RSA, it's kind of an ongoing joke among everyone to call the Western Cape to 'Republic of Zillestan'. It doesn't mean that people want the Western Cape secede. In fact when the Cape Independent party came to speak at my school, the 'pink things' brought them DOWN. Don't worry RSA. I saw that it was really bothering you so I edited my location.

morpheus24:

Zozloz has taken the words right outta my mouth. A South African who can see through the BS.  I am speechless.

RSA

can you show the statistics of "the growing black middle class" that are not somehow connected to collecting BEE hand out money. PLEASE!!!

The trouble is, black people can't see the bigger picture. A black person gets a R1 million rand car, now black people are successful. But that money was supposed to have provided houses,  education, electricity. Can black progress not be measured by the increased number of blacks who get a house, the increased number of black children sent to school , the increased number of black children who don't have to study by candle light because they have electricity. Juju, people do not want to live like you and the white man. They just want a house, clean water, electricity, they want to vote for change. People cannot tell me that these people can live in excess in a country where over half of the population live in poverty. These people should be serving the people, DOING THEIR JOB, WORKING, instead of living luxurious lives that can serve as inspiration to dirt poor citizens. I'm not anti-ANC, I just don't have this blind loyalty like someone who has an obese friend, but won't tell them because they are afraid of hurting their feelings. I'M OUT!!

morpheus24:

Zozloz has taken the words right outta my mouth. A South African who can see through the BS.  I am speechless.

RSA

can you show the statistics of "the growing black middle class" that are not somehow connected to collecting BEE hand out money. PLEASE!!!

You obviously don't know much about BEE besides the abbreviation. Do you think it's a government office that dishes out 'BEE' grants? You probably think that every successful black South African has received a hand out from the government. Even if that was the case it would be a good show of a government by the people for the people.

These are the BEE codes that South African and Multi-National companies must comply with in order to do business with the government:

- Code 100 – Ownership
- Code 200 – Management & Control
- Code 300 – Employment Equity
- Code 400 – Skills Development
- Code 500 – Preferential Procurement
- Code 600 – Enterprise Development
- Code 700 – Socioeconomic development

There's no business hand outs my friend. Hand outs are done by the Department of Social Development which gives monthly social grants to the poor which makes poor South Africans only theoretically poor.

^^^
@zolzlolz

I am kinda predicting a gradual shift from the ANC to the DA party for some of these "black up and coming middle class" elite being created as you have stated when the poor start attacking the very elite that is being created witin the ranks of the ANC and banging on the doors of the party these guys will have no choice than to shift to a party that might more protect their interests.

Just a prediction, I might add. whats that new black lady I keep seeing next o Helen Zille on T.V. Lindiwe Mazibuko, Pretty little chunky thing. I think she's Xhosa huh?

paniki:

You obviously don't know much about BEE besides the abbreviation. Do you think it's a government office that dishes out 'BEE' grants? You probably think that every successful black South African has received a hand out from the government. Even if that was the case it would be a good show of a government by the people for the people.

These are the BEE codes that South African and Multi-National companies must comply with in order to do business with the government:

- Code 100 – Ownership
- Code 200 – Management & Control
- Code 300 – Employment Equity
- Code 400 – Skills Development
- Code 500 – Preferential Procurement
- Code 600 – Enterprise Development
- Code 700 – Socioeconomic development

There's no business hand outs my friend. Hand outs are done by the Department of Social Development which gives monthly social grants to the poor which makes poor South Africans only theoretically poor.

Oh sorry maybe I should call them tenderpreneurs, make ya feel better.

Don't make assumptions of what I know and don't know about your country. I am not your average Nigerian who talks crap about SA.

zolzlolz:

The trouble is, black people can't see the bigger picture. A black person gets a R1 million rand car, now black people are successful. But that money was supposed to have provided houses,  education, electricity. Can black progress not be measured by the increased number of blacks who get a house, the increased number of black children sent to school , the increased number of black children who don't have to study by candle light because they have electricity. Juju, people do not want to live like you and the white man. They just want a house, clean water, electricity, they want to vote for change. People cannot tell me that these people can live in excess in a country where over half of the population live in poverty. These people should be serving the people, DOING THEIR JOB, WORKING, instead of living luxurious lives that can serve as inspiration to dirt poor citizens. I'm not anti-ANC, I just don't have this blind loyalty like someone who has an obese friend, but won't tell them because they are afraid of hurting their feelings. I'M OUT!!

Don't you know that since 1994 the government has built over 2 million houses for the poor?
Do you not know that the government spends a quarter of the yearly budget on education?
Don't you know about the Eskom electrification program which now provides electricity to even the most rural places in SA. Watch Khumbul'ekhaya tonight to see people living in the mountains who have Eskom power lines.
Your mind has been corrupted by those whites who all live the good life in Cape Town

morpheus24:

Oh sorry maybe I should call them tenderpreneurs, make ya feel better.

