Rhozabeth:
Question is did u report the loss of the passport at the passport? That should have been the first step tobgwtting ur passport back! U need ur old passport for renewal, they have all ur info in the system though. If u are to renew without the old one u might need things like police report and an affidavit!
However, it is important u get advice from the immigration office.

Thanks. And yes those documents are available (police report et all). But I was asking about bypassing renewal process for brand new. I've even heard of people with two different e passports. How'd they do that? I guess this is where the deeper "if u knows how it goes" come in.

Please share your knowledge if you know about these things


If an e passport with some wrong info (middle name) has expired for over a year, is it possible to apply directly for a new passport. Pls note:

Old e passport was only used once and has been lost for a while now

Expiry date was 2017. Obtained at ikoyI office.

All other valid I'Ds (drivers license, BVN) carry the correct middle name

Question is, is it possible to just apply for new e passport instead of bringing up the expired erroneous one? whats the best approach. Thanks in advance.

Lady must be smart and agile.

Reside within, around or close to ikeja

Able to use accounting software Peachtree

Interested, call or whatsapp number in signature.

redcliff:


america and russia are two dif countried though. you can be an illegal immigrant in the states for 20yrs and you are quite safe than europe (except uk).

True! And ull make money "legally" too if you're not lazy. I know people clocking 25 or 30 years there without papers, and doing fine. No scams or ish like that. Tho nobody can predict the future- the rate of Nigerian immigration into the US may soon FORCE some sort of counter-action that would affect even the well established. The only reason this trend has prevailed so far is because it actually pays the US government to have cheap labor with tax returns- it's a coded system of voluntary slavery, where the government would "act" as though they frown upon it yet nothing concrete would be done to halt the process. The weaker the slaves (Mexico, Africa etc) the stronger the masters (USA, Canada, UK). It's an established system.....why do you think the British empire ruined Nigeria by empowering the dumbest to rule it when they were forced to leave, The French also handed half-independence to their countries to maintain indirect control, it's all planned......but Africa is an especially foolish and helpless continent of natural slaves! It's hopeless.

Thank You....

samtinx:
hello nairalanders please,i am currently in a relationship with a force lady "army" to be precise,i love my lady but friends and family have been tellling me about how millitary ladies are very tough and wicked,but the truth is that i already knew my lady before she became a military personal "as a civilian" we both fell in love my girl has really been caring uptill date but my friends and family are really making my feelings very much difficult for me and deep down my hearth i love her wether being a civilian or military.

You are being sentimental by bringing up stuff like " I knew her before she enrolled bla bla" does a chicken come out of the oven the same way it went it? Just sayin.

Anyway, what you must consider is who she is NOW. Not everyone in the military is a violent combatant, so her being in the army doesn't necessarily pose a threat to you in any way. But if she happens to be the kind of lady who gets vengeful, unforgiving, bitter, or excessively angry when UPSET (which is the case with most ladies), then you should be alarmed. because, bro, fvck ups must happen in relationships. And while other girls would just freak out, walk away or cry as you try to make amends, this one might have already made some "calls" on your behalf only to regret it later when she calms.

I believe this is the reason why your loved ones are concerned. So its up to you to judge her character if she's the type with enough meekness and self-control to spare an ENEMY (lol. if you know what I mean)

Piiko:
So I just logged on my Facebook and saw a plain proposal, just the two of them in a field he goes on his knees to propose, she acts like she's surprised and the cameraman captures all four actions, you and your fiancee planned it all along and you act blandly, I am not impressed, be more creative people

its simple: Drama tins! Women have loved drama since the beginning of time- novels, fairy tales, chic flicks, fantasies etc. are all things they know aren't REAL but like to indulge anyway. So the proposal and their reaction is just an extension of this whole drama mentality playing out.

afoshat:
She was about leaving on sunday after she came to spend the weekend since Friday, when we were now cuddled up enjoying the moments and talking about random shits, when I told her that i would love to get a cat for a pet, nah ehm she change am for me ooooh, that if I get a cat or a dog that she would not come to this house again oooo, haah, I was like wetin happen but after she will be slaying on snapchat with all those whiskers, she said nooo that she don't like dogs or cat oooo, as a matter of fact, when she was young they had 7 dogs in their house,1 early morning she killed 6 of them except the last one that she likes so much, and up till today no one in the family knows who did it, she poisoned them, omo cold shivers where sent down my spine, I stood up carried my car keys and said oya lemme go and drop you, I on the AC while driving but I was still sweating, I don't even know what to think ...

