swezenberg:

^^^^^^^^^^^ do you trust this government that much? With all the lies about Bokoharam, to constant power etc

My friend, you can't just wake up and be skeptical over everything. It is bad for the health. The FOI bill is there for you to get info. Use it. The only people who have tried to say there is no subsidy are politicians and public commentators seeking relevance. Even labor and Journalists agree that there is subsidy. And they also agree that the cost is high. Even the ACN governors who are sopposed to be opposition, agreed there is subsidy. Dont you think if what the government says is a lie, they are in a better position to know? I will not come here with a smile on my face and say remove subsidy. It is a hard decision and one that will bring some pain, but the bigger picture and my point is, we are living on welfare in Nigeria and it is the wrong way to run government. The military started all this mess and it must stop someday. I don't envy GEJ. He is the dirty Harry that has to do all the dirty cleanups and it aint a pleasant job to do.

dmainboss,

I love your argument but if you were to be fair on the common man would you have taken this step without considering any step to cushion in the effect of this policy on the man that is still struggling with the present minimum wage in the country.

Just put yourself in their picture.

swezenberg:

dmainboss,

I love your argument but if you were to be fair on the common man would you have taken this step without considering any step to cushion in the effect of this policy on the man that is still struggling with the present minimum wage in the country.

Just put yourself in their picture.

Totally agree with you that there should be cushions and we must continue to demand that. But i beg to disagree that labor is the common man. I hate political cliches and that is one that has been peddled for too long. labor is not Nigeria. Their population is very small. Making policies in Nigeria along the lines of what labor wants is one of the things that have stunted our progress. How can you make major laws for a country of 160million people based on the demands of less than 2 million people? In fact labor is not even up to a million.

dmainboss:

My friend, you can't just wake up and be skeptical over everything. It is bad for the health. The FOI bill is there for you to get info. Use it. The only people who have tried to say there is no subsidy are politicians and public commentators seeking relevance. Even labor and Journalists agree that there is subsidy. And they also agree that the cost is high. Even the ACN governors who are sopposed to be opposition, agreed there is subsidy. Dont you think if what the government says is a lie, they are in a better position to know? I will not come here with a smile on my face and say remove subsidy. It is a hard decision and one that will bring some pain, but the bigger picture and my point is, we are living on welfare in Nigeria and it is the wrong way to run government. The military started all this mess and it must stop someday. I don't envy GEJ. He is the dirty Harry that has to do all the dirty cleanups and it aint a pleasant job to do.

What you need to know is that you can't dine with the devils and say you are clean. Jonathan is in a very wrong party for me to expect anything good from him. Nothing good can come out of PDP. It is a fact you need to understand. I posted on his candidacy before the election and am glad his supporters are seeing the result of their flaws.

May the Lord keep us till 2013 and we'll both come around here to evaluate this step taken by the GEJ govt

It continues to boggle my mind that there are still quite a few nigeirans on this forum who continue to support  this subsidy removal.  Does it mean that these people are not affected by the high unemployment, high cost of living,substandard services, poor infrastructure etc

Even in countries like Greece and Ireland where people enjoy a standard of living that is beyond the reach of  most nigerians, the people of these countries still came out en masse on the streets to challenge their govts  plan to implement austerity measures.

Maybe its still too early to tell what the outcome of this subsidy removal will be in nigeria

I hear say Kano get 40 LGs yet contribute nothing to Nigeria's IGR
6 small States has been sustaining the whole Nigeria with Oil and Gas

All these subsidy wont help at all. Cos Government depends on the natural resources of 6 States to feed the whole nation.

Imagine, just imagine/assume that the Oil/Gas run out, hahahahahahaahah,

I suggest 100% resource control NOW, with 17% tax paid to Abuja (Kano with 40 LGs will make diamond out of that desert sand by fire by force)
Senate and National Assembly (Lower House) should be combined and we do not even need 2 houses, we know they are all useless, so we can slash government expenses in half.  Infact if thats done subsidy can be handled.

dmainboss:

Totally agree with you that there should be cushions and we must continue to demand that. But i beg to disagree that labor is the common man. I hate political cliches and that is one that has been peddled for too long. labor is not Nigeria. Their population is very small. Making policies in Nigeria along the lines of what labor wants is one of the things that have stunted our progress. How can you make major laws for a country of 160million people based on the demands of less than 2 million people? In fact labor is not even up to a million.

But how can you consider labour to be less than 2 million even if they were two million which we both know is not true, who caters for the aged, the infants and the rest of the populace. Is it not the same lame labour force.

That aside. I did not even mention labour in the context of my post. I reflected on the common man which encompasses the market women, ,men, students, artisans, public servants and the rest that constitute two-third of the entire population.

