nwando:

babs can you tell us what happened to the lost Torah.

lafile:

He doesn't. He hasn't been told yet. Google hasn't brought up the answer. Take your pick.

He's not after the "mystery" of any LOST Torah or Injil. Rather, he has fomented the typical Islamic trademark of arguing away from the "LOST" Torah and Injil in order to discredit the available ones where he has been told that Muhammad cannot be dribbled into them!

If you allow them dribble Muhammad through the backdoor into the available Torah and Injil, then they will typically claim that those documents are "inspired" by Allah. The moment you show them their FRAUD that Muhammad is not in any verse of the Bible, then they deny everything in the same Allah's "inspired" Torah and Injil and then claim it as a "mystery" for the LOST ones!

Abeg make una leave these blabbing machines to keep entertaining us with their HOGWASH!!

Zakir Naik is still researching the best response to the "mystery" of allah's lost torah and injil.

As soon as he is done be sure to expect a deluge of "copy and paste" responses from allah's misguided foot soldiers.

@Davidylan: Is your statement making any sense to you? First, Muhammad came and said to you that you have corrupted the words of God! Then you can't disprove this statement. Except that you support his statement, by not been able to agree to a single 'standard Bible.' The real issue is to actually agree that Muhammad said he received revelation that your Bible, both old and new testaments are not in original form any longer. He further said that your Bible is never going to be one final copy, that you can all agree upon. The catholichas their and it is very different from the protestants.

How do we prove this man wrong, get we are asking his adherents to give the Bible that is lost? The answer is clear. The one group which should be lookig for the Bible is not the followers of Muhammad. It should be the christians.

The protestants claim to have the true Bible, yet they copied and pasted from the mother catholic, who the protestants call them cultists! Wonders will never to exist.

@ olabowale, like other muslims you have a severe allergy to the truth.

Was it not allah who claimed to have sent down and confirmed the torah and injil? WHERE THEN IS THIS TORAH AND INJIL?

Mohammed claimed that the bible was corrupted, does that not indicate that at some point there must have been an original bible that mohammed probably saw? WHERE IS THIS ORIGINAL BIBLE?
Does it make sense to accuse someone of forgery when you cannot produce the original?

Why shld the buirden of proof lie with christians? We have never complained of having corrputed bibles, muslims cry loudly about corrupt bibles and YET cannot bring out the one allah keeps making noise about. did allah lose it or was he lying?

I wont bother to humor u with a response as regarding several versions of the bible. Shakespeare's works are published in several languages and by diff publishers, does that make his works corrupt?

Islam has always been on a collision course with reason.

@olabowale,

olabowale:

@Davidylan: Is your statement making any sense to you? First, Muhammad came and said to you that you have corrupted the words of God! Then you can't disprove this statement. Except that you support his statement, by not been able to agree to a single 'standard Bible.'

Muhammad "came and said" so many things that are incoherent, inconsistent, self-contradictory, and have been proven several times are merely his own opinions which he devised as "revelations" from Allah. Please ask a few and we shall remind you of how many we have served already and Muslims keep ducking from them.

olabowale:

The real issue is to actually agree that Muhammad said he received revelation that your Bible, both old and new testaments are not in original form any longer. He further said that your Bible is never going to be one final copy, that you can all agree upon. The catholichas their and it is very different from the protestants.

I feel very sorry for the sort of idea you have expressed. For one huge thing: you have failed here to look at the SOURCE of the same Bible that Muhammad derided! Muhammad sometimes claimed that he believed in the Torah and Injil - but when the Jews used to recite them in his day, Muhammad told his companions to NOT believe them, while claiming that they believe them!!

With such kinds of double standards and doublespeak, who is going to actually trust Muhammad?

olabowale:

How do we prove this man wrong, get we are asking his adherents to give the Bible that is lost? The answer is clear. The one group which should be lookig for the Bible is not the followers of Muhammad. It should be the christians.

Don't worry yourself - Muhammad has been proven wrong times without number! That is why Muslims are so frantically looking for the LOST Injil and Torah - something whcih Muhammad was never able to clearly enunciate for Muslims.

olabowale:

The protestants claim to have the true Bible, yet they copied and pasted from the mother catholic, who the protestants call them cultists! Wonders will never to exist.