Don't see this issue lightly though- I know of a very calm gentle smallish lady who blatantly robbed her company of MANY MILLIONS OF NAIRA in a way that anyone would swear she couldn't. I mean, even brave bad guys wouldn't dare pull that stunt. She got away too because the stuff she pulled was super-stealth and no one looked in her direction. So, as someone has mentioned earlier, you are dealing with a very deadly character (ignore her outward countenance) and what just happened to slip off her tongue is something you should consider urself "privileged" to hear early enough- thank your lucky stars and begin to disengage systematically from the relationship. Try to make her lose interest in you...don't just terminate the relationship or you might be setting yourself (or your future partner) up for trouble.

Interesting15:

Then why do the police arrest some set of people and send them to jail?

Because the police are humans just like us. The system was created by humans. Don't fool ur self that there's any such thing as a justice system OUTSIDE the human world. Have u ever seen a lion get arrested by nature for eating innocent deers or "wasting" rabbits on a daily? No! Have u ever seen a baby born with a BELIEF or orientation? No! We all learn, choose, and become.

So even though we humans are born and then conditioned to believe all sorts of rubbish, in this world, and by the evidence of nature herself, there are predators, preys, and the neutrals! Everyone belongs to one category or the other whether u consider urself good or bad. Morality and conscience are traits we develop/learn in life and while growing up. Nature herself doesn't care what we do.

Before nko? Science is very limited and superficial in style.

Have u heard of Something called "spontaneous human combustion" where humans suddenly catch fire from within (mostly after death)?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spontaneous_human_combustion

Or the MARY CELESTE- ship that was found still intact but just drifting with no one, and life boat gone- as though the whole crew abandoned ship for some unknown reason and then died (as they were never found or heard from again).

Seun:

Claims of the Prophet's illiteracy may have been grossly exaggerated, but even if they are true, being illiterate only means that you cannot read or write. An illiterate can be creative and have a good memory.

The Prophet composed the verses over a period of many many years, memorized them, and taught them to his friends, who also memorized them. This is exactly how most societies passed on their traditions and myths from generation to generation before writing became a thing. There is nothing remarkable or supernatural about this.

His claim to have met a supernatural entity are easily explained as untruths. Many of his revelations are obviously self-serving such as the one permitting only himself to take more than 4 wives when he wished to do so, and those promising rich rewards to young men who died in battle when he was in need of fighters.

If you believe the Prophet's revelations came from a supreme supernatural entity who created the universe, then you should be a Muslim. Why are you not a Muslim?

@ameri9ja, seun's post here pretty much does justice to ur "proofs"

I was honestly hoping you would say something a bit "unfamiliar" but to use Biblical/Quoran stories and CLAIMS as proof doesn't really help ur argument with people who are in doubt of the very RELEVANCE of those books. Can't we have some proof thats not based on these same old boring proofs? Of all the people who believe in Bible God, can't anybody hear/see/know/experience something new to the world besides what the ancient believers had? Great men/women of God today claim to communicate with God frequently, yet they haven't thought to clarify critical biblical controversies with him, so that they may explain these to the world through relatable DIVINE knowledge? No! They are all just there grappling with the same Old Arabic controversial teachings and trying to explain these away with ordinary wits. This is fishy!


Also, it seems a lot of people (including you) confuse spirituality with religion- there's a difference. Miracles, prophesies etc are all elements of spirituality, not necessarily religion. Think Abt it: psychics, herbalists, prophets, seers, and the likes have always existed haven't they? In biblical times and even today. Some of these people are capable of miracles and prophesies aren't they? So u see that its not really about Bible God or religion- just spirituality, something available to mankind with or without their belief in God. This is why bad people can pray and still get answers, and why Voodoo people can do voodoo. So religion using it's own form of spirituality (praying, miracles etc) to cash in as "proof" of the scriptural God is void and pathetic!


