AoifeNightfall:
I don't believe homosexuality is against African cultures. At worst, they are indifferent. The hostility towards LGBTQ community, started with the coming of the white man and Christian religion.

Too right. There were no laws that criminalised same sex behaviour until the British penal code was foist on African societies.

DaddyJapan:


Enough of the hyperbole.
No one has imposed homosexuality on you!

If God wanted everyone to be able to procreate, no woman would be barren and no man will be impotent.

By the way, according to The Reformation Project, Sodom and Gomorrah addresses gang rape and not same-sex relationships.
To be honest, I am sufficiently persuaded by that view too -- https://reformationproject.org/case/sodom-and-gomorrah

but God created Adam and Eve not Adam and Steve or Eve and Ada

Same sex is evil and demonic, the pop should not encourage it in Africa


It’s even more pathetic that most gay people are trying to lord it on peoples face online these days, yo I fukkk assss ok bro keep it to yourself don’t come out outside soliciting for support or some crazy awareness

Gadafii:
but God created Adam and Eve not Adam and Steve or Eve and Ada

Same sex is evil and demonic, the pop should not encourage it in Africa


It’s even more pathetic that most gay people are trying to lord it on peoples face online these days, yo I fukkk assss ok bro keep it to yourself don’t come out outside soliciting for support or some crazy awareness

Ha, I hear your literal interpretation of the bible loudly.

God created Adam and Eve right? And that couple went on to have sons and daughters bah?
So where did Cain's wife come from?

DaddyJapan:


Ha, I hear your literal interpretation of the bible loudly.

God created Adam and Eve right? And that couple went on to have sons and daughters bah?
So where did Cain's wife come from?

obviously not from same sex union

The Bible might not have given details about that, but it was definitely not from gay union, so?

By special case he meant a people mentally incapable of transcending the petty archaic sentiments and ideas passed down to them by their monkey ancestors.By special case he meant a people mentally incapable of transcending the petty archaic sentiments and ideas passed down to them by their monkey ancestors....

Gadafii:
obviously not from same sex union

The Bible might not have given details about that, but it was definitely not from gay union, so?

If the bible is silent on that matter, then it can be inferred that it is also silent on so many other world concerns too.

BondRiv:


These are independent thoughts. You are the one regurgitating mainstream talking points. A man cannot have sexual relations with another man. Same applies to a woman. It goes against the order of nature. A biological man cannot become a woman and vice versa. I won't conform to the absurdities and deviant lifestyles of your world.

I don't care about your idea of absurdities. I am only after your claim that there are natural laws on homosexuality.
Saying homosexuality is not natural is wrong because there are several cases of homosexuality in the bonobo and chimpanzee society.

Nature is absurd and does not care about your poorly fabricated morality.

killsmith:
I don't care about your idea of absurdities. I am only after your claim that there are natural laws on homosexuality.
Saying homosexuality is not natural is wrong because there are several cases of homosexuality in the bonobo and chimpanzee society.

Nature is absurd and does not care about your poorly fabricated morality.

There is nothing natural about same sex relationships. It is a disorder being glorified now as progress.

When the rulers of this world want to entrench depravity, they find a way either through ridiculous studies or whatever.

When they wanted to evade Iraq, they found a way in the name of weapons of mass destruction.

LowKeyManny:


What values? Was killing of twins not part of our values before now? Since Mary Slessor pushed for the abandonment of such value, have we suffered for abondonment of same?

Ps: I do not subscribe to LGBTQ agenda. But at the end of the day, what a person decides to do with his/her body should not be anyone's concern as long as no harm is occasioned to others.

First, Mary Slessor did not "stop" the killing of twins in Old Calabar as most history books have erroneously recorded. The first effort towards the abolishment of twin deaths was orchestrated by Consul Beecroft in agreement with King Eyo Honesty II in 1849. Old Obutong people broke the agreement subsequently and were bombed by the Colonial Army. Six years later, King Duke Ephraim and other Chiefs entered into a written agreement with Consul Hutchinson to enforce and implement the ban on the killing of twins.

Mary Slessor was only 7years old in 1855. And to her credit, she was only responsible for providing safe haven for any twins she rescued in "Okoyong" where she was Vice President of the Native Court. She further used the instrument of court to magnify the essence of the already signed agreement.

