Ken4Christ:

Unbelief is your problem. Jesus has unveiled to us the destiny of the wicked but you still don't believe.

According to God's word the end of evildoer is DEATH! Genesis 2:17; Romans 6:23
But since we are not directly involved in what happened in the garden of Eden God arranged for innocent descendants of Adam to be raised from the dead. Job 14:13-15
This is what Jesus is using different illustrations to explain that just as people keep things they're not using in a store only to go back and pick them whenever they're needed God has also kept many in their graves to be called back to life when evildoers are no more.
But as for those that deliberately chose to be wicked they will not be remembered {Psalms 9:17} so their graves will be like a permanent dump site where fire keeps burning to completely destroy whatever is thrown there! Revelations 20:14-15

As for your thinking that God will roast people in fire that's a misinterpretation of God's word! Jeremiah 7:31

Janosky:


Oga, the second definition applicable to Jesus Christ.
God ts our heavenly Father.
Did he born us by reproduction?
No!
He created Adamu.
Job 38:1-7,God created spirits in the spiritual realm before Adamu on the earthly realm.


God his Father caused Jesus existence in the spirit realm,where God gave him life John 5:26, John 11:27 & Colossians 1:15. Jesus is "the first born of every creature"," the Son of God coming into the world"
The son of God coming from where?
From heaven of course, John 3:16 & Romans 8:3.

Adam was created in the Physical realm from earth material with the soul from God.
How was Jesus specifically created to be son of God while God is the father without reproduction?

In Islam our thinking were shaped into thinking that the word "SON" only means one begotten through sexual reproduction but you can check the dictionary's definition of "Son" in the below screenshot.

AntiChristian:

Adam was created in the Physical realm from earth material with the soul from God.
How was Jesus specifically created to be son of God while God is the father without reproduction?

MaxInDHouse:

According to God's word the end of evildoer is DEATH! Genesis 2:17; Romans 6:23
But since we are not directly involved in what happened in the garden of Eden God arranged for innocent descendants of Adam to be raised from the dead. Job 14:13-15
This is what Jesus is using different illustrations to explain that just as people keep things they're not using in a store only to go back and pick them whenever they're needed God has also kept many in their graves to be called back to life when evildoers are no more.
But as for those that deliberately chose to be wicked they will not be remembered {Psalms 9:17} so their graves will be like a permanent dump site where fire keeps burning to completely destroy whatever is thrown there! Revelations 20:14-15

As for your thinking that God will roast people in fire that's a misinterpretation of God's word! Jeremiah 7:31

Explain these two verses for me, Revelation 19:20 & Revelation 20:10.

Dtruthspeaker:


See your error because of your limitation? Man is animate yet he was not produced sexually or asexually.

That's because we believe in the creation story. This is not a limitation. The first creation of all kind is usually different from others in its mode Creation. Others are reproduced either sexually or assexually.

No one call Adam son of God in the real sense of it. But Jesus is called God, some even saying he is the Father. So how was Jesus created to make him God?

We are limited beings but God is unlimitable and He can bring about any thing or person in any unimaginable way.

That is why He is God and He is The Greatest!

Agreed!

MaxInDHouse:
In Islam our thinking were shaped into thinking that the word "SON" only means one begotten through sexual reproduction but you can check the dictionary's definition of "Son" in the below screenshot.

We are humans! So we interpret like humans!

So which is applicable to Jesus here?

Which is applicable to all humans?

Where can we place this?
Blessed are the peacemakers for they shall be called sons of God!

Ken4Christ:

Explain these two verses for me, Revelation 19:20 & Revelation 20:10.

First of all you should know that Jesus is the one who passed these messages to John and he USED SIGNS {Revelations 1:1} to illustrate what will happen in the end. So the metaphorical terms aren't meant to be taken literal!

