I really dont get this why must IE be the bad child among many children, did a job for a client, viewed it in all browsers very oky, now i make a major change, wola IE becomes the bad child rendering my page useless, unfortunately for me, my client only uses IE, and i must fix the problem, had to spend 3 hrs figuring out where d problem was, and d problem was that i was customizing a wordpress theme, i didnt hand code it from the beggining, but thank God i prevailed.

Even IE 7 is better than IE 8 and IE 9, it renders CSS better, well help me view d site (www.wataccents.com) maybe i missed one or two things is wrong before my client complains again.

no be only u but what can we do we just have to figure it out. Any way make sure u check ur site on crazy browser opera mozilla and chrome also i do that alot for preview

cyclops4real:

no be only u but what can we do we just have to figure it out. Any way make sure u check your site on crazy browser opera mozilla and chrome also i do that alot for preview

Yes i did test it in all browsers, opera, safari, mozilla and chrome, but it was just only IE that wants to fall my hand.

1) When you say you made a "major change", what exactly do you mean?
2) Always adopt a policy of "incremental coding" where you code and test in bits and pieces
3) Always ask your client what his target audience/browser is
4) Like it or not, IE still accounts for at least 70% of the browser market
5) If word is anything to go by, beginning with IE9, all browsers should finally behave the same
6) To get IE8 to act like IE7 (thus eliminating need for hacks), add the IE7 emulate tag right after your starting HEAD tag
7) I too would like to see IE banned for good but truth be told, as long as people are buying PCs, that will be a tall order

Good luck!

@yawatide, the major change was that i had to increase the size of the gallery thumb nail pictures, but in IE it was overlapping each other, meanwhile in other browsers it was perfect, i agree IE accounts for 70% of the browser market, i just feel they need to make serious adjustments to the way they render CSS styles, but in your 6th suggestion, i tink i will try that for any future challenges, well we learn everyday

Freeman,

If not already, get the IE developer toolbar. Not as good as firebug but still very useful in times like this.

Yep, we learn everyday. The day we stop learning is the day we die.

you should always do cross browser testing. save yourself embarrassment. browserlab.adobe.com their browser testing suite is superb and free. by the way have you checked your website page speed? http://gtmetrix.com/reports/www.wataccents.com/3RTgrFm1

Internet Explorer does not have up to 70% of the Browser Market Share.

http://www.w3schools.com/browsers/browsers_stats.asp

@ Yawatide
Internet explorer does not account for 70% of the browser market. Infact they don't have the largest market share. That title belongs to mozilla firefox.

@OP if you are having problems with CSS then I can be of help! I wrote a simple css file that takes care of IE browsers less than IE6. For me I think IE is a pain in the ass and should stop development if they cant keep up to date!

abhosts/afam4eva,

So, I am looking at the source of your stats and I notice it is w3schools. Then I ask myself, "what is their source?" I could be wrong but I would imagine that the target audience for w3schools would most likely be those who either use their site or web developers, hence the high numbers.

Be that as it may, I will stand by what I said: Pretty much every company I have worked for buys web stats from a company called Forrester Research and it is the stats from this research company that drives what/how we code. In other words, no matter how hard a bug may be to fix, if it occurs in > IE7, it has to get fixed. At my recent employer's, 4 or so months ago, we got the latest stats and 70% of the web users are still using > IE7. IE6 dropped to single digits hence stopped coding for it. FF is hovering around 20%.

Bottom line, take it or leave it, majority of the world still uses IE and that will continue to be as long as it comes by default on PCs. Now, with the increase in the use of mobile devices, this may not be the case but until that day comes (again, research says that by 2014, 50% of web users will have mobile devices), it is (sadly) IE all the way.

Final comments:
Over this past weekend, I had a visitor who told me she was having some computer issues. So I go to google to check out what's up. She then asks me, "what is that you are using?" and I tell her "a browser" somewhat sarcastically. To cut a long story short, she says, "I have never heard of 'muckzilla'", to which I tell her that it has been around for a while and that I strongly I advise her to switch. The kicker is that this lady graduated with highest honors in chemistry and is actually very smart. If she didn't know of firefox, I actually found it disturbing. Now ask yourself: How many others do you think are out there like this? I know, this is an unofficial stat but hey, it's telling nonetheless.

abhosts:

Internet Explorer does not have up to 70% of the Browser Market Share.

http://www.w3schools.com/browsers/browsers_stats.asp

U are right i agree with you, its currently mozilla, followed closely by chrome.