Guess what? In the middle ages Europe, people honestly believed that women flew on brooms! They called them witches and murdered any woman suspected of this practice. Whether these allegations were true back then, WE CAN'T BE SURE NOW. But as time went by, civilization quenched these claims and ladies stopped getting murdered. This is same with religion. Only difference is that the world leaders NEED religion to control the world, hence their reinforcement of religious beliefs! Otherwise they wud have abolished this too and you won't be believing in flying​ women or ancient doctrines today. Oh and before you say Jesus prophesied that his word would remain in future, lemme inform u that Mohammed also predicted future supremacy, yet both are rival parties apparently from the SAME GOD! What is he, a confusionist?? Don't be fooled; religion is only alive today because it was FORCEFULLY reinforced by those who wanted POWER over others. It is a political tool, and a cash cow too! Otherwise religion wud be long dead and forgotten.


Like I've stated earlier, we either agree that the world was created by a supernatural MAN-LIKE being named YAHWEH, who was just as crazy as any science genius (according to what the holy books clearly show us), or we accept religion as it is; an ancient belief that has long expired! Either way, modern religious doctrines wud still be wrong and misleading, as they SHY AWAY from either facts! However, what we should try to understand better is SPIRITUALITY! Meditation, prayers, fasting, counting beads, voodoo, rituals, prophesies, miracles, are all FORMS OF SPIRITUALITY- and these should be our focus if we are to figure out anything anytime soon- not droning after ancient claims by a certain group of people practicing and forcefully spreading THEIR OWN KIND of spirituality- religion! Why not just stick to their doctrines 100% by not doing anything on SABBATH (Saturday) bla bla and all that crazy shiit in the Holy Books that modern religion CONVENIENTLY avoids now ehn? Doesnt this make religious practitioners hypocritical?

orunto27:
.

Atheist grows from knowledge to Understanding and becomes Theist and Confucius.
Agnostic stops searching. He has now found. He becomes Nostic and Illuminati.

This makes sense to a degree. It does.

CoolUsername:


Well, words have definitions and I think my stance of the God connection fits a particular definition. If my beliefs change, I look for another label. What I don't do is try to redefine the English language, and then call myself open-minded.

Fun fact: it's the open minded people who redefine ANYTHING​ that ever gets redefined. Not the Zombies

matrix600:
Proove that I proved you right

Oh that's simple: I did say that Atheists (most, not all) hate being put in tight corners during arguments; they tend to get unnecessarily antagonistic. U happened to do just that.

And I'd love to continue this banter with u but u already gave me the wrong signals as stated above. Means u won't be very good with arguments. Sorry

matrix600:
Your post is filled with fallacy. So many hasty generalizations. I will not prove you wrong when you have not submitted anything worth proving wrong.

Who argues with a fallacious thinkers..

Ironic tho, that with such a bitterly antagonistic attitude to a rather "general" post, uve already proved me right

orunto27:
Such is Life. There are at least two stages in every aspect of life. The Amatuer stage and the Professional stage. The Atheists, The Agnostics and The Believers all pass through these stages.
The Believers' Professional stage is when they become "Born Again". That is when they have now seen and encountered who they believe in.

Hmmm....what are the other professional stages?

CoolUsername:


Every other person simply enjoys customized labeling while you alone know the truth. I get it.

Look, I can't be bothered if u choose to think for urself or follow MASS opinions. But I do my own thinking. capisce? Plus u keep trying to put words in my mouth in order to judge me. Am I offending u by debunking ur RIGID beliefs? Lol. Take it easy

matrix600:
Bros, na you dem ask? Besides you clearly do not know the difference between an atheist and a scientist, you're equating atheism to science... SMH.

PROVE. ME. WRONG.

ameri9ja:


What a wrte-up! Gives so much food for thought.
The only thing is that it is based on the likely faulty assumption that your brain (with which u r reasoning all this) was designed to perceive reality as it truly is. That's why religion is superior. It makes no such assumption. It's "proof" comes from a reality outside our own. A reality beyond our human comprehension, logic, and science.

1. What is this religion's esoteric "proof" of which you speak? Id like to understand you.

2. From what I know so far, religion bases it's doctrines on ancient teachings of God/Allah, while always whitewashing or ignoring his perceived shortcomings (things he did that they *secretly* do not approve) in their bid to assume perfection for a POSSIBLY imperfect deity. This is an ASSUMPTION! So how is religion any Superior?

BigShazam:
Just take your time and enjoy your life to the fullest.

If man is in search of knowledge, he can simple Bleep an animal because he is not knowing. And feel it is right.

Steal in public in Oshodi market and walk off or even engage in bloody rituals and won't be visited by demons.