And the wild beast was caught, and along with it the false prophet that performed in front of it the signs with which he misled those who received the mark of the wild beast and those who worship its image. While still alive, they both were hurled into the fiery lake that burns with sulfur. Revelations 19:20

The BEAST is the collision of human governments that ruled over the earth in the endtime. The FALSE PROPHETS are notable religious leaders instigating their members to vote for either sides during political struggles and most times it does leads into wars where the people will pick up weapons and start killing one another whereas they're supposed to love one another as worshipers of God under the direction of God's Son. The IMAGE is last world government that will merge all the people under one religion instead of praying for God's Kingdom through Christ Jesus they will rely on human effort to make the world a better place. So they will all come against JWs because that's the one and only organization that her members will solely rely on God's Kingdom with unshakable faith {Revelations 16:14-16} so while they're hunting JWs up and down Jesus will lead his angels from heaven to destroy all those that doesn't want his government {Luke 19:27} remember all these people don't know they're actually fighting against the same Jesus they've been singing his praise {Act 5:39} that's why it was written that their religious leaders performed signs to DECEIVE them!

And the Devil who was misleading them was hurled into the lake of fire and sulfur, where both the wild beast and the false prophet already were; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever. Revelations 20:10

Satan will not be destroyed immediately with those people rather after their destruction Satan will be locked up in an inactive state for 1,000 years in which billions of people will be resurrected to gain accurate knowledge about the Christ {Revelations 20:1-3} but after that 1,000 years were ended Satan will be released to mislead those who has been made perfect through Christ's reign {Revelations 20:7-9} then Jesus will destroy both Satan and all those that followed him at that time.

Because nobody will die during that 1,000 years of intensive training survivors will forever continue to remember those destroyed and what led to their destruction, it will be like flames from a burnt site that keeps going up even children born in Paradise will be told all these stories and it will be as if those people are being tormented each time their stories are told just as we all keep imagining Sodom and Gomorrah burning till today whereas those cities has gone for good!

AntiChristian:
We are humans! So we interpret like humans!

So which is applicable to Jesus here?

Which is applicable to all humans?

Where can we place this?
Blessed are the peacemakers for they shall be called sons of God!

If humans interprets as humans then there's no reason arguing over what we all know as definitions of that word "SON"

Jesus wasn't born through sexual reproduction so he was created just like all other spirit sons of God.
Humans are also God's children through Adam who is God's first human son! Luke 3:38
Salam (Peace) is what we all know comes from God alone so whenever we see humans trying to make peace reign with the words of their mouths we know that those words aren't coming from ordinary humans but from the GREATEST PEACEMAKER Himself GOD!

MaxInDHouse:


If humans interprets as humans then there's no reason arguing over what we all know as definitions of that word "SON"

Jesus wasn't born through sexual reproduction so he was created just like all other spirit sons of God.
Humans are also God's children through Adam who is God's first human son! Luke 3:38
Salam (Peace) is what we all know comes from God alone so whenever we see humans trying to make peace reign with the words of their mouths we know that those words aren't coming from ordinary humans but from the GREATEST PEACEMAKER Himself GOD!

Is this what you are asked above?

AntiChristian:

Is this what you are asked above?

Perhaps you can make yourself more clearer because from my end i've answered you.

AntiChristian:


Adam was created in the Physical realm from earth material with the soul from God.
How was Jesus specifically created to be son of God while God is the father without reproduction?

Colossians 1:15 KJV "first born of every creature."
"Son of God coming into the world", John 11:27.
The holy Bible, John 11:27, did NOT say "God coming into the world",Oga please take note.

Also,Mark 13:19 & Revelation 3:14 , Jesus "the beginning of creation (which God created)."

Proverbs 8:22-30 (1 Corinthians1:24), God created the Wisdom/Craftsman "as the first of his works".
God created Jesus Christ first, the first creative work of God.
(Proverbs 8:22, Genesis 14:19,22,"possessed" meaning created. Screenshot PROVEN).
In the Bible,God gave details of his creation of Adam, Genesis 2:7
Did God give extensive details of how God created spirits/angels?

No!

