YOU DON'T BELIEVE IN GOD. LET ALONE JESUS CHRIST AND HIS ATONING SACRIFICE. BUT SUPPOSING YOU ARE WRONG.? SUPPOSING HE REALLY EXISTS AND THERE IS A PLACE CALLED HEAVEN AND HELL.? IT WILL BE TERRIBLE IF YOU LATTER DISCOVER THESE WHEN YOU HAVE DIED.

I BELIEVE IN GOD. I BELIEVE IN HIS SON JESUS CHRIST AS MY SAVIOUR. YOU KNOW WHAT? EVEN IF AM WRONG (THANKS TO GOD AM NOT) I HAVE NOTHING TO LOOSE ON THE LONG RUN. BUT IF AM RIGHT (THANKS TO GOD I AM) THEM YOU HAVE A DILEMMA IN YOUR HANDS.

PERMIT ME TO GIVE YOU THIS ILLUSTRATION:

THERE WAS A RICH MAN WHO WAS ALWAYS SEEKING FOR ADVENTURES. ONE DAY HE DECIDED TO BUY AND FLY HIS OWN PLANE. SO HE BOUGHT ONE AND WENT STRAIGHT TO BUY A PILOT'S MANUAL. HE FELT THAT WAS ALL THERE IS TO FLYING A PLANE. ONCE YOU CAN READ AND FOLLOW THE MANUAL, THE REST IS COMMON SENSE. SO HE FLEW ONE DAY FOR THE FIRST TIME. AFTER A LONG FLIGHT HE FELT HE HAD TO GO BACK HOME SO FOLLOWING THE MANUAL HE MANOEUVRED THE PLANE AND MADE A U-TURN. ON GETTING TO THE AIR PORT, HE WANTED TO LAND THE PLANE SO HE QUICKLY FLIPPED THROUGH THE PAGES OF THE MANUAL TO FIND THE RELEVANT SECTIONS. HE ONLY DISCOVERED AT THE END OF THE BOOK THIS STATEMENT "TO LEARN HOW TO LAND A PLANE, GET THE SECOND VOLUME OF THIS BOOK." THAT WAS A FATAL MISTAKE THAT COST HIM HIS LIFE. HE WAS IGNORANT OF THE COMMUNICATION GADJETS IN THE PLANE, HE KNEW NOTHING ABOUT THE CONTROL TOWER. HE REALISED THE TRUTH WHEN IT WAS TOO LATE. ORDINARY COMMON SENSE IS NOT SUFFICIENT FOR US TO LIVE A FULFILLED LIFE HERE ON EARTH AND PHYSICAL EVIDENCES OF LIFE THAT WE KNOW ARE NOT SUFFICIENT IN THEMSELVES TO GIVE US THOROUGH UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT MAKES THIS WORLD GO ROUND AND THE PURPOSE OF OUR EXISTENCE.

MAKE THE WISE CHOICE WHILE YOU ARE STILL ALIVE

^^^^

you should also consider this, if this divine message of salvation is only divine and important by "faith" and a "personal commitment" which finds meaning in relation to you, WHY ARE YOU PORTRAYING IT AS TRUTH RATHER THAN WHAT ITS ACTUALLY IS?

Re: Atheists Dilemma
« #1 on: Today at 11:28:45 AM »

^^^^

you should also consider this, if this divine message of salvation is only divine and important by "faith" and a "personal commitment" which finds meaning in relation to you, WHY ARE YOU PORTRAYING IT AS TRUTH RATHER THAN WHAT ITS ACTUALLY IS?

AND WHAT IS IT ACTUALLY?

private opinion without an attempt at truths

Even common sense tells us that when we are travelling to a country we ve not been to before, we look for every available info that will guide us in preparation. If u get to the country and see that some of the info u gathered are not neccessary then u have nothing to lose. Its better u over prepare than not to be adequately prepared. Its foolishness of the highest order for someone to belief there is no God and no heaven and Hell, only for the person to die and discover that he has deceived himself all this while.

