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Did God Create Dinosaurs? - Religion (2) - Nairaland

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Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by OLAADEGBU(m): 10:09am On Sep 02, 2011
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by OLAADEGBU(m): 2:21pm On Sep 02, 2011
Joagbaje:

It is not a compromise , it is truth. Dinosaurs dates millions of years. We can't deny that .

The truth according to who?  God or Evolutionists?  Did you see the resource material that alethea posted earlier?

Joagbaje:

The earth will never be empty. Judgement to come will not empty the earth. Look at it again .

Jeremiah 4:23-25
23 I beheld the earth, and, lo, it was without form, and void; and the heavens, and they had no light. 24 I beheld the mountains, and, lo, they trembled, and all the hills moved lightly. 25 I beheld, and, lo, there was no man, and all the birds of the heavens were fled.

The highlighted words there are not precisely implicit expressions, we can only know what it means by its context in which it occurs so as to arrive at the exact meaning.  Take for example, you have a word like "blank" in reference to your computer screen.  There are two possibilities here, it can either be blank because the screen has been deleted or it can be blank because nothing has been typed on the keyboard.  The word "blank" itself does not suggest the real reason why the screen is blank, you can only arrive at the reason why it was blank if you take the whole context into consideration.

The same way we can use the phrase "formless and void" to mean that the earth began that way simply because it was not yet formed and filled or it was that way because of judgment.  If we are to read Genesis 1:2 in its proper context you will realise that it does not infer or suggest any judgment as you have implied.  Passages like Jeremiah 4:23 "does not imply that the state of the creation in Genesis 1:2 was arrived by some sort of judgment or destruction as imagined by the gappist" Theologian Robert Chisholm, Jr. wrote;

"By the way, allusion only works one way.  It is unwarranted to assume that Jeremiah's use of the phrase in a context of judgment implies some sort of judgment in the context of Genesis 1:2.  Jeremiah is not interpreting the meaning of Genesis 1:2."   

Joagbaje:

The flood of Noah only affected the earth . The flood Peter refers to here affected heaven and earth . The only time something like that happened was in the pre adamite world.

All Peter was refering to here was Noah's Flood, you can check other verses where Peter spoke about the Flood.

Joagbaje:

Have you wondered why most scientific discovery of those fossil claim that a flood must have destroyed them millions of years ?

The so called "scientific discoveries" where a result of secular, speculations and interpretation of the past which you now take as the gospel truth.
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by OLAADEGBU(m): 2:45pm On Sep 02, 2011
PA1982:

OLAADEGBU, your information is so out-dated it's pathetic.
It's the sort of thing you'd expect to read from a religious fanatic in the American deep South, not someone in the 21st century.
And no, I'm not mocking you.
I know that one day you'll understand the nonsense you've been fed is simply that- nonsense.

Hint- the intermediate forms are all around you!

All you had to do was to answer my questions and back up your words with scientific facts otherwise you might just continue to take solace in your ad hominems.
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by mazaje(m): 3:19pm On Sep 02, 2011
OLAADEGBU:

All you had to do was to answer my questions and back up your words with scientific facts otherwise you might just continue to take solace in your ad hominems.

WHERE is your scientific method of dating that shows that the dinosaurs lived 6000 years ago?. . . .WHERE is it?
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by PAGAN9JA(m): 3:59pm On Sep 02, 2011
^these are skeletons of real dinosaurs. this is PROOF. Now do you have any skeletons of adam and eve, or noah, to show us as prooftongue





[img]http://1.bp..com/-4t3NDS17mtU/TY-g-JC3jKI/AAAAAAAAN-I/CwQ3mf7cF4M/s1600/field22.jpg[/img]



Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by OLAADEGBU(m): 4:42pm On Sep 02, 2011
mazaje:

WHERE is your scientific method of dating that shows that the dinosaurs lived 6000 years ago?. . . .WHERE is it?

