PoliteActivist:


*Politeness*
Ok, you've stylishly told is your house was part of "the rich or upper middle class"
But seriously, what other job do you want a billionaire big-time generator importer to get? And you think he'd just fold his hands and allow it?

IbeOkehie:


It's curious why you keep putting out statements that you know are complete LIES on a public forum. It seems you're doing it just to appear even handed in your criticism? Right?

Cement used to be a subsidized and price controlled commodity. The result was scarcity and at least two "cement armada" scandals under Presidents Gowon and Shagari. It was President Obasanjo of the PDP that cancelled cement subsidy, privatized the industry and imposed a free market.

Here's President Jonathan of the PDP in December 2011 -

https://www.channelstv.com/2011/12/16/president-jonathan-appreciates-the-pain-of-the-people-but-insists-on-fuel-subsidy-removal/

https://dailypost.ng/2011/12/07/oil-subsidyjonathan-insists-on-subsidy-removal-senators-divided/

Why do you insist on lying about PDP policy on subsidies?

For that matter, IBB was the one that initiated free market policy via SAP, you should have exempted him from that blanket list. What PDP did on taking power was to restart the implementation of SAP. That's all. Without SAP there would be ZERO productivity in the Nigerian economy. IBB saved Nigerians from penury but today he's probably the most unpopular President, mention his name and Nigerians start spatzing out.

Note how most Nigerians hate both Jonathan and IBB but still venerate Buhari and Murtala. That's a clear measure of the socio-economic sentiments of the Nigerian people. Nigerians are SOCIALIST, they PREFER socialism. PDP tried to save them when conditions were more suited to change, but they allowed themselves to be deceived by APC.

Thank God the internet is here, this isn't the old days when anyone can make any claim and it can't be refuted.

Have a good day.

Good Luck to Nigerians.

IbeOkehie:


It's curious why you keep putting out statements that you know are complete LIES on a public forum. It seems you're doing it just to appear even handed in your criticism? Right?

Cement used to be a subsidized and price controlled commodity. The result was scarcity and at least two "cement armada" scandals under Presidents Gowon and Shagari. It was President Obasanjo of the PDP that cancelled cement subsidy, privatized the industry and imposed a free market.

Here's President Jonathan of the PDP in December 2011 -

https://www.channelstv.com/2011/12/16/president-jonathan-appreciates-the-pain-of-the-people-but-insists-on-fuel-subsidy-removal/

https://dailypost.ng/2011/12/07/oil-subsidyjonathan-insists-on-subsidy-removal-senators-divided/

Why do you insist on lying about PDP policy on subsidies?

For that matter, IBB was the one that initiated free market policy via SAP, you should have exempted him from that blanket list. What PDP did on taking power was to restart the implementation of SAP. That's all. Without SAP there would be ZERO productivity in the Nigerian economy. IBB saved Nigerians from penury but today he's probably the most unpopular President, mention his name and Nigerians start spatzing out.

Note how most Nigerians hate both Jonathan and IBB but still venerate Buhari and Murtala. That's a clear measure of the socio-economic sentiments of the Nigerian people. Nigerians are SOCIALIST, they PREFER socialism. PDP tried to save them when conditions were more suited to change, but they allowed themselves to be deceived by APC.

Thank God the internet is here, this isn't the old days when anyone can make any claim and it can't be refuted.

Have a good day.

Good Luck to Nigerians.

nairalanda1:



I see no reason for disagreement. At the end, we are saying the same thing. Subsides are not sustainable.

PDP did keep subsides on power, and on education and on petroleum too.

But for me, this is not a party thing anyway...

But then again, the parites and the army are all the same. Nigerians will soon see that, and then we can wake up. Maybe we get a sane version of Macri, or collapse.

nairalanda1:

The truth is, no subsidy is sustainable, and it is a pity that all governments, millitary, APC and PDP, can't see that. But then again, what can one do.? The USSR subsidised a lot of things. It helped a lot of people certainly, but it also led to the collapse of the USSR itself.