@alexleo

you have changed the texture of OP from one leaning on uncertain, unsure statement to certainty

folaski:


YOU DON'T BELIEVE IN GOD. LET ALONE JESUS CHRIST AND HIS ATONING SACRIFICE. BUT SUPPOSING YOU ARE WRONG.? SUPPOSING HE REALLY EXISTS AND THERE IS A PLACE CALLED HEAVEN AND HELL.? IT WILL BE TERRIBLE IF YOU LATTER DISCOVER THESE WHEN YOU HAVE DIED.

I BELIEVE IN GOD. I BELIEVE IN HIS SON JESUS CHRIST AS MY SAVIOUR. YOU KNOW WHAT? EVEN IF AM WRONG (THANKS TO GOD AM NOT) I HAVE NOTHING TO LOOSE ON THE LONG RUN. BUT IF AM RIGHT (THANKS TO GOD I AM) THEM YOU HAVE A DILEMMA IN YOUR HANDS.

PERMIT ME TO GIVE YOU THIS ILLUSTRATION:

THERE WAS A RICH MAN WHO WAS ALWAYS SEEKING FOR ADVENTURES. ONE DAY HE DECIDED TO BUY AND FLY HIS OWN PLANE. SO HE BOUGHT ONE AND WENT STRAIGHT TO BUY A PILOT'S MANUAL. HE FELT THAT WAS ALL THERE IS TO FLYING A PLANE. ONCE YOU CAN READ AND FOLLOW THE MANUAL, THE REST IS COMMON SENSE. SO HE FLEW ONE DAY FOR THE FIRST TIME. AFTER A LONG FLIGHT HE FELT HE HAD TO GO BACK HOME SO FOLLOWING THE MANUAL HE MANOEUVRED THE PLANE AND MADE A U-TURN. ON GETTING TO THE AIR PORT, HE WANTED TO LAND THE PLANE SO HE QUICKLY FLIPPED THROUGH THE PAGES OF THE MANUAL TO FIND THE RELEVANT SECTIONS. HE ONLY DISCOVERED AT THE END OF THE BOOK THIS STATEMENT "TO LEARN HOW TO LAND A PLANE, GET THE SECOND VOLUME OF THIS BOOK." THAT WAS A FATAL MISTAKE THAT COST HIM HIS LIFE. HE WAS IGNORANT OF THE COMMUNICATION GADJETS IN THE PLANE, HE KNEW NOTHING ABOUT THE CONTROL TOWER. HE REALISED THE TRUTH WHEN IT WAS TOO LATE. ORDINARY COMMON SENSE IS NOT SUFFICIENT FOR US TO LIVE A FULFILLED LIFE HERE ON EARTH AND PHYSICAL EVIDENCES OF LIFE THAT WE KNOW ARE NOT SUFFICIENT IN THEMSELVES TO GIVE US THOROUGH UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT MAKES THIS WORLD GO ROUND AND THE PURPOSE OF OUR EXISTENCE.

MAKE THE WISE CHOICE WHILE YOU ARE STILL ALIVE

Is there a problem with your keyboard? Why are you trying to present your point in all caps?

What does it matter!? The message of salvation is my focus am glad you at least read it.

@ Kay 17: to say that a statement like "for God so love the WORLD that He gave His only begotten Son that whosoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life " is a private opinion is a public denial of the truth with the risk of being immodest. Jesus loves you & He desires a personal and fulfilling relationship with you. Pls respod to His love.

Well, 99% of believers are ggoing to hell, as an unbeliever I'm going to hell, why stress myself?

folaski:

@ Kay 17: to say that a statement like "for God so love the WORLD that He gave His only begotten Son that whosoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life " is a private opinion is a public denial of the truth with the risk of being immodest. Jesus loves you & He desires a personal and fulfilling relationship with you. Pls respod to His love.

Demonstrate its the truth

@ micheline89: you dont have to go to hell if you dont want to. My pastor may chose to go to hell but i will not follow him there. Jesus says"yo shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free' John 8:32 it is an individual jorney not collective as you mean.

folaski:

@ micheline89: you dont have to go to hell if you dont want to. My pastor may chose to go to hell but i will not follow him there. Jesus says"yo shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free' John 8:32 it is an individual jorney not collective as you mean.