Second, using that as a reference point for this discourse, is a total deviation from what is. We won't have problems with people's sexual orientation and inclinations if they are respectful enough not to try shoving these practices down our throats. It is that coercive approach that is being resisted and always will be.

BondRiv:


There is nothing natural about same sex relationships. It is a disorder being glorified now as progress.

The bonobos are naturally bisexual. Are you smarter than God that created them? How can you not see that you are intolerant?

killsmith:
I don't care about your idea of absurdities. I am only after your claim that there are natural laws on homosexuality.
Saying homosexuality is not natural is wrong because there are several cases of homosexuality in the bonobo and chimpanzee society.

Nature is absurd and does not care about your poorly fabricated morality.

Our flawed education system cannot be excused in this regard.

As recorded by Stephen O Murray and Will Roscoe in Boy-Wives and Female Husbands, queerness is not alien to Africa. Prior to European colonization, a variety of pre-colonial African societies expressed far more relaxed attitudes towards sexual expression and gender identity. As far back as 2400 BC, tombs have been excavated in Ancient Egypt with two men’s bodies, Niankhkhnum and Khnumhotep, embracing each other as lovers.

This was not unique to Egypt. Sir Richard Burton, who once proclaimed queerness as exogenous to sub-Saharan Africa to the point of literally excising such practices from his map ironically, acknowledged 16th Century Portuguese sources which observed instances of male homosexuality among the Kongo tribe. These sources, penned by European travellers, spoke of men who refused to wear traditionally masculine clothes and who “[served] as passive women in the ‘abominable sin’” (Murray & Roscoe, p.142). Interestingly, the writer takes no care to justify his characterisation of this act or whether it was seen as ‘abominable’ in the society in which it existed. This lack of context allows the traveller to make presumptions on behalf of the Kongo Kingdom; projecting and universalising their disdain for homosexuality unto the Kongolese.

Source: https://democracyinafrica.org/fake-history-misunderstanding-colonial-legacies-and-the-demonization-of-homosexuality-in-africa

killsmith:

The bonobos are naturally bisexual. Are you smarter than God that created them? How can you not see that you are intolerant?

Unfortunately, you have succumbed to the enormous and overwhelming deceit of this world. By God's grace, I won't.

The weapons of our warfare are not carnal.

BondRiv:


Unfortunately, you have succumbed to the enormous and overwhelming deceit of this world. By God's grace, I won't.

The weapons of our warfare are not carnal.

By the grace of the same God that created the bonobos?

BoldBrainz:

Second, using that as a reference point for this discourse, is a total deviation from what is. We won't have problems with people's sexual orientation and inclinations if they are respectful enough not to try shoving these practices down our throats. It is that coercive approach that is being resisted and always will be.

You sound like those who once opposed 'race-mixing' (interracial marriages) in various parts of the world but most notably in the USA. They also felt it went against the laws of nature, and actually lynched fellow humans to drive home the point.

aribisala0:
Culture is not what your ancestors did but what you are doing
Culture includes technology e.g

Toothbrush is now more prevalent than chewing sticks
Condoms,electricity ,pornography are now part of our culture.
Let us understand culture in that regard first

Homosexuality has traditionally in European culture been considered wrong and criminalized.
So this idea that it has always been part of European culture is wrong. It is a NEW CULTURE.

NEW CULTURES can take over and replace old if people allow e.g Baby Mama culture
So far Nigeria has not accepted the Homosexual culture but we must understand that as a culture it is not Historically European. It is new BECAUSE they ALLOWED it to emerge and take root. We should learn and known what to do

The summary of your post is "culture is dynamic".

OLAADEGBU:


Africans Are 'Special Case' When It Comes To LGBT Blessings Because Of Their Culture – Pope Francis.

Its not bad to us...we consider it a taboo.

abhosts:


So if indeed hatred towards marginalized people was holiness and God's will, why is Africa so poor and wretched? Why are your fellow Africans fasting and praying to get visa to become dishwashers in 'sodom and gomora'?

The progress in life has nothing in any way to depict being at God's side. If your your life success convinces you to be much on God's side then you are ignorant of the exense of Christianity. Christianity should have after life as it's focus, reason why you should not fear what kills your body but what takes your soul.
Africa may be poor, but don't use their poverty to judge them of being hated by God.

