shadeyinka:

I think I have explained the "loving!" to you: and you may choose to misunderstand it. It doesn't change anything. I understand that your misunderstanding is based on a false premise of a view that "the size of God" is comparable to that of man. Unfortunately, not. He's is vastly different from us.

If you cultured yoghurt bacteria, do you have to explain to anyone what you do to both the yoghurt and the bacteria therein?

You actually sound angry over the "arrogance of God"! Why should He...!? At least for you, you can see that your choice isn't just based on intellectual conclusion BUT emotional! Why should one get emotional over what doesn't exist?

If I told you that you are actually under the influence of a spiritual virus, you wouldn't agree because nothing will convince you.

And like I said, the love of God to His children is unconditional. However, not all Gods creations are His children.

shadeyinka:

I think your emphasis now is on the character of God ,"loving"!
The word "loving" cannot be overstretched beyond reason.

It is understandable if God loves His own "children" unconditionally.
But can God love all His creations unconditionally?

If God is Just: He must punish wickedness!...even from His
own Children

Are all humans children of God?
The answer is a big NO!

shadeyinka:


The tree of knowledge of good and evil was not just a test, it was a means of selection of creations with a certain trait.
Is it possible to have the gift of Volition and yet be denied the opportunity of exercising it? If God wanted robots, your option would have been a great idea.

I wouldn't even recommend my church to you..cause we have our own weaknesses. I don't go to scoan, I'm not their member. I don't even endorse them but I'm willing to recommend you to scrutinize "bizarre" occurrences their. You'll find a lot on YouTube but the best is a visitation if you can.

There are many living churches especially in Nigeria. With the minority reports, don't just wave them away: they show at best that maybe our five senses are not sufficient to understanding the universe AND that demons and spiritual forces exist.

misteradey:


You’ve made your point clear and in a respectful way. I really appreciate that. I believe in evolution. It is the basis of life. You can say it’s man’s main purpose. In the same way I believe in the supreme being. Which is God. You mentioned man’s evolution from zygotes, this theory makes sense. But you never mentioned how this zygote came to be. Think about a fruit hanging from a tree. You ask the fruit about the origin. It says “ oh. I originated from This tree. This tree grew all the way from a small branch to a huge tree and it produced me.” But this fruit never makes reference to the seed planter because it knows nothing of the planter. The fruit does not understand anything other than itself and the shrubs around it. The fruit has no idea it was down for a reason. This can be a representation of what man is. Man was created by a being. A being so enormous, so intelligent no man can understand the being’s ways. The ways of the supreme being is beyond human reasoning even the smartest scientists you’ve been talking about call the beginning a Big Bang theory. Something unexplainable. But man’s ego wouldn’t want him to believe something out there is greater than he is so man comes up with theories.

Danhumprey:
I don't know how the religious apologists can explain or rationalize Satan's origin. A supposedly all-knowing God, who knew the end from the beginning and the beginning from the end, created Satan, an angel in heaven. And when Satan rebelled, he cast him down to Earth, knowing fully well what Satan will do to man in the garden and spoil everything. How these religious folks tend to rationalize this is simply beyond me.

Always quick to shift the blame for evils to Satan, forgetting who created Satan and has the power to destroy Satan once and for all.

theoriginalgood:


Facts are facts amigo. There’s no way a good God would create beings that produce unwanted poop, urine, sweat, body odors etc.

Humanity would soon be eradicated by God because God hates all evil. It hasn’t happened yet because it’s like cooking a meal. It’s only ready after sometime with the fire and not immediately you apply the fire.

shadeyinka:

Adam and Eve!

The summary is that Volition must be tested if it truly given. But there are consequences of misuse of Volition.

Who planted the "tree" of the knowledge of good and evil in the garden? God!
Why?

Volition of man must be tested?

The question really is: did God know that man would fail? Yes!
From the resulting chaos, some are chosen while others rejected. Like I said: the earth is an exam field.

What does God want,: creatures who out of their free will and Volition choose to Love and Trust Him.