Don't make assumptions of what I know and don't know about your country. I am not your average Nigerian who talks crap about SA.

You too should not assume that we know nothing about Nigeria

morpheus24:

^^^
@zolzlolz

I am kinda predicting a gradual shift from the ANC to the DA party for some of these "black up and coming middle class" elite being created as you have stated when the poor start attacking the very elite that is being created witin the ranks of the ANC and banging on the doors of the party these guys will have no choice than to shift to a party that might more protect their interests.

Just a prediction, I might add. whats that new black lady I keep seeing next o Helen Zille on T.V. Lindiwe Mazibuko, Pretty little chunky thing. I think she's Xhosa huh?

Black people will never vote for white leadership so your prediction is incorrect. The DA won Western Cape province because blacks are in the minority and some of them like zolzlolz have been corrupted by the white man who lives a good life in Cape Town and Stellenbosch. Whites will continue to have a grip on the economy and therefore they will always be seen as the enemy.

Lindiwe Mazibuko is South African. We are not so ethnocentric as you Nigerians

paniki:

You too should not assume that we know nothing about Nigeria

xcept what you hear on SABC 1

paniki:

Black people will never vote for white leadership so your prediction is incorrect. The DA won Western Cape province because blacks are in the minority and some of them like zolzlolz have been corrupted by the white man who lives a good life in Cape Town and Stellenbosch. Whites will continue to have a grip on the economy and therefore they will always be seen as the enemy.

Lindiwe Mazibuko is South African. We are not so ethnocentric as you Nigerians

Right right, a consequence of Apatheid struggles.

its a prediction you dimwit, it can't be incorrect if its assumed to happen at a future date. Ever heard of a Black repulican. Some people thought that was an impossible phenomena but it happened. Hmmmm?

morpheus24:

xcept what you hear on SABC 1

Just being part of nairaland has got me to know a lot about Nigeria and google helps too.

morpheus24:

Right right, a consequence of Apatheid struggles.

its a prediction you dimwit, it can't be incorrect if its assumed to happen at a future date. Ever heard of a Black repulican. Some people thought that was an impossible phenomena but it happened. Hmmmm?

Please get hold of Nelson Mandela's speeches on the interwebs and read them. He liked talking about "peace and unity"
Black South Africans used to kill each other in ethnic and political clashes during the late 80s and early 90s but Mandela's "peace and unity" mantra prevailed.

Please accept that black South Africans will never again allow themselves to be ruled by whites. You prediction is incorrect because your line of thinking is illogical therefore impossible. It's like me predicting that black Africans will land on the moon in the next decade - it's possible but unfathomable therefore incorrect.

paniki:

Please get hold of Nelson Mandela's speeches on the interwebs and read them. He liked talking about "peace and unity"
Black South Africans used to kill each other in ethnic and political clashes during the late 80s and early 90s but Mandela's "peace and unity" mantra prevailed.

Please accept that black South Africans will never again allow themselves to be ruled by whites. You prediction is incorrect because your line of thinking is illogical therefore impossible. It's like me predicting that black Africans will land on the moon in the next decade - it's possible but unfathomable therefore incorrect.

Stay focused. Your 'pap' eating azz is jumping the gun. The prediction was not about whites taking over power again. Go back and read will ya.

The reasoning was based on a comparison of similar social stratification systems based on race and similar political and economic emergence of an under class within such a society i, e the US in comparison to Southa Africa.  Therefore the arguement cannot be illogical because it is based on  valid deductive reasoning and therefore not impossible or unimaginable.

Damn some o ya'll are slow

morpheus24:

Stay focused. Your 'pap' eating azz is jumping the gun. The prediction was not about whites taking over power again. Go back and read will ya.

The reasoning was based on a comparison of similar social stratification systems based on race and similar political and economic emergence of an under class within such a society i, e the US in comparison to Southa Africa.  Therefore the arguement cannot be illogical because it is based on  valid deductive reasoning and therefore not impossible or unimaginable.

Damn some o ya'll are slow

Your hypothesis shows that you don't understand South Africa and it's social construct. You sound like those IMF economists who sit at a New York office and then tell the Nigerian government how they should manage the "oil" economy based on postulated ideas.

paniki:

Your hypothesis shows that you don't understand South Africa and it's social construct. You sound like those IMF economists who sit at a New York office and then tell the Nigerian government how they should manage the "oil" economy based on postulated ideas.