This supreme knowledge is the unknown spiritual knowledge call 'Fronesis' in Greek meaning the precise knowing of God. Some say it is a voice inside that tells you the difference between good and bad.

You are angry because some know and understand God's personality and you don't.

Every religion emanated from the seven books of Moses which is part of the Bible. An intellectual can only know what he reads.

The spirit man judges all.

Wow! U said so much that I got​ lost.

Angry? Lol. Atheists are usually the angry ones, not Agnostics. Oh and those people don't actually know God parse, they just follow some ancient books.

And finally, right and wrong are things of the conscience. Humans don't need, and should not depend on "knowledge" or "holy books" to know the difference.

CoolUsername:


Funny how you think you know better than all the parties involved.

There's a difference between knowledge and understanding. Whoever claims to KNOW so much is obviously lost in delusion. But the ability to UNDERSTAND is a gift naturally bestowed on some. I understand that u either believe, don't believe, or are uncertain. Simple! Even those who have never heard about God are considered UNBELIEVERS by default, until they are educated, and may then believe, not believe, or be skeptical! This is fact. So "all the other parties" can KNOW whatever they like. They Simply enjoy the drama of CUSTOMISED LABELLING. Lol.

orunto27:
Atheists think they KNOW.
Agnostics are SEARCHING FOR KNOWLEDGE.
Believers know that KNOWLEDGE is God and THINKING is a Process- Spirit of God's Life.
Believers also know that Searching is a Spirit synonymous with Thinking.
In other words, Searching, Thinking, Knowing and Success in all these are Spirits of God that the Agnostic is searching for and the Atheist is keeping aside.
Believers know that God is Wisdom, Knowledge, Understanding, Feeling, Thinking, Reasoning and Success of all these.

Hmmm...nice perspective I'd like to understand more. However, I simply think a typical believer is naive and devoid of logical reasoning on the subject of God. Theres a powerful admonition that says: do not question things of God! which is what spiritual leaders use to numb even the otherwise intellectual believers. So I honestly doubt typical believers are that AWARE, as u credit them here.

CoolUsername:


This means you basically have no argument. If you classify Richard Dawkins as an agnostic when he calls himself an atheist then you can clearly see how wrong you are.

Learn the terms.

Again, not necessary. No matter what dictionary u are using, there will always be THREE groups: the believers, the unbelievers, and the skepticals. All those sub-groups are just a waste of time and brainpower. Not needed.

Seun:

Scientists don't know where the concentrated ball of matter that exploded at the beginning of time came from. They are very clear about that. Very few people are saying that it "came from nothing" or that it was "random". Nobody knows whether "something" preceded it or not.

The big bang theory is not a dogma for atheists. It doesn't interest me as much as the theory of evolution, for example. But when theists claim that God is the only explanation for the universe around us, we have to point them in that direction. Cosmology has very convincing explanations of how galaxies, stars, planets, moons, etc were formed through the natural laws of physics, for example. If only it wasn't so boring.


Thumbs up!


Sometimes scientific educators are a bit over-zealous; presenting hypotheses based on limited evidence as if they are hard facts, but most scientists will freely admit that some so-called theories that are really just hypotheses e.g. that wacky theory about infinite universes.

Im happy you agree that science can be overzealous. You see, that is the ONLY part thats irritating; they speak as tho what they say is fact, when it is indeed nothing but postulations- and the world blindly believes them just because they are so far our greatest resource for practical Knowledge. Just look at how many people consider the big bang a FACT! Is this not the same way religion operates?? If we are to be honest with ourselves, science is at it's core IGNORANT TOO! All science has ever done is TRY to understand/explain/utilize elements of Nature. Of course this is good for mankind- I mean, using gas to cook beats smokey firewood any day! But that doesn't mean they know enough to start confidently misleading the world again with their ignorant ideas about how the world began. They did this with their Flat Earth theory, then Atomic theory, both of which they themselves have now debunked as ridiculous! So my question is, why do they still draw these ignorant conclusions?? Why not just let the world understand that they don't know enough yet. Is it ego? Cos I sincerely believe science collectively has HUGE ego.

ArcFresky:
Some people will come and be saying only God can help us...

Naa God vote saraki and co into govt?

Anyways, Hope is faint for Nigeria, as long as the supposed educated youths continue shouting "NCAN, Afonja" and other nonsense.

