Myer:


Lol great advice. Let's not speak of the "mistakes and evils" of God in the Bible. Let's only talk about the good side.

But do you know God admitted making mistake?
When the Bible says "it repented God that he created man" just before the flood, what is your meaning of this?

Honestly, just as it's impossible to convince a victim of abuse that her batterer husband is evil because she's blinded by love, I don't expect to convince you. I'm only speaking as someone who is unbiased and irreligious about the Bible. Love is beyond Christianity and it's blindening. Be it the love of romance, religion, money, friendship, etc.

You know this discussion we've been having for months now would easily reach a valid conclusion if only you can manifest the gifts of the spirit since you already know that's my major bone of contention.

But I know you'll always have an evasive response that will only drag this further.

Your submission is still full of error of improper reading. You aren't listening to that. When you are ready to start reading properly I will be available to help.

You are still reading the scriptures like someone reading Facebook post. That's why you are getting your misinterpretation.

Bible interpretation is a serious matter. The scriptures acceptance and understanding is not based on emojis or retweets like social media posts. It rest on humble heart and a diligent spirit. I am not sure social medialist like you appreciate such. But I trust God for you, to see the light of His words.

Myer:


I was a bit confused by this statement and even considered it an insult until I understood your import.

You believe I'm angry with God maybe cos I have an ailment right?

Well, "thank God I do not have an ailment." However I while I was a Staunt believer I had Christians with ailment come to me for healing and after praying with faith, no healing happened. By the way those Christians are still battling with their ailments. Maybe I should forward their numbers to you and who could also try your luck.

That said, my present dsiposition is simply from someone who consummately took the Bible verbatim as the word of God and did every thing by the book knowing it is also simply by Grace and the Spirit.

Yet no results.

I have concluded hence that Christianity is just another religion just like Islam.

If you do not see anything wrong in a Muslim leaving Islam for Christianity then you shouldn't see anything in a Christian leaving Christianity for anything else.

Both have proven only to be religions.

While the bane of Islam is how it still promotes killings in defense of their God.
Christianity promotes judging anyone that is not a Christian as hellbound. Because scriptural Jesus said he's the way, the truth and the life and no one come through the father except through him.

That said, Christianity would have been valid if only the powers that go with it were genuine and testable. However it has only created an environment where 0astors and prophets claim God said this and that only for the gullible congregants to part with their properties in hopes of entering the kingdom of heaven.

Thats why I've always quizzed you regarding the gifts and fruit of the Spirit. Cos with this you can confirm that you are a true Christian. Absent the gifts and fruit, I can't take you seriously as a Christian.

After all the bibke says in the last days there'll be false prophets, so we can only confirm true prophets by their Fruit and the signs that follow.

Bro, leave this eisegesis. I asked if you have ailment and in need of gods power because of your consistent effort to see healing online. It is not abusive neither am I assuming you have an ailment hence your reactions to the scriptures. You are the one reading that likely due to restlessness of the heart towards God and his words.

Calm down Bro. You really need to.
Your experience and inexperience cannot invalidate God's word neither can your restlessness works God's righteousness.

Myer:


Whether mirror or glass, I'm reading what the Bible says. Your interpretation is simply based on your belief that everything the Bible says God does is good. When God himself says he can kill and make alive, wounds and heals as he pleases. Deut 32:39-43
Even when God destroyed Adam and Eve simply due to their ignorance, not warning them of any form of evil.

Or when God blessed both Isaac and Ishmael which has led to the Christian and Muslim wars that have destroyed countless lives till date.

Or when God destroyed Job and his family just to win a bet with Satan. Even though the bible said God restored Job, I wonder what his original family that God allowed Satan to destroy would think about this.

Or when God rejected Saul simply for deciding to spare some lives of children, women and cattle instead of destroying everything. In case that went over your head, God was against sparing any form of life- both human (children and women) and cattle.

Did you read how God allowed Moses not to enter promised land cos he was angry people disobeyed God? Imagine God who gets angry that we disobey him now punishing you for being angry for his course to the point that the devil almost claimed the body of Moses?

I hope you read where God allowed Joseph to be killed even after restoring Israel back to God just because he was fought against an ungodly nation.

Pls read the story of Eli and see how God rejected him because of the sins of his children and all his service to God was not even remembered?

Of course there are other examples if you would only read your Bible.

When you realise that your faith in Christ as a Christian is no different for a Muslim's faith in Allah and Muhammed maybe it won't be too late for you to realise you're just another victim of religion.

There are so much of error in this writeup that i don't even know where to start from. The best place to start from will be to admonish you to open your heart to learning and reading properly. I have consistently tell you this and it will profit you if you take this.

It will be good if you avoid speaking about scriptures for now till you can fully grasp the progressive approach and explanation of the scriptures. Please do.

Myer:


You and your evasive tactics.
Did I say you have an online ministry?
I said whether or not you have an online ministry, the signs should follow you nonetheless both offline and online.