Finally, reason and common sense is coming back to our government that has for years lacked focus.

Good move!

swezenberg:

What you need to know is that you can't dine with the devils and say you are clean. Jonathan is in a very wrong party for me to expect anything good from him. Nothing good can come out of PDP. It is a fact you need to understand. I posted on his candidacy before the election and am glad his supporters are seeing the result of their flaws.

May the Lord keep us till 2013 and we'll both come around here to evaluate this step taken by the GEJ govt

Points like these will always have us disagree. I dont like it when you turn the Nigerian problem into party affairs. It is wrong. I am currently in Edo state for the holidays and here, most former members of the PDP have decamped to the ACN. Does that mean they are now righteous because they have left the PDP? It is wrong when some of you make Nigerian problem a PDP problem. Nigeria has been going down long before PDP was founded. The PDP is the ruling party so you find a lot of interest there. If ACN or CPC become the ruling party today, just like in Edo state, all the politicians will decamp there. So will you then start to fight ACN or CPC? The same ACN choose Atiku who was a known crook as their flag bearer in 2007 just to see if they can wrest power. So please let us address the root problem instead of making partisan statements. Some of the best governors in the country today are from the same PDP. So when you say nothing good can come out of PDP, you are so wrong. Akpabio, Amaechi and Chime are examples of PDP governors doing great. The issues we should always address are bad politicians and bad and greedy mindsets of our leaders, not parties.

cap28:

It continues to boggle my mind that there are still quite a few nigeirans on this forum who continue to support  this subsidy removal.  Does it mean that these people are not affected by the high unemployment, high cost of living,substandard services, poor infrastructure etc

Even in countries like Greece and Ireland where people enjoy a standard of living that is beyond the reach of  most nigerians, the people of these countries still came out en masse on the streets to challenge their govts  plan to implement austerity measures.

Maybe its still too early to tell what the outcome of this subsidy removal will be in nigeria  

Well I am surprised that people like you come here post things like these. I have travelled many countries and Nigeria has one of the lowest cost of living. In these countries you mention, you have as high as 45 percent tax. In Nigeria,  most people pay 0 tax. fact. Nobody bothers you in Nigeria. fact. The major things we suffer in Nigeria are infrastructures like power and roads. As for cots of living, we do not have higher cost of living than all these countries you mention. My friends in UK are living from hand to mouth. They cant hardly buy anything for themselves. We go from here to UK and take them out.

I have learnt that the view of the general public is mostly wrong and based on sentiment. I try to be more objective on public issues.

But imagine  $7billion dollars anually on subsidy, no wonder we keep borrowing.
it may take some time but competition will bring prices down.

The leaders we have in this country are just pathetic greedy fools who are insensitive to the cry and sufferings of Nigerians, they have misplaced their sense of reasoning and are terribly lacking in innovative ideas on how to run this Nation. Fuel subsidy, when last was a new refinery built in Nigeria When the world was busy evolving, our leaders were busy revolving Nigeria for more than 51 years now.

Who are those being paid money for fuel they did not import, who are they? Can't the CEO of this country mention their names, instead he is busy giving tom dick and harry national awards. People are being killed by BH daily and GEJ is comfortable in his villa? This is absolute insanity to think that removing subsidy (if any) will solve the problem of this country which is majorly corruption, Corruption has killed this nation and it is not perpetrated by ghost, they are humans with face. The monk called GEJ is just something I cannot describe, this is pathetic, OMG.

Yes there will be hardship initially, but lets face it.

All the importers have licenses for private refinery, but refuse to operate them because they collect subsidy money. NNPC along cannot refine enough fuel to run the country.
Within 12 months, only those that refine locally will be in business as they will have lower cost. the new refinaries will create jobs for many too.

Maybe we should give this 1 yr and see how it pans out.

PS. I support the removal but, NNPC refineries should have been taken to a higher level of production first.

babestella:

The leaders we have in this country are just pathetic greedy fools who are insensitive to the cry and sufferings of Nigerians, they have misplaced their sense of reasoning and are terribly lacking in innovative ideas on how to run this Nation. Fuel subsidy, when last was a new refinery built in Nigeria When the world was busy evolving, our leaders were busy revolving Nigeria for more than 51 years now.

Who are those being paid money for fuel they did not import, who are they? Can't the CEO of this country mention their names, instead he is busy giving tom Joystick and harry national awards. People are being killed by BH daily and GEJ is comfortable in his villa? This is absolute insanity to think that removing subsidy (if any) will solve the problem of this country which is majorly corruption, Corruption has killed this nation and it is not perpetrated by ghost, they are humans with face. The monk called GEJ is just something I cannot describe, this is pathetic,  OMG.