This was a debate around 325-381 ad - council of nicea between 2 factions of orthodox christianity. One believed the messiah was yahusha and he is not equal to the creator, the other want him to be called jesus cos of their evil agenda and want to equal him with the creator. The war lasted for 56yrs and the later broke out and formed the catholic church. Then came a wicked emperor thioudosis who enforced it. He persecuted and killed anyone with a contrary view. That is how you guys were decieved and call an impostor your messiah and god. In the 1611 kjv bible their is nothing like god or jesus. The orthodox faction still held on to that belief that is why they still persecute and kill them even till today. The name they first used was iesous which means hail zeus to please the greeks who worship zeus. When the letter "j" was invented the catholic later changed it to jesus. The name of a pope's son. A meaningless name. You guys are highly decieved and blinded by signs which are used to keep you sedated

AntiChristian:
The first creation of all kind is usually different from others in its mode Creation. Others are reproduced either sexually or assexually.

So iPhone 2 to 14 were created sexually and asexually? Eh.

AntiChristian post=119919543
[b:
No one call Adam son of God in the real sense of it.

Exactly as no one calls Peter Obi's son son of Peter Obi. We call him his name Gregory Obi.

[quote author=AntiChristian post=119919543
But Jesus is called God, some even saying he is the Father. So how was Jesus created to make him God?[/quote]

Now you departed from the post

AntiChristian:
The first creation of all kind is usually different from others in its mode Creation. Others are reproduced either sexually or assexually.

So iPhone 2 to 14 were created sexually and asexually? Eh.

AntiChristian:

[b]No one call Adam son of God in the real sense of it.

Exactly as no one calls Peter Obi's son son of Peter Obi. We call him his name Gregory Obi.

AntiChristian:

But Jesus is called God, some even saying he is the Father. So how was Jesus created to make him God?

Now you departed from the post of creating sexually.

Go to your Koran, the Bible is not for you, therefore you are cut off from it, for those who it belongs to understand it.

Dtruthspeaker:


So iPhone 2 to 14 were created sexually and asexually? Eh.

Don't be dumb! Our convo has been on animate creations!

Exactly as no one calls Peter Obi's son son of Peter Obi. We call him his name Gregory Obi.

But Jesus is the son of God! How was he begotten? Did he just existed from nothing? And then become part of your God?

Now you departed from the post of creating sexually.

Go to your Koran, the Bible is not for you, therefore you are cut off from it, for those who it belongs to understand it.

It seems your Bible will only be understood without deep reasoning!

AntiChristian:

But Jesus is the son of God! How was he begotten? Did he just existed from nothing? And then become part of your God?

The word "begotten" has already answered you. If you are unable to understand, that is because you are a Muslim. So stick to your Koran and leave our Bible alone.

Dtruthspeaker:


The word "begotten" has already answered you. If you are unable to understand, that is because you are a Muslim. So stick to your Koran and leave our Bible alone.

Okay.

Make i create another thread!

MaxInDHouse:


First of all you should know that Jesus is the one who passed these messages to John and he USED SIGNS {Revelations 1:1} to illustrate what will happen in the end. So the metaphorical terms aren't meant to be taken literal!

And the wild beast was caught, and along with it the false prophet that performed in front of it the signs with which he misled those who received the mark of the wild beast and those who worship its image. While still alive, they both were hurled into the fiery lake that burns with sulfur. Revelations 19:20

The BEAST is the collision of human governments that ruled over the earth in the endtime. The FALSE PROPHETS are notable religious leaders instigating their members to vote for either sides during political struggles and most times it does leads into wars where the people will pick up weapons and start killing one another whereas they're supposed to love one another as worshipers of God under the direction of God's Son. The IMAGE is last world government that will merge all the people under one religion instead of praying for God's Kingdom through Christ Jesus they will rely on human effort to make the world a better place. So they will all come against JWs because that's the one and only organization that her members will solely rely on God's Kingdom with unshakable faith {Revelations 16:14-16} so while they're hunting JWs up and down Jesus will lead his angels from heaven to destroy all those that doesn't want his government {Luke 19:27} remember all these people don't know they're actually fighting against the same Jesus they've been singing his praise {Act 5:39} that's why it was written that their religious leaders performed signs to DECEIVE them!