Was man really an infant?
Man was spiritual alive hence not really a baby. He may not understand the full implication of his action though. It's like falling into the hands of a 419 after you have been warned.


I didn't dispute that Europeans brought Christianity to Africa but Christianity didn't originate in Europe. They were just tools of propagation of the religion.


I can't show you minority reports, I can only point you in some general direction to look.

I do not endorse any one of these:

1. Near death experiences
2. Deliverances and healing (scoan)
3. Sumerian knowledge of the planets
4. Peruvian skulls
5. Occultism (third eye)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZtLkzg8bFgA



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rC7xZmLcOeY

If you are in Nigeria, go to scoan..things happen that may not be easy to act planned script. (You wanted something compelling)

Are these evidences? No! Not at all. But ....

Most churches operate far below their spiritual capacity. Many are even dead. And some are business outfits of 419s who call themselves pastors.

shadeyinka:

I didn't say that.
I can only assume that Gods judgement on those would be fair



Let's assume that God decides to annihilate some people who doesn't fit into His mould. Would that be wickedness? (I don't know what would be their fate: the scriptures did not elaborate other than they would be judged according to their conscience)


Less intelligent people can be excused bit not the very intelligent ones.

The intelligent once want to put God into a certain kind of mould, and when God doesn't fit in: the rebel against Him.

I spoke about minority reports: intelligent people will always by choice decide to ignore it. They will never try to understand things if it differs from the high end academic theories.


I for instance think critically: and the scriptures make sense to me. BUT, I also have subjective experience of God and the spirit realm. No argument can take that away from me.

Every atheist who sincerely looks at minority report usually have a rethink.

shadeyinka:


Not really!

What of the students are not willing to learn? Would knowledge be forced into their heads?

Human beings could be wicked. The evil than we can do even Satan will cringe! It doesn't mean all are bad: hence a need for selection. As long as we submit ourselves to doing evil, evil will consume humanity.

Did God create a defective product?
No!
Satan introduce the virus of sin to us and so we are infected.

What you see is the effect of the consequence of Volition given to man.

My religious beliefs didn't come from Europe: but the Europeans did a lot in propagating it.

alBHAGDADI:


Were people not doing it before Christian civilization? Are people not practicing incest today?

Romans 3:20
for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

budaatum:

Interesting. Determined by what, exactly? The Determiner perhaps, or some Almighty God, to give it a name? Pray tell where the Determiner informed buda of what was "determined"?

Determinism is the philosophical idea that all events, including moral choices, are determined completely by previously existing causes. Determinism is at times understood to preclude free will because it entails that humans cannot act otherwise than they do.

I think a thing determined is a thing that is inevitable, hence, my existence is inevitable since I exist. But as stated in my response to my Lord, we look at today (my existence) and claim it was determined by yesterday (which it was to the very large extent of something ma and pa did 'yesterday'), but the truth is that my existence is more like the throwing of a coin where heads or tails has nothing to do with the previous throw apart from the dice being in the hand that's throwing it (before you ask why tomorrow can't be Friday!). If I did not exist, even you would have been doing something else right now instead of reading what buda wrote.

Question though. Is buda saying existence is by chance or existence is determined? Just imagine all that one sperm swimming towards an egg to form buda. Just one tiny variation in conditions (pa not liking ma enough to make buda for instance, or the bed being in a different room with a different temperature, etc) and the sperm and egg that produced buda could have produced a different person or no one at all if even they did not exist or had not met.

It all looks like its predetermined, is my point, after the fact, however.

alBHAGDADI:


You find it disgusting right?

Your friends want us to throw away the law that prohibits doing that.

Now, who's disgusting?

alBHAGDADI:


You find it disgusting right?

Your friends want us to throw away the law that prohibits doing that.

Now, who's disgusting?

shadeyinka:


Why wouldn't God save all humans?
It's like asking why a teacher didn't make all his students pass.

