

At some point, we'll have one killing too many and then more sane people will stand up and speak out.

As far as I can see, the violence at the moment is unidirectional. But then again I'm a leftist troll schooled by Trotsky himself

Someone answer this question. Has anyone been able to draw even a faint line connecting d mass murder in Arizona with this supposed violent rhetoric from d right wing (or even d left wing). Weren't there election just in November which were peaceful with no reports of violence or disruption. If this supposed "violent talk" was supposed to be causing sane people to go insane or pushing slightly unstable people to mass murder. Why was it that during the November mid-terms elections, d height of political sloganeering and rhetorical back & forth, a target rich environment for unstable psycho's to wreck havoc. Why were there were no incidences at all?

^^because as much as the country (and by the country I really mean the media) are trying to whip up a storm now, the truth is incidents like these are very rare - and that's the honest truth.

It's not about equivalence Omofat. The media is trying to make us think there's this sudden wave of politically-motivated violence fueled by our leadership when there just isn't. If there's a greater % of violence, I'm sure its across the board and not restricted to politics - unless I'm wrong.

As long as I have been paying attention to politics, the[b] talk is no more caustic today that 10yrs ago[/b]

the ONLY difference -

[b]is that we're on a 24hr news cycle that bombards us,[/b]information is dissipated quicker and with more frequency, drumming it into our psyches. Such that soundbites from 1999 can be culled out in 2 seconds, amplified and then made to sound more sinister than it actually was.

---

And who's dat calling omofat a leftist troll?

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/11/us/11taxi.html?_r=1&hp

Shooting Suspect Was Calm During Cab Ride to Supermarket, His Driver Reports
By KIRK JOHNSON and ANISSA TANWEER
Published: January 10, 2011
New York Times

TUCSON — Jared L. Loughner wanted change back from a $20 bill that he used to pay for a taxi ride to a Safeway store here, according to the manager of the taxi company.

His demeanor was so unremarkable that the driver thought nothing of walking into the store with Mr. Loughner to get change, and did not know that a shooting rampage occurred at the scene until many hours later.

“No red flags went up,” said Joe Acosta, the general manager of the taxi company, AAA Full Transportation. “The customer got his change, our driver got his fare and left, and that’s it.”

That account of the taxi ride provides small but telling new details on what preceded the shooting.

It might suggest, for example, that Mr. Loughner, 22, planned or hoped to escape, and would need the money, after what police said was a deliberate attack on Representative Gabrielle Giffords.

Or it could be one more element of his unsettled mental state on the morning of the attack — that getting his change was somehow important before, as police say, he opened fire with a 9 millimeter Glock pistol at a constituents meeting.

Mr. Acosta said the driver, John Marino, who was questioned by the F.B.I. and Pima County sheriff’s officers at the taxi company on Sunday morning, was not taken into custody and has declined to speak to any reporters.

“He was like, ‘I really don’t need this,’ ” Mr. Acosta said.

Mr. Loughner’s state of mind, in the weeks and months before the shootings and perhaps especially on Saturday morning itself, has emerged as a major subtext of the investigation here, as the authorities try to understand his motive and mental state.

But the environment of Tucson — the light traffic on a Saturday morning, and the volume of taxi calls — perhaps played a role as well in what, according to Mr. Acosta’s secondhand account, seemed at the time to be nothing more than a young man’s calm ride to the grocery store.

“Since the volume wasn’t that heavy on Saturday, he was picked up moments after the call was placed,” Mr. Acosta said. “And a few minutes later he was at the Safeway.”

The driver, Mr. Acosta added, “treated it like it was a normal run — nothing out of the ordinary.”

Mr. Acosta said that Mr. Marino noticed sirens coming in the opposite direction as he was heading to pick up his next fare on Saturday morning, but thought nothing of it until the next day, when security camera images showing him walking into the store with Mr. Loughner became part of the police investigation.