Your excuse of not having an online ministry is rather not tenable. Imagine Jesus saying he couldn't heal the centurions servant because he's only sent to Jews?
Or Paul saying he can only heal Gentiles?

Well, I know you get my point, I'm only curious what excuse you'll make yet again to justify why you have no testimony here on nairaland. Of course you know the gospel is not in words but power.

Bro, are you with an ailment and in need of the power of God to heal you? Please answer this as this is important so as to know what is the issue exactly.

Myer:


Atleast you're our Apo-stle.

And while NL may have contributed to this, you do know that apostasy is way beyond NL.

You should be more worried that it's easy for a Christian to lose his Christianity on NL. Does that not prove that darkness has comprehended the light? Lol

Bro, you are reading all my text from a mirror view. Better turn your phone properly.

Who is talking about apostate on nairaland? Lol. What we have mostly on nairaland are set of confused believers who likewise have refused to receive proper learning and end of claiming apostate or atheist. Apostate that can be flogged within a seconds of humility.

See, the solution to confusion is proper learning not stronghead. And the indices to this is humility and simplicity of heart. Start from this very point.

Myer:


Our discourse is not solely based on what you've said but what the bibke teaches. That being why I mentioned this.

Whether you admit it or not your Bible teaches you that except I believe in Jesus, I'm hell-bound.
Just like a Muslim believes except i believe in the prophet muhammed I'm hell-bound.

So my point being, you are only a victim of the religion you're exposed to which has shaped your perception of life and your judgment of it.

If God has ever spoken to you maybe that could justify you but all you know and belief is simply based on the book you believe to be inspired by God, the Bible. Just the same way a Muslim believes the Quran is inspired by God.

Is it not ironic that you both believe only your book is inspired by God?
I bet you believe the quran is the devil's book simply because you're not a Muslim.

Religion is really very ridiculous when you're detached from it.

Bro, you are yet to speak up what your real issue is. You are yet to come out plainly about your pains and issues. When you are ready, you know I will be here available for you to help. But before then, I am not ready to go in the direction you are going.

I believe in doing all things unto edification not unto destruction.

Myer:


It's a little too late for me to be an atheist. At best I'm an apostate.
Would have preferred to be an atheist though just that my logical reason proves otherwise.

No be only apo-state, you will soon see apo-country or apo-city. Lol

Online Apo(ses). Nairaland is amazing.

Myer:


You're walking in it by faith only, not in reality though. Otherwise the signs would have followed you even here on NL.
Even when Jesus was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel he still healed gentiles, samaritans, Romans, etc.
Likewise Paul who was sent to gentiles also healed Jews.

So whether your ministry is online or offline, the signs should be evident. Mark 16:17

Bro, I don't know why you decided to speak for me. I said I don't have online ministry. Is that what you should argue again? I speak about myself not you. Why are you tensed with that

Myer:


If a Muslim tells you to learn or relearn what salvation in Islam is about, will you?

As far as you know, you are only following the religion you have chosen. And this has sharpened and determined your perspective about yourself, others and life.

But while non-religious people don't judge you, you have been instructed by your religion to judge others by seeing them as sinner and hell-bound even when your religion preaches against judging others. Isnt that ironic?

Are you having hidden fears? Why trying to play sentiment cards that never existed. Have I ever called you a sinner or judge you based on your actions? Where is hell mentioned on all my discussion? Hopeful you can narrate your fears well then I may be able to help instead of using sentiments.

So, don't bring in what we aren't discussing to our discussion. You didn't tell me you are a Muslim nor tell me you are a sinner. So, keep that aside. You speak about the scriptures and that is what you should maintain. No blackmail. It's your decision afterwards that can judge you not me judging you.


Back to the real issue Sir.
I said your interpretation of the scriptures are misguided, this is what you should address and relearn. If you claim you study the Bible, then you need a real relearning of the same to help you see things better. This is what you should take with open arm. And if you know you don't read the Bible, then why not quit making unfounded statement about it to avoid presenting yourself in bad light.

Hope am clear enough.

In

Myer:


Does my statement not touch the obvious questions you're not allowed to ask as a Christian?

The whole purpose of Salvation through Christ based on the premise of victory over sin and the devil right?

How come after the "victory", sin and evil still persists even to the point of overcoming Christians and not only unbelievers?

Maybe you should tell me what changed between Pre-Christ and Post-Chr8st.

You are missing the point totally and you are even haughty about it.

There is no question that can't be asked in Christianity. Anyone who tells you not to ask a certain question is ignorant.

But the issue here is that you aren't asking question, you made an assertion, you made an affirmative statement. Read your statement again.

And you know why am bothered?

Not because your statement can have any effect on what Christ already done for man and for you but because your wrong believing will be what you live and else you have confessed and accepted the victory of sin over you and the persistent of evil over your actions.

