₦airaland Forum

MaxInDHouse:
So apart from humans can you explain how an animal does any of the four:
Feeling
Expression
Reverence
Adoration


This is what confused you!
If you want to stick to what the Bible God said about creation it's only man that was created in God's image so all other creatures live on instinct which means they have no ability to think regarding feeling, expression, reverence or adoration towards any deity, animals only regarding what is visible to them that's why God admonished man to become a demigod over all animals:

Then God said: “Let us make man in our image, according to our likeness, and let them have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and the domestic animals and all the earth and every creeping animal that is moving on the earth.” Genesis 1:26

So animals can only WORSHIP/ADORE Man as the VISIBLE demigod in Eden!

Alright...

Firstly, animals do feel emotions (from birds to dogs, dolphins and monkeys, tigers and snakes, etc)... As for reverence and adoration, that's faith and the expression of faith. You can't use biology to explain it; you can't explain why humans worship a God they can neither see nor touch but we do. Therefore, I can only use the Bible (which you believe in thoroughly) to validate my point.

Again, I'll quote this verse... Numbers 23-27
When the donkey saw the angel of the LORD standing in the road with a drawn sword in his hand, she turned off the road into a field. Balaam beat her to get her back on the road.

Then the angel of the LORD stood in a narrow path between two vineyards, with walls on both sides.

When the donkey saw the angel of the LORD, she pressed close to the wall, crushing Balaam's foot against it. So he beat her again.

Then the angel of the LORD moved on ahead and stood in a narrow place where there was no room to turn, either to the right or to the left.

When the donkey saw the angel of the LORD, she lay down under Balaam, and he was angry and beat her with his staff

If you read it, you'll understand that the donkey was entirely aware that it's master was being confronted by an Angel of God, the donkey recognised His authority and made several attempts to save it's master from God's wrath.

Secondly, with regards to this

This is what confused you!
If you want to stick to what the Bible God said about creation it's only man that was created in God's image so all other creatures live on instinct which means they have no ability to think regarding feeling, expression, reverence or adoration towards any deity, animals only regarding what is visible to them that's why God admonished man to become a demigod over all animals:

So you mean Animals don't recognize God as their creator despite the Bible numerously stating that they do? They were instructed to praise God, along with man. The Bible is wrong? Or the ancients who wrote it were silly to give human attributes to animals?

Man isn't 'demigod over animals'... That's blasphemous.

God placed parents over their children, commanding the latter to obey and honour the former.

He also placed men over women, commanding the latter to obey and honour the former.

He also placed priests over their congregations, commanding the latter to obey and honour the former.

He also placed masters over their slaves, commanding the latter to obey and honour the former.

Are parents, men, priests, and masters demigods? The answer is NO! Because they were also given the responsibility to cater to the needs of those beneath them. Their privilege doesn't make them God's second-in-command but God's representative on earth. For example, the priest concerns himself with the spiritual needs of his congregation but that doesn't mean his followers have no souls nor the ability to worship God without his intervention. He was simply appointed by God to nurture and guide His people.

God made man in his image, yes but what had that got to do with faith? Does God worship a superior being? Our intelligence and higher consciousness makes us alike to God, that's it. But animals being inferior doesn't make them dumb beasts. If they were, why did God bother creating them? Why were they in the garden Eden alongside Adam and Eve? Why reserve them a place in the paradise to come?

***

If you persist in claiming animals are oblivious to the presence of a divine creator, you're indirectly saying faith and religion is a human thing.

***

Animals do have faith, they recognise that earth is the good work of God and they praise him however they can. Because they don't participate in elaborate human rituals doesn't change that.

MaxInDHouse:
If you make something and that thing is perfect as in working as intended we could say it brings you praise.

Likewise all the things God created brings him praise it doesn't mean they're worshiping Him!

Disappointing...

Let me define 'worship', so you understand better

Oxford dictionary

Noun

The feeling or expression of reverence and adoration for a deity.

Now, animals 'praising' God as the true ominipotent deity, I infact worship.

Isaiah 43:20

Even the wild animals will honor me; jackals and ostriches will praise me when I make rivers flow in the desert to give water to my chosen people.