Where is your evidence that that shows the origin of dinosaus 220 million years ago? And answer the question:

"Where did the Dinosaurs come from?"
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by lagerwhenindoubt(m): 5:04pm On Sep 02, 2011
@OLAADEGBU I feel your drift, grin The Devil planted Dinosaur bones deep in the earth to give atheist a shit-time finding them grin
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by Joagbaje(m): 6:49pm On Sep 02, 2011
OLAADEGBU:

All Peter was refering to here was Noah's Flood, you can check other verses where Peter spoke about the Flood.

The flood of Noah did not affect the heavens or galaxies but the pre adamite flood of lucifer did. In addition ,all the places where the flood of noah was refered to,they usually put noah's name there . As peter would do in his writings
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by thehomer: 10:02pm On Sep 02, 2011
PAGAN 9JA:

^these are skeletons of real dinosaurs. this is PROOF. Now do you have any skeletons of adam and eve, or noah, to show us as prooftongue
<images>

Those pictures mean nothing. All they show is that humans have been able to locate where the devil buried the artificial bones. In fact, the last picture looks like a ladder and saddles which shows that humans were able to ride on those dinosaurs. grin grin
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by PAGAN9JA(m): 10:08pm On Sep 02, 2011
shocked wow u Nairalanders have crossed all limits of dullness. even the wall can understand better, if i explain to it. lipsrsealed
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by OLAADEGBU(m): 10:38pm On Sep 02, 2011
lagerwhenindoubt:

@OLAADEGBU I feel your drift, grin The Devil planted Dinosaur bones deep in the earth to give atheist a poo-time finding them grin

Have you guys run out of excuses such as "I don't know?"  The question was where did the dinosaurs originate from, is that too much for asking?
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by PAGAN9JA(m): 10:41pm On Sep 02, 2011
they originated all over the world. as a result of gradual evolution and a touch of God.
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by OLAADEGBU(m): 10:47pm On Sep 02, 2011
Joagbaje:

The flood of Noah did not affect the heavens or galaxies but the pre adamite flood of lucifer did. In addition ,all the places where the flood of noah was refered to,they usually put noah's name there . As peter would do in his writings

In 2 Peter 3:5–6 Peter is criticizing uniformitarianism; the concept that the rate of geological change today has always been the same: “

"All things continue as they were from the beginning of creation."   

In opposing this view, Peter reminds his readers that scoffers deliberately ignore two events: the Creation and the Flood, which were unique in earth history.

Peter refers to this same Flood of Noah’s day in 1 Peter 3:20 and 2 Peter 2:4–5. 

In fact, there is no reference to a Luciferian Flood anywhere in Scripture, If you disagree can you point it out?

Closing the Gap

[img width=500 height=500]http://www.answersingenesis.org/assets/images/media/cartoons/after-eden/20050411.gif[/img]
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by PA1982(f): 7:20am On Sep 03, 2011
My question goes unanswered.
Why are people quoting from a known forgery in the NT canon to back up their belief the Earth is 6,000 years old?
I refer to 2 Peter, of course.

Doesn't anyone realise the foolishness of this?

And as a curiosity, Jericho has been dated to over 9,000 BC.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jericho

That makes Jericho older than the Earth, doesn't it?
And guess what?
No evidence of a flood there!

Joagbaje wrote
Have you wondered why most scientific discovery of those fossil claim that a flood must have destroyed them millions of years ?


Epic fail.
Shall I send you to Wiki again to start your education?

OLAADEGBU wrote:

All you had to do was to answer my questions and back up your words with scientific facts otherwise you might just continue to take solace in your ad hominems.

There was no ad hom. in my comment, OLAADEGBU.
I was attacking your argument, not you.
I said your sources were out-dated. That your quotes and conclusions were nonsense.
I also added the hope you'd learn in time.
Here's a definition of ad hom for you:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem

You want to learn about dinos?
Go here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dinosaur
There is a long section on the origins of dinos.
Working with out of date data is frustating, OLAADEGBU. I know. I've been there.
But that's why we move on.
You'll find the wiki article fascinating and with lots of links!