---

I am speaking to you the way I am currently because I assumed all you are saying are from point of ignorance and not pride against God's word else I would have handled this differently.

But what baffles me is that you are yet to see in these few years, your wrongs in Bible interpretation hence your believe system is already seeing the casualty. Bro, you must be careful. Atheism is just a minute away to openly welcome you if you continue on this road.


When you don't know or when something is not clear, ask questions with openness not from knowledge driven by error or confusion. It's obvious as at today you are neither here or there. And that is not a good virtue even in the natural.

There are no neutral ground, you must help yourself to decide what you hold true, it is a sign of stability.


So, please sit Bro, and relearn what salvation is about. You obviously don't know what it is at all. Quite sorry to say.

Myer:


Well, I'm actually curious as to your understanding of the doctrine of Salvation and Sin, and what I seem to have misread, mis-seen, misinterpreted and mis-believed.

You know as much as I appreciate the theories in the bible, I believe as a witness of Christ, you will be kind to cite practical examples too.

You inference is not even about examples. Your statement touched the very fabric on which the work of salvation is built. It stabbed the very suffering, patience, sorrow, death and victory of Christ over sin built on the longsuffering of God in actualizing man's salvation from sin.

In simple terms, your statement asked for another savior and thereby take the death of Christ as vanity (Gal 2:21)

It makes me sad really but God's patience and grace still abounds. So I believe you will come to understand this in dew time.

Myer:


Wrong information as written in the bible though.

Well, if a man read wrongly, he will see wrongly and know wrongly. Which will then lead him to believe wrongly, act wrongly and speak wrongly and lastly end up living wrongly.

You can see, when we don't read properly, it leads to a long chain that ends up controlling who we are.

I have implore you severally to first knock off all false information you have learnt about the scriptures and start relearning by reading the scriptures PROPERLY with focused attention and openness of heart.

The solution to this challenge of misinterpreting the scriptures by you is very simple one, but you can make it complex by a single act of closing your heart to relearn.


Hence, your inference of Salvation and Sin doctrine is the very fabric upon with the whole scriptures is built. A very loud doctrine all through the volume of the books and emphatic theme of the scriptures, yet you still miss its implication, application and interpretation, and am sure likewise it's practices.

Bro, work dey o.

Myer:


Ministry is where ever you're commissioned to.
And the evidence is in the Power of the Holyspirit backing you and confirming the Word in signs and wonders.
It's not in words.

Well you are correct that ministry is where ever you are commissioned to. Sadly I am not commissioned to online or random post on a forum. So I don't do ministry on Nairaland. Do you? Then you will be the one to show me your converts and disciples here. I intend not to have any here.

So either in words, signs, wonders or demonstration of power, it's all ours and we walk in it. If you don't, we should ask why.

Myer:

My question after everything is... To what end?

Imagine even the death of Christ did not solve the problem of sin.

Adam and Eve only committed 1 act of sin and fell from glory and were cast out of Eden right?
Yet all the acts of righteousness of all the prophets combined and even Jesus Christ has not solved and nullified that single act of sin that was committed to restore man to glory and into Eden?

Is the sin of Adam more powerful that all the Roghteousness of Christ?

Honest question.

Chairmannnnn.
This your honest question comes from a root of wrong information about the concept of salvation that you may have been exposed to.

Myer:


My ever evasive brother.
I didn't say you should point at others, rather tell me how you are operating in that capacity.

You cannot claim to be operating in the same level of wisdom when you're not working in the same level of power.

Yes it is not about the the apostles who are but vessels. It is about Jesus through the Holyspirit working through even the Apostles and every Christian, so show us how He is operating through you. How many NLDers have been healed through you?

Bro, trust you are good.
Apologies for delayed response.

---

Ministry is not Nairaland o. And get this also that I neither preach on Nairaland nor have disciples or followers. I neither have such interest too.

Ministry is local Bro.

Also, note, like I told you before, God works and still works through and in men today as in the days of Bible. Speaking, writing about or elevating it is inconsequential as you should know that even scriptures never admonish to put such as priorities. I guess you are used to hearing testiphonies.


Well, the truth is, you must learn to trust God's word to the letters. If it says, you can heal the sick, that settles it. It's the same word that says you are saved, that also told you you can heal the sick, that the power of God is at work in you. It's now left you to how much of that you believe.

But for me, I BELIEVE GOD and his word and that's enough for me to function in all He has said concerning me through His word.

Myer:


Some times i find it hard choosing words due to easy misconceptions and communication lacuna.

When I said theory, I meant what is written and studied in the Bible.
When I said practical, I meant how it is practised in our time.

I didn't say the early Christians in the Bible were perfect. But answer this simple question. Are you operating in the same level of wisdom, love, power, faith (fearlessness) of the Holyspirit as the Peter or Paul? As Stephen or Philiip? As Apollo or Barnabas? Even as the ordinary brother Ananias through who God healed Paul's blindness?