And the Devil who was misleading them was hurled into the lake of fire and sulfur, where both the wild beast and the false prophet already were; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever. Revelations 20:10

Satan will not be destroyed immediately with those people rather after their destruction Satan will be locked up in an inactive state for 1,000 years in which billions of people will be resurrected to gain accurate knowledge about the Christ {Revelations 20:1-3} but after that 1,000 years were ended Satan will be released to mislead those who has been made perfect through Christ's reign {Revelations 20:7-9} then Jesus will destroy both Satan and all those that followed him at that time.

Because nobody will die during that 1,000 years of intensive training survivors will forever continue to remember those destroyed and what led to their destruction, it will be like flames from a burnt site that keeps going up even children born in Paradise will be told all these stories and it will be as if those people are being tormented each time their stories are told just as we all keep imagining Sodom and Gomorrah burning till today whereas those cities has gone for good!

You just exposed your ignorance.

The beast is the future anti Christ that will rule on earth for 7 years.

He will rule from a confederation of ten European countries. The headquarter will be in Rome. He will be made manifest after the rapture of the church.

The false Prophet is the false Christ the Jews will accept as their Messiah. But because of the image of the beast he will set up after three and a half years, the eyes of the Jews will know that they have been deceived.

However, the main reason why I cited those two verses is to let you know that the Lake of Fire does not make those thrown in to disappear.

They will be there for eternity. The soul of man is immortal. But you will still not believe.

Go back and read the verse again.

After Jesus comes back to the earth, he will defeat the anti Christ who is referred to as the beast and the false Prophet. Both of them will be thrown alive into the Lake of Fire - Revelation 19:20.

After this, Satan will be bound for 1,000 years. And Jesus will rule on earth for that same period.

At the end of the 1,000 years, Satan will be loosed for a season. He will gather the ungodly people in large numbers to fight the people of God. But fire will come from heaven and destroy them all.

And Satan himself will be thrown into the Lake of Fire. And the scripture says that at the time Satan will be thrown, the beast and the false Prophet who were thrown in over a thousand years ago are still there - Revelation 20:10.

They didn't cease to exist. They are there for eternity.

I am helping you to know this truth so that you will not go there.

The devil through Jehovah Witness is teaching people otherwise so they will be lured there.

Please, harden not your heart while you still have the opportunity to be saved. Once you are in there, you can't come out.

The sorrow is unimaginable. The pain is unbearable.

Ken4Christ:

The beast is the future anti Christ that will rule on earth for 7 years.

Scriptures please!

MaxInDHouse:

Scriptures please!

The explanation is a whole book but I will do that later.

The beast completes the 70 weeks of Daniel.

The remaining one week to be fulfilled is the 7 years reign of the anti Christ.

And it will be the seventh kingdom of the world and the last.

Details later.

Ken4Christ:


The explanation is a whole book but I will do that later.

The beast completes the 70 weeks of Daniel.

The remaining one week to be fulfilled is the 7 years reign of the anti Christ.

And it will be the seventh kingdom of the world and the last.

Details later.

Get your details regarding the SEVEN YEARS!

MaxInDHouse:


You're just a sadist. Go and get a life because God never had such thoughts {Jeremiah 7:31} if you read such a thing and concluded it's literal then you must be as stupid as those who thought Jesus was talking about cannibalism when he spoke to them in parables! John 6:61-65

Satan and his demons and all false prophets has been erased from God's plan for the future that's the meaning of what you're reading. So all those that failed to do what will make their names enter into the book of life will also join them in that same condition! Revelations 20:15

I have to present something as I see it in the Word...
This Jeremiah 7:31 is not talking about using fire as punishment by God.

