BrighterSyde:
■ You seem to be silent on the Bible vs gospel issue. Don’t be proud. Just admit your foolishness in making that statement. Now let us go to the Bible or should I say gospel passage we are referring to and see what exactly it says. Pls read Matthew 5 vs 31-32. It says that …anyone who divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality… Pls read all of it so you get the full context. This clearly states that there is ground for divorce and it is sexual immorality. Let me pause so you can read that verse and telll me what it means to you so I know whether I’m wasting my time explaining to someone who can’t read and understand simple English. If Bible and gospel is confusing you then this might be challenge for you too.

Are you certain you read it carefully?

31 “It was also said, ‘Any man who divorces his wife must give her a written notice of divorce.’[f]
32 But I tell you that any man who divorces his wife, except for the problem of sexual sin, is causing his wife to be guilty of adultery. And whoever marries a divorced woman is guilty of adultery. - Matthew 5 vs 31 - 32

He is causing her to be guilty of adultery so what does it mean? If she ends up being the one guilty of adultery, what sin am I guilty of assuming I sin by my action? Saying someone causes another to be guilty of adultery — the second person is the guilty party, not the first— is not the same as saying that someone has sinned, right? So let's see what the same Jesus Christ said about causing someone to sin.
A. In Matthew 18 and Mark 9, Jesus Christ made clear that there exists a curse on the life of those who would cause little children in His Kingdom to sin.

1 About that time the followers came to Jesus and asked, “Who is the greatest in God’s kingdom?”
2 Jesus called a little child to come to him. He stood the child in front of the followers.
3 Then he said, “The truth is, you must change your thinking and become like little children. If you don’t do this, you will never enter God’s kingdom.
4 The greatest person in God’s kingdom is the one who makes himself humble like this child.
5 “Whoever accepts a little child like this in my name is accepting me.
6 “If one of these little children believes in me, and someone causes that child to sin, it will be very bad for that person. It would be better for them to have a millstone tied around their neck and be drowned in the deep sea.
7 I feel sorry for the people in the world because of the things that make people sin. These things must happen, but it will be very bad for anyone who causes them to happen. - Matthew 18 vs 6 - 7

...

42 “If one of these little children believes in me, and someone causes that child to sin, it will be very bad for that person. It would be better for them to have a millstone tied around their neck and be drowned in the sea.
43 If your hand makes you sin, cut it off. It is better for you to lose part of your body and have eternal life than to have two hands and go to hell. There the fire never stops.
44 [c]
45 If your foot makes you sin, cut it off. It is better for you to lose part of your body and have eternal life than to have two feet and be thrown into hell.
46 [d]
47 If your eye makes you sin, take it out. It is better for you to have only one eye and enter God’s kingdom than to have two eyes and be thrown into hell.
48 The worms that eat the people in hell never die. The fire there is never stopped. - Matthew 9 vs 42 - 48

B. Is there anything regarding causing another man or woman to sin in the Kingdom of God? There does not seem to be any as Jesus Christ preached personal responsibility for all else in His Kingdom. Mark 9 vs 43 - 48 and Matthew 5 vs 29 - 30 state that one should cut off all that would cause one to continue in sin rather than enter into God's Kingdom whole only to end up thrown into hell at the end.

Jesus Christ is never in fact recorded to have said that causing another individual — not a little child— to be guilty of sin is itself a sin. What this means is that it becomes a sinful leap to conclude that causing another adult to be guilty of sin is itself a sin — since Jesus Christ never mentioned it being of sin.

Hardtalk:
So, even the rich also cry.

Na wah ooooo.

I remember when this man was apostle of married and singles. Hardly a campuse existed that he didn't visit. He showcased his marriage as the best, even as his wife was five years older.

My advice is that, no perfect marriage anywhere. Let us all make our marriages work. Even marriage counsellors are not angels. They too need help.

Wow! I didnt know the bolded. I guess that's why his wife felt she could keep slapping him anytime he did something she didn't like.

NoToPile:
Until I watched this interview sometimes in January this year, I thought he was still married to Ify. I never even knew they got divorced. I still remember the lady's picture on billboard, fair lady.

If you were conversant with campus programme's some 20years back the name Olumide and Ify Emmanuel will always ring a bell.

The interview was eye opening though. Watched it all.

It's crazy to know that he hasn't seen his kids since she left him like 15 years ago.

kay29000:


It's crazy to know that he hasn't seen his kids since she left him like 15 years ago.

This story reiterates the point that sometimes, people generally might not listen to counsel, I would have thought after Dr Olukoyas stern counsel to the woman an improvement should have been made considering that she would have respected his opinion as a man of God.

