there's no disputing the fact that nigerians love,cherish,adore God.the christians however,are in a class of their own.its no secret that most christians resign themselves to faith and believe "all things work together to them that love god and are called according to its purpose".they also believe "in everything,give thanks unto the lord".this attitude accounts for why christians believe they have no business in politics and believe their "pastors" dont need to criticize the leaders.even the ones that choose to be active like tunde bakare meet condemnation from christians.

for the purpose of this thread,i'd list a few popular "testimonies" by christians in church.
1. "brethren praiseeeeeeeeeeee the lord.after 3 years of fasting and prayer,i have finally gotten admission to univesity/polytechnic/college of education/technical school etc".the pastor then comes up and screams loudly "brethren praise ye the lord.the lord is good.brethren every enemy sitting on your admisiion,they shall die for your sake".congregation will scream amen.

the pastor,testifier and congregation out of their ignorance dont realise the fact that there are no invisible enemies "sitting" on any admission.if nigeria were in a better state,with good educational system in which every eligible candidates gains an admission into their preferred departmennt,would there be a need to go into marathon prayer and fasting talkless of testifying?
if our governemt was functional and the economy in good state which could enable the testifier afford a private university,would he/she be testifying for gaining admission into zoology despite applying for medicine?

these christians need to be told that their ridiculous stance of "we are not of this world" is grossly annoying.they need to speak out and expect same from their pastors.a pastor that doesnt speak out against government injustice doesnt want the progress of his "sheep" and any christian who remains in such a church is an ignoramus

Are you a muslim?

Delafruita: there's no disputing the fact that nigerians love,cherish,adore God.the christians however,are in a class of their own.its no secret that most christians resign themselves to faith and believe "all things work together to them that love god and are called according to its purpose".they also believe "in everything,give thanks unto the lord".this attitude accounts for why christians believe they have no business in politics and believe their "pastors" dont need to criticize the leaders.even the ones that choose to be active like tunde bakare meet condemnation from christians.

for the purpose of this thread,i'd list a few popular "testimonies" by christians in church.
1. "brethren praiseeeeeeeeeeee the lord.after 3 years of fasting and prayer,i have finally gotten admission to univesity/polytechnic/college of education/technical school etc".the pastor then comes up and screams loudly "brethren praise ye the lord.the lord is good.brethren every enemy sitting on your admisiion,they shall die for your sake".congregation will scream amen.

the pastor,testifier and congregation out of their ignorance dont realise the fact that there are no invisible enemies "sitting" on any admission.if nigeria were in a better state,with good educational system in which every eligible candidates gains an admission into their preferred departmennt,would there be a need to go into marathon prayer and fasting talkless of testifying?
if our governemt was functional and the economy in good state which could enable the testifier afford a private university,would he/she be testifying for gaining admission into zoology despite applying for medicine?

these christians need to be told that their ridiculous stance of "we are not of this world" is grossly annoying.they need to speak out and expect same from their pastors.a pastor that doesnt speak out against government injustice doesnt want the progress of his "sheep" and any christian who remains in such a church is an ignoramus

well said,though i wouldn't blame them much when most of their life is dependent on miracle.

MacDaddy01: Are you a muslim?

i keep getting that question.to answer your question,NO i am not a muslim

Delafruita:
i keep getting that question.to answer your question,NO i am not a muslim

Some people were claiming such. I just had to get an answer

MacDaddy01: Are you a muslim?

i keep getting that question.to answer your question,NO i am not a muslim.however,besides the extremism associated with islam i.e. alqaeda,bokoharam,al-shabab etc,islam is eons ahead of christianity in many respects.for one,islamic clerics are never afraid to speak out against injustice,they rarely ever twist the qur'an in a bid to fleece funds from their followers.they have their own shortcomings,but its quite minimal compared to christian pastors

MacDaddy01:

Some people were claiming such. I just had to get an answer

yeah i saw that.

Religion is d problem, not God.

^^^^

But what is religion without god?
The god delusion is the problem.

bisi16: Religion is d problem, not God.

Concepts of god do not outlast the religions they are attached to.When they do, they become myth. As long as they believe in god, religion will be a problem.