Fayimora:

@OP if you are having problems with CSS then I can be of help! I wrote a simple css file that takes care of IE browsers less than IE6. For me I think IE is a pain in the Bottom and should stop development if they cant keep up to date!

I would not mind ooh, if u can post it hear for everyone, or attach it as a word.doc so we can all learn from it, because i believe webmasters will continue to face this problem, because most of us create our work with mozilla, and easily neglect IE.

yawa-ti-de:

Freeman,

If not already, get the IE developer toolbar.  Not as good as firebug but still very useful in times like this.

Yep, we learn everyday.  The day we stop learning is the day we die.

IE 9 automatically comes with it, just press F12, it will bring out the HTML and CSS syntax

Sorry for the multiple posts but, 2 more things to think about:

1) Here is another web stat for august 2011: http://www.w3counter.com/globalstats.php - so which stat is right? Furthermore, how did they get their stats?  For that, scroll to the bottom of their page.  Now, remember what I said above about w3schools' stats.  Noticing a pattern with what I said above?

2) Check the stats for websites you have built, either via cpanel or google analytics.  Then come back to the forum and be honest enough to share your stats.  Sure, not scientific but telling, nonetheless.  I just checked 4 sites that I have google analytics on at random and the average is IE at about 45%.  Opera Mini is actually coming in 2nd, most likely because people are using mobile devices to view those particular sites.  

Finally, as you may know, many browsers spoof other browsers in their user agents.  Okay, I am off my soap box now and I actually feel much better about myself

@Yawatide
I've checked the stats of the websites that I've built and Mozilla firefox takes the lead by a wide margin. Who uses IE this days. Probably people that inherited a pentium 2 PC from thei grandfather.

afam4eva:

@YawatideWho uses IE this days. Probably people that inherited a pentium 2 PC from thei grandfather.

Wrong! Anyone who buys a windows computer and happens not to be a developer uses IE until they are advised to change. The slang is "As long as it opens the page"!

afam4eva:
Who uses IE these days? You'd be surprised. For one, and don't take this as an insult, your grandparents, who have no computer skills at all, are most likely to go for the first browser they see on their computer (IE) as opposed to a browser they have to "suffer and download"

fayimora:
Thanks

Again, IE takes the cake, especially if you combine versions 7-9. It's not a contest. All the same, in light of the facts, so as not to digress from the topic of this thread (yes, idealistically, IE should be banned), I say let's agree to disagree otherwise, in typical NL fashion, this will degenerate into ad hominem attacks and I am too old for that

Do i post the IE hack here or create a new thread?

Fayimora:

Wrong! Anyone who buys a windows computer and happens not to be a developer uses IE until they are advised to change. The slang is "As long as it opens the page"!

yawa-ti-de:

afam4eva:
Who uses IE these days? You'd be surprised. For one, and don't take this as an insult, your grandparents, who have no computer skills at all, are most likely to go for the first browser they see on their computer (IE) as opposed to a browser they have to "suffer and download"

fayimora:
Thanks

Again, IE takes the cake, especially if you combine versions 7-9. It's not a contest. All the same, in light of the facts, so as not to digress from the topic of this thread (yes, idealistically, IE should be banned), I say let's agree to disagree otherwise, in typical NL fashion, this will degenerate into ad hominem attacks and I am too old for that

If you guys had made this statement some years back i would have agreed with you. But this is 2011, where people are enlightened computer-wise and the average computer users knows more than enough. Most people i know that have IE as their default browser always end up installing Mozilla firefox. Also, if you go to cyber cafes you'll notice that most of them either use firefox or Opera browsers. Internet explorer's days are numbered especially with Hp's decision to quit the PC market.

If you guys had made this statement some years back i would have agreed with you. But this is 2011, where people are enlightened computer-wise and the average computer users knows more than enough. Most people i know that have IE as their default browser always end up installing Mozilla firefox. Also, if you go to cyber cafes you'll notice that most of them either use firefox or Opera browsers. Internet explorer's days are numbered especially with Hp's decision to quit the PC market.

he he, call it aging but something told me that sooner or later, you would say the things I have bolded above. I wanted to preempt you on those but I decided not to play the "ITK" card

1) When dealing with facts, you don't go by who you know. That is subjective and biased. You go with the facts. Even at that, you want to go for reputable facts as facts are subject to criticism as well. For instance, you or someone else pasted the w3schools stats. That is better than going by who you know.