I direct people to wiki because while it's not where any investigation ends, it's a good place to begin for the general reader.
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by OLAADEGBU(m): 8:40am On Sep 03, 2011
PAGAN 9JA:

they originated all over the world. as a result of gradual evolution and a touch of God.

Originated all over the world, how? At least you made an attempt to answer the question that others have been avoiding, maybe other skeptics would step up to the plate.
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by OLAADEGBU(m): 8:46am On Sep 03, 2011
@PA1982,

The Bible to you may be outdated but to me it is fresher than tomorrow's newspaper.  I take my authority from the Word of God while your authority comes from wiki, so you can see why we are saying different things about the same evidence  When will you answer my question? and if not at least answer the question to the OP instead of all these diversionary tactics.

Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by PAGAN9JA(m): 9:45am On Sep 03, 2011
OLAADEGBU:

Originated all over the world, how?

life on the Earth first started in the seas through small micro-organisms. then some of these sea creatures evolved in order to suit the changing conditions of the Earth and they came on land, grew legs and evolved. some that lived on trees started to jump from tree to tree in search of food. these creatures eventually developed wings. however these wings were only suitable for gliding from one place to another. eventually these wings evolved for long distance flying and the hands completely disapeared.

now as to how these micro-organism formed and how evolution actually occurs might be the work of supernatural forces or the Gods. i believe so and you can try a simple experiment. take a plain, white, piece of paper and  imagine that is the universe before things existed in it. this universe is the materialistic part. now no colour or dirt can get on this plain, white paper unless an external force acts on it to do so. now , imagine yourself as that external force and draw something on the paper.

in the same way, there has to be some supernatural force that gave the initial push. without a supernatural part, there is no question of a materialistic part. both forces have to be balanced. This is one of the laws of nature.
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by OLAADEGBU(m): 10:18am On Sep 03, 2011
PAGAN 9JA:

life on the Earth first started in the seas through small micro-organisms. then some of these sea creatures evolved in order to suit the changing conditions of the Earth and they came on land, grew legs and evolved. some that lived on trees started to jump from tree to tree in search of food. these creatures eventually developed wings. however these wings were only suitable for gliding from one place to another. eventually these wings evolved for long distance flying and the hands completely disapeared.

now as to how these micro-organism formed and how evolution actually occurs might be the work of supernatural forces or the Gods. i believe so and you can try a simple experiment. take a plain, white, piece of paper and  imagine that is the universe before things existed in it. this universe is the materialistic part. now no colour or dirt can get on this plain, white paper unless an external force acts on it to do so. now , imagine yourself as that external force and draw something on the paper.

in the same way, there has to be some supernatural force that gave the initial push. without a supernatural part, there is no question of a materialistic part. both forces have to be balanced. This is one of the laws of nature.

Thanks for the effort to explain your position which qualifies you to be a "theist evolutionist."  Can you tell us from what creature the dinosaur evolved from?  Was it from a lizard or any other reptile?
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by OLAADEGBU(m): 10:30am On Sep 03, 2011
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by PAGAN9JA(m): 4:15pm On Sep 03, 2011
OLAADEGBU:

Thanks for the effort to explain your position which qualifies you to be a "theist evolutionist."  Can you tell us from what creature the dinosaur evolved from?  Was it from a lizard or any other reptile?

yes im a theist evolutionist. as for your question, it depends on the kind of dinosaur you are talking about. for example i heard it is said that the closest living creature, similar to the T-Rex is the chicken. come to think of it, there is a basis in its leg formation, etc. Birds are in fact, the living descendants of the Therapods.

The cockroach is also a living fossil. it has survived on this planet for 350 million years.

the Coelcanth is also a famous living fossil. it was thought to be extinct since the Cretaceous period (dinosaurs existed in this period), but a it was discovered ""alive"" in South Africa in 1938. one of the most important discoveries ever to be made. this creature first evolved around 400 million years ago. ( notice its tail. strange isnt it and its eyes too.  cool)

The Coelcanth:




Dinosaurs are mostly descended from reptiles. surprisingly, the crocodile is also a living dinosaur.