Delafruita: there's no disputing the fact that nigerians love,cherish,adore God.the christians however,are in a class of their own.its no secret that most christians resign themselves to faith and believe "all things work together to them that love god and are called according to its purpose".they also believe "in everything,give thanks unto the lord".this attitude accounts for why christians believe they have no business in politics and believe their "pastors" dont need to criticize the leaders.even the ones that choose to be active like tunde bakare meet condemnation from christians.

for the purpose of this thread,i'd list a few popular "testimonies" by christians in church.
1. "brethren praiseeeeeeeeeeee the lord.after 3 years of fasting and prayer,i have finally gotten admission to univesity/polytechnic/college of education/technical school etc".the pastor then comes up and screams loudly "brethren praise ye the lord.the lord is good.brethren every enemy sitting on your admisiion,they shall die for your sake".congregation will scream amen.

the pastor,testifier and congregation out of their ignorance dont realise the fact that there are no invisible enemies "sitting" on any admission.if nigeria were in a better state,with good educational system in which every eligible candidates gains an admission into their preferred departmennt,would there be a need to go into marathon prayer and fasting talkless of testifying?
if our governemt was functional and the economy in good state which could enable the testifier afford a private university,would he/she be testifying for gaining admission into zoology despite applying for medicine?

these christians need to be told that their ridiculous stance of "we are not of this world" is grossly annoying.they need to speak out and expect same from their pastors.a pastor that doesnt speak out against government injustice doesnt want the progress of his "sheep" and any christian who remains in such a church is an ignoramus

I would say that it is a major problem not that it is the problem. For someone to come with such a testimony, it sort of implies that they don't know better while the rich pastor who does know better, would simply enroll his own children in schools most of the congregations wouldn't be able to dream of sending their children.
This mindset encourages a refusal to seek appropriate redress when wronged.

POSTER,


Every country has a problem.,.

Every country belive in a GOD

if the problem of nigeria is GOD,

Then the problem of every countrx is God

Hence the problem of the world is GOD

Hence NO RELIGION, NO WORLD PROBLEM!!!


True or false

tobechi20: POSTER,


Every country has a problem.,.

Every country belive in a GOD

if the problem of nigeria is GOD,

Then the problem of every countrx is God

Hence the problem of the world is GOD

Hence NO RELIGION, NO WORLD PROBLEM!!!


True or false

you're getting it wrong.the point is nigerians have become so over-reliant on God that they no longer hold the government accountable for their problems.instead,its the "invisible enemies" in their mother's village.take for example,i was invited to a church,then the pastor requested the entire congregation to say a special prayer for a woman who was "under attack of the enemy".i was already wondering what the attack was when the woman went to the front of the church and then i realised she was heavily pregnant.in summary,the "attack" was that she went for scan and was told her baby was in breach and had to deliver via a ceasarian section.i was amazed at the ridiculous scenario.in my little knowledge,a CS is a routine operation just like an appendectomy or a tooth removal,but because of the history of inadequacies of our healthcare system,people resort to fasting and prayer for "healing".
my postulation is that if people werent so dependent on god for miracles,they'd actually realise the failures of the system and then condemn their pastors for not condemning the people in authority they hobnob with

^^^^^
Well said.

It is getting more ridiculous by the day.These days, I ask people "how are you?",and they reply "we thank god".
I then asked "how is your family?", again the reply is "we thank god".
Then I asked "how is your business?", again the same response, "we thank god".

At this time, I am confused because they do not answer my simple questions. Then I wait a bit, allow them to relax, and in a different tone, I ask again " so how have you been, whats been going on with you"?, once again, I hear them say " we thank god for everything".

At this time , I am completely exasperated. I give up.

This godism is turning ordinary people into vegetables and really doing major damages to our social fabrics.
it is getting increasingly hard to have a decent conversation with an average Nigerian without god this and god that. One would think that god, the maker and puppet master of the universe, has taken up residence in Nigeria. But there is no evidence to show that.

Yes.


God. Allah. Sango. Satan. etc

plaetton: ^^^^^
Well said.

It is getting more ridiculous by the day.These days, I ask people "how are you?",and they reply "we thank god".
I then asked "how is your family?", again the reply is "we thank god".
Then I asked "how is your business?", again the same response, "we thank god".

At this time, I am confused because they do not answer my simple questions. Then I wait a bit, allow them to relax, and in a different tone, I ask again " so how have you been, whats been going on with you"?, once again, I hear them say " we thank god for everything".