Emphasis on the words, 'honor' and 'praise'...

Take away the elaborate rituals of the Church and that's exactly what humans do! We simply 'acknowledge', 'honor' and 'praise' God.

Catholics do that with mass and the holy communion. Jehovah witnesses are more of a close-knit community (if you understand what I mean). Protestants are more concerned with miracles and such.

Like I wrote earlier, the language barrier stops us from communicating with animals, which therefore prevents us from understand their manner of worship (remember, just because it's different and incomprehensible doesn't mean it's non-existent or unimportant)...

Whites justified enslaving Africans because the latter were nothing but 'faithless barbarians' but we know this isn't true...

I think it's about time Christian redefined it's position on the God given rights of animals (not sure how to phrase it but you understand).

The inability of animals to communicate doesn't mean they lack a soul. Science and the Bible has proven that they are equally conscious beings capable of emotions and faith... Whites then used to assume Blacks were soulless due to our different culture, and the language barrier made it easier to reinforce this stupid belief.

What therefore is the distinction between humans and animals, in terms of spirituality if we both acknowledge and worship God almighty?

You could argue the God gave man dominion over animal but God also placed woman under the authority of man, but that doesn't deprive her of her immortal soul?

Does that mean we should open the doors of our churches to animals? Accept that they too might attain heaven and so on...

The Bible never said otherwise, we only assumed.

In fact, animals were a part of the paradise Eden and would exist in the one to come after the end of days, proving that they hold a special place in God's heart. Why create them if they were just stupid beasts?

I would ask Muslims the same question but unfortunately, I'm not familiar with Islam... I'm not a bigot.

***

Back to the topic, do animals worship God? Are they even aware of his existence? After all, if there is indeed a divine creator, then faith shouldn't be a Christian thing (it would then seem like some 'human' invention). Humans eat and fight and feel happiness, so do animals but the things we don't have in common as those we created. Is religion and faith one of them? Animals were also principal characters in the Bible, almost as much as humans.

For example,

Numbers 23-33

When the donkey saw the angel of the LORD standing in the road with a drawn sword in his hand, she turned off the road into a field. Balaam beat her to get her back on the road.

Then the angel of the LORD stood in a narrow path between two vineyards, with walls on both sides.

When the donkey saw the angel of the LORD, she pressed close to the wall, crushing Balaam's foot against it. So he beat her again.

Then the angel of the LORD moved on ahead and stood in a narrow place where there was no room to turn, either to the right or to the left.

When the donkey saw the angel of the LORD, she lay down under Balaam, and he was angry and beat her with his staff.

Then the LORD opened the donkey's mouth, and she said to Balaam, "What have I done to you to make you beat me these three times?"

Balaam answered the donkey, "You have made a fool of me! If I had a sword in my hand, I would kill you right now."

The donkey said to Balaam, "Am I not your own donkey, which you have always ridden, to this day? Have I been in the habit of doing this to you?" "No," he said.

Then the LORD opened Balaam's eyes, and he saw the angel of the LORD standing in the road with his sword drawn. So he bowed low and fell facedown.

The angel of the LORD asked him, "Why have you beaten your donkey these three times? I have come here to oppose you because your path is a reckless one before me.

The donkey saw me and turned away from me these three times. If she had not turned away, I would certainly have killed you by now, but I would have spared her."

***
Animals too were instructed to worship God.

Psalm 148:10-13

Praise him, all you wild animals and cattle.

Praise him, you small creatures and flying birds.

Praise him, you kings of the earth and all nations.

Praise him, all you princes and rulers on earth.

Praise him, young men and women.

Praise him, old men and children. Let them praise the name of the LORD.

His name alone is honored. His glory is higher than the earth and the heavens.

***

Isaiah 43:20

Even the wild animals will honor me; jackals and ostriches will praise me when I make rivers flow in the desert to give water to my chosen people.