Corruption is not the problem of Nigeria. Our almost irreparable ethno/cultural differences is the biggest problem of Nigeria. It is the cause of corruption. We need true federalism or outright disintegration

Also, noone told you they are paying money for fuel they didnt import. The importers are doing a legitimate business. Those talking about naming them or arresting them are funny. They are doing legitimate business. The problem is that the Nigerian situation has created loopholes for them to benefit unfairly. Government simply wants to block those loopholes

The subsidy on diesel was removed long ego and there was little protest from civil right groups, why are they waiting for the removal of subsidy on fuel before they will protest or are producers that use diesel not Nigerians? Am happy that atleast one loophole which currupt elements use to loot has been blocked, it will create a larger hole in my pocket but will make me think of better ways to urgment my sources of income; enterprenuership to the rescue.

Ur gf leaves U̶̲̥̅̊ 4 a petrol attendant#blame gej# ur bf turns of d ac of his car#blame gej# bicycle importation increases#blame gej#

This country is seriously heading for the rocks and even the so called leaders are grossly Oblivious of dis, they decided to perfect the design of hardship for a common man all at once starting from 2011, lekki expressway toll (this is sad and extremely painful). Now to really translate this fuel subsidy issue (which at this rate I don't think our so-called leaders fully explored and digested the implication on a common nigerian; infact even an averge nigerian)
*scenerios*(assumptions)
*A common nigerian like me who spends 250 from jakande ajah to yaba would now have to pay about 500 I.e times 2, guess y cause bus driver would collect 200 for what he used to for 100 for; you cannot blame him becos ,
*A bus driver Who used to buy fuel let's say 20ltrs for 1300 (20*65 =1300) would now buy the same amount of fuel for 2860 (@143) or even 2760 (@138) . Who would blame the guy for charging times 2 of the fare, the guy has to buy fuel doesn't he,
*dont even let me get started on bike fare, which is on the high already o, at the end of  †ђε  day those riders might even have to change business line b4 lagos state even thinks of facing them out, dey would humbly bow out of the trade and most likely into the wonderful vices that have by God's intervention died down over  †ђε  last couple of yrs (armed robbery, yahoo yahoo, mecenaries, car jackers, ritual to mention but a few)
This country is in for the roughest ride of her life, unfortunately we are the grass
MAY GOD ALMIGHTY HELP us dis time around!!!!!
Nigerian leaders pls and plsss there is a threshold you shouldn't push us to; don't make us animals, cos the "hungry ones" fights more viciously than the well fed

dmainboss:

In your anger, which I fully understand, you have made a few missteps. 3rd mainland bridge was a project spanning more than 9 years. It was started long before Babangida's time. If Jonathan wanted to loot money, he would have simply stayed with fuel subsidy. It is easier to connive with fuel importers to steal money than to let it remain in the Nigerian government system, not to talk of all the pressures the whole episode has put him thru. He has actually made a much more difficult decision

Pally, don't include yarning falsehoods as part of your arguments. At the bolded part, IBB started Third Mainland Bridge. He conceived it, nurtured it and commissioned it.

Jonathan wants to loot more money! What has not been accounted for in all this subsidy imbroglio is this: Where does the money earned from selling the 350,000 barrels of crude oil kept? Where is the account of that money?
Also, what happens to the PMS refined from the 50,000 barrels of crude that the local refineries manage to refine in-country?

There aint no subsidy, and the removal of fuel subsidy is just another way of getting more money available into the pockets of the selected few.

Let me do a simple analysis for us all

Total cost of imported PMS = Landing cost + Depot Cost + Bridging Cost =   125  +  x   +  x    = 150 (hypothetical final figure from govt circles)
Cost of PMS at the Pump = 65
                       Subsidy = 150 – 65 = 85

Subsidy can only exist if the money earned from selling the 350,000 barrels of oil per day is not enough to offset this N85 from each litre of PMS sold in Nigeria. Let me itemise with a little analogy
It is common knowledge that there is 158 litres of PMS in a barrel of crude oil, therefore for simplicity I would use this for the analysis.