But it is talking about using humans for sacrifice by/through fire....

if using fire as punishment by God never came to His mind,
then the story of/about Sodom and Gomorrah is fake.

Let's check from the Word:

*. Leviticus 18:21 "And thou shalt not let any of thy seed pass through the fire to Molech, neither shalt thou profane the name of thy God: I am the Lord."

*. Deuteronomy 18:10 "There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch."

*. 2kings 17:17 "And they caused their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire, and used divination and enchantments, and sold themselves to do evil in the sight of the Lord, to provoke him to anger."

*. 2kings 21:6 " And he made his son pass through the fire, and observed times, and used enchantments, and dealt with familiar spirits and wizards: he wrought much wickedness in the sight of the Lord, to provoke him to anger."

*. Jeremiah 7:31 "And they have built the high places of Tophet, which is in the valley of the son of Hinnom, to burn their sons and their daughters in the fire; which I commanded them not, neither came it into my heart."

*. Jeremiah 32:35 " And they built the high places of Baal, which are in the valley of the son of Hinnom, to cause their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire unto Molech ; which I commanded them not, neither came it into my mind, that they should do this abomination, to cause Judah to sin."

We have to know the difference between human sacrifice by fire for God and
human punishment with fire by God ...

Can God punish humans with literal fire?

Let's see from the Word:

* Genesis 19:24 "Then the Lord rained upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the Lord out of heaven;"

*. Luke 17:29 "But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven , and destroyed them all."

*. Matthew 25:41 "Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:"

*. 2peter 3:10 "But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up ."

The Word agrees that God can use for to punish humans...

Whoever feels he or she is more merciful than God for this His decision... No problem

Hell fire is real and literal !!!

MaxInDHouse:


Get your details regarding the SEVEN YEARS!

Sure, I will.

Destruction differs from prison.

God destroyed faithless generation of Noah's days with flood, destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah with fire, destroyed Pharaoh's army by drowning them in the sea and destroyed 185,000 Assyrians by an angel.
They are gone for good and nowhere again but sustaining people alive in fire is what those demons demanded knowing fully well that it will destroy them.
So when God referred to what Canaanites were doing it's obvious He is against throwing people alive in fire to be TORMENTED!

KNOWMORE56:



I have to present something as I see it in the Word...
This Jeremiah 7:31 is not talking about using fire as punishment by God.

But it is talking about using humans for sacrifice by/through fire....

if using fire as punishment by God never came to His mind,
then the story of/about Sodom and Gomorrah is fake.

Let's check from the Word:

*. Leviticus 18:21 "And thou shalt not let any of thy seed pass through the fire to Molech, neither shalt thou profane the name of thy God: I am the Lord."

*. Deuteronomy 18:10 "There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch."

*. 2kings 17:17 "And they caused their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire, and used divination and enchantments, and sold themselves to do evil in the sight of the Lord, to provoke him to anger."

*. 2kings 21:6 " And he made his son pass through the fire, and observed times, and used enchantments, and dealt with familiar spirits and wizards: he wrought much wickedness in the sight of the Lord, to provoke him to anger."

*. Jeremiah 7:31 "And they have built the high places of Tophet, which is in the valley of the son of Hinnom, to burn their sons and their daughters in the fire; which I commanded them not, neither came it into my heart."

*. Jeremiah 32:35 " And they built the high places of Baal, which are in the valley of the son of Hinnom, to cause their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire unto Molech ; which I commanded them not, neither came it into my mind, that they should do this abomination, to cause Judah to sin."

We have to know the difference between human sacrifice by fire for God and
human punishment with fire by God ...

Can God punish humans with literal fire?

Let's see from the Word:

* Genesis 19:24 "Then the Lord rained upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the Lord out of heaven;"

*. Luke 17:29 "But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven , and destroyed them all."

*. Matthew 25:41 "Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:"

*. 2peter 3:10 "But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up ."