***

To be continued

Finitin:
good evening bro, i'm not trying to take advantage of your kind heart, but if you can help me with any amount of money, i'll be very grateful. I'm in my finals in school and i can barely feed myself. I've had absolutely nothing on me for the past few weeks. Me being an introvert made things worse.
I'll really appreciate if i can get help from you.
my account number is 6235805248 fidelity bank. God bless you chairman

A final year student for so long?

I'll send you something, hopefully tomorrow. Convenient?

Though it isn't much but it would be useful... You're a student after all.

I'll call you tomorrow... To confirm your identity. Too bad I can't get a picture, you should to be handsome.

Nairalanders, make a wish today.

Solomon requests for wisdom

1 Kings 3:5-15

5 In Gibeon the Lord appeared to Solomon in a dream at night; and God said, “Ask what you wish Me to give you.”

6 Then Solomon said, “You have shown great lovingkindness to Your servant David my father, according as he walked before You in truth and righteousness and uprightness of heart toward You; and You have reserved for him this great lovingkindness, that You have given him a son to sit on his throne, as it is this day.

7 Now, O Lord my God, You have made Your servant king in place of my father David, yet I am but a little child; I do not know how to go out or come in.

8 Your servant is in the midst of Your people which You have chosen, a great people who are too many to be numbered or counted.

9 So give Your servant an understanding heart to judge Your people to discern between good and evil. For who is able to judge this great people of Yours?”

10 It was pleasing in the sight of the Lord that Solomon had asked this thing.

11 God said to him, “Because you have asked this thing and have not asked for yourself long life, nor have asked riches for yourself, nor have you asked for the life of your enemies, but have asked for yourself discernment to understand justice,

12 behold, I have done according to your words. Behold, I have given you a wise and discerning heart, so that there has been no one like you before you, nor shall one like you arise after you.

13 I have also given you what you have not asked, both riches and honor, so that there will not be any among the kings like you all your days.

14 If you walk in My ways, keeping My statutes and commandments, as your father David walked, then I will prolong your days.”

15 Then Solomon awoke, and behold, it was a dream. And he came to Jerusalem and stood before the ark of the covenant of the Lord, and offered burnt offerings and made peace offerings, and made a feast for all his servants.

Nfpmod

DevilishMan:
OP you be man or woman?

Homophobic?

Unsympathetic pieces of sh**

Nairalanders, where do I begin?

This evening, I strolled out to get some things from a nearby store after withdrawing the only money I have from my account.

Instead of going home, I decided to check on a friend of mine; a boy I've been toasting for the past few weeks.

I misplaced 2k on the way and I'm going insane!

This boy didn't even give me his phone number, though he said he doesn't have a phone...

I need consolation. I'm so angry, I won't visit him for the next two weeks!!!

Also, someone should ask for my details and transfer the money to me. Please! Don't let me starve.

Excellent! God loves all.

If God were to forgive everyone, including gay and trans people, on judgement day, most Nigeria christians would be miserable.

Frustrated scumbags

preciousee17:
You said part 2 but there's nothing new here...
You should have just called it part 1 revamped

Alternate title: Hey Nairalanders, I Just Feel Like Arguing

Again, I was too tired to continue. But I'll another thread soon.

Again, this is my personal opinion. If you don't like it, kindly Bleep off.

I created a similar thread some weeks ago, maybe a month back...

1. God isn't perfect. He's both good and bad.

2. God is capable of committing sin. That's why humans and angels are flawed; we were created in his image. After all, didn't he murdered the entire world cause he was mad?

3. God is perfect only because he has near-perfect control of his ''badness'. (Near-perfect because sometimes he misbehaves)

4. This inherent evil is the reason Lucifer fell from grace.

5. Evil (with a capital E) is the only thing above God. It has power over him too.

6. God can't end Evil and it's consequences (suffering) because God didn't create Evil.

7. God is merciful, Evil isn't.

8. The only reason Jesus came to Earth was to teach us of Evil and how to overcome it through resistance.

9. In the Beginning was Evil, not God. Either Evil existed first (though it's hard to believe God could come from it) or Evil existed WITHIN God and it was defeated.

10. The whole point of Christianity is basically: Be Godly, meaning emulate God and conquer the evil within you.

11. In the end would be Evil. No matter what happens, it would always exist as long as there is life.

12. God drowned millions, including children because it was the only option he had. He couldn't snap his fingers and set things right because Evil is greater than he is. The only things God has control over are those he made.