At this time , I am completely exasperated. I give up.

This godism is turning ordinary people into vegetables and really doing major damages to our social fabrics.
it is getting increasingly hard to have a decent conversation with an average Nigerian without god this and god that. One would think that god, the maker and puppet master of the universe, has taken up residence in Nigeria. But there is no evidence to show that.

Lol wow!

omo_to_dun: God is not the problem of Nigeria. The problem of Nigeria is Nigerians.

Agreed.

yes he is. he is the stumbling block for the rebellious nigerians. he is the stone that people trip over.

omo_to_dun: God is not the problem of Nigeria. The problem of Nigeria is Nigerians.

nigerians became the problem of nigeria the day nigerians started the "all is well" doctrine.the day they decided they "are in the world but not of the world".some will even quote the story of lazarus and the rich man to convince you that its better to accept "destiny".

buzugee: yes he is. he is the stumbling block for the rebellious nigerians. he is the stone that people trip over.

rebellious nigerians?stumbling block?still lost

Delafruita:
rebellious nigerians?stumbling block?still lost

you confuse hypocrisy with genuine spirituality

buzugee: you confuse hypocrisy with genuine spirituality

the issue here isnt spirituality,its the over-dependence on the idea of God

Delafruita:
the issue here isnt spirituality,its the over-dependence on the idea of God

its akin to the over-dependence on sex or the over-dependence on fraud or the over-dependence on dbanj and tuface. these are just solace places for lost and empty souls

buzugee: its akin to the over-dependence on sex or the over-dependence on fraud or the over-dependence on dbanj and tuface. these are just solace places for lost and empty souls

so now you understand that the overdependence on the idea of god by a majority of the population which inadvertently leads to an acceptance of "fate" in place of a quest for a better nation is the problem of nigeria

Delafruita:
so now you understand that the overdependence on the idea of god by a majority of the population which inadvertently leads to an acceptance of "fate" in place of a quest for a better nation is the problem of nigeria

i am not in support of religion. however the question is not a religious question. the question says IS GOD THE PROBLEM OF NIGERIA. God is not a religion. God did not bring religion. i am basing my answer on MORALITY not RELIGION. you are the one who took a religious angle to it. whatever it is that nigerians are obsessed with called 'religion' is satanic. thats just a pastime for frustrated people. what i mean is that GOD is a stumbling block to nigerians because they find it hard to keep his commandments. the bible is a book of history and commandments. a manual of instruction for humans. it is not a religion. so nigerians find it hard to keep the commands and as such God is the problem for these people.

Delafruita, cool post, cool arguments so far. I think that the answer to your question is NO. But I think your argument is patent. I also think that your postulation of "over-dependence" on God being the cause of societal ills is wrong.

I agree with all the posters who said it is religion that is the problem. Religion is man's conceptualisation of God, ideas manufactured by men about God. And history and current affairs say that something is always fundamentally wrong with these ideas. How do we know this? By the playout of those ideas in the lives their subscribers live. But more on that later in the next paragraph. The problem cannot be God unless we somehow find Him responsible. If people hold erroneous concepts of Him that screw their lives up however, then the blame will rightly be on religion.

I am probably not as frustrated as you and also, in a sense, more frustrated than you by such examples as you gave. My reasons for both are that, for the first, I know a capable and proven answer to the situation, and that, for the second, the situation is much worse than you could perhaps have seen. Like you said, people take God as an excuse to avoid responsibility. I don't know about it being more prevalent in Christianity than in other religions since I've never been in any other religion and do not have plans on joining or rejoining any. But I do know that somehow people think that it is God's responsibility to take hold of them and do this or that with them while they stay limp and intellectually and morally uninvolved. That results in very terrible situations. However, since you mentioned Tunde Bakare, I'll also say that I have at least the same lack of respect for people who make unworthy (in fact, any) assumptions about God and His desires and wishes as I have for people who actively refuse responsibility because they "believe" in God.