Catholicism does not define Biblical Christianity - and we all have seen how the Popes and Bishops of the RCC themselves have expressed that they do not believe in the same Bible that they claim to have canonized! If others have read, studied and believed the Bible, where does that leave Catholicism?

In just the same way, we are waiting for Muslims to let us know when their divided sects (over 70 of them) will drop their divisive tendencies and show that they actually have one same exact tenet in Islam. The Sufists are derided by the Shiites and the Sunnis; not to talk about the Wahabis who are waiting in the wings to finish them all off!

Pligrim.1: (1) Muhammad (as) said the christian Bible is corrupted already. Proof it wrong! Lets get a single Bible out that the whole christianity will agree upon! You will never be able to do it. In a million years! Ask the support of all that you can.

Others will come after (1) is attended to.

olabowale:

Pligrim.1: (1) Muhammad (as) said the christian Bible is corrupted already. Proof it wrong! Lets get a single Bible out that the whole christianity will agree upon! You will never be able to do it. In a million years! Ask the support of all that you can.

Others will come after (1) is attended to.

Muslims are adept at reverse logic and aversion to rational reasoning. Mohammed said the christian bible is corrupt and we are just meant to swallow it hook, line and sinker without questioning the rational behind that verbose claim? Did mohammed peradventure have a copy of the "original, uncorrupted" bible?

How do you identify a fake without an original to compare it with?

The onus then lies on mohammed - if indeed the bible is corrupt, where then is the original torah and injil allah claimed to have sent down and confirmed?

Mohammad seemed to me to be more intelligent than Allah, cos he could manipulate his god (Allah) to gi ve him revelations to suite his (Mohammad's) many situations of confusion . Like Dave said, the burden is on Mohammad to srve us with the original if he claimed what we have now is fake. shikena!

@Davidylan: To answer your question about about fake versus original; when you have so many fakes, you should ask where is the original? If you claim that they are all originals, then how are they different from one another?

I have a standing offer for you david: If I show you two Bibles, from the same publishers, one printed after the other. But they are not exactly alike in content,say one has at least a verse which the other does not have, will you then leave christianity, with your love ones? I only ask you for a truthful commitment here. And then, you at least study islam with open mind? Am not even demanding that you become a muslim, because only God makes muslims. Can I have your commitment, if you are truthful?

olabowale:

@Davidylan: To answer your question about about fake versus original; when you have so many fakes, you should ask where is the original? If you claim that they are all originals, then how are they different from one another?

You need to have seen a genuine N5 note before you complain of a fake note. Where was the injil and torah allah sent down and confirmed . . . maybe that is the original one. Bring it and let us see. All these merry go round, trying to avoid that question wont help u.

olabowale:

I have a standing offer for you david: If I show you two Bibles, from the same publishers, one printed after the other. But they are not exactly alike in content,say one has at least a verse which the other does not have, will you then leave christianity, with your love ones? I only ask you for a truthful commitment here. And then, you at least study islam with open mind? Am not even demanding that you become a muslim, because only God makes muslims. Can I have your commitment, if you are truthful?

Oya show me the two verses.

@pilgrims, ricadelide, Nwando and others.


This is for those that have been denying the fact that the bible in existence has been tampered with.

There existed many different Bibles during the time of the Roman Emperor, Constantine, which were widely believed in by different Christian sects in the year 312. In other words, during the first 3 centuries of "Christianity" (300 years), many different canons with 100s of books/gospels combined existed! That is a lot of canons, a lot of books/gospels, and a lot of time (300 years) of different Christian religions existed. Also, Constantine's own "unified canon or bible" got lost and only small portions of it were found! So what we have today from "Bible(s)" are not even Constantine's books.

If you are saying the bible is complete and not corrupted, why these verses are not in some bibles apart from KJV.


a.Mathew 17 v 21
(b) mark 11 v 26
(c) acts 8 v 37 (d)
Mathew 17 v 21
(e) Mathew 21 v 44
(f) Mathew 23 v 14 etc

I heard that the verses are omitted in the original manuscript and if so, please where did KJV got its own from?

I also stumbled on this link, you go there and have a look

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-46848.32.html


Have a lovely day

Combatant is merely following the islamic script . . . the topic clearly seeks to find allah's alleged torah and injil that he claimed to have sent down and confirmed . . . muslims are more interested in ferreting out alleged "missing verses" in the bible.