The Bible speaks of spiritual gifts which was manifest and all could distinguish the Christians because of the Grace of God working in them and through them.

You've been "ministering" on NL for some time now , what testimony can you share concerning the lives you have touched either through spirit-led generosity or healed someone's infirmity?

Have you left your family behind to take up missionary work in another state or even country?

Can you share any of your practical experiences that confirm your Christianity is in the likeness of that which was written and documented in the Bible? That was my question and point of this thread.

Okay Bro.

Like i said earlier, there is nothing different from what you see in the early church that God is not doing in his church today. We mustnt see God's work within what our limited eyes can see. You and I are just 2 out of billions of people who call on God daily, so you do make a lot of assumptions in your words by speaking for many.

Just because you cant see things around you doesnt mean its not happening. A change of location or change of mindset might do.


I will give you a simple clue you must always hold when judging from biblical view. And that is the fact that if God/scriptures says something will or can or is happening in our time, i have no reason to doubt it as i believe totally that God's word transcend my limited sight and knowledge. If you have issues with this, then we may have to start from point of preaching faith again.


So, are all these you listed happening today? Yes surely.

Have i seen then happened, Yes surely.

Can i or have i worked in such wisdom? Yes i have as much as every believer can. Its Christ abilities not early church abilities.

Should i start a testimony series here for you to believe? No, we are not taught as such from the scriptures.


If the scriptures isnt enough for someone to believe the power and work of God on earth today, no testimony, telemony or television will change the person even if he is a very eye witness of it.


So, if there be any sacrifice, commitment, persecution, demonstration of God's power, influence of the spirit at work through me or in me, i will be the most foolish person on earth to come here on social media and speak about it. unto what end Bro? For men to be saved? Is the preaching of the gospel now impotent to save the lost?


If you cant see "practical" Christianity around you Bro, its either you arent getting your definition/expectation of Christianity right, or its high time you change that your location and escape the "unchristianed" environment.

But take this to the bank: There are people in our days who have made and still making greater sacrifices than what you saw in Acts.

So, If you cant see the influence of the spirit of God on his church today, Bro, issue dey ni yen o.

Myer:


If you followed this thread then you'll know it wasn't about theory in the Bible but the practical observation of the Christians.

As a spirit-filled Christian what is the difference between yoi and non Christians?

Cos if Christians were anything like the biblical theory then we won't be having the Nigeria we have today considering we probably have the highest number of Christians in 6he world.

Brotherrrrr Myer.
Trust you are good.

The Bible Christians can't be referred to as theoretical. In fact they were as practical as what you see today.

There is no difference in what you see in bible days than what you see in a bible believing church today.

The Bible days believers weren't perfect people, likewise today's believer must be under continual training to maturity.

Myer:


The point of emphasis of our discussion is clearly stated in Romans 11 which I extracted for you. But in your usual manner you can't admit to being wrong and why you continue to digress. You my friend seem to have mastered the strawman argument.

My point has been made on this issue. God rejected the Israelites and chose the Gentiles in response to make them jealous as he had already prophesied in the old testament which Paul clearly also confirmed.

You know the reason i took my time to explain is because it is you. If you are observant, i have tried to even avoid having to do much explanation or quoting scriptures since on this thread. I have my reasons. I have known you for someone who receives God's word as it is and make correction without pride. So dont let that change.

Hence firstly, you will need to stop hiding behind the first bold statement above, as it will not allow you see the truth. I gave you scriptures and even go extra length to explained and pointed out the key areas you missed. The right thing for you to do is to humbly go back and read. Or better still point out where you think i misinterpret. Show scriptures, that is how bible students discuss.


But you still cling unto what wasnt written, Paul clearly showed you that Israel rejected the gospel, which you can see over over again in the 3 Chapters, yet to said it is not so but its god who rejected Israel. Bro, this is how rebellion to God's word starts. It is not about winning arguments, its a bout seeing things the way they were written down and hold to it.

I beg of you, desist from wrestling with scriptures especially when it is obvious you are wrong.

Myer:


You make too many assumptions for some one who i perceievd to be intelligent. Cos assumption is actually the bases form of intelligence.

Why should I quote the whole of the chapters Romans 8-11 before you know I read them?
The point of emphasis of our discussion is clearly stated in Romans 11 which I extracted for you. But in your usual manner you can't admit to being wrong and why you continue to digress. You my friend seem to have mastered the strawman argument.

My point has been made on this issue. God rejected the Israelites and chose the Gentiles in response to make them jealous as he had already prophesied in the old testament which Paul clearly also confirmed.

Bro, i am not assuming it that you didnt read properly, especially the Chapters, i am giving you an affirmative statement. Your interpretation gave you away because if you have READ PROPERLY, you wont have come to the conclusion you came to.


The word READ, when discussing the scriptures doesnt mean you have seen or read the scriptures, even an unbeliever is likely to have read them. But the word usually means YOU HAVENT READ PROPERLY. When use in scriptures, it is usually from the Greek text anaginosko. Which translates as "to read again and again". It is used for proper reading to understand. This is what you havent done.