As to "over-dependence" on God, I do not believe that it is possible to be over-dependent on God. I think that that limp attitude toward responsibility that religious people take is actually a very strong display of unbelief and "under-dependence" on God. If they really depended on God, they would have been bold to take responsibility to act according to His Principles. They would have sat an examination well-prepared, taken proper observation of the conditions and environment of the exam-venue and lodged very strong complaints with the proper authorities should the exam body tell stories about their results especially if those stories are unreasonable. They would do so if they believed in God and knew He has an eternal principle of justice, fairness, equity and right reward. The pregnant woman would have done solid research into cs procedures and checked for alternatives and discussed with her husband and taken a clear decision rather than look for enemies to kill with prayer if she believed in God and knew His Principle of dominion: that the situation does not rule the human, rather does the human rule the situation. Religion has a way of making weaklings of people, moral weaklings, intellectual weaklings. But God doesn't. He has this effect of Power on people who really trust in Him. It is said that they "mount up with wings as eagles...run and not grow weary...walk and not faint" when they have waited upon Him.

So, in answer to your post, I say that God is not the Problem of Nigeria. It's a dare and it's not wholly necessary to this discussion so I will not defend it, but let me say that Jesus Christ is the Solution......not silly beliefs about Him o abeg!

Ihedinobi: Delafruita, cool post, cool arguments so far. I think that the answer to your question is NO. But I think your argument is patent. I also think that your postulation of "over-dependence" on God being the cause of societal ills is wrong.

I agree with all the posters who said it is religion that is the problem. Religion is conceptualisation of God, ideas manufactured by men about God. And history and current affairs say that something is always fundamentally wrong with these ideas. How do we know this? By the playout of those ideas in the lives their subscribers live. But more on that later in the next paragraph. The problem cannot be God unless we somehow find Him responsible. If people hold erroneous concepts of Him that screw their lives up however, then the blame will rightly be on religion.

I am probably not as frustrated as you and also, in a sense, more frustrated than you by such examples as you gave. My reasons for both are that, for the first, I know a capable and proven answer to the situation, and that, for the second, the situation is much worse than you could perhaps have seen. Like you said, people take God as an excuse to avoid responsibility. I don't know about it being more prevalent in Christianity than in other religions since I've never been in any other religion and do not have plans on joining or rejoining any. But I do know that somehow people think that it is God's responsibility to take hold of them and do this or that with them while they stay limp and intellectually uninvolved. That results in very terrible situations. However, since you mentioned Tunde Bakare, I'll also say that I have at least the same lack of respect for people who make unworthy (in fact, any) assumptions about God and His desires and wishes as I have for people who actively refuse responsibility because they "believe" in God.

As to "over-dependence" on God, I do not believe that it is possible to be over-dependent on God. I think that that limp attitude toward responsibility that religious people take is actually a very strong display of unbelief and "under-dependence" on God. If they really depended on God, they would have been bold to take responsibility to act according to His Principles. They would have sat an examination well-prepared, taken proper observation of the conditions and environment of the exam-venue and lodged very strong complaints with the proper authorities should the exam body tell stories about their results especially if those stories are unreasonable. They would do so if they believed in God and knew He has an eternal principle of justice, fairness, equity and right reward. The pregnant woman would have done solid research into cs procedures and checked for alternatives and discussed with her husband and taken a clear decision rather than look for enemies to kill with prayer if she believed in God and knew His Principle of dominion: that the situation does not rule the human, rather does the human rule the situation. Religion has a way of making weaklings of people, moral weaklings, intellectual weaklings. But God doesn't. He has this effect of Power on people who really trust in Him. It is said that they "mount up with wings as eagles...run and not grow weary...walk and not faint" when they have waited upon Him.

So, in answer to your post, I say that God is not the Problem of Nigeria. It's a dare and it's not patent to this discussion so I will not defend it, but let me say that Jesus Christ is the Solution......not silly beliefs about Him o abeg!

Very well said

Ihedinobi: Delafruita, cool post, cool arguments so far. I think that the answer to your question is NO. But I think your argument is patent. I also think that your postulation of "over-dependence" on God being the cause of societal ills is wrong.

I agree with all the posters who said it is religion that is the problem. Religion is man's conceptualisation of God, ideas manufactured by men about God. And history and current affairs say that something is always fundamentally wrong with these ideas. How do we know this? By the playout of those ideas in the lives their subscribers live. But more on that later in the next paragraph. The problem cannot be God unless we somehow find Him responsible. If people hold erroneous concepts of Him that screw their lives up however, then the blame will rightly be on religion.