Do these people suffer a disconnect witih reason?

the allegedly missing verses are duly included in the footnotes of every single bible . . .

@David

I have followed your posts and found that rather than provide answers or attend to issues, you prefer going the other way round. I have asked you a very straight forward questions and all you did was waste your time, energy etc in beating about the bush. Let me quickly address your last post before I move over to that of ricadelie in other thread

Combatant is merely following the islamic script . . . the topic clearly seeks to find allah's alleged torah and injil that he claimed to have sent down and confirmed . . . muslims are more interested in ferreting out alleged "missing verses" in the bible.

Yes, I know perfectly well what the topic is all about but can we vouch for a book that has verses missing but present in others as the word from God. I begin to wonder the position of the holy spirit when these are happening.

I wonder why you are asking for the Injil when you couldnt provide answers to my questions on your bible being corrupted. Having seen that the bible has been corrupted, do you still have any evidence to deny that the bible is not the same as the message given to Jesus?

Do these people suffer a disconnect witih reason?

You are entitled to your opinion. That is normally christians way of avoiding questions. I have perused other threads and found you muddling up threads.


the allegedly missing verses are duly included in the footnotes of every single bible . . .

Please why are they included as footnote and other versions are including the verses as part of the original message. I thought the holy spirit is supposed to have inspired them when compiling the bible!!.

Have a lovely day

combatant:

Yes, I know perfectly well what the topic is all about but can we vouch for a book that has verses missing but present in others as the word from God. I begin to wonder the position of the holy spirit when these are happening.

The topic has NOTHING to do with authenticating the validity of the bible BUT about where allah has hidden the torah and injil he himself claimed to have sent down and confirmed. Please stick to the issues. . . it is the muslim way to avoid answering glaring contradictions by rushing to copy and paste yet more questions meant to divert the thread.

combatant:

I wonder why you are asking for the Injil when you couldnt provide answers to my questions on your bible being corrupted. Having seen that the bible has been corrupted, do you still have any evidence to deny that the bible is not the same as the message given to Jesus?

We ask for the injil so we can understand why mohammed claimed the bible was corrupted. To accuse someone of possessiing a fake N5 note, you MUST be able to produce the genuine no? Again i have answered this again and again and again . . . no bible was given to Jesus!
Maybe allah's torah contains that "message", care to share it with us?

combatant:

the allegedly missing verses are duly included in the footnotes of every single bible . . .

Please why are they included as footnote and other versions are including the verses as part of the original message. I thought the holy spirit is supposed to have inspired them when compiling the bible!!.

The Holy Spirit inspired the recording of the books of the bible by the ancient prophets . . . whether you choose to put those verses in the index, footnotes or main text is not the job of the Holy Spirit.
NOTE: you also perpetuate the error that is inherently swallowed hook line and sinker by islamists; the Holy Spirit inspired the writings of the authors of the several books that make us the bible. The compilation of the bible as we have it today is a man-made venture.

An example: several men may be inspired by God to write down short stories of our lives. That someone decides to collate all those writings into one volume 100yrs from now should not be blamed on the Holy Spirit should the compilers choose to omit some short stories for reasons best known to them.
The original manuscripts from where the bible is translated are available for hypocrites like you to see.

I am becoming quite disheartened with babs and his cohorts. 

I read so many titles here which purport to expose some great truth and claim to enlighten me, but I sadly only find evertime that I have once again been tricked into only reading a post which contains mere questions in the childish attempt to "set up" someone for looking silly.

your subject title (in case you forgot):

Unveiling The Mystery Of 'lost' And 'corrupted' Torah And Injil

This is no question, it is a statement. And a misleading one, as the reader can become excited about all the information therein contained. Only to (once again) be let down to the fact that this information is nowhere to be found within. The Americans would call this false advertisement, bait and switch. If you truly have information that is pertinant to the "saving" of our everlasting souls, you then have an obligation to share this information quickly and consisely, as nobody is blessed with "wisdom" only to confuse and befuddle people even further. I find it an irresponsible use of knowledge and one that can have no reward.

If this knowledge truly exists then get on with it and leave us your essay. Otherwise one can only come to the conclusion that you truly do not have such knowledge and are only playing games.


P.S.
I just found this under this text entry window for entering the subject:

"Subject must be a concise summary of what your topic contains. No teasers or 'smart' titles please."

As laid down by the Owner, I would call this by definition a Rule.