13. God has significant authority over the Devil because he created the Devil (Lucifer). And he has authority over sinners for the same reason.

vdestro:
Yet you woke up on your own to attack it. No one forced you.

But because now you see that you are fooling yourself with your stupid attack as you no longer had any sensible thing to say, you now resorted to insulting him because you could not defeat his argument.

Glowry be to God. Good work Emusan.

DTruthSpeaker? Is this your alt account?

It has to be! I have never met someone half as bitter and frustrated as you are.

Stupid spawn of Satan.

Shokoloko:
But will indeed God dwell on the earth? Behold, heaven and the heaven of heavens cannot contain You (1 Kings 8:27).

1st heaven Gen 1:1 In the beginning, God created the heaven and the earth.

2nd heaven Gen 1:7-8 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so. And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day.

3rd heaven Deut 10:14 Behold, the heaven [2nd heaven] and the heaven of heavens [3rd heaven] is the LORD’S thy God, the earth also, with all that therein is [included the 1st heaven].

1 Ki 8:27 But will God indeed dwell on the earth? behold, the heaven [2nd heaven] and heaven of heavens [3rd heaven] cannot contain thee… [also 2 Chr 2:6, 2 Chr 6:18]

Neh 9:6 Thou, even thou, art LORD alone; thou hast made heaven [2nd heaven], the heaven of heavens [3rd Heaven], with all their host, the earth, and all things that are therein [including the 1st heaven], the seas, and all that is therein…

Psa 113:4 The LORD is high above all nations, and his glory above the heavens [His glory is above ALL heavens].

Heb 4:14 Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens (plural), Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession.

Eph 4:10 He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things. [cf. Ps 113:4, above]

Exactly.
The sky equals heaven. But there's no mention of outer space; systems, galaxies, etc.

Emusan:
You're changing your own thread, stay in one place and stop preambulating.



But the fact is the people who believed in Him brought CIVILISATION to you.



You agree someone CRIPPLED early civilisation but you still stated above that "Belief in him isn't proof of him" o ma se oooo

You're embarrassing me... you're not making any sense. Like I said, belief in God isn't proof of him.

And many people regardless of their religion made active contributions. It's not a Christian thing and it wasn't the result of their faith but their human effort.

Shokoloko:
The bible states that God has an office beyond space. But he no longer works from his office, he works from home. His home is our hearts.
Heaven is where the throne is but ‘The kingdom of God is within,’

Bible verse?

Because everything points at the fact that the sky is heaven, where God resides.

Emusan:
Now you're derailing your own thread.

He is Anti civilisation yet many of people who believe in Him brought the same civilisation to you.



At least you recognise His Presence on early men. So why do you think He silent now?

Belief in him isn't proof of him.

Everything you see, God neither revealed nor taught. We are here thanks to the hardwork and dedication of millions of people of different faiths: christians, muslim, heathens and atheists.

His presence? He literally crippled an early civilization. And for what?

Emusan:
It's the decision to settle that was the problem. Read to understand next time.



The above is a simple English.



He is not offended but just following His own plan.

You can't tell Him what to say and not what to say besides, the language above is easy to comprehend without injecting your own interpretation.

Mind you, they were one people before they decided to settle. What's your point?

Lmao. What he said was easy to understand.

"If as one people speaking the same language they have begun to do this, then nothing they plan to do will be impossible for them".

Again, he didn't complain about their disobedience, but their capabilities.

Emusan:
Who are you to tell God how to do His business?

Black Africans and defending a borrowed God who's anti-civilization

While the world advances without any opposition from your unusually silent God, you're here excusing why he hindered the progress of the early men for some stupid reason (his insecurity).

Shokoloko:
Could you clarify what sentence or phrase led you to qualify God's action as punishment? I'm curious

I made that point?

These were my questions:

***
Yet God has no problem with aeroplanes, jets, rockets, satellites, the international space station, and so one. In other words, God is perfectly okay with space exploration. Yet God was 'intimidated' watching the people build the tower of Babel, a city which would reach heaven.