IbeOkehie:


There you go again trying to massage away simple facts. We are NOT writing the same thing. You made a BLANKET STATEMENT that all governments of Nigeria support subsidies. Let me again reproduce what you wrote:



My position is that among the political parties, PDP is generally against subsidies while APC is generally in favor of subsidies, while IBB was the only military government that was also against subsidies.

It's also a religious and tribal thing. Muslims tend to favor government ownership, price controls and subsidies while Christians do not. The voting patterns and public reactions to government policy bear this out.

Your blanket statements on this and similar issues don't help anyone seeking to understand the Nigerian political-economy. Again, we're not saying the same thing. You're lying and quite bold about it despite clear recorded history. Typical Nigerian behavior.

Good Luck to Nigerians.

nairalanda1:


The truth is, no subsidy is sustainable, and it is a pity that all governments, millitary, APC and PDP, can't see that. But then again, what can one do.? The USSR subsidised a lot of things. It helped a lot of people certainly, but it also led to the collapse of the USSR itself.

So, why did PDP keep subsides on petrol and power?

So, why did PDP keep subsides on petrol and power?

I am not here to say your party is this, or APC is bad. The whole subsides thing arises from the idea at independence that we would all get a better share. It is that attempt to fufill that better share thing that led to the whole subsides issue.

I was not referring to subsides on cement (which I was under the impression have gone since)...it is petrol and power, because I see it as hindering our industrial growth as a nation. Both sectors have to make a profit to grow, to power us away from dependence on oil and into the hoped for industrial growth we need to really grow economically.

Like I said, I am not here to play political games. I stopped supporting parties long time ago. I have voted for minority parties for ages. But at the end, the fact is, PDP handed subsides on petrol to APC, and APC maintained subsides on petrol PDP privatised power and kept price contrls on power, and APC continued those price controls.

IbeOkehie:
This is your original comment that brought me here. For continual reference.



Then your latest rationalizations of the obvious -

(1)

Because big changes in a large political economy can't be done at once, in one step. Like I've written before, the Nigerian people PREFER socialist policies like subsidies and price controls. So anyone can see that much as PDP tried to move Nigeria towards a free market regime, they encountered a lot of opposition.

The FIRST policy to introduce free markets to the formal economy was SAP by IBB in 1986. Most Nigerians don't even know that the ONLY REASON private banks, airlines, universities, radio and tv stations and such exist today is SAP. Unfortunately Abacha either stopped it or wasn't interested, then PDP restarted the policy in 1999. Why can't you acknowledge this simple thing? PDP removed subsidies and allowed free market pricing in telecoms and cement. That surely counts for progress toward an ultimate goal.

(2)

I repeat this your query because, let me use Nigerian language....the question is somehow. I'm struggling to maintain writing composure here. Ummm, PDP kept subsidies on those and many other things because that's what the Nigerian people wanted and PDP was unable to overcome the political obstacles. You do remember Occupy Nigeria in Jan 2012?

(3)

Your stance here is COWARDICE, a very Nigerian characteristic. Even on an anonymous forum, you can't bring yourself to condemn the wrong and appreciate the good, instead you hide behind an easy general condemnation. Because you don't want to take sides and fight for what is right. Very, very Nigerian. This is why people shy away from doing the right thing, in the end Nigerians still don't give credit to those who earned it, instead everyone is normalized as THE SAME...again a very socialist approach to public policy.

I don't have a political party. I deal in facts not feelings. I'm an Igbo man, I get into spats with my own people all the time when I tell them the TRUTH, that it was the Igbo that imposed Unitary Government on Nigeria...a known FACT of history, yet the average Igbo will tell you it was Gowon or the Fulani. It's like telling a Nigerian lawyer that nobody can own land in Nigeria...watch how they go into contortions trying to convince you of something written black & white in the Constitution of the Federal Republic

FACT - the PDP is a party dominated by free market type people, at least from 1999 to 2015. I'm not making a CLAIM, that's a FACT. The EVIDENCE is that PDP abolished subsidies and price controls in the following industries - telecoms, cement, petrochemicals/fertilizer. This happened within living memory, from 1999 to 2015. I truly don't understand why you assign socialist credentials to a party that pursued such policy without a crisis forcing their hand.