Jesus used the same word severally for Pharisees, i hope you know a Pharisee is a teacher, scholar of the scriptures, Yet Jesus told them to read or havent he read. Read there mean to read properly Bro.

Matt 19:4 “And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read,
Mark 12:10 And have ye not read this scripture;
Matt 12:5 Or have ye not read in the law,

So, telling you, you didnt read is not an assumption or abuse, its a call for you to read properly. Hence, you should go back and read properly.
When you have dont this, you will see the scriptures clearly.

There is a reading of the scriptures and there is a PROPER reading of the scriptures. The gap between this is thin but the effects is as wide as the red sea.

Myer:


What exactly was revealed to you?

Firstly let me know, in what capacity and role you are asking this.

Are you the supervisor of the Body of Christ or an hovering spirit over the angels of the churches. Which capacity are you Sir.

Myer:


All this epistles, and you didn't answer the simple question.
Was it revealed to you?

Okay Yes . Any issue with it?

Myer:


Romans 11:13
Now I am speaking to you Gentiles. Inasmuch then as vI am an apostle to the Gentiles, I magnify my ministry 14 in order somehow to make my fellow Jews jealous, and wthus save some of them. 15 For if their rejection means xthe reconciliation of the world, what will their acceptance mean but life from the dead?

What is your understanding of the above scrioture? Emphasis on vs 15.
I take it you believe the scriptures are inspired by God hence it was God speaking through the apostle Paul.

Bro, I won't be reading scriptures for you. You have to do the reading yourself.

To understand the verse you quoted go and start from Chapter 9 verse 1. That is where this discussion started from. Read it through chapter 10, then read chapter 11 patiently. You will understand Paul's flow of thought.


He already told you in

Rom 10:1

Brothers and sisters, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for the Israelites is that they may be saved

Hence this is speaking about salvation in Christ. So when you say rejected by God, it must be defined in this. It's their rejection of salvation offered in Christ.

Verse 10 already showed you what they rejected.

10 For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you profess your faith and are saved.


They rejected the faith in Christ.

11 As Scripture says, “Anyone who believes in him will never be put to shame.”

Observe he said ANYONE.

Verse 12 expanded that for you

12 For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile—the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him,

Same salvation, for both.

13 for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”[f]

Everyone includes Jews.


Hence they rejected it.

But not all Jews rejected. Some did accept.

Verse 16 But not all the Israelites accepted the good news

Note, 'the goodnews'

21 But concerning Israel he says,

“All day long I have held out my hands
to a disobedient and obstinate people.”


So, Jews were the one who rejected the gospel not God rejecting them. Understand the flow well.

The gospel is for all, Jews still rejected it.


Chapter 11:1

I ask then: Did God reject his people? By no means! I am an Israelite myself, a descendant of Abraham, from the tribe of Benjamin. 2 God did not reject his people,

This clearly showed you that God wasn't the one who rejected Israel.

In salvation, God doesn't reject anyone. Israel wasn't rejected in receiving salvation.


They rejected it. But not all of them

7 What then? What the people of Israel sought so earnestly they did not obtain. The elect among them did, but the others were hardened

So it should be clear to you now that it's not God who rejected Israel from receiving salvation, Israel did reject it themselves just as anybody can. It's their choice not God's choice.


Now observe patiently

Vs 11
11 Again I ask: Did they stumble so as to fall beyond recovery? Not at all! Rather, because of their transgression, salvation has come to the Gentiles to make Israel envious

The bold is not in Greek text, it was inserted by translator and I believe this affected your view.

The word "has come" is better put as "is preached".

So Israel rejected, the Apostles take it to the Gentiles.

Why? He told you, "to make them envious" . Envious why? To provoke their acceptance.


Vs 15.
For if their rejection brought reconciliation to the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead

Now, this should be clear to you.

The word "their" will be referring to who? God or Israel? Of course Israel. You have seen from Chapter 9 till now that Paul emphasized who is doing the rejection. Not God but Israel.

So it's better written...
For if Israel rejection....

Hope this is clear.


Now again in this verse .

Same thing as verse 11. The word brought wasn't in Greek text. It was inserted. This insertion already give you an interpretation that you hold to.

Even at that, it's the rejection by Israel that made gospel preached to the Gentiles EARLY. Israel is to be saved first, not last. But their rejection here means the preacher will go to the next city. It's not God issues here. It's Israel issues.

Remember Jesus said.

... But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another:.... Matt 10:23

.... The first shall become the last... Matt 20:16


So in conclusion
Did God reject Israel for Gentiles in salvation in Christ? No. Israel was the one who rejected it.

So, can God reject his children and go for enemies children? I already told you, that it takes a bad father to do such.