Honestly the youth are the most annoying group; formally educated, yet totally illiterate at heart. Its like all their parents were too busy trying to make ends meet instead of teaching them baisc tenets of Rights, Wrongs, and Reasoning. They are actually the ones that make me dispair. #hopeless

joyAA:
For what its worth, this is enlightening

Atheists are always soooo damn feisty
Like they on their period whenever you mention God n stuff

Some believers sef dey tire person. Be fighting and practically bearing false witness for God in situations especially when it comes to saying some miracles.

But anyhow, to each his own

I'm an unrepentant believer in God and the Lordship of Jesus.


Yessss # Jesus loves me!!!

Lol. at least u're not a Robobeliever! Also, believing in God has been helping people since the beginning of religion so it can't be that bad. It's only those lousy robots u described that make it annoying.

hopefulLandlord:
can you mention one popular atheist based on your own definition? I'll wait

Oh Im not a very good source for such info, as I seldom waste my time following, listening to, or debating with Atheists cos in my mind it's just like doing such with a Christian fanatic or Catholic or Jihadist- it's futile! I discuss with Agnostics. But Google is your friend. Also, try looking up the definition. You wud find that it is categorized into three parts, but in essence, it is simply disbelief! Deliberate or otherwise. See the op and the context in which I described Atheists.

hopefulLandlord:
Theism/atheism speaks to what you *believe*. Gnosticism/agnosticism speaks to what you *know*. One can claim to be a gnostic theist (very common), an agnostic theist (far less common but not unusual), an agnostic atheist (virtually all atheists are this), or a gnostic atheist (these are incredibly rare, and will usually clarify their position by stating that they only take this position regards to specific god claims, as Matt Dillahunty does). Richard Dawkins, easily the most famous atheist advocate, calls himself an agnostic atheist, because he does not believe, but he does not claim to know for certain.

I myself claim to be mostly an agnostic atheist. To the specific claim of the Abrahamic god, I will go so far as to claim gnostic atheism - not because of any special knowledge on my part, but simply because I have yet to hear a description of this deity that passes so much as basic logical coherence. There may yet be a god - but if we do discover one someday, it most likely won't be the one the bible/Koran/Torah/Mormon etc talks about.

The mistake most people make on the subject. There's no need to sub-group these groups. From your last paragraph for instance, you are simply an Agnostic! If anyone says with assurance that deities don't exist, he or she is simply Atheist! and the rest, peddling one god or the other, are simply Believers! It's as simple as that.

MOST HUMANS TYPICALLY FALL INTO ONE OF THESE GROUPS:

The believers- a closed mind FOR God.

This group is made up of...sheep. Very gullible and docile, born to believe Stuff. If you remove one of ur your car Tyres, put it on an alter and cover part of it with a white cloth (u can use ur bedsheets) then claim that God confided in you that he wud now begin answering prayers through that Tyre since he now lives in the Tyre, this group would flock to you! You, the Pastor or Imam or whatever, would suddenly become their go-to guy for instructions and direction whether scriptural or otherwise. You pretty much become their god- only they won't call you that! Next the fanatic ones would go about repeating your bogus claims as though they were there when it happened, and condemning​ everyone else who doesn't buy it. If there's a God, even he probably wouldn't fancy this bunch so much- just like a guy wouldn't fancy a girlfriend who can't think for herself and just fooolishly agrees to every dumb thing anyone claims he Said or did.


The atheists- a closed mind AGAINST God.

This group consists of intellectuals and deep thinkers who are simply repulsed by the gullibility of the first group. They are actually VERY interested in the idea of God, but after searching and researching Religious claims, and finding nothing other than a seemingly Genocidal drama queen *cough paraded as The Supreme Being by the Holy books, they got fed up in their heart and decided it's best to just bury the whole idea of a supreme being for the sake of their own sanity! But this group often take their denial a bit too far; sometimes ignoring ELEPHANTS in rooms in favor of anti-supreme-being theories. Nothing makes sense to them unless it's AGAINST the existence of a deity. They seem a little too determined to deny God that one begins to suspect their true motives- perhaps daddy issues? The "Daddy" being... a God they're secretly searching for? Lol. The Christian fanatic, the Jihadist and the Atheist all have extremism in common.


The agnostics- an open mind on the subject of God.

