₦airaland Forum

A40:
That's why I said I wouldn't dispute anyone having Jokic over Malone but Malone was a 3x MVP that got to multiple Finals and swept the Lakers (might have been a different Story if Worthy played)

I just go off the back of what Malone did with what he had

For me oh. I think he has passed KD. Had it been the Warriors never won another title his record would have been bullet proof. However the fact that they won again inside 3 seasons. Now KD can still pass Joker. But if you ask me now. This dominant showing from Joker without an MVP or All star teammate (even though we know Murray is an Allstar caliber guy) tops anything KD has done

The argument about him and KD is sound

A40:
The size made a huge difference in this series. But I thought the Celtics had a bit of size advantage as well, how come they failed to use it is my question

Defense is really about effort. Even MAGA Mike when he shows some effort he looks like a half decent defender. Defense is 20% skill 80% will

Brown is a key player but he will not be an irreplaceable loss. Winning a title means they will definitely get willing veterans that will play under their market value for a shot at a ring

Same opinion, also they just made a trade to get some future 1st from OKC, which if they continue to hit at the rate they've been might net them another rotation piece.

A40:
The size made a huge difference in this series. But I thought the Celtics had a bit of size advantage as well, how come they failed to use it is my question

Defense is really about effort. Even MAGA Mike when he shows some effort he looks like a half decent defender. Defense is 20% skill 80% will

Brown is a key player but he will not be an irreplaceable loss. Winning a title means they will definitely get willing veterans that will play under their market value for a shot at a ring

The zone was the Celtics Achilles heel. Zone defense can negate size differences (that is why it is a Shaq rule), and also make penetrative dribbles hard because players can easily collapse, that is why guys like Jalen who don't have tight handles always lose the ball in such situations.
Also the Celtics had no big man that could receive the ball in the low block or in the paint who is a capable scorer and passer. Whenever the Heat went Zone against the Celtics and AL got the ball without nobody within 3 ft of him, he could not even look at the rim and was just looking for someone to hot potato it to. When they tried it against Jokic, he just looked to score, if they collapse he passes out of it, if they leave him 1v1 it was barbecue chicken .

You cannot play zone against a player who is an excellent passer and who is comfortable taking both a 12-15ft midrange and also backing you down.

A40:
Jokic has passed KD IMO. Anyone with even a ring as the undisputed top dawg head honcho is ahead of KD. So that means guys like Dirk, Giannis, Jokic

KD is dropping like stone rn especially with his lack of success without GSW and Golden State winning that title without him was just the worst possible outcome for his legacy

Centers
Kareem
Russell (I don't like counting that era ngl)
Shaq
Wilt
Olajuwon
Malone
Jokic

Now if Jokic theoretically gets another ring. He jumps ahead of Malone. If you say he's ahead of Malone now I won't argue but I still have Malone ahead for now. If he hits 3 rings and is FMVP all 3?? He will skip a lot of people and I'd put him right behind Shaq

Your centers list is same as mine, you can argue Malone and Jokic, I personally will take Jokic because he is easier to build around. As for him and KD, IMHO projecting forward, if he wins another ring and KD retires with just 2, then there is no argument, Jokic is absolutely better. But as it stands now, I say it's a toss-up

PS: I have the same issue with Bill Russell era of basketball. 8 teams and even some of your bench players are in the HOF.

Roland17:
They need volume scoring from somewhere, preferably the guard position.

Seriously, the person does not even need to be a great defender, just someone who is willing to put in effort on D and score efficiently at high volume.

A40:
This Nuggets team injury permitting will be a problem for years to come. Personally I don't think they even played at their best in this series.

Their balance of size and shooting is very difficult to top. It will ultimately come down to their motivation and then injuries. Does Jamal Murray want to be Allstar All NBA, does MAGA Mike want to improve and get to All star level and does Jokic want to be like Tim Duncan.

It's rare to find a team where the smallest guy is 6'4. Which means finding mismatches will be difficult all their guys are mobile and big enough to guard multiple positions

Their size is seriously underated. Personally that is why prefer tall players who can move their feet on defense, with just great effort that kind of player can automatically be an average defender, with coaching he can become a plus defender easily. We can see it in MPJ, Jamal and Jokic, not known for defense but their size and ability to move laterally for their position already gives them a huge starting point on turning into good defenders.
Going forward I doubt they can keep brown but I like what I saw from the rookie Braun, so that helps them there. If in FA all you are looking for is a 6th to 8th man, as a team you are good

larride:
First in NBA history.

The boy is a beast

Roland17:
Great points but only few people will look at it that way.

It has to be said that he was poor in this series and the final games of the Celtics series. He looked out of sorts and played below his level and that would be talked about in the future.

Agree totally, there was reports of Ankle stuff during the Celtics series like game 5 or so. The Heat needs another guy, whether it is Dame or whoever they just need someone who can on their own create high quality offense

PDPGuy:
FT of FIBA U-16 Basketball championship final:
USA 118-36 Canada 😲🙆🏾😲

That’s what you call absolute destruction!!

That is what I keep telling people, it's the world as a whole that has caught up to the USA not one country, a talent pool of 350mil against 7.8billion

A40:
Definitely a flaw on his game. The Nuggets did not bite on those fakes all series which meant Jimmy had to work for every bucket. Not sure he crossed 30 in any game and it was a huge reason why

The thing is Denver had the good luck that their primary defender on Butler is not only taller than him, he is more athletic and one of his unique gifts is that he hardly jumps on pumps fakes. That is why nba basketball at it's highest level is about matchups and personnel

Jokic status in the game all time is now up for debate, guaranteed top 10 center all time, arguably a top 5 center( the case can be made). A top 30 player all time and if he gets another one a top 15 is possible and a discussion will be had if he has overtaken KD

donlittle25:
The people who will sit in 30 years and decide how much of a stain it is on his resume haven’t been born yet. People like steady

He has lost to 2 guys who will end up when they retire as top 30 players all time, Jokic and Lebron. So he did the best he could.