Dinosaurs are vertebrates, i.e. they have a spine. this group also includes fishes sharks, amphibians, reptiles, mamals and birds.
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by PA1982(f): 8:54pm On Sep 03, 2011
OLAADEGBU, have you forgotten your own posts?

The Illustrated Encyclopedia of Dinosaurs, Dr. David Norman, 1985, p. 186.

"The question of the origin of dinosaurs is one that has puzzled paleontologists for many years."

Dr Norman is a lecturer in Zoology

This is a quote from an authoritative book:

"Where did dinosaurs come from?  That apparently simple question has been the subject of intense debate amongst scientists for over 150 years, . . ."

The Natural History Museum Book of Dinosaurs, 1998, p.12

These are your out of date sources.
Please, educate yourself.
I've posted up an excellent source for you to peruse and learn from.
Why not take advantage of it?

The evolution of dinosaurs occupies a good part of the article I linked to.
Did you read it?
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by bright007(f): 12:11am On Sep 04, 2011
*one question dat has appeared more dan any other one on dis thread is “where did dinosaurs come from”.But I think d question should be“where did human come from”.Once dis question is answered,ťĥĕ dinosaur question will not be difficult.
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by PA1982(f): 8:01am On Sep 04, 2011
And just to show how OLAADEGBU argues, that tired old source of his comes from here:

http://www.genesispark.com/genpark/origin/origin.htm

For guaranteed laughs, I reccommend the site.

bright007:

*one question dat has appeared more dan any other one on dis thread is “where did dinosaurs come from”.But I think d question should be“where did human come from”.Once dis question is answered,ťĥĕ dinosaur question will not be difficult.

Well, you can always start a thread about the origins of humans, can't you, bright007.
This one's about dinosaurs.
Still, on the subject of the origins of humans, again, back to wiki.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human

Anatomically modern humans evolved from archaic Homo sapiens in Africa in the Middle Paleolithic, about 200,000 years ago. By the beginning of the Upper Paleolithic period (50,000 BP [Before Present]), full behavioral modernity, including language, music and other cultural universals had developed.

There is, however an alternative view on this wink

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Clm6nlWxzc

Back to dinosaurs, please!

edited to add:
Curiously enough, even AnswersinGenesis has criticised the 'walking with dinos' idea
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kent_Hovind

And to give you an idea of just how absurd the thing can get:
http://www.chick.com/bc/2000/dinosaurs.asp
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by OLAADEGBU(m): 12:51am On Sep 05, 2011
PA1982:

OLAADEGBU, have you forgotten your own posts?

These are your out of date sources.
Please, educate yourself.
I've posted up an excellent source for you to peruse and learn from.
Why not take advantage of it?

The evolution of dinosaurs occupies a good part of the article I linked to.
Did you read it?

Wiki educated graduate.  You want me to waste my time on articles you have not bothered to read yourself?  If you have read them why do you find it difficult to answer my question?
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by OLAADEGBU(m): 12:59am On Sep 05, 2011
bright007:

*one question dat has appeared more dan any other one on dis thread is “where did dinosaurs come from”.But I think d question should be“where did human come from”.Once dis question is answered,ťĥĕ dinosaur question will not be difficult.

We have asked them what was the ultimate cause of the universe and how they think life originated? they simply don't know, but now my question is where did the dinosaurs come from? all they can do is to post wiki links.  What I want them to say is that since they believe animals evolved to higher animals, what kind of animal did dinosaurs evolve from?  I don't understand why they are now running from pillar to post. undecided
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by PA1982(f): 8:30am On Sep 05, 2011
OLAADEGBU:

Wiki educated graduate.  You want me to waste my time on articles you have not bothered to read yourself?  If you have read them why do you find it difficult to answer my question?

An interesting accusation.
You have something to back it up other than your own delusion?
I did answer your question telling you where to start reading basic informationon a subject you claim to be interested in.
Also, of course I post links to help others learn.