                                                   If Govt imports 15,800,000 ltrs of PMS, subsidy on it          =    15,800,000 * 85 = 1,343,000,000.00
                To get the equivalent of the 15.8M ltrs of oil, govt would need to export (15.8M/158) =  94,048 barrels of crude oil
Govt earnings from 94,048 crude export = 94,048 * $100 (cost of crude) * N150 (exchange rate) =  1,410,720,000.00

So from the above Govt earnings – Subsidy   ==>  (1,410,720,000 – 1,343,000,000 ) = 67,720,000
This implies that from every 15.8M litres of PMS imported into this country, even at the selling price of N65, the FGN still makes a profit of 67M (Sixty-Seven Million naira), so my fellow Nigerians, WHERE IS THE SUBSIDY

Now some may take an erroneous view that I should be using the full N150 to calculate the cost of the 15.8M imported, however, once you realise that the N65 sell price is already an earnings/income to the government, then what we need to account for is the differential in income, which is the subsidy.

Wait a minute, why should the government remove subsidy only on PMS
How will that help those interested in building refineries?

@Akainzo
Then you get the petroleum free - from your calculation after you excluded the cost of the  product. Check your calculation again. Are you insinuating there hasn't been any subsidy of fuel in Nigeria? Come on!

Chei! See mathematicians!!! Hmmm. . . Gongo aso no be small. #NoComment!

@Akinzo,

you are a funny chap. So of the 160 million Nigerians including labor, you are the only one that saw that "revelation " eh? Funny chap. So if it is that simple, why didn't labor see it like you just did and stand by that? Even labor and all the opposition governors didn't disagree that there is subsidy. They are only making arguments in the areas of corruption and assurances for cushioning the effects of subsidy removal. Nigerians self and their self deceit and i too know attitude!

Nigerians should wake up and face reality, your Nigeria can no longer support fuel subsidy for ALL her citizens. We need stop behaving like a first son, who once upon a time got ice cream whenever he demands for one. But, as his parents had more children and family purse became leaner, his parents could no longer afford ice cream for all their children. The first son rather than show understanding, threatens fire and brimstone.

Decades of inept, bad and visionless leadership which didn’t start during GEJ's tenure has resulted in a comatose entity called ‘Nigeria’ and please spare me, GEJ is not the cause of all our problems as a lot of people have been brainwashed to believe! This population can no longer be supported with oil from the Niger Delta which is a non renewable resource. Look at the UAE, in addition to  revenue generated from crude oil, they have invested in Dubai and made it a global tourist destination hence, creating another source of sustainable income in case, the oil runs out!

For other nations, their greatest resource is their population but ours is our greatest undoing. Whether ACN, PDP or CPC they would still have removed subsidy. What we need to focus on now is to ensure that money realised from this removal is invested in the development of social amenities. One question for the people raving, ranting and asking for GEJ's head-how many  social  and developmental amenities has the past governments put in place to make life comfortable for the common man ?All the structures that we have on ground were constructed between 20-30 years ago! FOOD FOR THOUGHT!

God bless Nigeria!

We shall sit down and watch like we always do and see where this will take us to. Those that are comfortable do not care about the discomforted. what a sinful nation!

My sister it is not everybody in Lekki that is sad about the toll fee. Some are happy and even want more toll gates to flush out the less privilege in their midst. This is how we are.

When a government means well she will consider the effect of her decision on the entire populace especially that of the majority that brought her into power. That is why you see prime ministers in some countries resigning over what we call trivial issues and why some country will go on strike over an increase in fuel by 2 pence.

@ Akainzo,

There are some wrongful assumptions you made.

(1) You assumed that the cost of exploration and production is zero
(2) You assumed that the companies that explored, drilled, serviced, produced the petroleum run a charity, hence do not declare profit.
(3) Nigeria has an unlimited quota hence could increase the volume of her petroleum export to offset the subsidy

etc

Let's face the fact economically speaking the Govt is right, the other way round due to the hardship Nigerians will go true for the time being they will not understand, it's a hard sale.

Our govt is very incensitive, thouth they are still consulting

Obiagu1:

@ Akainzo,

There are some wrongful assumptions you made.

(1) You assumed that the cost of exploration and production is zero
(2) You assumed that the companies that explored, drilled, serviced, produced the petroleum run a charity, hence do not declare profit.
(3) Nigeria has an unlimited quota hence could increase the volume of her petroleum export to offset the subsidy

etc

@ Obiagu1
God bless you for showing Akainzo the 'Mathematican' the light.

Shakes head in dismay!

dmainboss:

Well I am surprised that people like you come here post things like these. I have travelled many countries and Nigeria has one of the lowest cost of living. In these countries you mention, you have as high as 45 percent tax. In Nigeria,  most people pay 0 tax. fact. Nobody bothers you in Nigeria. fact. The major things we suffer in Nigeria are infrastructures like power and roads. As for cots of living, we do not have higher cost of living than all these countries you mention. My friends in UK are living from hand to mouth. They cant hardly buy anything for themselves. We go from here to UK and take them out.

i dont know why you are suprised why "people like me come here to post " am i not a nigerian? do i not have the right to post my opinions on here?