I've said it again and again: the earth is a school. We pass or fail due to how we have served the need of God. Why hasn't God touched others? Perhaps He has but they choose to be stubborn. Did I see an Angel to believe? No! I didn't see anything spectacular. I desired to find Him and I did.


I believe you still remember the parable of the Sower.

The word of God will certainly be meaningless to some people.
The word will be accepted by some people but it wouldn't last because it was just at an emotional level
The word of God will be accepted by others and due to the love of the world and pleasure, the word is sacrificed
And for others the word of God will grow to bear fruit, such God desires.

Why should the wickedness of man be blamed on God? Man decided to invent weapons of mass destruction using the intelligence given to them by God and we still turn round to accuse Him of not coming down to stop the wars.

Could it not be that we as humans gave our lives over to Satan to rule. And when destruction comes we turn around to blame God. As they say "Guns do not kill, People do!"


Of course, Christianity will almost die out. It has been prophesied in the scriptures. It's not surprising at all: not surprising.

About speaking to atheists. I have spoken to tonnes of them. To my opinion, most are disappointed and dissatisfied with the church. Looks like the church is a big scam...and of course seeing that Christians seem not to be superhuman in any ways. A minority among them do so because "God didn't hear their prayers". Most of them however became atheists on coming to the developed world and finding that they are not a tenth as religious as we are yet things are working fine. Three out of four of their friends would either be atheists or agnostics at best.

I understand!
I was to live in Europe. I would choose my close associations carefully... So that I don't get infected with the virus ...LOL���

budaatum:

How can one honestly claim the "universe is deterministic"? Does anyone honestly believe their existence is already determined?

shadeyinka:

If I was Born in India or South Korea, the probability of knowing God is slim. And that's why, "by grace, I am saved: not of myself, it's a gift of God.


Not exactly!
Those who did not know but acted their life in the goodness of their pure conscience are judged according to that standard. The scriptures did not say exactly what befalls them but I assume not of evil.

Saved from Hell!? Yes

"IN My Father's house there are many mansions..."


It's your choice! Because every man chooses at a point to reject the message of God. People are analytic biases not withstanding. The conscience of such a person will say this is the way until the person by his will chooses to override his conscience.

Interestingly, the more critical and intelligent people choose to ignorance the minority report.
Like Evidence of Life after death
Supernatural events
Statistical odds
Gaps in knowledge etc

There is always as excuse that "it can be replicated in the laboratory"! Skepticism will prevent them to open their eyes to see.


I have explained this above.

A lot of things are beyond us!
The family we are born in, the country from where we are born, the genetic pool from which we take ours, our strength, height, health, wealth etc.

shadeyinka:

If I was Born in India or South Korea, the probability of knowing God is slim. And that's why, "by grace, I am saved: not of myself, it's a gift of God.


Not exactly!
Those who did not know but acted their life in the goodness of their pure conscience are judged according to that standard. The scriptures did not say exactly what befalls them but I assume not of evil.

Saved from Hell!? Yes

"IN My Father's house there are many mansions..."


It's your choice! Because every man chooses at a point to reject the message of God. People are analytic biases not withstanding. The conscience of such a person will say this is the way until the person by his will chooses to override his conscience.

Interestingly, the more critical and intelligent people choose to ignorance the minority report.
Like Evidence of Life after death
Supernatural events
Statistical odds
Gaps in knowledge etc

There is always as excuse that "it can be replicated in the laboratory"! Skepticism will prevent them to open their eyes to see.


I have explained this above.

A lot of things are beyond us!
The family we are born in, the country from where we are born, the genetic pool from which we take ours, our strength, height, health, wealth etc.

OpenYourEyes1:


What do employees do with the money?

Servants also trade their time for food, shelter and clothing

MuttleyLaff:
Let those be your passions, interest, rituals you religiously thrive at and do. If you do those, you advertently or inadvertently, are obeying and/or doing the commands of Jesus, that will guarantee you a safe haven

OpenYourEyes1:


Modern employees are bought (technically)

alBHAGDADI:


Is the Bible talking about little children when it speaks of children?