I also appreciate the fact that he's talking about it plenty years later and resisted the temptation to shalaye via press conference then, for that marriage to break down it was something because they were the couple going about with keys for singles very late 90s to early/mid 2000s so the divorce itself would have caused a lot of shake up in his church. That couple made waves back then via books and programme's in campuses before this SM era.

I was so shocked In January when I first saw the video I had to watch the interview, I watched the 2 part video to know what really happened.


I am an anti-Divorce advocate as a christain but there are lot of things to be learnt from his story for both males and females especially the christains.

YOU ARE VERY CONFUSED. May God give you or your children an abusive marriage...... Then you shall change your sermon.

Bible or your church doctrine

immortalcrown:
Only incest is biblically acceptable for a divorce. But many people claim that the Bible permits divorce if adultery happens. Some people claim that the Bible supports divorce if any form of unfaithfulness occurs in the marriage.

If incest is not the biblical ground for a divorce, why did the disciples of Jesus Christ say what they said in Mathew 19:10? Read the chapter and pay attention to the verse 10. Then, tell me why the disciples made the statement.

The problem here is hypocrisy. People want to be here and there. People want to eat their cake and have it.

If you want to divorce your spouse when he or she offends you, avoid church wedding. Do your traditional marriage or any other form of marriage. The issue is that people want church wedding but don't want the cross that comes with church wedding. Church wedding vow says, "... until death do us part". Nobody is forcing you to choose the bible type of marriage. But if you willingly choose it and fail to maintain it, you are deceiving yourself.

Choose a tradition you can maintain. Don't deceive yourself with church wedding when you are not willing to abide by its principles.

Many people are quoting me. Before you argue with me, read the article below. 👇🏽

https://www.facebook.com/share/p/YsuRQDEXyRcf4Xv9/?mibextid=oFDknk

Is Divorce a Sin?

I think the right question should be, did Jesus Permit divorce? Did God permit divorce? In other words, are you even allowed to divorce before you start talking about whether it is a sin or not?

The straight answer is that Jesus never permitted divorce. Once marriage is validly contracted, even adultery as some of you wrongly allege is not a ground for divorce.

I know this whole misunderstanding is coming from Jesus' statement in Matthew 19:9. I will clarify it. But before then, I am not writing this to give people a license to cheat on their spouses. As a matter of fact, you owe your spouse fidelity and faithfulness. It is their right. You are not doing them a favor by being faithful.

Back to Matthew 19:9 where it seemed Jesus gave an exception for divorce:

"Whoever divorces his wife except for unchastity and marries another commits adultery."

The exceptive clause, "EXCEPT FOR UNCHASTITY" is the major issue here. Simply put, unchastity is a good reason to divorce one's spouse.

You may want to ask, what constitutes 'unchastity?' We shall get to know soon.

We all remember that the New Testament was originally written in Greek bah?

The Greek word for unchastity is "PORNEIA." The Protestants argue that this Greek word "porneia" means adultery. This is why if you read the Protestant New International Version of the Bible, Matthew 19:9 is translated thus:

"I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, EXCEPT FOR MARITAL UNFAITHFULNESS, and marries another woman commits adultery."

For most Protestants, though marriage is meant to last a lifetime, but adultery justifies divorce and remarriage. This is because they interpreted the Greek word "porneia" or "unchastity" as adultery.

This is not true. And this is not Catholic teaching.

Catholic biblical scholars believe that it is wrong to translate the Greek word "porneia" as adultery. In the Catholic New American Bible, Matthew 19:9 is translated thus:

"I say to you, whoever divorces his wife (unless the marriage is unlawful) and marries another commits adultery."

Here, the exceptive clause is: "UNLAWFUL MARRIAGE."

If you read the King James Version of the Bible, the translation for PORNEIA is even more interesting. It translates Matthew 19:9 thus:

"And I say unto you, whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for FORNICATION, and shall marry another committeth adultery."

Here, the exceptive clause is Fornication. And fornication is the sin of two unmarried people having sexual intercourse. If either person is married or both are married to other people, the sin is called adultery. Following this translation, the only way that a couple could commit fornication is if they were never really in a Christian marriage to begin with.

Many recent translations of porneia in Matt 19:9 used "sexual immoralities." That still begs the question of what sexual immoralities could mean.

In all these, what really is the correct translation for the word PORNEIA? Is it the Protestants' "adultery", the King James' "fornication", or the Catholics' "Unlawful marriage"? Even if porneia is to be seen as unchastity or sexual immoralities, what constitutes unchastity?