You claim nigerians enjoy low cost of living -how come food prices are so high? how come the average nigerian can not afford to live in a decent accommodation and is forced to live in places with untarred roads, overflowing open gutters stinking of raw sewage?

how come the average nigerian can barely make ends meet on the meagre salaries that they earn, if cost of living was as low as you claim how come the majority of nigerians livign abroad are supporting their relatives back home?

Tax may be as high as 40% in some european countries but at least the money is used to provide universal healthcare, free education, clean and tarred roads, underground sewage systems, responsive emergency services like the police, fire services and ambulance services.  In nigeria we all know where your taxes go - straight into the pockets of those thieves you call leaders thats why your roads are death traps, your healthcare is non existent your educational services are substandard and your police services are glorified armed robbers.  Wouldnt you rather pay a lot of tax and live in a clean and secure environment?  Wouldnt you prefer to be able to send your children to schools where they actually graduate with the ability to read and write?

the govt doesnt bother with you because they are too busy looting the national treasury, this is why you are all left to your own devices - the thing you fail to understand is that your govt should be serving you- you should be holding them to account not allowing them to get away with grand theft.
Governments have a responsibility to provide for their citizenry - nigerians are the only people who demand nothing from their govts thats why they continue to abuse and exploit you. As you can see they are about to shaft you once again by hiking up petrol prices under the pretext that they intend touse the money generated to provide infrastructures - if you beleive that this govt of criminals have any intention of doing anything constructive for the nigerian populace then you must really be naive.  
Understand this - THEY DONT GIVE A DAMN ABOUT YOU- THEY DONT CARE WHETHER THE ENTIRE POPULATION OF NIGERIA DROPS DEAD - ALL THEY ARE CONCERNED ABOUT IS FREEING UP THIS EXCESS MONEY TO FINANCE THEIR ALREADY LAVISH LIFESTYLES.

Here in the UK the average person can afford to take care of their family without having to engage in criminal activities, their salaries are sufficient to put food on the table and pay for their electricity and gas bills.  Those who can not afford to do so ie the unemployed, pensioners, disabled etc are given assistance by the govt and are not abandoned and left to rot as is the case in nigeria, the fact that you come to the UK and take your friends out does not mean you are better off than them - unless you are going to tell me taht you also pay their mortgage/house rent and bills?

I find it funny that you can say your friends in the UK live from hand to mouth when over 70% of the nigerian population live on less than the equivalent of $1 a day.

The removal of fuel subsidy by
FG is one of the best things to
ever happen to this country. Up
Jonathan, Ngozi, Diezani, Sanusi and co.

I love Okonjo Iweala. The first assignment I gave her here on NL was to remove the wasteful subsidy. . . And she has nailed it!

hahahaha, fresh mess is soon going to be replaced with the real fresh air. No matter what you agents of GEJ are saying, people are already feeling the pains and they are angry. This act of cowardice by a government not even listening to the people or imforming them of its plans is alarming. Nigerians must stand up against this rubbish once and for all. All the Nigerian government knows how to do is steal. They are not even smart enough to cut the over bloated salaries. So while they have adjusted their own salaries for this change, Nigerians will suffer while they still get petrol and other basic services for free at the expense of every Nigerian. This is ridiculous.

[table]Corruption is not the problem of Nigeria. Our almost irreparable ethno/cultural differences is the biggest problem of Nigeria. It is the cause of corruption. We need true federalism or outright disintegration

Also, noone told you they are paying money for fuel they didnt import. The importers are doing a legitimate business. Those talking about naming them or arresting them are funny. They are doing legitimate business. The problem is that the Nigerian situation has created loopholes for them to benefit unfairly. Government simply wants to block those loopholes[/table]

@mainboss

I agree that those who are importing fuel are doing their legitimate business. So who are the people who have leveraged on the loopholes to make money of the govt? Does the govt want to tell us they don't know them. Because I see a scenario where money paid to these people are far more than what the legitimate importers (so to speak) as getting as subsidy.

Now one question, the govt have refused to publish the details of what it cost to import fuel in into this country. I mean the landing cost of PMS at Apapa port, the clearing (duties payable) storage (tank farm fees) and other sundry charges from the customs.

If this can be done, then Nigerians can clearly do the maths and be able to understand what subsidy is all about, it is simple.

Finally, this is a process which would have been done in stages if they are bent on suffering Nigerians. Increasing pump price by over 100% is not done in any economy. The price of essential service and products will also increase in the same percentage. Please let our leaders be reasonable when they decide the destiny of this nation.