Again, didn't I tell you that if you sell your children, it is no crime for them to be bought and owned?

That's why I advised you against procreating when you can't cater for them.

OpenYourEyes1:


“ Anyone who kidnaps someone is to be put to death, whether the victim has been sold or is still in the kidnapper’s possession." Exodus 21:16

OpenYourEyes1:


" If your brother with you becomes so poor that he sells himself to you, you are not to make him serve like a bond slave. Instead, he is to serve with you like a hired servant or a traveler who lives with you, until the year of jubilee. Then he and his children with him may leave to return to his family and his ancestor’s inheritance. Since they’re my servants whom I’ve brought out of the land of Egypt, they are not to be sold as slaves." - - Leviticus 25:39-42

MuttleyLaff:
I am pleased you acknowlege this fact and truth.

Not just and/or only psychopaths, but true still, because if the conscience is not clear and good, then it must have gone defective then

Love actually is the highest virtue, however the religion you are advised to follow is empathy and/or compassion. These are what you are advised to religiously be doing, as in having and/or showing compassion or empathy

They are the only true pure religion and that is approved of by God

Obeying and/or doing the commands of Jesus will save Dhumancanvas

MuttleyLaff:
I know of people born in India, who happen to be believers and/or christians though Dhumancanvas

Who put that conscience there in you, Dhumancanvas?
Depending Dhumancanvas, on whether you have a clear and good conscience, your salvation is guaranteed

Faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God Dhumancanvas.

The only religion that is true, pure, one that God approves and finds no fault in it, that you follow fully is to show compassion and/or empathy

Religion takes different shapes and forms, has different passions, interest, rituals etcetera. Christianity, Hinduism, Islam, Buddhism, New Age, Scientology, Paganism, TAR, etcetera too are religions. Also for some, sports, like football or hockey is a religion. For others and/or some, fashion too is a religion and atheism too funnily enough, as well, is a religion however there is only one true and pure religion, that is faultless. So let's call a spade, a spade, as nobody, not even you Dhumancanvas, can find a fault in empathy and/or with compassion.

It is organised religion(s), like for example, Christianity, before you latch on to that that Karl Marx comment, that is called the opium of the people, and not empathy and/or compassion, that is pure, true and without faults Dhumancanvas

Be rest assured that God is fair and just. Nobody gets going to where they dont deserve to be. Even your conscience will agree with whatever judgement is pronounced on you.

alBHAGDADI:




Where are children bought and sold as servants in the old testament?

alBHAGDADI:


It's okay to beat an erring servant. The degree of offense is what determines the level of punishment. But no matter what, if the servant dies, the master will be punished for it. That alone will caution the master from inflicting the kind of punishment that may lead to death.

Didn't you get flogged at school?

alBHAGDADI:


Where does it say little children? - if that's what you are implying.

Aren't children sold today as housemaids or househelps? Aren't they the same?

alBHAGDADI:


So what's your point exactly that I haven't answered in the previous post?

alBHAGDADI:


Stop using Bible translations other than the King James Version. Other Bible translations are Satan's handwork designed to create confusion.

The translation you used spoke of slave as if the Bible condones slavery. It makes it look like the Bible supports the trans Atlantic slavery.

But the KJV speaks of servant. Servants do get punished today. Even though it doesn't occur in cooperate offices, it occurs in brown collar jobs.


Exodus 21:20-22 King James Version (KJV)
And if a man smite his servant, or his maid, with a rod, and he die under his hand; he shall be surely punished.
Notwithstanding, if he continue a day or two, he shall not be punished: for he is his money.

Please stay away from all those other Bible versions, especially the NIV, they are Satan's playbook he uses to confuse believers. Read the thread below for more understanding.

https://www.nairaland.com/4957299/bible-sword-butter-knife-why

I believe I've answered your questions by showing how a false bible misled you into thinking that slaver was condoned.

Where are children bought and sold as servants in the old testament?

alBHAGDADI:


Where are children bought and sold as servants in the old testament?