Please Bro, always read scriptures from where the very discussion starts from. Read through. Sometimes it takes reading 6 chapters together to understand, sometimes reading the whole book, even atimes reading the whole bible.

Myer:


Was it revealed to you?

I am just one out of billions of believers all around the world.

Is like the computer age has made you to believe that if something is not online, it doesn't exist. It's a fallacy of this age. You already bought it.

How many Christian do you know out of the billions for you to reach your conclusion, how many churches do you know in villages, huts, hamlet, caves, hills even in houses. You have assumed for all of these.

When we see things only through our own eyes or coverage we will always make a wrong assumption.

There are billions of persons around the world today with no access to internet. You have already spoken for them here with your assumptions. Christianity is not online.


Also note this and take good note of it. Not all churches or Christians go to media or seek media fame to disclose what was revealed or known or received. The church aren't sent to do that. But since we are in the age of media craze, we believe if it's not in media it doesn't exist.

Bro, repent from your assumptions. Always speak based on what you know and the distance of your eyes.

How does it sound if some claim Myer doesn't exist in the whole world just because he never seen you online or social media. There are many Myers that doesn't even have access to internet and some that won't even make use of it.

Myer:


I meant their rejection of Christ made God also reject them and choose the Gentiles.

What did you read in the scripture I shared?

Now Jews who were God's chosen were rejected while the Gentiles (whom Jesus forbade his disciples from preaching to) were chosen. And thus began the ministry of Paul and Barnabas. Acts 13:2-3

Bro habaa.

Jews rejection is what I have explained to you above. It has nothing to do with Christ. Christ death is for all. Both Jews and Gentiles. Jews were to bring that same salvation in Abraham to all nations but they rejected it.


Christ came to fulfill that. Hence both Jews and Gentiles now need salvation and has to be saved in Christ.

How will you sya Jews rejection of Christ brought salvation to Gentiles. This is the reason I told you that you must read the scriptures as a whole.

The plan of God for all the earth is all over the scriptures.
God's plan has always been about all humanity, all the earth. Even before the time of Jews and Gentiles.

You will see this being repeated by God's all through the scriptures. You only need to pay attention.

Gen 1:26-28. ... Multiply, Replenish the EARTH. that's God's plan even from days of Adam.

Gen 22:18.... In you shall all the NATIONS OF THE EARTH be blessed.

Hab 2:14... Glory of the lord shall cover the EARTH as the waters.....

Joel 2:28... Pour out my spirit upon ALL FLESH..

Matt 28: 18-19.... GO...YE... Make disciples ALL NATIONS

Mark 16:15... Go into ALL THE WORLD....

Acts 1:8-9 Jerusalem, Judea, Samaria and TO THE UTTERMOST PART OF THE EARTH

The promise never changed.

You will see this on and on. God's plan for all. It didn't start in Matthew.

God's plan and promise never changed, also his words never changed. It is you that need to be available to understand fully his plan, thoughts and words.

Myer:


How exactly do you think I read the Bible?

I've completed the Bible once or twice, the Synoptic gospels even more times.

You will only see the inconsistencies in the Bible if you ever study it from a non-religious perspective.

Anything done in the name of religion is done blindly and absent sense because you're not allowed to question the so called word of God no matter how ludicrous it is, across religions. Muslims and Jews likewise believe their divine books are perfect just like Christians do and cannot be questioned.

Just as a Christian can easily pick the errors in the Quran, that's exactly how the Bible's inaccuracies and inconsistencies abound.

The bold is absolutely false.

A proper study of the Bible leads to critical thinking. The scriptures is a mind engaging writings. When read well, you will understand that critical thinking is not about finding inconsistency but understanding the essence, reasons for God's actions and the truth expressed through it.

Even in our days, The texts of the scriptures which is over thousands of years in age, it's composition, expression and literacy will stand above the best of our modern literatures. And the writers will rate among the best scholars in our days.

The inconsistency you see are still product of not understanding the scriptures well. But I trust God you will in due times.

Myer:


Meaning it was not revealed to you.
Lets not mistake revelation for predictions.

There are several conspiracy theories that have shared better predictions on Covid -19. Even some pastors like Oyakhilome are teaching such conspiracies.

I asked if God revealed it to you. I asked because it is a major phenomenon that shook the whole world. Yet it wasn't revealed to God's special children? Some of whom have now met their untimely death in the hands of Covid?

The bible tells us in so many instances whenever such plagues would happen, God reveals it to his prophets/friends and even gives them the chance to plead on behalf of the people in order to avert it.

I'm just wondering why this isn't the case in a generation that boasts of walking in the prophetic, dining with Jesus, etc.

So, how did you know it wasn't revealed to anyone?


Likewise, dont still forget the below. Read it well and act of it. A Christian dont make bogus claim and assumptions. We arent as thought like that.

Philippians 4:5
5 Let your moderation be known unto all men. The Lord is at hand.


So, read this well and act properly.