Having said that, I admit Africans have it's own problems especially in the area of corruption, stealing, fraud etc. However, these issues cannot in any way make homosexuality an approved norm by God. Homosexuality is against nature. Again, I do not support any discrimination. But approving their relationship and blessing such is a NO NO

DaddyJapan:


You sound like those who once opposed 'race-mixing' (interracial marriages) in various parts of the world but most notably in the USA. They also felt it went against the laws of nature, and actually lynched fellow humans to drive home the point.

You keep smuggling extant references to this dialogue.

Look, no African or Nigerian has gone to Western nations to revolt against their LGBTQ+ perceptions, neither have we sought to dictate to them how things should be done as regards where a man wants to put his penis and what a woman decides to bury in her vagina. All we have asked is that we not be coerced to accept all of that decadence as a traditional way of life.

Only reason Western Nations have the audacity to push these agendas down our throats is because people like you leave room for them to be heard in the first place. If you want to chalk this down to the backwardness of the African race, take the echoes of this your sentiment to the Russian and Chinese borders and see if you won't be put to death within hours.

Let's stop normalising nonsense. There is nothing positive about LGBTQ+. Absolutely nothing!

BoldBrainz:


You keep smuggling extant references to this dialogue.

Look, no African or Nigerian has gone to Western nations to revolt against their LGBTQ+ perceptions, neither have we sought to dictate to them how things should be done as regards where a man wants to put his penis and what a woman decides to bury in her vagina. All we have asked is that we not be coerced to accept all of that decadence as a traditional way of life.

Only reason Western Nations have the audacity to push these agendas down our throats is because people like you leave room for them to be heard in the first place. If you want to chalk this down to the backwardness of the African race, take the echoes of this your sentiment to the Russian and Chinese borders and see if you won't be put to death within hours.

Let's stop normalising nonsense. There is nothing positive about LGBTQ+. Absolutely nothing!

What you have framed as an 'extant reference' is easy to explain. It is my attempt to demonstrate how racist Americans stood history on its head, by framing miscegenation as something new. Never mind that people of seemingly different cultures have been cohabitating and indulging in coitus for thousands of years, to the American government; this was to be viewed as a new invention - a transgression to be outlawed and governed by the most punitive punishment of all, death!

My point is a simply one. What does not sit well with you is not always counter-culture. Let me provide another example for illustrative purposes. To the roadman 'yuut' on the streets of England, any man dressed in a wrapper is to be considered queer, soft, unmanly - you get the picture. To the one who draws on a literal interpretation of his bible, such an act is to be considered an abomination.

A woman shall not wear man’s clothing, nor shall a man put on a woman’s clothing; for whoever does these things is an abomination to the LORD your God. Deuteronomy 22:5 (NASB)

Yet go to many villages in Africa or Asia today, and you will find illustrious men decked out in that apparel.

My life is not constrained because certain sexual minorities seek greater freedoms and neither is yours. Live and let live.

He even called Africans "small ideological group". Smh

abhosts:
Poor people usually have archaic cultural practices that stifles free expression and tolerance. That is how their evil leaders keep them in captivity. Just look at how they are demonizing Peter Obi's son who has wronged no one, neither did he break any UK law.

As a person of faith myself, I believe in live and let live. It should not be by force for everyone to share my values and religious beliefs. I would also want my religious rights and freedoms to be respected when i find myself in liberal countries that now have a palpable disdain towards organized religion.

Poor people like the people of Dubai and Saudi right?

killsmith:

The world is a representation of ideas. The idea of the modern world is equality. You see modern institutions trying to balance the gap between genders and minorities. The modern world is about leaving no room for oppression and giving everyone equal opportunity to achieve their goals and live life to the fullest.

Unfortunately, Africans struggle to think in terms of equality because slavery and oppression is fundamental to the average African culture.

Using that argument, I could argue for the approval of pedophilia and beastiality, because the modern world is about leaving no room for oppression and giving everyone equal opportunity to achieve their goals and live life to the fullest.

Equality always comes with caveats.

(I don't believe in policing what two consenting adults do with each other. If they want to hear why I bleieve that gay acts are a sin, I am ready to talk, but if they don't, I keep my mouth shut. EIther way, I treat them with respect and decency).

DaddyJapan:


What you have framed as an 'extant reference' is easy to explain. It is my attempt to demonstrate how racist Americans stood history on its head, by framing miscegenation as something new. Never mind that people of seemingly different cultures have been cohabitating and indulging in coitus for thousands of years, to the American government; this was to be viewed as a new invention - a transgression to be outlawed and governed by the most punitive punishment of all, death!