Na me go choose or na Baba?

^^^ Baba(God) has done His best for you He has shown you the way of eternal bliss and He has also given you the free will to chose if you will follow Him or not. Your choice will dermine your eternal destination. So chose Christ ; the only provision made by God.

MY IMAGINARY CITY

Once upon a time, a long time ago, my world view was deeply religious. I was devoted to my religion and holy book. I felt well protected with the armour of God. My world appeared to be a city, meticulously constructed with beautiful engravings and huge halls. The walls were deep and strong, to keep us all safe from the corruption and sin of the outside world, and they were guarded by God to prevent Satan intruding. All in all, a very comfortable and safe place to live.

One day I wanted to just look up close at one of the engravings on a wall. It didn’t quite look right, and I just wanted to check that it wasn’t my eyesight. When I reached out to touch the engraving, to my horror my hand went right through. There was nothing but dust left of that engraving. I went to my preacher, as he would have to know about this. I showed him the hole, guiltily expecting him to berate me for it. Instead he acted as if he couldn’t see it. He commented upon how beautiful the engraving was, how neatly it fit in with the rest of the decorations, and how his father, and his father’s father had also admired this engraving.

As you can imagine this caught me a bit off guard, but I accepted that maybe it was me who was wrong. After all, he was expected to be much more intelligent that I was in matters like this, not to mention wiser. In a spirit of interest however, I went and had a look at some of the other sections of the city. To my amazement I could knock down whole walls and rooms with hardly any effort. After a while I was pulling down the buildings just for the pleasure of being able to. Whenever I pulled down a structure I could see that people were still walking around in it as if nothing had happened. This confused me and scared me.

After a while I knocked down the outer wall, the one that protected me from all of the evil in the world. What I saw was a collection of similar cities and small towns. I went and had a look at a few of them, but I didn’t seem to be able to inhabit them, because again I could easily knock holes in the buildings, and find myself unwelcome.

Eventually from my standpoint all that I was left with was a huge flat plain. There was nothing left that could stand up to even the most simple investigation. Nothing was certain, everything crumbled. I could still see my family walking in the air as if their city was still there, but I could not talk to them because they were so far away.

The flat plain was definitely the most intimidating time for me. I could not talk to anybody. I had no shelter, no rules, no group. I spent many hours shouting for people to hear me in their imaginary cities, but to no avail. Perhaps this is what hell is like? No certainty, no authority, no faith, no deity. I tried everything.

Eventually I worked out that the only option available to me if I wanted somewhere to live was to build it myself. I started out with some building blocks that I knew couldn’t be knocked down. “Treat people the way you like to be treated”, “Learn before believing”, “Understand before judging”, ”Be honest with yourself”. These are plain and simple bricks, not the fancy marble sculpturing that my old home had, but at least they are verifiably solid. They withstand the most rigorous scrutiny. The house is simple and I started to enjoy every day I spent in it.

My neighbours now look at me with a mixture of envy, fear and curiosity because I didn’t build my new house with any of the ‘usual materials’ that is commonplace in all the cities I visited. How could this house stand? Hmmm! How could it protect against all the dangers lurking in every corner, the principalities and powers, and rulers of darkness? No engravings or sculptures, just simple solid bricks, but they suffice for my home. I included a garden for contemplation, and I considered myself lucky to have such a large plain to build on. Now my house is how I want it, shape, size and décor. I few neighbours have come over to see how they could build a house like this. Some have started building, others are consumed with fear. I wish them well, in their journey to the real world.

^^^ my dear friend you depended on people & they behaved according to their type,you built your hope & faith in man and you lost both. You were gulible you did not search for the truth yourself and you were disapointed. Worse stil you now left the citadel of truth to build your house where even angels fear to tread, where men when they die suddenly realise that they are lost forever; decieved. Pls wake up from this bad dream to reality while you stil have the chance or else if you slip unprepared into the great beyond you wil wish you have never been borne.

folaski:

What does it matter!? The message of salvation is my focus am glad you at least read it.

Actually, I didn't read it.

^^^ You said so.