***
I gotta ask, where exactly is God? Residing in the sky? In space? Beyond?

Emusan:
You're the one who quoted this scripture yet failed to see @underlined part.

Again, if you read the passage, you would see that it wasn't their decision to settle that was the problem, but their pride, they choose to build a city to reach heaven, and that troubled God.

Again:

Genesis 11:6-7
6 The Lord said, “If as one people speaking the same language they have begun to do this, then nothing they plan to do will be impossible for them.

7 Come, let us go down and confuse their language so they will not understand each other.”

If he was offended by their disobedience, he could easily have punished them (he's done that many times)... He didn't have to utter the aforementioned statement. That's telling. Almost at though he were scared of their capabilities.

MightySparrow:
Space exploration is not a problem to God. He was angry because the then people were working against God's agenda of spreading to cover the earth. Now, there are no places on earth that are not belongings to a people on the world map. In fact we are working towards colonizing Moon and Mars. If it is against his idea, He will still prevent one way or the other.

Again, you're ignoring Genesis 11:6-7

Glad you mentioned the moon and mars. Isn't it curious they were never mentioned in the old testament bible by the illiterate peasants who wrote it?

I wonder if God would be happy with us colonizing other planets. After all, the instruction was to populate and govern earth.

Shokoloko:
It was not a punishment.
God never said the idea was bad. It was not just the right time
Apparently, the passage shows that God wanted them scattered all over the face of the earth. God wanted exploration of the earth first. They did not want that - they wanted to stay in Shinar (no movement). That is not how to replenish the earth which was the blueprint given to Adam.

Which Bible did you read?

Genesis 11:6-7
6 The Lord said, “If as one people speaking the same language they have begun to do this, then nothing they plan to do will be impossible for them.

7 Come, let us go down and confuse their language so they will not understand each other.”

What makes you think God was pro-exploration? Next time, read.

If God wanted to create different languages, he could have easily done so without hindering their progress.

Besides:

Again, we can assume the story is nothing but a myth to explain why we speak different languages but we now know it isn't true. They weren't all created the same time; some are extinct, still evolving, and others being created. There are over 7000 languages spoken today.

New International Version


Genesis 11:1-9

11 Now the whole world had one language and a common speech.

2 As people moved eastward, they found a plain in Shinar and settled there.

3 They said to each other, “Come, let’s make bricks and bake them thoroughly.” They used brick instead of stone, and tar for mortar.

4 Then they said, “Come, let us build ourselves a city, with a tower that reaches to the heavens, so that we may make a name for ourselves; otherwise we will be scattered over the face of the whole earth.”

5 But the Lord came down to see the city and the tower the people were building.

6 The Lord said, “If as one people speaking the same language they have begun to do this, then nothing they plan to do will be impossible for them.

7 Come, let us go down and confuse their language so they will not understand each other.”

8 So the Lord scattered them from there over all the earth, and they stopped building the city.

9 That is why it was called Babel—because there the Lord confused the language of the whole world. From there the Lord scattered them over the face of the whole earth.


***
Yet God has no problem with aeroplanes, jets, rockets, satellites, the international space station, and so one. In other words, God is perfectly okay with space exploration. Yet God was 'intimidated' watching the people build the tower of Babel, a city which would reach heaven.

***
I gotta ask, where exactly is God? Residing in the sky? In space? Beyond?

***
I need answers.

Honestly, assuming we were to make contact with aliens, would that mean there's no God? Or would nothing change for you?

VinnyBaba:
Let's hear from the

'I Hate the Show with Passion' crew.

I hate the show with a passion

TenQ
AdvanceDNA
MaxInTheHouse
Preciousee17
Maynman
DTruthSpeaker

.
Honestly, let's assume it's the end of days and God decides, mercifully, to forgive everyone regardless of the sins they committed on earth.

Prostitutes and pornstars, alcoholics and drug addicts, politicians and fraudsters, atheists and heathens, etc, are all going to heaven.

Would you feel cheated or happy for the lucky sinners or indifferent? And tell me your reasons.