Shoodboi:


Using the same logic, wouldn't I be correct if I say ex-Soviet states that joined NATO are acting out on a script by the US?

There is no record of Putin (or Russia) giving anyone any script but there are records of the US urging ex-Soviet states to join NATO. This started right after the fall of the Soviet Union when the US created the North Atlantic Cooperation Council to act as the first step to getting ex-Soviet states (other than Russia, which was the major bloc in the Soviet Union, and considered the successor of the Soviet Union) into NATO.

Also, lots of ex-Soviet states have super-good relations with Russia, so I don't understand why you're fingering Belarus and making it appear as if every ex-Soviet state hates Russia or want to join NATO.



Again, I'll take you to this quote from NATO's website:

It is often said that the North Atlantic Treaty Organization was founded in response to the threat posed by the Soviet Union. This is only partially true. In fact, the Alliance’s creation was part of a broader effort to serve three purposes: deterring Soviet expansionism, forbidding the revival of nationalist militarism in Europe through a strong North American presence on the continent, and encouraging European political integration.[/b]

The boldened is the main reason why NATO was founded. You should understand that WWII stripped the UK, Japan, and France of their superpower status, leaving US and the Soviet Union as the two economic and military superpowers left.

And both were trying to spread their ideologies throughout the world in their bid to expand and win more influence. The US spread capitalism while the Soviets spread communism. It was this communism the US was trying to counter with NATO.

And we see that through the Cold War and series of physical wars that occurred in the late mid to late 20th and even early 21st centuries, capitalism spread, making the US richer and the Soviet Union and other Communist states poorer as a result, leading to its collapse.

Now, regarding the Soviet Union wanting to join NATO, the Soviets thought NATO was founded to stop another war in Europe (as US told everyone at the time) without realizing it was formed to counter their influence. They soon found out though, leading them to be wary of the association.

You also need to understand that UK and France planned to invade the Soviet Union during WWII until of course, Germany invaded France, leading the UK and whatever was left of the French military to focus on fighting Germany. (Germany would later invade the Soviet Union too, dragging it into the war). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Pike

The US and UK were still interested in invading the Sovieet Union and even drew up plans, but abandoned them because the Soviet Union was too powerful. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Unthinkable

And why do they hate the Soviet Union so much?

Because Russia negotiated a surrender with Germany during WWI, leaving the American, French, and British to continue fighting the war.

Russia didn't leave the war because it wanted to. It left because its rulers were overthrown during a revolution and the new rulers were not interested in continuing the war. https://www.loc.gov/exhibits/archives/sovi.html

Shoodboi:


From NATO's website, you can see that Ukraine joined the North Atlantic Cooperation Council (which was formed by NATO to bring the former Soviet states other than Russia into NATO) in 1991. https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/topics_37750.htm#:~:text=Dialogue%20and%20cooperation%20started%20when,for%20Peace%20programme%20(1994).

At the same time, EU's website here shows that Ukraine first established trade relations with the EU three years later in 1994. (Mind you, it didn't talk about joining the EU). https://cordis.europa.eu/article/id/2672-euukraine-partnership-and-cooperation-agreement

So why was (and is) Ukraine more interested in joining the military NATO and not the economic EU?

Ukriane didn't join NATO because Germany and France repeatedly refused its membership as it shares a large land border with Russia, controls Russia's access to the Black sea, and is of course, too close to Moscow. Kyiv to Moscow is 1hr 15mins and it'd be much shorter if a plane takes off closer to the border.

Meanwhile, US and UK continued urging it to reapply and even lobbied other EU countries to allow its membership, which they all did -- except of course, Germany and France.

Ukraine only started trying to join EU after its NATO bid failed and it was clearly a ploy to join the EU first and then, NATO afterwards.

The Yanukovych you talked about wanted a neutral Ukraine that was neither here nor there, and the protests you talked about happened after he refused to sign an agreement to bring Ukraine into the EU. Russia claimed NATO funded the protests, NATO denied it, and Ukraine became a madhouse.

Bluntguy:
So they are still at the questionnaire stage. Before their membership is fully completed, Russia must have taken over the entire country.

loswhite:
Russia was part of the council of corporation

bkool7:


Kindly name the former USSR that are still friendly to Russia aside Belarus.

The bolded is your emphasis and interpretation. I've told you the primary objective of NATO was not to attack Russia but to be ready to defend smaller nations from being subjugated by Putin. Its obvious in the fact the USSR did put up a proposal to join for its own sinister purpose, but the request was declined for its intentions

If Russia and the US are giving out scripts and Russia's neighbours are accepting the US but rejecting Russia's what does that tell you?

It is often said that the North Atlantic Treaty Organization was founded in response to the threat posed by the Soviet Union. This is only partially true. In fact, the Alliance’s creation was part of a broader effort to serve three purposes: deterring Soviet expansionism, forbidding the revival of nationalist militarism in Europe through a strong North American presence on the continent, and encouraging European political integration.

https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/declassified_139339.htm

The document below is a translation of V. M. Molotov’s proposal to the Soviet Presidium in March 1954 that the USSR should issue a diplomatic note to the Western powers stating its willingness to consider joining NATO. The background to Molotov's memorandum was the launch of the Soviet campaign for European collective security at the Berlin Conference of Foreign Ministers in February 1954. At that conference Molotov proposed the Soviet alternative to western plans for a European Defense Community (EDC) involving the participation of a rearmed West Germany—the conclusion of a pan-European collective security treaty. This proposal was linked in tum to a further set of Soviet proposals on the German question, including Germany's reunification and neutralization in the cold war.

https://www.wilsoncenter.org/publication/molotovs-proposal-the-ussr-join-nato-march-1954

Shoodboi:
This is what Ukraine should have done from the onset:

Join an economic alliance founded to unite Europe but no, Zelensky went on to try joining a military alliance founded to destroy its neighbor.