^I hope all this is not the defense setting up for a mental-disorder case which will prevent him from getting the needle.

99% of people who commit crimes obviously have 'mental disorders'.

I just posted it because it interests me. The human behavior part of it. Also, the story of he poor taxi driver that was initially described as "a person of interest."

Have you seen the shooter's most recent picture? If you looked up "Crazy" in the dictionary, that's what you expect to see. The earlier pictures of him with the big bouncy "afro" hair is like a totally different person!

isale_gan2:

I just posted it because it interests me. The human behavior part of it. Also, the story of he poor taxi driver that was initially described as "a person of interest."

Have you seen the shooter's most recent picture? If you looked up "Crazy" in the dictionary, that's what you expect to see. The earlier pictures of him with the big bouncy "afro" hair is like a totally different person!

I know oh o jare. I hate to sound so cold, especially if his mental disease turns out to be a legitimate one (imho they're usually not).

I just looked up the pictures. You're right, it does look like 2 different people. All this hot political air we've been blowing on this thread . . . the police have not given an official report on what his motives were.

I don't have a problem discussing it, or even proferring a reason for his action.  We all speculate.  It doesn't bother me.

Yes, there was a jump to blame it on right wing rhetoric.  But that's politics in America.  My opinion, of course. 

I have met "tea party" people though.  The less said the better.

isale_gan2:

I don't have a problem discussing it, or even proferring a reason for his action.  We all speculate.  It doesn't bother me.

Yes, there was a jump to blame it on right wing rhetoric.  But that's politics in America.  My opinion, of course. 

I[b] have met "tea party" people though.  The less said the better.[/b]

At asalatu?

JeSoul:

^I hope all this is not the defense setting up for a mental-disorder case which will prevent him from getting the needle.

99% of people who commit crimes obviously have 'mental disorders'.

So I am guessing you favor d death penalty.

fstranger1:

At asalatu?

No, silly!  At the workplace.  They said Obama was a bum, and that Palin would make a great president.    Let's get 'em! 

Actually, I only disagree with one of those sentiments.

@montelik,

Someone answer this question. Has anyone been able to draw even a faint line connecting d mass murder in Arizona with this supposed violent rhetoric from d right wing (or even d left wing). Weren't there election just in November which were peaceful with no reports of violence or disruption. If this supposed "violent talk" was supposed to be causing sane people to go insane or pushing slightly unstable people to mass murder. Why was it that during the November mid-terms elections, d height of political sloganeering and rhetorical back & forth, a target rich environment for unstable psycho's to wreck havoc. Why were there were no incidences at all?

You are using too much logic and sense. Haven't you realised that you stand very little chance of communicating with the Leftist partisan hacks here when you engage such faculties?

@topic,

In these days of political correctness and hyper-sensitivity, one has to resist every attempt to criminalise dissent and opposition. If we leave it to certain elements on the Left, the use of euphemism and figure of speech will be a thing of the past. Like I said earlier, I see nothing wrong in the way Obama, Palin or any of the other Politicians have used certain words and phrases. One only needs to understand the use of those words and phrases in context.

Unfortunately for our society, some people are trained to only look for certain words and phrases without understanding how they are used. They are trained to take those words and extrapolate them while whipping their intended audiences up in a frenzy. This is why certain individuals will come on nairaland to repeat talking points from their favorite Leftist websites in order to demonise their perceived enemies. They lay common sense aside and assume a partisan position. Our community is the worse for it because of the continued distrust that we now have in each other. We don't seek to understand what a person says, but only how to exploit what they have said to achieve a predertermined end.

I learnt long ago that we think in images. Words well spoken are words that paint good images. When Palin used the word "target" and followed it up with an image, did she by any stretch of the imagination making a shooting hit list? The answer is "No". If that is so, why then are we still having this conversation? The answer is simple - politics. Our partisan brothers on the Left cannot even wait for us to mourn the loss of some of us before they begin their political game. What a shame!!!