I am probably not as frustrated as you and also, in a sense, more frustrated than you by such examples as you gave. My reasons for both are that, for the first, I know a capable and proven answer to the situation, and that, for the second, the situation is much worse than you could perhaps have seen. Like you said, people take God as an excuse to avoid responsibility. I don't know about it being more prevalent in Christianity than in other religions since I've never been in any other religion and do not have plans on joining or rejoining any. But I do know that somehow people think that it is God's responsibility to take hold of them and do this or that with them while they stay limp and intellectually and morally uninvolved. That results in very terrible situations. However, since you mentioned Tunde Bakare, I'll also say that I have at least the same lack of respect for people who make unworthy (in fact, any) assumptions about God and His desires and wishes as I have for people who actively refuse responsibility because they "believe" in God.

As to "over-dependence" on God, I do not believe that it is possible to be over-dependent on God. I think that that limp attitude toward responsibility that religious people take is actually a very strong display of unbelief and "under-dependence" on God. If they really depended on God, they would have been bold to take responsibility to act according to His Principles. They would have sat an examination well-prepared, taken proper observation of the conditions and environment of the exam-venue and lodged very strong complaints with the proper authorities should the exam body tell stories about their results especially if those stories are unreasonable. They would do so if they believed in God and knew He has an eternal principle of justice, fairness, equity and right reward. The pregnant woman would have done solid research into cs procedures and checked for alternatives and discussed with her husband and taken a clear decision rather than look for enemies to kill with prayer if she believed in God and knew His Principle of dominion: that the situation does not rule the human, rather does the human rule the situation. Religion has a way of making weaklings of people, moral weaklings, intellectual weaklings. But God doesn't. He has this effect of Power on people who really trust in Him. It is said that they "mount up with wings as eagles...run and not grow weary...walk and not faint" when they have waited upon Him.

So, in answer to your post, I say that God is not the Problem of Nigeria. It's a dare and it's not wholly necessary to this discussion so I will not defend it, but let me say that Jesus Christ is the Solution......not silly beliefs about Him o abeg!

i must say that was a very wonderful response.if most people had this realisation,then our country will be a lot better.however i must state that my intention isnt to cast all our woes unto God,rather i meant the "idea of god" held by nigerians.the god that will "take the wealth of the gentiles for his children" the god that says "ask and ye shall receive".a church behind my house holds service everyday and attendees are primarily the same people.then i ask,if these people want bblessings,what works do they have for the lord to bless?the pastors always conclude the service with "you will receive a phone call that will change your life" or "the person that has been assigned to bless you will locate you" to which the congregation screams a powerful amen.i
i keep hammering on xtianity because such phenomenon arent rampant in islam and traditiojal religion.however,it is pertinent to note that god cannot be seperated from religion at least in our society.every religious act is performed in the name of god.then i would expect the leaders of the various faiths to enlighten their congregation on the difference between god and religion but do they?they rather take advantage of the ignorance of their flock to fleece them.and our people,due to emotional attachment are so blind to see the reality of their predicament.

i agree that religion is the culprit and not god himself,however until a distinction can be made between the two,god will continue to carry the burden

Ihedinobi: Delafruita, cool post, cool arguments so far. I think that the answer to your question is NO. But I think your argument is patent. I also think that your postulation of "over-dependence" on God being the cause of societal ills is wrong.

I agree with all the posters who said it is religion that is the problem. Religion is man's conceptualisation of God, ideas manufactured by men about God. And history and current affairs say that something is always fundamentally wrong with these ideas. How do we know this? By the playout of those ideas in the lives their subscribers live. But more on that later in the next paragraph. The problem cannot be God unless we somehow find Him responsible. If people hold erroneous concepts of Him that screw their lives up however, then the blame will rightly be on religion.

I am probably not as frustrated as you and also, in a sense, more frustrated than you by such examples as you gave. My reasons for both are that, for the first, I know a capable and proven answer to the situation, and that, for the second, the situation is much worse than you could perhaps have seen. Like you said, people take God as an excuse to avoid responsibility. I don't know about it being more prevalent in Christianity than in other religions since I've never been in any other religion and do not have plans on joining or rejoining any. But I do know that somehow people think that it is God's responsibility to take hold of them and do this or that with them while they stay limp and intellectually and morally uninvolved. That results in very terrible situations. However, since you mentioned Tunde Bakare, I'll also say that I have at least the same lack of respect for people who make unworthy (in fact, any) assumptions about God and His desires and wishes as I have for people who actively refuse responsibility because they "believe" in God.