Roland17:
2 NBA final losses will not look good on Butler’s resume when all is said and done. It looks bright now because of the effort but trust me, the narrative after he is done will be hard on him.

That is for people who did not watch it, he had the less talented team by a wide margin both times. The first one he was the 3rd best player on the floor through out the series Lebron and Bubble AD were on the other team and as for this one Jokic in his prime was on the other team

Congratulations to Coach Malone, he knew he had the better team and made sure to coach his ass off. As for Calvin the GM, he added the final pieces to a winning roster and they went all the way.
My man KCP is a 2 time champion and he made clutch plays this series just like he did in the bubble. That is why guys like him get paid

Congratulations to Denver, and there's a new king in town. Nikola of house Jokic. The first of his name, the passing savant of Serbia, the butcher of the Suns, Lakers and Heats, the one and only Joker

What this game lacks in quality it makes up in its intensity and tension

Denver just needs to run every single Jokic actions they have till the end of the game. He is the only player who has been all game a near guarantee bucket

donlittle25:
nobody don score in like 3 minute. This game sweet

Assin, this one tire me

A40:
Lol. He has an all star appearance.

The Mavericks are not a Kyrie away from a title. So paying Cuban will be canceling a mistake with another mistake and that's not considering his fit and availability issues. What the Denver Nuggets and Warriors are showing is that chemistry is far more important than an assortment of stars

You need as many quality players that fit your best players. That is something Cuban just does not get. No one knew what Luka's ceiling was and were don go send 2 1st round picks to Knicks for Kristaps. GSW and now Denver are showing that patience is still a virtue

If Murray's shots starts falling this game is over

The tension in this game is so thick you can cut it with a knife. The quality of basketball on the other hand can be better

donlittle25:
This team is good. Really Good. The patience to construct team like this, Cuban no get am. weyrey ma ti da ru

Cuban is one of the worst owners at team construction. The only good thing for him and other bad owners is that the new CBA will make it easier to build a championship team with just one franchise player.

When Denver wins this championship it will be 5 straight years of different champions in the nba. With only GSW and the Heat making more than 1 finals appearance. It seems this is what the owners and league brain trust wants because the new CBA starting next season will make it very hard for a team to pay two stars and also give good money to role players.

donlittle25:
Watch PAT RILEY go after a big name soon

Dame is interested

A40:
1 more for Denver.

The Heat will put up a brave face but I feel at this point they know

The final nail for me happened when they could only chip off 1 point when Jokic sat because of his 5 fouls

Game 3 was the 1-2 carrying the team. This game has been a tale of the others for Denver. Role players coming up big with timely shots and stops

A40:
KCP and Brown. Issa wrap

Assin, 3 possession 3 buckets down the stretch

Roland17:
I swear I can’t with him… This is coming from a guy that has M. Smart in his team..

He is annoying as an opponent, but if he is on your team, he just knows how to get some pretty easy points now and again

SmooshCHN:
Someone sounds pained. A40, I don't really blame these young boys with money. I just thought at this point it was common knowledge to avoid these girls and they'd have agents whose job is to save them from themselves.

All these things are not new, social media and the internet as a whole just makes these information more accessible.

Roland17:
MPJ has been disappointing in this series. He has managed to stay healthy which is shocking but this series has been a struggle for him. He is missing defensive assignments and not imposing his will offensively. With his size and length, he can help the Nuggets with guarding Butler so Gordon can catch a break. Yesterday, Malone made the call to stay small by taking MPJ out and keeping Braun on the court because the latter was more impactful.

His defense in game 3 was actually good, his issue in that game and why Braun got more minutes was his unwillingness to be a cutter/slasher on some of those Murray and Jokic 2-man game. As soon as the heat started trapping Murray without leaving Jokic, he countered by looking for cutters, Braun was willing to do it but MPJ not so much.
Lastly Braun showed a willingness to attack the basket off the dribble on fast breaks and off pump fakes when he had the opportunity.

Roland17:
The Heat culture is the system and hierarchy is a big reason Spoelstra has succeeded and no, culture is quite difficult to replicate because it is not driven by one person. If it was that easy then every team will be successful because they will buy the culture. The Heat have the most stable leadership in Riley and Zo. They are responsible for the recruiting and establishing expectations. Spoelstra is a great coach, the best right now but make no mistake about it, the system is why the Heat have thrived.

Shaq was overweight when the Lakers trades him to the Heat and in the following season he returned with 6 packs on his way to another championship because the Heat system is not for slackers and is intense. You can send Spo to the Sixers but if the culture of accountability is not replicated from top to bottom, then there is not much Spo can do. Embiid is lazy and entitled, he would not survive Miami Heat culture if he was sent there sef.

That's what I am saying, if you start it and most of the role players are up for it, but the franchise guy is the one against, that in itself is a statement that not only is he not a winner, he also is not willing to learn how to be one.

Roland17:
You are right about retaining them but their success has largely been because of the Heat system, style and coaching.
I’d like to see them to get paid because they deserve it but I don’t think they will replicate this level of success on another team.

But if you bring them to a team and they start out working your franchise player, and said franchise player refuses to step up, you know then and there it's time to reset and start over. The heat culture is something that can be replicated easily, the harder task is getting a coach with Spoelstra coaching acumen.
A team like sixers would benefit from this, that body fat metric would do wonders for Embiid and the work ethic can also bring forth a more complete version of Maxey