The answer to the above questions can be better clarified using the bible. I will give you two examples: Matthew 15:19 and Mark 7:21-22.

Matthew 15:19 "For from the heart come evil thoughts, murder, ADULTERY, UNCHASTITY, theft, false witness, blasphemy."

Mark 7:21-22, "From within people, from their hearts, come evil thoughts, UNCHASTITY, theft, murder, ADULTERY, greed, malice, deceit, licentiousness, envy, blasphemy, arrogance, folly."

Pay attention to this: Adultery and unchastity are both prohibited in the texts above. If you read the Greek text, it is "porneia" that is translated as unchastity, in some bible it is translated as sexual immorality. While the Greek word "moicheia" is translated as adultery. Therefore, from these passages, we can see that porneia does not mean adultery as that would be an unnecessary repetition.

The word for adultery in Greek is 'moicheia.' If the author of Matthew 19:9 felt that Christ was talking about adultery, he wouldn't have used 'porneia' which means unchastity.

This is Matthew 19:9 in its original Greek

λέγω δὲ ὑμῖν ὅτι ὃς ἂν ἀπολύσῃ τὴν γυναῖκα αὐτοῦ μὴ ἐπὶ ΠΟΡΝΕΊΑΙ καὶ γαμήσῃ ἄλλην, ΜΟΙΧΑ͂ΤΑΙ.

I have put into capital letters two words:
πορνείᾳ (porneia) and μοιχᾶται (moichatai — verb form)

If the Bible intended that adultery is a ground for divorce, the two words would have been moicheia. And it will read thus: "I tell you that whoever divorces his wife, except for ADULTERY, and marries another woman commits ADULTERY."

But fortunately or unfortunately, that is not how it was written in the Bible.

If you read Act 15:28-29, the Apostles addressed the Gentiles prohibiting four things:

"For it has seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things: that you abstain (1) from what has been sacrificed to idols, and (2) from blood and (3) from what is strangled and (4) from unchastity. If you keep yourselves from these, you will do well. Farewell." RSV (inserted numbers, mine)

Take note of the number (4), still talking about Porneia or Unchastity. These four prohibitions above came from a deep-rooted Jewish tradition found in Leviticus 17 and 18.

If you read Leviticus through, you will discover that in chapter 18, what the Jews mean by unchastity or Porneia was explicitly explained. It was simply an incestuous marriage. Having sexual intercourse with a close relative was greatly forbidden, not to talk of marriage. For the Jews, marriage of this nature is unlawful. This was what Christ was referring to in Matthew 19:9. It is a reference to an unlawful and thus invalid marriage. It is not a reference, as Protestants view it, to a specific act committed during a legitimate "life-long marriage.

Jesus' teaching on divorce was revolutionary. Remember that it was to answer the Jews who thought that one could divorce his wife for some reasons that made Jesus to give the answer he gave. If Jesus permitted divorce, what then makes his teaching different from the one Moses taught the Jews in the OT?

If Christ's teaching on divorce was that simple, how can one explain the surprise that surrounded the disciples when they responded in the next verse?

Matthew 19: 10, "(His) disciples said to him, 'If that is the case of a man with his wife, it is better not to marry.'"

©Fr Kelvin Ugwu

Porksupplyib:

Hmm
If we go by that, no marriage will exist anymore.

Every single marriage have their own issues. And many can be helped.
Even the best of lovers who are so called 100% compactible can develop issues during marriage.

The exact same sermon I was talking about.

I was emphatic about the if they no longer 'see eye to eye'.

Who is talking about an issue free marriage or compatibility?

immortalcrown:
Church is different.

Nothing makes Church marriage different.

All kinds of marriages are exposed to troubles and spousal violence.

Christian couples no dey kill each other?

CoolAmbience:
Nothing makes Church marriage different. All kinds of marriages are exposed to troubles and spousal violence. Christian couples no dey kill each other?

Did I say there is a kind of marriage that is not exposed to troubles?

forexprophet:
YOU ARE VERY CONFUSED. May God give you or your children an abusive marriage...... Then you shall change your sermon. Bible or your church doctrine

Be it unto you according to your wishes for me.

NothingDoMe:
Why does an "Unlawful Marriage" require a divorce? Nor be to simply waka commot? There is nothing like Unlawful marriage. It is either you are married or not. Remember Jesus's Word of Knowledge to the woman at the well? "You have had 5 husbands and the man you have now is not your husband" Isnt that clear enough that cohabitation or fornication is not marriage by biblical standards?

Did I talk about unlawful marriage in my comment?

immortalcrown:
Did I say there is a kind of marriage that is not exposed to troubles?