US Population Pre 1964: 200million estimated white population 75%, estimated black population 23%
South African population pre 1994: 45 million estimated white population 5%, estimated black populatio 95%

US: 95% economy controlled by 75% of population
SA; 95% economy controlled by 5% of population size

US: JIM CROW LAWS, segregation, seperate but equal laws, Whites only facilities vs Colored only facilities
SA: PASS LAWS, Bantustans, Apatheid laws, Whites only facilities vs Colored/Black only facilities

US: 1964 pasage of civil rights law
SA 1994 passage of full adult suffrage laws i.e voting rights

DO YOU REALLY WANT ME TO CONTINUE!!!!

^^^^^^

That's exacty what they said when the convinced our government to go ahead with American Affirmitive Action

paniki:

^^^^^^

That's exacty what they said when the convinced our government to go ahead with American Affirmitive Action

and your BEE project is working well isn't it or not?

morpheus24:

and your BEE project is working well isn't it or not?

BEE is a policy that applies only to companies that do or want to do business with the government(you said you know this). There are many businesses that have no interest in government contracts or tenders and so BEE doesn't apply to them. When government decides to build anything or wants any kind of service from industry, they give the tenders to BEE compliant businesses. Being BEE compliant means that a business will have some or all black ownership, some or all black management in the business, the business must employ black people in its ranks, the business must prove that it trains black people in its employ, the business must prove that it buys its supplies from small black suppliers(Preferential Procurement), the business must prove that it supports black enterprise by funding black start-ups, the business must prove that it participates in developing the communities in which it operates. BEE has had mixed success because many businesses try to dodge these requirements

paniki:

BEE is a policy that applies only to companies that do or want to do business with the government(you said you know this). There are many businesses that have no interest in government contracts or tenders and so BEE doesn't apply to them. When government decides to build anything or wants any kind of service from industry, they give the tenders to BEE compliant businesses. Being BEE compliant means that a business will have some or all black ownership, some or all black management in the business, the business must employ black people in its ranks, the business must prove that it trains black people in its employ, the business must prove that it buys its supplies from small black suppliers(Preferential Procurement), the business must prove that it supports black enterprise by funding black start-ups, the business must prove that it participates in developing the communities in which it operates. BEE has had mixed success because many businesses try to dodge these requirements

There is practically no difference with this and an American Affirmative action quota systems.

ok

[flash=450,350]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xay9p8c9jCk[/flash]

South Africa's militant youth leader, Julius Malema, led thousands of protesters from Johannesburg to the seat of power in Pretoria on Friday (October 28), demanding more jobs, the nationalisation of mines, and the seizure of white-owned farms in Africa's richest nation. The march to highlight chronic unemployment and the continued economic power of the nation's white minority is a direct challenge to President Jacob Zuma, whom the influential ANC Youth League leader accuses of not doing enough to improve the lives of millions of impoverished blacks.

[img]http://empireminecraft.com/attachments/bump-gif.5616/[/img]

Why did this get bumped. It rather old news.

andrewza: Why did this get bumped. It rather old news.

You fail to see the relevance after the S.A. government and corporate slaughter of the miners?

Afro_Blue:

You fail to see the relevance after the S.A. government and corporate slaughter of the miners?

O ok. So it has nothing to do with the OP. To why you brought bumped this.

Ignoring the police and the shooting since that matter is different and has a thread I want to bring up the root causes. Who was to blame for the strike to start in the first place.

The min company? They just a mine company. They may be owed a UK company but the south african branch is run by mainly black south africans. And they all so paying what all the other mines pay so it is not that this company is at the wrong because if they are doing something wrong all the mine company's are at wrong.

Then there is government. You could say they should have tried to improve there lives a long time ago. problem is they are not that bad off there are people in even worse condition. I know 4000 is not a lot of money. You could barely look after your self with that much never mind a family. But there are people far worse off in SA.

Then there are the 2 unions. Thhey really messed up this time. I put a lot of blame on the unions. I mean the miners could not have come up with 12500 rand out of there heads some one told them that figure. And personally 12500 is way to much that more than the pay than a trained mech.


what I think should happen. Government must bring in legislation to improve miners work and living condition.

By
Minimum wage for R7000 for mine workers

Free medical aid(spouse and kids included) and life cover.

Cheap or free lunch provided at the mines for the workers.

[quote author=andrewza]

O ok. So it has nothing to do with the OP. To why you brought bumped this.

bottom line, satisfied workers don't protest or strike.

That is true. But who is truly at fault. The company who is like all other company trying to get rich, government who have bigger problems to deal with, or unions or spread miss information.

andrewza:
That is true. But who is truly at fault. The company who is like all other company trying to get rich, government who have bigger problems to deal with, or unions or spread miss information.

Greed and mistreatment of the working class eventually leads to extreme circumstances.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owJFelAZBDc