The APC on the other hand has always had a party manifesto committed to socialist principles. The APC is still paying fuel subsidies to this very day. The only reason they REDUCED it is because the government ran out of money and the majority of the Nigerian people accepted it because APC is an Islamic Fulani-Yoruba alliance and hold a credible popular mandate.

(4)

YOUR POST referred to ALL subsidies and all politicians and parties, military and civilian. It was a BLANKET STATEMENT that was false on its face. If you're under the impression that cement subsidies are gone, who removed the cement subsidy? Guy, you just dey make contradictory statement here and there. For the avoidance of doubt, President Obasanjo of PDP removed cement subsidy and price controls. In case you don't know, now you know. Sheeeesh!!! Why is this so difficult for you to acknowledge?

(5)

This one shows you don't even know what you're writing about. Sorry, PDP didn't privatize electricity because again, they couldn't overcome the popular political opposition. Yes, they CLAIMED they privatized electricity, but a simple look at the STRUCTURE of the industry says otherwise. Put it simply, the entire electricity system is controlled by TCN, which is 100% owned by the Federal Government of Nigeria. All to say, details do matter. It's like the perennial APC claim that they've FLOATED THE NAIRA...when all they did is devalue!

Your kind of opinion is interesting. Confirms Nigerians are a really special people. University graduates who can't even grapple with FACTS of their own national history that happened in LIVING MEMORY. With your kind of fair, unbiased thinking, Nigeria is going nowhere good.

Good Luck to Nigerians!

nairalanda1:



And despite all you have said, PDP failed its free market prinicples by keeping subsides on petrol and power. And you use the argument APC apologists use about Buhari and tinubu by saying that they could not remove it because of sudden changes to the system.

It is like you really do not know the damage subsides have done to our power and petroleum sector. The day I had my eyes opened in 2011 thanks to trying to understand why GEJ was trying to remove subsidy, something they had been telling us for decades, was the day I knew. And I have been an implacable opponent of subsides.

P,S I don't appreciate being called a coward.

omohayek:

I am not against the decentralization of Nigeria's power infrastructure - in fact, I've argued for it on here in the past. While there are efficiency gains to be had from a single power grid spanning the entire country, better that there be multiple regional grids that are actively maintained and reliable than a "national" grid that is in constant disrepair.

That said, decentralization still doesn't address the main issue with Nigeria's power sector: the inability of GENCOs and DISCOs to charge enough to cover their costs. You say that "consumers will pay for whatever is asked", but that is simply not even close to being true. Nigerian consumers would rather put up with constant shortages than pay what it costs to produce something they desire - just look at the backlash to Tinubu's attempt to abolish the petrol subsidy (a move he was actually forced into by the country's impending default on its loan obligations). Is it any surprise, then, that no government has dared to allow the GENCOs and DISCOs to freely set their own rates, instead of having to come and beg for increases every few years?

Most Nigerians have no comprehension of opportunity costs, and see nothing wrong with having to buy "I pass my neighbor" generators to compliment the unreliable "cheap" power they are offered by private companies which can't even cover their costs, just as most Nigerians prefer "cheap" petrol that is constantly in short supply over market-priced fuel that leaves room for the government to invest in basics like good roads, education and basic health care. You can decentralize all you want, but this mentality will still be there wrecking any efforts whether at the state or even LGA level. Nigerians say they are willing to pay for reliable power, but few are ready to do so upfront, as if heavily indebted and unprofitable GENCOs and DISCOs are in any position to offer under-priced power indefinitely until Nigerians feel it is reliable enough to be worth paying for (which will in reality be "never" ).