You said so by exempting the Church.

Sirianese:
The Bible doesn't regard incest as a sin, hundreds of biblical denizens has sex and even kids with their siblings and relatives So...

Aren't the bible quotations in the comment true? Answer the question if you are right.

DeepSight:


Me? Sorry I am not a Christian, perhaps I should have mentioned.
But I have no doubt that Christ would never subscribe to anything so rigid, so abominable, so irresponsible and so disgusting as what you have just presented.

Maybe you will change your mind if you have a daughter who finds herself in that scenario, heaven forbid though.

Don't mind him,
Those guys are evil minded

Kobojunkie:
I am afraid none of this is also true. Jesus Christ never said divorce was a sin. He never changed that aspect of things as far as marriage. So to claim divorce as a sin is against God.

I'm booted out of my senses to see you try your take at Christianity knowing how divergent you are even on secular issues.

I won't make the mistake of joining words with you. Bye Ms heretic weirdo.

I am not a priest but I can answer your questions.

STYCNig:

1. You claim incest was the only reason for divorce... how about Abraham who got married to his own Sister, Sarah? Jocob too had same marriage among others - can you put more light to it in retrospect of incest, the only reason for divorce.

The Bible recorded many sins committed by many people. The same Bible condemns those sins. Leviticus 18:9 condemns what you said about Abraham. That the Bible gives an account of bad things people did does not mean the Bible supports those bad things. Would you say that murder is not a sin since some people committed murder in the Bible?

2. What's the difference between seperation and divorce?

Separation in this context is when a man and a woman live apart while still being recognised as a couple. It is done to possibly calm warring couple, not to end the marriage. Divorce means to end the marriage.

3. It sounds to me, the reason Catholic Priest are not permitted to marry could be coz they will be no room for divorce even at evidence of repeated cheating, infidelity or its affiliate - I may be wrong, put me right, please.

"Theologically, the church desires to imitate the life of Jesus with regard to chastity and the sacrifice of married life for the "sake of the Kingdom" (Luke 18:28–30, Matthew 19:27–30; Mark 10:20–21), and to follow the example of Jesus Christ in being "married" to the church, viewed by Catholicism and many Christian traditions as the "Bride of Christ"."

4. Practically as a priest, have you ever had marital cases of continous infidelity by couples, which either of them could not bear the insult and disrespect attached to it... what was your advised to the victim ?

Priests encounter such cases and do many things to solve the problems but never suggest divorce unless incest is part of the problems.

5. Could it be said that, since incest is the only grounds for divorce, to die in marriage is far better and rewarding than divorce?

Yes.

6. Contextually, have you ever seen divorce as an object of discipline, correction? If divorce is a sin and its not permitted via any reason whatsoever except incest, how would you discipline a woman who continuously defile the marriage bed?

Divorce is not an object of discipline in marriage. Discipline means an attempt to make someone a better person without disowning the person. Countries jail their citizens as a discipline but do not disown the citizens. Parents punish their children as discipline but do not disown the children. Disowning your child is beyond discipline, it means giving up on your parental duty. So, divorce is not discipline in marriage.

7. According to your script, who should execute divorce? The man or the woman? Whom is the bible referring to as the one committing this incest

The man should go for divorce if the woman is guilty of incest. The woman should go for divorce is the man is guilty of incest.

Fulgur:
It is always dangerous when canal wisdom -- which you employ -- tries to dabble into spiritual matters.

If anything can truncate a marriage, adultery is at the very top. It is the 2nd worst sin after murder. And if incest or fornication which was committed before marriage can make the marriage null how much more would adultery under an existing marriage nullifies it?

You talk foolishly as inspired by the devil

So, you sleeping with another man's wife is worse than you sleeping with your daughter or your mother?

VULCAN:
Let me ask a question that I know the answer.

Did you watch the video?

We know you didn't.

So what is the basis of this long epistle.

What in the movie contradicts my comment?

CoolAmbience:
You said so by exempting the Church.

Explain how my comment on church wedding is a claim that church marriage cannot be troubled. Otherwise, you are a false accuser.

immortalcrown:
So, you sleeping with another man's wife is worse than you sleeping with your daughter or your mother?

This is your take on Matthew 19:9?

Your counterparts several centuries ago where all impaled publicly for heresy. You're only alive today with your stupidity because man has evolved.

Fulgur:
This is your take on Matthew 19:9? Your counterparts several centuries ago where all impaled publicly for heresy. You're only alive today with your stupidity because man has evolved.

You didn't answer my question.