My point is a simply one. What does not sit well with you is not always counter-culture. Let me provide another example for illustrative purposes. To the roadman 'yuut' on the streets of England, any man dressed in a wrapper is to be considered queer, soft, unmanly - you get the picture. To the one who draws on a literal interpretation of his bible, such an act is to be considered an abomination.



Yet go to many villages in Africa or Asia today, and you will find illustrious men decked out in that apparel.

My life is not constrained because certain sexual minorities seek greater freedoms and neither is yours. Live and let live.

This your comment succinctly summarises both our points.

Life's dynamics have always seen variances in cultures and behavioural ways of life vis-a-vis different regions. What works in the West doesn't necessarily have to work for us and we're at liberty to resist that which we consider to be inimical to our societal justifications.

Goodluck Jonathan was hounded by the Obama administration to the point he lost his reelection bid in 2015, one of the major reasons being the Anti-gay bill he signed into law and stamped a 14 year jail sentence to it.

Only December of last year, Museveni of Uganda passed one of the world's harshest Anti-gay bills, where even the death penalty is prescribed in certain cases. Swiftly, Western Nations threatened the sovereignty of Uganda and withdrew all aids in a bid to coerce him into a U-turn.

If your principle of "Live and let's live" is much to go by, Western Nations ought to mind their blawdy business as regards this LGBTQ+ issue. Our laws, cultures and morals don't tolerate such sexual deviance, and I'm not even about to dance around the provisions of the bible on this one.

nairalanda1:


Using that argument, I could argue for the approval of pedophilia and beastiality, because the modern world is about leaving no room for oppression and giving everyone equal opportunity to achieve their goals and live life to the fullest.

Equality always comes with caveats.

(I don't believe in policing what two consenting adults do with each other. If they want to hear why I bleieve that gay acts are a sin, I am ready to talk, but if they don't, I keep my mouth shut. EIther way, I treat them with respect and decency).

Every idea comes with caveat.

killsmith:

Every idea comes with caveat.

Now you are talking!

BoldBrainz:


This your comment succinctly summarises both our points.

Life's dynamics have always seen variances in cultures and behavioural ways of life vis-a-vis different regions. What works in the West doesn't necessarily have to work for us and we're at liberty to resist that which we consider to be inimical to our societal justifications.

Goodluck Jonathan was hounded by the Obama administration to the point he lost his reelection bid in 2015, one of the major reasons being the Anti-gay bill he signed into law and stamped a 14 year jail sentence to it.

Only December of last year, Museveni of Uganda passed one of the world's harshest Anti-gay bills, where even the death penalty is prescribed in certain cases. Swiftly, Western Nations threatened the sovereignty of Uganda and withdrew all aids in a bid to coerce him into a U-turn.

If your principle of "Live and let's live" is much to go by, Western Nations ought to mind their blawdy business as regards this LGBTQ+ issue. Our laws, cultures and morals don't tolerate such sexual deviance, and I'm not even about to dance around the provisions of the bible on this one.

But you are not allowing others to live - that's my point.

DaddyJapan:


But you are not allowing others to live - that's my point.

Nobody is stopping anyone from living. Just live within the constitutional provisions of the land.

abhosts:
Poor people usually have archaic cultural practices that stifles free expression and tolerance. That is how their evil leaders keep them in captivity. Just look at how they are demonizing Peter Obi's son who has wronged no one, neither did he break any UK law.

As a person of faith myself, I believe in live and let live. It should not be by force for everyone to share my values and religious beliefs. I would also want my religious rights and freedoms to be respected when i find myself in liberal countries that now have a palpable disdain towards organized religion.

Who says your are gay? You are gay!

You allow same sex marriage but refuse polygamy. Funny and dishonest people

They (West) have tried without succeeding politically to get Africa into approving LGBT, even going as far as threatening to cut aids. Knowing how religious we are, they (West) are now attempting the religious route, using Catholic as their medium.

I'm glad the pope is aware, these white people can't keep forcing their woke culture on us (blacks)

Do not use poverty or anything to masquerade your deviant sexual preferences. Homosexuality, lesbianism and the likes are unnatural and abominable.Do not use poverty or anything to masquerade your deviant sexual preferences. Homosexuality, lesbianism and the likes are unnatural and abominable....