As to "over-dependence" on God, I do not believe that it is possible to be over-dependent on God. I think that that limp attitude toward responsibility that religious people take is actually a very strong display of unbelief and "under-dependence" on God. If they really depended on God, they would have been bold to take responsibility to act according to His Principles. They would have sat an examination well-prepared, taken proper observation of the conditions and environment of the exam-venue and lodged very strong complaints with the proper authorities should the exam body tell stories about their results especially if those stories are unreasonable. They would do so if they believed in God and knew He has an eternal principle of justice, fairness, equity and right reward. The pregnant woman would have done solid research into cs procedures and checked for alternatives and discussed with her husband and taken a clear decision rather than look for enemies to kill with prayer if she believed in God and knew His Principle of dominion: that the situation does not rule the human, rather does the human rule the situation. Religion has a way of making weaklings of people, moral weaklings, intellectual weaklings. But God doesn't. He has this effect of Power on people who really trust in Him. It is said that they "mount up with wings as eagles...run and not grow weary...walk and not faint" when they have waited upon Him.

So, in answer to your post, I say that God is not the Problem of Nigeria. It's a dare and it's not wholly necessary to this discussion so I will not defend it, but let me say that Jesus Christ is the Solution......not silly beliefs about Him o abeg!

i must say that was a very wonderful response.if most people had this realisation,then our country will be a lot better.however i must state that my intention isnt to cast all our woes unto God,rather i meant the "idea of god" held by nigerians.the god that will "take the wealth of the gentiles for his children" the god that says "ask and ye shall receive".a church behind my house holds service everyday and attendees are primarily the same people.then i ask,if these people want bblessings,what works do they have for the lord to bless?the pastors always conclude the service with "you will receive a phone call that will change your life" or "the person that has been assigned to bless you will locate you" to which the congregation screams a powerful amen.i
i keep hammering on xtianity because such phenomenon arent rampant in islam and traditiojal religion.however,it is pertinent to note that god cannot be seperated from religion at least in our society.every religious act is performed in the name of god.then i would expect the leaders of the various faiths to enlighten their congregation on the difference between god and religion but do they?they rather take advantage of the ignorance of their flock to fleece them.and our people,due to emotional attachment are so blind to see the reality of their predicament.

i agree that religion is the culprit and not god himself,however until a distinction can be made between the two,god will continue to carry the burden

Delafruita:
i must say that was a very wonderful response.if most people had this realisation,then our country will be a lot better.however i must state that my intention isnt to cast all our woes unto God,rather i meant the "idea of god" held by nigerians.the god that will "take the wealth of the gentiles for his children" the god that says "ask and ye shall receive".a church behind my house holds service everyday and attendees are primarily the same people.then i ask,if these people want bblessings,what works do they have for the lord to bless?the pastors always conclude the service with "you will receive a phone call that will change your life" or "the person that has been assigned to bless you will locate you" to which the congregation screams a powerful amen.i
i keep hammering on xtianity because such phenomenon arent rampant in islam and traditiojal religion.however,it is pertinent to note that god cannot be seperated from religion at least in our society.every religious act is performed in the name of god.then i would expect the leaders of the various faiths to enlighten their congregation on the difference between god and religion but do they?they rather take advantage of the ignorance of their flock to fleece them.and our people,due to emotional attachment are so blind to see the reality of their predicament.

i agree that religion is the culprit and not god himself,however until a distinction can be made between the two,god will continue to carry the burden

Quite so. I have no contentions with your response. As for the distinction, well, is there any better way for God to clearly mark that except by human lives? I don't think there is. I think that when you see the product of the life of a man in whom Jesus lives and contrast it with the product of the life of another in whom religion lives, you'll perceive the distinction.

I started a new thread that might, as far as reason goes, address some of that distinction. I welcome your views on it. Because I'm using a java phone, I can't copy and paste the link here. But it's titled "Jesus Christ is not, in reality and essence, a religion".

Thank you, Mr Anony

Here's the link to the thread: www.nairaland.com/987990/jesus-christ-not-reality-essence