Secondly the article already explains the verse you quoted.

axglide:
Isn’t this the video where he said divorce is not a sin? And he used Kenneth Copeland marrying 3 times to justify what he’s saying? He also used the Meyer’s too?

Sir Olumide, the Word of God is our standard not men’s experiences.

Sorry about the abuse you had to go through thou.

The word that was given to you or where? David, Abraham, Solomon, had how many wife’s? Paul who said one wife to a man was ever married? Paul also speak according to his own thinking not as lead by the Holy Spirit. Most of you are a fan of a religion because you are born into it. If you father were to be an imam, you would have been an Alfa too, so stop all this and focus on your holy life. You mean he should have stayed and be beaten to death? Even God will judge him for been a fool. As for the person saying avoid church marriage. Well, if you read your Bible very well, there was no church marriage anywhere in it. The Bible recognize traditional marriage and not church marriage.

immortalcrown:
You didn't answer my question.

Secondly the article already explains the verse you quoted.

Your question was only a pointer to the shallowness of your understanding and a proof of your spiritual hollowness.

What article, authored by you --- a religious-scholar wannabe who has a lot of idle time at hand to dabble into the depth of the truth he knows absolutely nothing about.

You neither have the knowledge nor calling nor experience to even make a presence at teaching in any religious setting. Pack those your heretic articles and be gone to hell where Satan awaits you with his crown.

immortalcrown:
Explain how my comment on church wedding is a claim that church marriage cannot be troubled. Otherwise, you are a false accuser.

So, why isolate the Church?

That is enough evidence.

Fulgur:


Your question was only a pointer to the shallowness of your understanding and a proof of your spiritual hollowness.

What article, authored by you --- a religious-scholar wannabe who has a lot of idle time at hand to dabble into the depth of the truth he knows absolutely nothing about.

You neither have the knowledge nor calling nor experience to even make a presence at teaching in any religious setting. Pack those your heretic articles and be gone to hell where Satan awaits you with his crown.

You said that adultery is the second-highest sin after murder. I ask you if adultery is worse than incest. Answer my question when you are ready for the conversation.

CoolAmbience:
So, why isolate the Church? That is enough evidence

What do you mean by isolation?

immortalcrown:
You said that adultery is the second-highest sin after murder. I ask you if adultery is worse than incest. Answer my question when you are ready for the conversation.

I don't conversate with the prince of darkness who's out to destroy more souls by making light of the cardinal sin of adultery. I won't even be bothered to quote scriptures with your kind.

I'll treat you like the Satanic ill-trained apprentice that you are.

Fulgur:
I don't conversate with the prince of darkness who's out to destroy more souls by making light of the cardinal sin of adultery. I won't even be bothered to quote scriptures with your kind. I'll treat you like the Satanic ill-trained apprentice that you are.

Your refusal to defend your claim shows you are the prince of darkness here. In fact, you are already a kind of darkness by being a false accuser here because no part of my comment trivializes adultery.

immortalcrown:
Your refusal to defend your claim shows you are the prince of darkness here. In fact, you are already a kind of darkness by being a false accuser here because no part of my comment trivializes adultery.

You're cognitively challenged obviously! If adultery is not a ground for divorce as claimed by you, what else do we need to know that you're Satan's boy?

Satan did a poor job recruiting a dweeb like yourself who can't even form a logical straightline in an argument.

Fulgur:


You're cognitively challenged obviously! If adultery is not a ground for divorce as claimed by you, what else do we need to know that you're Satan's boy?

Satan did a poor job recruiting a dweeb like yourself who can't even form a logical straightline in an argument.

Self description.

BrighterSyde:


Read your bible well. Adultery is also grounds for a divorce. Also if your partner wants a divorce you are allowed to grant him or her that request.

At least, educate the members with biblical reference to support your position.

Basicend:


Lol. . You can't understand what am saying sir. . . I don't want to reveal things in public. If you have a ministry and it's a very forceful one against the kingdom of darkness. . You will understand what communion means.

Let's leave it there.

I really understand you. The truth always receive stiff opposition. In my friend's words, being a Christian is really a tough experience and journey.

Fulgur:
∆ I'm booted out of my senses to see you try your take at Christianity knowing how divergent you are even on secular issues.
I won't make the mistake of joining words with you. Bye Ms heretic weirdo

Take on Christianity? For Pete's sake, Jesus Christ disavowed religious leaders and even religion beginning with the one that existed during His time. Christianity which is modelled after Judaism is equally of the antichrist explaining why most of what you lot believe conflict with that decreed by Jesus Christ as far as His own Kingdom.