@Kay17: the love God demonstrated to the world by giving us His only Son as a propitiation for our is enough.(Am sure you'll agree that love is giving). The only way by which i can demonstrate my own love is to invite you into the family of Christ where i belong. I have given you what i have , pls kindly accept it.

@folaski. Christians love human sacrifices, by killing Jesus and blood flowing our into the ground. God must really be so happy right? God was not happy with sheep, or even Jephthah's daughter, no he wanted more blood.
So he had to see a human being killed and tortured and bloodied just like the mayans used to do.

What's the difference?

[img]https://www.nairaland.com/attachments/547894_313460_282775281742168_100000290956195_1139187_1731813346_n-1_jpg05abdcd3839e0e7db879aac0cc5f994d[/img]

[img]http://firstlightforum.files./2010/08/sacrif_dees221.jpg[/img]

[img]http://3.bp..com/_cRbRK5iGrD8/R0OqpXEwhhI/AAAAAAAABmU/jNftk3fwoAE/s400/God+in+the+Sky.jpg[/img]

manmustwac:

MY IMAGINARY CITY

_________________________
_________________________
_________________________

@manmustwac, once, I saw you post this imaginary city story, and I wanted to repost it as a fresh thread, but due to the obstinacy (the nicest word I can find) of certain theists I was debating , I lost sight of this,  thinking I could reason with them.
Seeing the post again reminds me that this tale of the "Imaginary City" ought to be a thread of its own.
In this wise then, I implore you to start a thread with this topic or at least allow me to do so (with due credit to you).

folaski:


YOU DON'T BELIEVE IN GOD. LET ALONE JESUS CHRIST AND HIS ATONING SACRIFICE. [b]BUT SUPPOSING YOU ARE WRONG.? [/b]SUPPOSING HE REALLY EXISTS AND THERE IS A PLACE CALLED HEAVEN AND HELL.? IT WILL BE TERRIBLE IF YOU LATTER DISCOVER THESE WHEN YOU HAVE DIED.

I BELIEVE IN GOD. I BELIEVE IN HIS SON JESUS CHRIST AS MY SAVIOUR. YOU KNOW WHAT? EVEN IF AM WRONG (THANKS TO GOD AM NOT) I HAVE NOTHING TO LOOSE ON THE LONG RUN. BUT IF AM RIGHT (THANKS TO GOD I AM) THEM YOU HAVE A DILEMMA IN YOUR HANDS.

@OP Paschals wager has been thoroughly refuted.
You dont believe in Allah or in Sango or in Amadioha or in Ayelala. If you are religious (and you are), you probably believe in "jazz" or juju.
Well, what if you are wrong ? What if Allah or Sango or Amadioha or the wonder working juju you believe (has power) in is the real deal ?
Then you have a lot to loose for backing the wrong horse.
When you consider how many religions there actually are, the probability that yours is the right one is really slim.

jayriginal:

@manmustwac, once, I saw you post this imaginary city story, and I wanted to repost it as a fresh thread, [/b]but due to the obstinacy (the nicest word I can find) of certain theists I was debating , I lost sight of this,  thinking I could reason with them.
Seeing the post again reminds me that this tale of the "Imaginary City" ought to be a thread of its own.
In this wise then,[b] I implore you to start a thread with this topic or at least allow me to do so (with due credit to you).
@OP Paschals wager has been thoroughly refuted.
You dont believe in Allah or in Sango or in Amadioha or in Ayelala. If you are religious (and you are), you probably believe in "jazz" or juju.
Well, what if you are wrong ? What if Allah or Sango or Amadioha or the wonder working juju you believe (has power) in is the real deal ?
Then you have a lot to loose for backing the wrong horse.
When you consider how many religions there actually are, the probability that yours is the right one is really slim.

Actually i was thinking of that myself but then go ahead, your more than welcome. If you search nairalaland google you'll findout that i copy and pasted MY IMAGINARY CITY from another nairalander named alaper from an old post. So your welcome to go ahead 

@jayriginal: I know that there are many religions that claims all sorts. You see, Christianity, according to John 14:6 there Jesus boldly claimed "I am the way the truth and the life, " check out the creedal content of the rest and see if any one came out so boldly and clearly. There is no missing it if you follow Him. As per the other demon inspired congrigations pls find time to read mathew 12:22-37 with open mind of course; power pass power.