You, on the other hand, quote internet sources without referencing their source.
That isn't good etiquette, you know.
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by OLAADEGBU(m): 2:58pm On Sep 05, 2011
PA1982:

An interesting accusation.
You have something to back it up other than your own delusion?
I did answer your question telling you where to start reading basic informationon a subject you claim to be interested in.
Also, of course I post links to help others learn.

Is that how you answer questions from your teachers, by posting wiki links? 

PA1982:

You, on the other hand, quote internet sources without referencing their source.
That isn't good etiquette, you know.

I will be happy if you can refer me to where I have done this so that I can make amends.
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by lagerwhenindoubt(m): 7:15pm On Sep 05, 2011
Just a side comment, I have noticed that a lot of NLers unfairly discount the[b] worth of Wikipedia [/b]trivializing this source of intelligent information (at best) classifying it with gossip magazines. PLEASE!! respect the work of countless of intelligentsia who give you jewels of enlightening information neither Bible nor revelation could offer you. Please do not insult intelligence just because you have too little to contribute to the benefit of the world who require it smiley
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by PAGAN9JA(m): 7:30pm On Sep 05, 2011
^Well said. cool
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by OLAADEGBU(m): 10:00pm On Sep 05, 2011
lagerwhenindoubt:

Just a side comment, I have noticed that a lot of NLers unfairly discount the[b] worth of Wikipedia [/b]trivializing this source of intelligent information (at best) classifying it with gossip magazines. PLEASE!! respect the work of countless of intelligentsia who give you jewels of enlightening information neither Bible nor revelation could offer you. Please do not insult intelligence just because you have too little to contribute to the benefit of the world who require it smiley

You are there making side comments when you are supposed to help your bedfellows out by answering the pertinent question.  How do you guys do your assignment at college?  Do you cite wikipedia links as your reference?  There are some questions that can't be answered by google you know.
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by PAGAN9JA(m): 10:24pm On Sep 05, 2011
^point noted.
Re: Did God Create Dinosaurs? by KAG: 2:23am On Sep 06, 2011
OLAADEGBU:

1. How could a small reptile evolve into a large dinosaur?
2. Shouldn’t there be thousands (millions) of intermediate fossils in the cambrian explosion?
3. Why don’t we see intermediate dinosaur forms in museums?

There's no reason to expect to see "thousands or millions" of fossils, as fossilisation is a rare occurence. In fact, you'd be hard pressed to find thousands and millions of fossils of the many species that have gone extinct in the last few decades.

Further, on the cambrian explosion? Really? While a vast array of fossils of species that thrived during the cambrian explosion have been found, I'm not sure I understand why you - or anyone - would have reason to link the immediate ancestors of dinosaurs to the cambrian period. Let's chalk the presence of the cambrian explosion in your questions to a misunderstanding.

Finally, there are some fossils that give some idea of what proto-archosaurs were like and indicate the probable evolution of dinosaurs. From TalkOrigins:

Claudiosaurus (late Permian) -- An early diapsid with several neodiapsid traits, but still had primitive cervical vertebrae & unossified sternum. probably close to the ancestry of all diapsides (the lizards & snakes & crocs & birds).
   
Planocephalosaurus(early Triassic) -- Further along the line that produced the lizards and snakes. Loss of some skull bones, teeth, toe bones.
   
Protorosaurus, Prolacerta (early Triassic) -- Possibly among the very first archosaurs, the line that produced dinos, crocs, and birds. May be "cousins" to the archosaurs, though.
   
Proterosuchus (early Triassic) -- First known archosaur.

Hyperodapedon, Trilophosaurus (late Triassic) -- Early archosaurs.


Source: http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-transitional/part1b.html

Great claims require real evidence.

Indeed. So when are you going to present some real evidence? Or are you under the impression that copy/pasting Points Refuted a Thousand Times (PRATTs) from Creationist websites, and posting cutesy cartoons suffice as evidence?

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