Unfortunately, switching from joining NATO to joining the EU in the middle of a NATO/EU-funded war is very suspicious, and clearly a poorly hidden plot to apply for NATO membership after joining the EU.

Russia can see through that.

Bigchristo:
You’re just too senseless, Russia is not interested in hitting NATO country the only thing they want for their Neighboring countries to be neutral because there’s an agreement on ground which banned NATO from expanding their territories to Eastern Europe, even the US you’re talking about won’t allow it Neighboring countries to join any military alliance with it enemies and unfriendly countries, remember what happened to Cuba when they were getting nuclear supplies from Russia? You’re talking about world war how Russia was rescued by the US, let me remind you that we are in 21 century where the world has far developed from Stone Age to digital world technology has advanced even building of Nukes has far developed than anyone can imagine trying to bully any countries, Russia is not a push over country they’re the major rivals to the US even in cold wars and everything arm sales crude oil and gas sales with other resources Russia is also rich.

Shoodboi:


Why will you believe the countries I'd name are friendly with Russia if you wouldn't believe factual statements that are right there on the NATO, EU, and Library of Congress links that I posted?

NATO itself makes it clear on the 3 reasons NATO was founded in a decasified document on its website:



The Soviet Union only asked to join because they thought NATO was founded to prevent another European war (which was what the US kept telling them)



Please read and digest these and if you'd reply me, use appropriate reference from appropriate websites as I did here. Thanks.

bkool7:


[s]This is clear, did the 3 core statement say ' NATO was established to "attack or invade Russia"? Is Russia USSR? Does the USSR exist again?
Are you not aware that Ukraine is contesting the fact that Russia is an impostor claiming USSR seat in UN?

So if the East, West and North of Nigeria go their separate ways the North will still be refer to as Nigeria?[/s]

[s]NATO is a defensive alliance, only those with sinister motives will be afraid of it.
After all, Russia is not the only former member of USSR that's not a member of NATO. Why aren't others complaining ?
Why is Putin the only one disturbing Europe's peace ?[/s]

With the dissolution of the USSR in 1991, the United States considered the Russian Federation as the successor state of the USSR.

Shoodboi:


Here's what the US government says on their website: https://history.state.gov/countries/soviet-union



So do you know better than the US government that created NATO to counter the Soviet Union and is currently funding a war against Russia?

Don't quote me anymore if you decide to continue being unrealistic.

loswhite:
The simple question is why are Russian Neighbors choosing the west?

Shoodboi:


Here's what the US government says on their website: https://history.state.gov/countries/soviet-union



So do you know better than the US government that created NATO to counter the Soviet Union and is currently funding a war against Russia?

Don't quote me anymore if you decide to continue being unrealistic.

Benny6944:






Shut down emphatic stf. Why couldn't Russia provide the evidence Ukr are supposed to be neutral since it wasn't for their greed, intimidation and wickedness?

bkool7:


Lol! How ironic? Just look at you now...quoting the US to support the invasion of Ukraine.
The USSR died in 1991, that's public knowledge. The US will obviously want to have a weak Russia as it's former enemy- it's logical. That's their opinion. But all former USSR do not agree

Bye!

baralatie:

This is very interesting
Thank you for the your in depth work on this subject
I appreciate

bakar007:


No one stop UKRAINE from joining EU from day one rather it EU rejecting UKRAINE for over 8years now.

post=112044577:

PEACE IS ALL WE WANT IN OUR WORLD.
Let's make Love, Not War.

All of us @[/b] SAY NO TO WAR.


[b]*******************************************

Dem MANNA. Say no more,
Children of hate, frustrations and perdition crying for war in their famy compound .... over to you

Kingsnairaland:


The west wants to control the world that USA dream.

Bigchristo:
Discipline by who exactly? The US and NATO countries dishing out sanctions? If them born them well make them start war with Russia that will be the end of World peace, is like una nor want make peace Dey the world again

Bigchristo:
Discipline by who exactly? The US and NATO countries dishing out sanctions? If them born them well make them start war with Russia that will be the end of World peace, is like una nor want make peace Dey the world again

Bigchristo:
Discipline by who exactly? The US and NATO countries dishing out sanctions? If them born them well make them start war with Russia that will be the end of World peace, is like una nor want make peace Dey the world again

wolesmile:
Why is this zelensky allowing himself to be pushed beyond his capacity. I won't be surprised if mad Putin takes this war to the extreme.
Why announce Ukraine is about to become a member of NATO?

Remember, War doesn't determine who is right. It determines who is left. By the time this war is over, Ukraine will be left in both physical and psychological ruins that will take years to recover from.

Akuruoulo:
WHY RUSSIA AVOIDING ESTONIA, LATVIA , AND LUITHANIA LIKE PLAGUE ? THEY ARE EVEN AFRAID OF LETTING A DUST FRM UKRAINE TO ENTER POLAND. WHY DIDN'T THEY STRIKE A SINGLE SHOT ON KYIV WHEN BORIS JOHNSON VISITED KYIV ? GETAT WITH UR OVERHYPED TEDDY BEAR