This is a balanced group and the most amiable of all three. They are like Atheists WITHOUT the extremism! They believe it's possible that a supreme being exists but they havent found convincing evidence (The Holy books deity is kinda wierd for a Supreme being, and the big bang theory is just that- a freaking THEORY with little to no real evidence besides more hypothesis) so they just keep an open mind about the whole thing. You'll find them practicing things like yoga, meditation, neo-religions, or even some religions ocassionally, and always willing to listen to your​ opinion on the subject of God. Whether you're claiming that God is the atmosphere or he is in your pocket, the Agnostics are likely to first hear u out. And even if they don't buy it eventually, they would at least consider it or muse over it before discarding it and going their way. Unlike believers who would condemn you to doom, or Atheists who would deny elephants in the room.


Among these three, if any is closest to truth, it is the Agnostics- for they accept that they do not know, which is the very path to knowledge.

Am I the only one who feels such strong distaste for Nigeria that is actually born of LOVE? Lemme explain the feeling;

I often AVOID the subject of Nigeria completely because it always burns my heart so deeply whenever I think about it- as I could actually sacrifice my time, energy and everything if I thought there was a chance of making a difference- even if just for future generations' sake. But my better judgement says the chance is too slim to even bother. Is this why I often feel like leaving on a one-way ticket? Could this be why several other straight thinking (Not overly tribalistic, sentimental, or religious) Nigerians have also decamped and completely turned their backs on Nigeria?


Nigeria's problems run so deep it's depressing. It's not the government or the economy, its the people! Nigerians, just like the rest of Africans, are our own plague 100%. The typical Nigerian sees EVERYTHING through three lens: Tribalistic lens, Sentimental lens and Religious lens. Which is why they never see a Spade as JUST a spade. It's either "That Yoruba Shovel" or "Our ancestors' instrument" or "The islamic weapon" but never just the SPADE that it is. This is the root of all our issues. If a monster was terrorizing a city, one could devote a lifetime to hunting down and killing this monster. But what do u do when the monster lives inside the hearts of it's victims?? How do u kill it?? Wouldn't it be wise to just pack up your good will and.... abandon ship?? Just let the whole thing self-destruct with time??


But what about future generations? If our parents and grandparents hadn't abandoned ship in their time, would we be facing a horrible economy today? Would we be embarrassed of our green passports whenever we're offshore? Would we be trying so hard to impress foreigners just to win their favors or permits or passports? Would our ladies be tripple-dating like professional prostitutes just to make ends meet? Would our society resort to celebrating criminals and scammers and ritualists out of sheer frustration with the system?? We are in this mess today because our PARENTS AND GRANDPARENTS WERE IRRESPONSIBLE!! They ran when they should have stood for our sake. They gave the bad eggs free reign, and now the bad eggs have so multiplied that it's hard to even see the good eggs among us.


But we too are doing the same now in our time, grabbing our bags and decamping, giving the bad eggs more free reign! Why? Is it that IMPOSSIBLE to help the situation? If the adults are too corrupt to redeem, can't we teach the younger ones how to THINK and see things​ straight? Is there nobody interested in showing the younger generations​ that scamming people is horrible, that there are Honorable ways to seek a living, that they have RIGHTS which must be respected in their own country, that power outage is NOT a normal thing, and that commuting on bad roads is NOT acceptable in a wealthy country like Nigeria?? Are we just going to fold our arms and claim it's the status quo? Why is it that people who have enough money never care to initiate sensitization projects like these? Are we all this selfish that we just don't care as long as we're okay? ...............What is wrong with us as a people?


I AM SERIOUSLY ASKING, FROM ALL I'VE SAID AND FROM ALL THAT YOU ALREADY KNOW OR THOUGHT ABOUT, DO YOU THINK THERES ANY HOPE FOR A BETTER NIGERIA?? IS THERE REALLY ANYTHING WE CAN DO TO HELP (Besides complaining or "praying" for a better future) OR SHOULD WE JUST GO AHEAD AND BUY MORE ONE-WAY PLANE TICKETS, LEAVING NIGERIA TO SELF-DESTRUCT?

OtemAtum:


What if the name of what brings everything into existence is not God, but something else, will atheists not eventually be right in their own respect? When the first cause resulted into everything, was it called by the name God? I[b] don't think atheists deny that something resulted into their being, but what I think is that they don't like the first cause to be called 'God' because that name 'God' has been so much abused that it/he/she would be better not to be in existence at all[/b]. I don't know what the stance of the atheists is about how everything came to being, but whatever they accept as the first cause is the creator to them, and what if they are right?