Is like the computer age has made you to believe that if something is not online, it doesn't exist. It's a fallacy of this age. You already bought it.

How many Christian do you know out of the billions for you to reach your conclusion, how many churches do you know in villages, huts, hamlet, caves, hills even in houses. You have assumed for all of these.

When we see things only through our own eyes or coverage we will always make a wrong assumption.

There are billions of persons around the world today with no access to internet. You have already spoken for them here with your assumptions. Christianity is not online.


Also note this and take good note of it. Not all churches or Christians go to media or seek media fame to disclose what was revealed or known or received. The church aren't sent to do that. But since we are in the age of media craze, we believe if it's not in media it doesn't exist.

Bro, repent from your assumptions. Always speak based on what you know and the distance of your eyes.

Myer:


The Jews were rejected by God as was prophesied. Even Paul acknowledged this. Thats how salvation came to the gentiles. Like you said, of course Jews who also chose to follow Christ are saved.

Romans 11:11-15
So I ask, did they stumble in order that they might fall? By no means! Rather, through their trespass usalvation has come to the Gentiles, so as to make Israel jealous. 12 Now if their trespass means riches for the world, and if their failure means riches for the Gentiles, how much more will their full inclusion2 mean!

13 Now I am speaking to you Gentiles. Inasmuch then as vI am an apostle to the Gentiles, I magnify my ministry 14 in order somehow to make my fellow Jews jealous, and wthus save some of them. 15 For if their rejection means xthe reconciliation of the world, what will their acceptance mean but life from the dead?

For me to understand you clearly. Can you confirm this is exactly what you mean by the bold above.

That Gentiles would not have seen salvation nor gentile be saved if Israel has not rejected God? So that means salvation will be for Israel alone?

So, it means salvation was meant only for Jews if not for their rejection? Bro, fear God o.

And I have told you before, that the way you misquote Paul regularly, he may stand against you at the "gates of heaven" to deny you access

Myer:


Can God leave his children and climg to unbelievers?
Really?
Why were the Jews (God's chosen through promise to Abraham) rejected and the Gentiles (Unbelievers) chosen?

Like I always say, the inconsistency of God is undisputed except on the basis that you do not want to acknowledge it.
I've presented other scenarios in the Bible where this is so. In fact most believe the God of the old testament must be different from the God of new testament cos apparently he changed due to the sacrifice of Jesus.

Bro, I won't have to be showing you everytime how much of the scriptures you misinterpret.

You already mixed up things again.
Work of Salvation was never through Gentile. What you will see through the scripture is

Abraham to Israel to Jesus. Rejection of Israel was only defined in God's work and plan of salvation, hence they were rejected in that work and Jesus had to fulfill what Israel refused to fulfill (The covenant). Israel was not rejected in receiving salvation as salvation is for all and that include the gentiles too. Israel wasn't rejected for gentile Sir. Israel themselves rejected the salvation provided for them.

You must know how to separate issues in the scriptures. You are mixing alot together.

Gentile doesn't even have a play in the work of Salvation. They only benefitted from it. Israel is to have a play, a responsibility in God's plan of salvation which they rejected and Jesus was the one who filled same that Israel rejected .

So, Abraham played his part, Israel is to fulfill that which Abraham set ahead but Israel failed, Jesus came and fulfilled the same. That is the rejection of Israel to make Jesus the chosen.
No Gentiles in this at all. Bible called gentiles godless.

Now what Jesus fulfilled is available for both Jews and Gentiles, so Israel is not rejected from receiving salvation. I have explained this to you earlier when you were speaking about covenants.

---

But just take this, try to be reading books of the bible not verses or just a part. You must read all together.

The scriptures must be read together to make a total sense to you.

Myer:


Like I said, it's you who isn't comprehending what you're reading.

Philippians 2:12 says work out your salavatiin, yes.
Phillipians 2:13 says it us God who will determine both your willingness to work out your salvation and also your ability to do it.

Clearly vs 13 proves it is all God's doing.

Have you not read that while Esau was yet unborn God already hated him and loved Jacob? Malachi 1:2-3, Romans 9:13

Did you not read in the Bible how God hardens people's hearts according to his desire? And how he himself prepares others for his use?

Until you read the Bible with an open mind, you will "choose" not to see these things.

It's ok anyway. I guess I wish i also didn't see these things, perhaps I would still have been a devout Christian.lol

Bro, I keep trusting God for you o. But you truly have to study the scriptures as a whole. Not snippet. That is what you are doing even your explanation.


Lastly, doctrine don't draw away peoples commitment to God. It's a person's heart that draws away. The scriptures doesnt. It is other things you have exposed yourself to that affect a personal devotion.

If you stay with the word, and stop having to be browsing what contribute negative thoughts to your devotion, you will do well.

No one is immune to being drawn away. Likewise we can all receive stable if we desire so.

Myer:


I wanted to leave you both to sort this out but I couldn't, seeing you intentionally misquoting him.