[size=13pt]PASCAL'S WAGER. Nothing to Loose If You Believe In God.[/size]

Pascal's Wager, also known as Pascal's Gambit, is a suggestion posed by the French philosopher, mathematician, and physicist Blaise Pascal that even if the existence of God could not be determined through reason, a rational person should wager as though God exists, because living life accordingly has everything to gain, and nothing to lose. Pascal formulated his suggestion uniquely on the God of Jesus Christ as implied by the greater context of his Pensées, a posthumously published collection of notes made by Pascal in his last years as he worked on a treatise on Christian apologetics. The Wager was set out in note 233 of this work.

Following his argument establishing the Wager, Pascal addressed the possibility that some people may not be willing to sincerely believe in God even after acknowledging the enormous benefit of betting in favor of God's existence. In this case, he advises them to live as though they had faith, which may subvert their irrational passions and lead them to genuine belief.

Following the publication of Pascal's Wager, some have argued that the Wager may also apply to conceptions of God within different religious traditions or belief systems, and as such has been used in traditions other than Christianity, such as Islam. Historically, Pascal's Wager was groundbreaking because it charted new territory in probability theory, marked the first formal use of decision theory, and anticipated future philosophies such as existentialism, pragmatism, and voluntarism.[1]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal's_Wager

@manmustwac, thanks.

folaski:

@jayriginal: I know that there are many religions that claims all sorts. You see, Christianity, according to John 14:6 there Jesus boldly claimed "I am the way the truth and the life, " check out the creedal content of the rest and see if any one came out so boldly and clearly. There is no missing it if you follow Him. As per the other demon inspired congrigations pls find time to read mathew 12:22-37 with open mind of course; power pass power.

The question really is how do you know for sure that yours is the right religion ? Other religions also claim to be right and their adherents have as much faith in their chosen religion (possibly more) as you do in yours.
Pointing to the bible is not a good argument because other religions also have their holy books which they also claim was handed down by God.

Whatever one thinks of Pascal's wager, while the evangelical atheist mumus would have you believe that it has been "refuted" they conveniently "overlook" the fact that the so-called "refutation" is based on spurious and false logic - typical of the mumus' sleight of hand.

folaski:


YOU DON'T BELIEVE IN GOD. LET ALONE JESUS CHRIST AND HIS ATONING SACRIFICE. BUT SUPPOSING YOU ARE WRONG.? SUPPOSING HE REALLY EXISTS AND THERE IS A PLACE CALLED HEAVEN AND HELL.? IT WILL BE TERRIBLE IF YOU LATTER DISCOVER THESE WHEN YOU HAVE DIED.

I BELIEVE IN GOD. I BELIEVE IN HIS SON JESUS CHRIST AS MY SAVIOUR. YOU KNOW WHAT? EVEN IF AM WRONG (THANKS TO GOD AM NOT) I HAVE NOTHING TO LOOSE ON THE LONG RUN. BUT IF AM RIGHT (THANKS TO GOD I AM) THEM YOU HAVE A DILEMMA IN YOUR HANDS.

PERMIT ME TO GIVE YOU THIS ILLUSTRATION:

THERE WAS A RICH MAN WHO WAS ALWAYS SEEKING FOR ADVENTURES. ONE DAY HE DECIDED TO BUY AND FLY HIS OWN PLANE. SO HE BOUGHT ONE AND WENT STRAIGHT TO BUY A PILOT'S MANUAL. HE FELT THAT WAS ALL THERE IS TO FLYING A PLANE. ONCE YOU CAN READ AND FOLLOW THE MANUAL, THE REST IS COMMON SENSE. SO HE FLEW ONE DAY FOR THE FIRST TIME. AFTER A LONG FLIGHT HE FELT HE HAD TO GO BACK HOME SO FOLLOWING THE MANUAL HE MANOEUVRED THE PLANE AND MADE A U-TURN. ON GETTING TO THE AIR PORT, HE WANTED TO LAND THE PLANE SO HE QUICKLY FLIPPED THROUGH THE PAGES OF THE MANUAL TO FIND THE RELEVANT SECTIONS. HE ONLY DISCOVERED AT THE END OF THE BOOK THIS STATEMENT "TO LEARN HOW TO LAND A PLANE, GET THE SECOND VOLUME OF THIS BOOK." THAT WAS A FATAL MISTAKE THAT COST HIM HIS LIFE. HE WAS IGNORANT OF THE COMMUNICATION GADJETS IN THE PLANE, HE KNEW NOTHING ABOUT THE CONTROL TOWER. HE REALISED THE TRUTH WHEN IT WAS TOO LATE. ORDINARY COMMON SENSE IS NOT SUFFICIENT FOR US TO LIVE A FULFILLED LIFE HERE ON EARTH AND PHYSICAL EVIDENCES OF LIFE THAT WE KNOW ARE NOT SUFFICIENT IN THEMSELVES TO GIVE US THOROUGH UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT MAKES THIS WORLD GO ROUND AND THE PURPOSE OF OUR EXISTENCE.

MAKE THE WISE CHOICE WHILE YOU ARE STILL ALIVE

Atheists Dilemma? Do you even know the meaning of the word "dilemma"? Let's take an except from a popular online dictionary :

DILEMMA : A dilemma is a problem offering at least two possibilities,neither of which is practically acceptable.

Source : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dilemma

That being said, how does this apply to Atheists? Atheists have no beliefs or faith in religion. They are not bothered about supernatural "unseen forces", heaven or hell. They just accept life as it is. You on the other hand believes in an imaginary god,spirits and even voodoo. So who's the one in a dilemma? Who's the one with the problem?

You keep repeating the same lame illogical statements all over the place and i wonder what your point is. You keep giving stories of "one testimony" or the other as if those are concrete facts verifying the existence of your god. This is what religion does to people and it spreads itself through GREED and FEAR! Greed for blessings (and promising better life than everyone else) and Fear of the unknown. It's so typical of people like you to appeal to the insecurities of weaker minds by attempting to incite fear of hell in the after life and all that nonsense. I have told you this before and i will tell you again :

THE ONLY REASON YOU ARE A CHRISTIAN TODAY IS BECAUSE OF INDOCTRINATION. IF YOU WERE BORN IN IRAN, YOU WOULD BE HERE SCREAMING "THERE IS NO GOD BUT ALLAH AND HIS ONLY PROPHET MOHAMMED". IF YOU WERE BORN IN JERUSALEM, YOU WOULD BE PRACTICING JUDAISM. IF YOU WERE BORN IN CHINA, YOU WOULD BE A BUDDHIST. IF YOU WERE BORN IN FINLAND, YOU WOULDN'T EVEN KNOW WHAT RELIGION WAS.

Get your head together abeg!

^^^ i know the meaning of dilemma. atheists are confused people they themselves have a spirit that keeps them alife and yet deny the existence of spirits.they claim the ownership of their own portion of the resources of the earth, yet deny the creator and giver. they are like pirate whose slogan is “take everything you can and give nothing back “ .in all, they deny their own existence and yet cannot accept God . they want to live and yet deny the giver of life. it is a parthetic situation. they do not know which to chose because they thought both are bad. may God have mercy on them.

^^^ i know the meaning of dilemma. atheists are confused people

How are they confused people? Can you prove the existence of the biblical god? Do you have one shred of evidence to bring forward apart from quoting scriptures and giving "testimonies"? My friend, a lot of Atheists (including myself) used to be religious (or Christians to be specific). I didn't just wake up one day and decide to become an Atheist. I was a devout Christian and ardent bible studier. I also understand why you can't comprehend how a human being will denounce the existence of a biblical god. I used to be like YOU so i understand the mentality. Okay? It's your indoctrination and FEAR OF THE UNKNOWN that makes you (and the horde of others) react the way you do.

they themselves have a spirit that keeps them alife and yet deny the existence of spirits.