Bottom line: decentralization would be helpful, but most of Nigeria's power sector problems would go away in a few months if the government

(i) permanently removed all the price controls on the GENCOs and DISCOs, instead of forcing them to beg annually for changes, and

(ii) abolished a true floating-rate exchange regime (making a parallel "black market" pointless). This would reassure foreign investors that they can repatriate their earnings as and when they see fit.

IbeOkehie:


So if GEJ tried to remove subsidies, why do you claim he supports subsidies?

PDP didn't fail, they were on a gradual path to putting in free market policies. Like it or not, everything can't be done at once. You keep mentioning Argentina, I think you have the name wrong, the name of the new guy is President Millei, I think. He's probably the most RADICAL libertarian politician in world history, yet he hasn't been able to do EVERYTHING on day 1. Go and check. And by the end of year 1, there will still be a lot undone.

Your statements reek of intellectual cowardice and hypocrisy.

GEJ's arguments opened your eyes to the dangers of subsidies YET you claim he was in favor of subsidies. How is a reasonable person supposed to reconcile that? Abeg carry go. You're a typical example of why Nigeria is the way it is.

Good Luck to Nigerians.

nairalanda1:


Because he kept them at the end. Fuel remained at 97 naira. Landing cost continued to rise.

Truth be told, most Nigerian leaders know subsides is bad (and let's give GEJ this, he removed subsides on diesel, kerosene...otherwise by now our debt would have been THIS big)...but they are not courageous enough to remove them

nairalanda1:


No. It is not held by any demonic forces...and I beg you, stop making Lucifer Asmodeus look more powerful than he really is.

The simple reason why we do not have enough power is that the government controls pricing in the power sector, to the point where they cannot make enough profit to pay for improvements (and the subsides don't cover the cost), also, 30-40% of Nigerians steal power.

No money, no improvement.

rayopt:
Lol. I laughed reading the headline. Won't even reading all that story because I honestly won't lie, I have never witness the light I am currently having in this Nigeria. I traveled between mowe, Lagos, and Ilorin in this December. The current state of electricity in these places is mind-blowing. And I get that from people in other locations. So, I don't know wat this post is all about.

happney65:


The GSM sector was totally unbundled. Then government handed off patapata they only started monitoring the sector. If obasanjo didn't unbundle it and did the type of yeye one the Jonathan administration did,it would have been a case of network outage for hours or days like it happens currently with Electricity.

Government should hands off
Generation
Distribution
Transmission

Completely

nairalanda1:


No. It is not held by any demonic forces...and I beg you, stop making Lucifer Asmodeus look more powerful than he really is.

The simple reason why we do not have enough power is that the government controls pricing in the power sector, to the point where they cannot make enough profit to pay for improvements (and the subsides don't cover the cost), also, 30-40% of Nigerians steal power.

No money, no improvement.

CodeTemplar:


And electricity will sell for N10,000/kWh. Cement example is there to learn from. Even competution in commodity value chain with hundreds of merchants get circumvented by unionizing actors. Is it a handful of discos whose market do not overlap that you expect not to secretly unionize and fix prices?

happney65:


You people keep on thinking we having 247 electricity is some kind of rocket science. See,that was the same thing that was said with telecommunications

"Telephone is not for the poor,yada yada". Today even the poorest of the poorest has a phone with the telecommunications sector declaring mad profits year to year.

You see having 247 electricity should be a basic human right. Power going off or customers installing transformers and power lines is archaic living and should be done away with. It is already basic human right in Europe and America and lots of countries in Africa but that of us you make it seem like it is rocket science and claiming people can't pay for it.

Government still holding on to Generation and transmission and a part of distribution when AMCON took over some distribution companies is bullshit. They should hands off everything and see the growth within a couple of years

We need a total unbundling of that sector. Not this fire brigade approach them dey do.

No matter how much they fix for pricing,it cannot be as much as running 247 Generator in your house.

Genuinely privatize the sector and more people will come in and there will be competition in the power sector like it is in the communication sector.

Not this nonesense they are doing

dacool1:


Government should hands off this and hands of that!! Then what's the business of government?