If this were the atheist argument, wouldn't it be respectable? Lol. Unfortunately, this is more like the agnostic argument. Atheists simply deny the existence of any deity or supreme being (Yahweh, God, Tomato, whatever) and rather go with scientific explanations (which is where the big bang theory usually comes in). THEIR ARGUMENT IS MORE LIKE LIVING​ IN BLATANT DENIAL cos sometimes they get very illogical just to defend it. Like, u snap ur fingers and someone gets a siezure and they say "oh that must have been a coincidence" Then u snap ur fingers again and another person gets a siezure and they still go with coincidence just because they don't want to believe/concede that u have supernatural abilities. See where their argument becomes irritating? The agnostic thinks he's on the same page with the atheist until he suddenly realises that the atheist is actually just hell-bent on denying God, while he just wants to know the truth- very different ambitions!


OtemAtum I see u also have questions in ur mind. U know, I've always said the best way to understand something deeper is to teach it. The little time I've spent writing replies on this thread has opened my mind to a new dimension of thought contrary to what I previous believed. Let me tell u something I just figured out maybe it wud help u understand better. Just take ur time to read:


Actually, we humans overthink the subject of God. We search everywhere except one place- within. We think like mature intelligent beings instead​ of going back to the basics of life in order to find answers about the basis of life. The best answers would be found studying babies and nature and pure creation, not by thinking through our already-biased minds. Afterall, u can tell a bit about an author's personality by reading his/her books, and about an inventor's character by observing his/her inventions, not by THINKING! There's​ a reason why of all the intelligent people who have walked this Earth, no one has ever been able to solve the puzzle. Its because the maker of the puzzle is a cheif puzzler who explicitly doesn't want us (his creation) to figure him out. Wait, don't overthink this too. Lemme explain:


I am a scientist who created a sentient (capable of thinking, planning and creating) robot. Would I want this smart robot to one day figure me out? Would I not try to be as mysterious as possible to prevent a possible backfire? Even if my robot are quite inferior to me, I still have to take precautions. Is this not the same thing we humans are afraid of about creating intelligent Robots? Lol.


Now, what would I do? I would deliberately limit this robot's life span so that it never lives long enough to be WISE enough to figure me out. I would plant misdirections everywhere so that when it seeks knowledge of me it would always get frustrated and give up on the subject. I would create intermittent self-initiating catastrophe to keep my smart robot busy. I would also create several other distractions in it's world (love, purpose, destiny etc) all to keep it occupied over it's lifespan. And no matter how personal I get with my robot, I'd never fully reveal myself to it, for it can use the knowledge of me against me!


This has been our mistake as seekers. We shud start thinking like creators in order to understand creation. The Bible is a great book of sacred knowledge, but it is also a very giant puzzle filled with riddles, misdirections and hidden Truths. Good luck to any man who always reads the Bible LITERALLY. Lol. There's a reason why Jesus always used parables- he's kinda like the creator, and they are really fond of riddles and misdirections he and his dad...or boss (Lol. yes I'm being facetious). Now let me shock you- there is NO perfection in the whole universe. This is one of the Bible tricks, to get mankind searching for a perfect God instead of a supernatural MAN-LIKE being. If u can find my previous replies I gave examples of how the Bible mixes real events with fiction for the sake of their personal agenda- which is what confuses us about God. Truth is, God is like man with SUPER powers. He has vulnerabilities, just like any other scientist genius.


When we created the computer, it developed bugs. When God created the universe, it developed bugs. Look around you, this world has errors (bugs) in it, which mean the inventor, like any other inventor, isn't perfect! At first the creator tried to debug his system, but it had been corrupted beyond redemption that the only way wud be to destroy and rebuild. But building the universe may not have been an easy task for the creator, and no, he isn't as "omnipotent" as the Bible paints. He's just like..say.. heaven Steve Jobs. He's a boss and a genuis and all, but not omnipotent parse. Hes intelligent beyond measure, but not omniscient. So you can actually advice God on what to do next or even negotiate with the creator (Moses did the first, Abraham did the second). But chances are, his ideas wud still be better cos he's super smart- I mean, u designed the computer, he designed the freaking universe in which u exist so *coughs. But he's NOT omniscient. So is it possible that God wud regret something? Absolutely!