Which Spirit? Have you seen this spirit? What proof can you offer that spirits exists?

they claim the ownership of their own portion of the resources of the earth, yet deny the creator and giver. they are like pirate whose slogan is “take everything you can and give nothing back “

Resources? Which resources are you talking about? Nothing comes to you unless you work for it so what are you talking about? Sit in your room for 3 months and see how many "resources" come your way. What have pirates got to do with Atheists? If there's anyone you should be talking to, it's all those "god fearing" looters who have condemned this country and stripped it bare. Is it not you people that are killing the country? And you are here talking. Hypocrites! Name ONE Atheist you know that has looted Nigeria's funds! All the most dishonest people i know are religious (mostly Christians). The most honest and straight forward people i know today are non-religious people a.k.a Atheist/Agnostic and they are very few. Go figure. Hypocrites! ! !

.in all, they deny their own existence and yet cannot accept God . they want to live and yet deny the giver of life. it is a parthetic situation. they do not know which to chose because they thought both are bad. may God have mercy on them.

Deny our existence? How does not believing in religion equate to denial of existence? Who is this "giver of life"? Have you met him/her/it/them? What do you know about this "giver of life" apart from all you've been taught?

@folasaki
Read what harakiri wrote below again then answer the following questions i've asked to prove to you that you have been indoctrinated into your religion

harakiri:

THE ONLY REASON YOU ARE A CHRISTIAN TODAY IS BECAUSE OF INDOCTRINATION. IF YOU WERE BORN IN IRAN, YOU WOULD BE HERE SCREAMING "THERE IS NO GOD BUT ALLAH AND HIS ONLY PROPHET MOHAMMED". IF YOU WERE BORN IN JERUSALEM, YOU WOULD BE PRACTICING JUDAISM. IF YOU WERE BORN IN CHINA, YOU WOULD BE A BUDDHIST. IF YOU WERE BORN IN FINLAND, YOU WOULDN'T EVEN KNOW WHAT RELIGION WAS.

Do you believe that you are a christian of your own freewill or is it because you were born and bred into a christian family?

1)Imagine that you were born in a country like iran to an iranian family. They speak farsi (which is the official iranian language) and they practice islam. Don't you think that if you were born in such circumstances that you would be a muslim believeing that there is no other god but allah?

2)What about being born in israel to jewish family don't you think you'd be jewish since you were born to a jewish family and probably be going to the synagogue to pray on fridays?

3)Lets say you were born in china to chinese parents. Do you believe that you would be speaking mandarin which is the official language there? If yes what about you being a buddhism because it is thier main religion there followed by taoism?

4)And finally assuming your parents are finnish from finland who like the overwhelming majority of the population were athiests who do not do jesus or any other god for that matter. Don't you believe you would go with the flow and focus more on life than religion?

folaski:

^^^ i know the meaning of dilemma. atheists are confused people they themselves have a spirit that keeps them alife and yet deny the existence of spirits.they claim the ownership of their own portion of the resources of the earth, yet deny the creator and giver. they are like pirate whose slogan is “take everything you can and give nothing back “ .in all, they deny their own existence and yet cannot accept God . they want to live and yet deny the giver of life. it is a parthetic situation. they do not know which to chose because they thought both are bad. may God have mercy on them.

Which god should have mercy on us exactly?
I don't have a spirit that keeps me alive unless the trillions of cells that make up my being are what you refer to as spirits. Oxygen and nutrients keeps the cells alive and when they are starved of either, they die. What does a "spirit" have to do with it? What is a spirit?

@folaski
if he exists he is a fool
he is immoral
and he is not fair
he will not judge in any way you can anticipate or in a way humans can phantom
because apparently his ways/judgement are beyond any of us
he could take your hell and me heaven and you don't have the right,power, means to question of even understand his justice
Either way you lose
you live your life on earth like a slave
and that gives you no guarantee at all even if Jesus is indeed God.
So don't be so arrogant to assume that you have understood Jesus and you can hold him ransom, that because you did his bid then he must take you to heaven.
it does not work that way
If you gamble with Christ only Christ wins, and you can only hope that you'd win too, but don't fill your self righteous head with certainty,