The Word agrees that God can use for to punish humans...

Whoever feels he or she is more merciful than God for this His decision... No problem

Hell fire is real and literal !!!

Ken4Christ:


Olodo, do you call names in parables? Tell me any parable Jesus gave that he called names?

Besides, what is a parable?

Did you go to school. Has Russell so brainwashed you that you have completely lost your sense of reasoning?

Even if it's a parable, do you make parable with something that is not real?

For instance, can you say in a parable that a man ate a full elephant? We know it's impossible. So parable is a short narrative of things that could actually happen in real life.

So, Jesus will just imagine that there is a place of torment that does not exist.

The other teachings he gave on the destiny of lost souls points to the same thing.

But the spirit of unbelief has blinded you from accepting the truth.

You see the truth and deny it at face level.

The teachings of Jesus concerning Everlasting torment is consistent through out the Bible.

The dead rich man from down inside his grave look up and he can see inside heaven. Guy, grow up nauuu. God gave you brains to think and reason.

God is the totality of the consciousness of the universe....

Jesus is just a character is a story. A character created by Rome to deceive...

TruthHurts100:


The dead rich man from down inside his grave look up and he can see inside heaven. Guy, grow up nauuu. God gave you brains to think and reason.

Lazarus wasn't in heaven at that time. The paradise is the bosom of Abraham. It was also underneath the earth and separated by a gulf or deep valley from hell.

It was after the resurrection of Jesus that they rose from the dead and relocated to heaven.

Ken4Christ:

Lazarus wasn't in heaven at that time. The paradise is the bosom of Abraham. It was also underneath the earth and separated by a gulf or deep valley from hell. It was after the resurrection of Jesus that they rose from the dead and relocated to heaven.

So they were both in the same geographical location only for some to be taken to heaven after Jesus' resurrection meaning Jesus has resurrected the dead to heaven, shey?

MaxInDHouse:


So they were both in the same geographical location only for some to be taken to heaven after Jesus' resurrection meaning Jesus has resurrected the dead to heaven, shey?

Matthew 27:51-52
51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;

52 And the graves were opened; and MANY BODIES OF THE SAINTS which slept arose,

53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

They were the cloud that received Jesus when he ascended back to heaven.

Acts 1:9 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and A CLOUD RECEIVED HIM out of their sight

The Bible calls the saints, cloud of witnesses - Hebrews 12:1.

That was a vision not real event otherwise Jews that witnessed dead people walking around will tell others moreover flesh and blood can't go to heaven!

Ken4Christ:

Matthew 27:51-52
51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;

52 And the graves were opened; and MANY BODIES OF THE SAINTS which slept arose,

53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

They were the cloud that received Jesus when he ascended back to heaven.

Acts 1:9 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and A CLOUD RECEIVED HIM out of their sight

AntiChristian:
That's because we believe in the creation story. This is not a limitation. The first creation of all kind is usually different from others in its mode Creation. Others are reproduced either sexually or assexually.

Yes.
The first creation were spirits.
Job 38:1-7, these too were called "sons of God".
They were eye witness of God's creation of Adam.

AntiChristian:


No one call Adam son of God in the real sense of it.

[b]Luke 3:38 "Adam son of God."
The holy Bible did.

AntiChristian:

But Jesus is called God, some even saying he is the Father. So how was Jesus created to make him God?[/b]

God created Jesus Christ directly by himself @ Colossians 1:15 & Proverbs 8:22,30 (called the Wisdom/Craftsman, confirmed by 1 Corinthians 1:24.
John 5:26, God his Father gave Jesus life, nah so Jesus talk am.).

All sons of the God Almighty are gods, Deuteronomy 10:17 & Psalm 82:6.
Jesus confirmed it, John 10:34-36.

MaxInDHouse:


So they were both in the same geographical location only for some to be taken to heaven after Jesus' resurrection meaning Jesus has resurrected the dead to heaven, shey?

Pastorpreneur says him own "paradise is underneath the earth"