2) Cyber cafes where? Nigeria, China, US, Australia? Are you saying you have been to every single cyber cafe in the world that is out there? If so, please produce your findings.

3) HP may be quitting but what about Toshiba, Dell, Acer, etc? I think rather than say this, you should focus on those who will be surfing the web on mobile devices (reference what I said about this, again based on facts from research) in the next 3 or so years. Speaking of which, there is a site I like to go to for news. Because of my schedule, I am mostly browsing on my mobile device. Unfortunately, I can't look at the site on my device. Why? I get this annoying, "this page is only optimized for Mozilla firefox". This pisses me off in a sense (this is 2011, you are still optimizing for certain browsers? ) but is amusing in a sense (I thought the whole "this page is optimized for" concept is heavily in use for IE, because the "webmaster" in question doesn't want to suffer to make their websites browser independent).

yawa-ti-de:

he he, call it aging but something told me that sooner or later, you would say the things I have bolded above.  I wanted to preempt you on those but I decided not to play the "ITK" card 

1) When dealing with facts, you don't go by who you know.  That is subjective and biased.  You go with the facts.  Even at that, you want to go for reputable facts as facts are subject to criticism as well.  For instance, you or someone else pasted the w3schools stats.  That is better than going by who you know.

You may be contradicting yourself here. Remember this statement?

yawa-ti-de:

Over this past weekend, I had a visitor who told me she was having some computer issues.  So I go to google to check out what's up.  She then asks me, "what is that you are using?" and I tell her "a browser" somewhat sarcastically.  To cut a long story short, she says, "I have never heard of 'muckzilla'", to which I tell her that it has been around for a while and that I strongly I advise her to switch.  The kicker is that this lady graduated with highest honors in chemistry and is actually very smart.  If she didn't know of firefox, I actually found it disturbing.  Now ask yourself: How many others do you think are out there like this?  I know, this is an unofficial stat but hey, it's telling nonetheless.

afam4eva,

I read over things at least 3 times before I post, so even if I contradict myself (in which case I would apologize), I will stand by what I said.

Would you mind telling me how I am contradicting myself? Please bear in mind the last sentence of that paragraph (note bolded portion, which acknowledges subjectivity, as opposed to objectivity/facts ), "I know, this is an unofficial stat but hey, it's telling nonetheless."

Did I hear someone say, "check mate"?

am kinda enjoying this thread. I really dont know why there is a rift building up between you guys. From what i read, the argument is not about which browser is better but which browser is moree popular. If its about which is better, then its mozilla but if its about which is more popular and owns the largest market share, then its IE.

1) As far as I am concerned, there is no rift b/w me and any of the other posters
2) As far as I am concerned, I am not arguing with any of the other posters

This is a debate, pure and simple. The aim of a debate is to convince the other party, even when you know that the evidence you are producing is full of crap. At the end of the day, it is strictly business for me, nothing personal. Worse case, we agree to disagree.

At the end of the day, we all learn a thing or two from each other, hopefully.

Here's proof: http://www.w3schools.com/browsers/browsers_stats.asp

afam:
Dem take w3schools swear for you?

@yawa-ti-de

I quite agree with you about people using IE mostly. Its just quite obvious, taking a look around u is enough,

I installed Opera on my sister's pc and told her it was the best, it has this, it has that, but what do you think happens??

She wants to surf the net and does this, click on the windows key on her keyboard and types just internet, the browser that shows is what she uses, and what

do you think will display,IE ofcourse, There are so many examples like that.

And when Afam was talking about Hp quiting the pc market, what abut brands like toshiba, acer and other makers who do have predefined default keys on their

system for loading internet explorer, Acer aspire as an example,

Unless, Microsoft is banned from preinstalling IE with the windows OS, i fear they are still gonna dominate the market,

@Yawa
Do u have a better source other than w3c that buttresses your argument or you just want to stick to your personal experience.

I thought we were supposed to base our arguments on fact and not mere personal experience.

Afam, which ones you no dey now? Abi, are you telling me you are (purposely) ignoring post #10?