Am I saying we can actually challenge God? Yes!! But, you know, you have to have like a very solid death wish to launch such a campaign. Lol.


We humans are pathetic. We are the greatest hypocrites of the Galaxy. We have a problem thinking outside the box once our selfish interest is involved. Why do we think it's okay to eat chickens and cows? Even if ur a vegan, why do we think it's okay to eat plants?...because, Duhh! They're food! Right. Okay. So we can eat stuff we can't​ even create, but God DOESN'T HAVE THE RIGHT TO EAT WHAT HE CREATED An ordinary KING or PRESIDENT​ can command the execution of a whole nation of fellow humans which he cannot even create, But HOW DARE GOD COMMAND EXECUTIONS OF ROBOTS HE CREATED Why do we think this way? Its because we overthink God. We expect perfection from God, but if there are bugs in the system God created then it means he ISN'T perfect, hence we can't just demand/expect perfection from him the same way we can't expect perfection from the makers of iPhones or cars or you name it!


Tell u what, if I created smart robots who began doing stuff on their own sometimes even against me or against my will, chances are I'd love some, hate some, kill some, defend some, punish some for others, be indifferent to some, use some as scapegoats to teach lessons to the ones I like, use some as experiment just for fun, because I freaking created them! I have every damned right to do whatsoever I Please! But if they rebelled and waged war against me, I won't be surprised either since I know I created self-sufficient beings who have my kind of crazy creative swag.


So, the secret is this, stop seeking a perfect flawless creator that is sooo Superior in swag and is omnibullsh!t bla bla bla as the Bible misleads, and start accepting in ur heart that the one who made us is in many ways JUST LIKE US- an imperfect genius-thinker being that, if u think about it, would make a very good friend!

OtemAtum:

I am not an atheist, but we have been existing right from the invention of time and space and we don't cease from existing, but we change state.

IMO, atheists are even more intelligent than theists, because in their search for GOD, they didn't settle down to accept dogs(gods of bad religions) as the CREATOR GOD. It is like when we say food does not exist because we don't know the nature of food yet, and in a bid to prove that food exists, you bring shit and ask us to eat it as food and believe it is food. Those who rejects such shit and keep looking out for a better presentation are better than those who settle down to eat those bitter shits which they are forced to accept as food.

This is the case with yahweh, Allah, Mazda and many other bad gods presented to us as God Almighty. The nature of God is far far different than the nature of the small small gods I mentioned above. So it is better for atheists to die as atheists and then know the truth about the real CREATOR in their afterlives than to accept dogs such as yahweh, allah etc as God Almighty and then be told that they have totally lived a life of error.

I like ur submission. It pretty much sums up the whole point. Tho I wud point out that u seem to be describing agnostics, not atheist. Atheist are simply the opposite of believers- unbelievers. They are like the south pole of the "belief" magnet, while theists are the North Pole of this same magnet. They are, sadly, just as ignorant as believers, since they also "blindly" believe there's no God WITHOUT evidence to unequivocally PROVE that God doesn't exist (cough **so how are u different from Christianity and Islam. U shud have ur own customised anti-religion Religion so that y'all can fight all day**). I do not personally respect this group, as I regard them with skepticism- in their intelligence they have also resorted to foolery.

Agnostics on the other hand, are the true seekers of truth. They neither agree nor disagree to the existence of a supreme being, only they won't settle for dumb science theories or bullsh!t doctrines unless u supply them with sensible evidence. In the absence of this evidence, the quest goes on, and no conclusions would be drawn. Period.


P.s: The bloody big bang theory should be morphed into a brand new religion too. Maybe then these science-hogging atheists wud realize they've also fallen prey to the brainwash system. Bloody stuupid baseless theory. Something science obviously resorted to for the lack of better alternatives! I mean, this is almighy science we're talking about; they have to come up with some explanation or they'll lose face! Then u hog it like it actually makes any sense, intelligent folks like you?? That theory is shiit, and u shud reject it for what it is while continuing ur seach for something that actually MAKES SENSE! Not gulp it down in servile surrender just cos it came from almighty science. I insist u aren't any better than the gullible religious folk.

@ameri9ja I think by now u already Know where I stand on this subject. There's a supreme being/source alright, but I doubt he's that melodramatic, insecure, inconsistent and misleading Hebrew Yahweh. If a BEING created this universe, I would expect him/her/it to be more......coordinated.