He never said he was a perfect Christian. In fact his whole point is that you who claims to be a perfect could be rejected while he (whether an imperfect believer or an unbeliever) could be chosen. Because at the end of the day only God know who will make heaven.

You are still speaking for him. There is no where I also did misquote him.

Below is the focus of his message.

GOD CAN LEAVE A BELIEVER AND CHOOSE AN UNBELIEVER even at Jesus's coming.

Observe his references, Paul, Thief on the right hand.

I then presented the Bible view to him about the faith of man in salvation, hence a child of God can't be compared to that of the devil.

Then, see his conclusion about my write up.

YOU HAVE NO UNDERSTANDING OF THE SCRIPTURES.

Which I didn't dispute with him.

But then, I asking him to present his understanding, you claimed I misquote him.

Can God leave his children and cling to the seed of the devil? That is what he emphasized.


Then I asked him a simple question, if he will be part of those Jesus will leave behind.

Why can't he answer the question since he already know who Jesus will not choose. I don't think that is a hard question or should lead to his flaring up.

Now do you know where his self righteousness and sense of perfection comes from?

Moment he could t sincerely answer that question, it shows he doesn't believe he will be left behind. Such persons will tell you "by grace", yet is the grace available for them alone?

He should honestly answer the question to know his expectation when Jesus appear. Then we can know the intent of his heart.

Lastly, Like I said, when you put God to be an unstable being that act of emotions and reactionary, who does even know what he wants or can change his word anytime, such preaching is what breeds his assumptions and erroneous explanation of the scriptures.

Myer:


This is why the Bible is an interesting book.
While you have correctly quoted scriptures that say that Salavation s man's choice, I will also quote scriptures that say that Salvatoon is God's choice.

Romans 8:30
And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified.

Phillipians 2:12-13
Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling; for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure.

I hope you see here that it is not your choice or will but God's will.

I will be helping you a bit to post that Philippians here to read through.


Philippians 2:12-13
12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure .

Don't read the verse 12 and forget 13. Also don't read them in isolation. Read together. They were written together.


I will give you other translations.

JB Philips
12-13 So then, my dearest friends, as you have always followed my advice—and that not only when I was present to give it—so now that I am far away be keener than ever to work out the salvation that God has given you with a proper sense of awe and responsibility. For it is God who is at work within you, giving you the will and the power to achieve his purpose.

EHV
12 So then, my dear friends, as you have always obeyed, not only when I was with you, but also now much more in my absence, continue to work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. 13 In fact, it is God who is working in you, both to will and to work, for the sake of his good pleasure

NLT
12 Dear friends, you always followed my instructions when I was with you. And now that I am away, it is even more important. Work hard to show the results of your salvation, obeying God with deep reverence and fear. 13 For God is working in you, giving you the desire and the power to do what pleases him.

Now reread all. Observe the use of work, it's meaning, it's subject, it's application.

That verse is a verse of spiritual growth not salvation from sin. Not a verse of going to heaven. But a verse to walk in the spirit, to renew mind and obedience


A closer verse to it is

Ephes 2:10

NLT
10 For we are God’s masterpiece. He has created us anew in Christ Jesus, so we can do the good things he planned for us long ago.

KJV
10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.


Observe also that Paul has earlier spoken of this in chapter 1 before the chapter 2 of Philippians

Philippians 1:6
For I am confident of this very thing, that He who began a good work in you will perfect it until the day of Christ Jesus.

If you have read the whole philippians together you would have seen this. That is why I said you need to start reading through and through.


You will see same consistency in all Paul's writings.

So the working out is to produce the good works which God has already done in you and he still same working to help you show this forth.

Myer:


Won't you say you're the one mixing it up?

You claim man's choice is what determines his salvation according to the scriptures you shared.

I also simply shared scriptures which show that it is not man's choice but God's choice that determines man's salvation.

Youre the one contradicting yourself here.

Bro, you still haven't read what I pointed to.

Let me show you what God's choice is in salvation. Left to God these are his desires.

1 Tim 2:4-6

4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

6 Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.



1. God wills ALL MEN to be saved
2. God gave Christ to die for ALL MEN

Are all men saved?

2 Peter 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance

Doesn't wants any to perish.
This is God's mind from the scriptures. Hence, he gave Jesus for all to die for all.


Now pay attention
Why is everyone not saved?

John 3:16
16... that whosoever believeth in him... .

That condition places the decision of salvation at the feet of man. He has to accept it. This is man's responsibilities. This is the core reason for the preaching of the gospel. This is the reasons the early church was persecuted, this is the reasons the apostles were martyred, and this is the reason the message of the gospel is still preached today.

Hence, God salvation works is not a forced acceptance, it must be received. That is why the word 'believe' is found almost in all the scriptures. Because man must receive that which God offers.


So, back to what I told you. Go and read those scriptures you shared again. The answers are there. No writer or preacher of the Bible preached the what you inferred there.