₦airaland Forum

basilico:
Some people are in solitary confinement for simply crossing a barrier to the Capitol waving Patriotic flags. While murderers walk free. If that dont prick your conscience you aint humane enough

Bas, Bas! So in your bamboo kraken world, it was J6 committee that kept them in solitary confinement?

basilico:
GOP still at 217 for a few days.
One more seat and Jan 6 inquisiton is gone

All you care about is end to J6 committee! You are scared of the outcome for your demi god

ono:
How is it that a president with a very low job performance rating, going into the mid term elections is getting his goons voted in and putting up such a strong performance?

Rigged election people!!

Ono, you created a new thread for your conspiracy goons. But, still returned here in less than 48 hours.

If only you were interested in finding real answers. But, you asked a question and answered it through your conspiracy prism.

Continue to support a loser!!!

feedthenation:
---why do some people still follow Donald Trump---after this racist message on Virginia GOP govetnor Glen Youngkin---

One of the main reasons they follow him.

Obrigardo:
The reality is that Americans rejected many of Criminal trumps endorsed candidate. So the narrative is that, when you become more maga Americans will finally come around to reject you. So how will Gazpacho act in the new Congress as it shows people are rejecting trumpism?

Gazpacho

Ibime:
Of course it is. The whole house in Arizona went cultist with their cyberninjas stuff and some funny extremism over there

It's unbelievable what Trump got these folks to believe, do and say without shame. What is the outcome of Cyber Ninja drama?

Sorry about your predicament. It's a big shame what you have to go through just to renew a passport as a citizen.

They ask you to do NIN, BVN, Voters Registration - all capturing biometric data. Still each process will frustrate life out of you.

Many people left Nigeria because of endemic corruption such as this way before this japa era. But, what I have learnt as a Nigerian in diaspora is that you can hardly escape 'Nigeria'. For example, just sending money to Nigeria is frustrating as rules keep changing all at your detriment.

That you posted your experience in September and only have few comments as of today shows how unserious we are as a people to deal with the plague of corruption. Instead, you see plethora of topics and all manner of contributions on 2023 election.

I don't know how you will get out of this as you must have been marked. I will suggest you get in touch with social media influencers with bias for social justice to bring more publicity to your plight.

All the best.

America! How?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yM9Aw_I9eps

Handmaids Tale is becoming real right in our eyes.

feedthenation:
---It is not possible to keep up with the mental gymnastics---even Trump is struggling to articulate concisely (not like he do anyways)---

Wednesday: "The FBI planted evidence"
Thursday: "Sure there were classified documents taken, but Trump could declassify them anytime"
Friday: "BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA, MILLIONS OF DOCUMENTS, MAYBE NUCLEAR?"

Trump is a shameless charlatan. Did you notice how he deliberately added HUSSEIN to Obama's name? He is a crook and knows his audience - DEPLORABLES!

In 2022, GQP openly giving standing ovation to a fascist! GROSS!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rtVUxdLejsI

Criminal Trump really undermined decades of working and effective democratic norms.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZvSpqv3BvE

PS: I don't and won't respond to resident lunatics.

Asquare84:
What is she doing in a hotel if not that she is a prostitute

There are really very thoughtless people in Nigeria. So women are not allowed in hotels? And, people like this shameful comment! GROSS!

basilico:
sssh How dare you say you that? they all blacks.
If you interrogate further I suspect they have no father figures

Dumb and dumber on the beat! How disgusting can people be? Gross!!!

feedthenation:
The Republican Party just announced they are withdrawing from future presidential debates. Echoing Trump, they said the commission that has hosted the debates for over 34 years is “biased” and they are “going to find a better platform.”

Trump has destroyed RNC from within. How they cannot see or why they are OK with this is what I can't understand. Imagine the whole RNC pulling out of presidential debates because one delusional loser cannot accept result of an election? Cowards!

DeepSight:
It is exceedingly lazy and escapist to hold an argument against IDs based on work commitments or commitments to care. There is more than sufficient time for all - as I said - over two years between elections at the minimum - at least in the states.

Secondly the very fact that questions can be raised about mail-in voting and ballot harvesting is enough reason to raise the bar on identification. In truth, I neednt even cite these as any step to lock in the integrity of the process even further can only be welcome. No well meaning and serious citizen could quarrel with such.

I honestly hate pointless chat which this has turned to.
So, @Deepsight, if you don gerit, forget about it.

DeepSight:
From your own link -

"Obtaining free electoral ID cards involves prospective voters having to take time off work and caring responsibilities to travel to council offices during opening hours to request them. Those that can most easily take time off from work or caring responsibilities to do this are usually the most likely to already have ID."

I say its both escapist and lazy for anyone to rely on this given that there is no urgent deadline within which this can be done. Any serious voter can find time in what is at least two whole years between elections.

It's not my link Mr Deepsight, I only pointed you to formal resource on topic of discussion. And, all you picked out the the report is escapism and laziness? I am convinced you can do better.

You are yet to show me proof of what is wrong with previous election processes as a means to justify changes.

DeepSight:
@ Konkoja -

Many thanks for taking the time to give, again, a reasoned response. Appreciated.



Why not though? If you really want to participate in a formal exercise it's very hard to argue against such reasonable identification. Why would anyone want to participate in a free, fair, open, formal and public exercise such as an election while resisting presentation of a photo ID. You have to agree that that would eternally offer grounds for suspicion.



Lets be wary of deploying the obvious notion of general complexities as defenses against the simple and rational.



Glad you answered your own poser here. People who dont wish to engage with the system have no business being aggrieved on account that they were asked to present photo IDs.



Every measure to further or improve the openness and legitimacy of elections should be supported by all well meaning people. Amigo, to be candid, no matter how you spin it, those who seek to avoid photo identification in such a matter will eternally come off as highly suspect. There's just no way to spin this one. If it were something which was a function of money for instance, you could argue that it would disenfranchise the poor. But it is not. If it were something which was a function of education, you could argue that it would disenfranchise the lower classes. But it is not. If it were something which was a function of any other qualification by merit, race, sexuality, religion, ethnicity or the like, you could argue that it would disenfranchise people of certain categories. But it is not. It is available to every person cross country.

Frankly it is also not lost on one that some of the principal categories of people who would be interested in avoiding photo IDs must include fugitives, impostors and fraudsters of every description.

As I said before, while I appreciate you taking the time to set out your reasoning, there is just no way to argue against any measure which offers full and proper identification for voters in an election. Arguing against such will always amount to arguing against free and fair elections.

Have a good read... Including research reports:

https://www.electoral-reform.org.uk/campaigns/upgrading-our-democracy/voter-id/

See both sides of the argument based on facts.

Just to check what I'm missing here with the bolded - what is the proof or proofs of previous elections were not free and fair? This is like pumping someone with medication when he/she is not unwell!

Good chat mate - I rest my case.

DeepSight:
Thanks for this reasoned response ... I may respond in detail later as I am on the road. But for now you really have to bear in mind that among the "complex social issues" which you raise is the very real "complex" issue that resisting IDs will rightly be seen by many as a desire to rig elections.

IDs are used for virtually everything. Banking. Flying. Even to have an alcoholic drink. How much more to choose decision makers over the future.

There cannot really be any sound argument against IDs. Note that rather than present one, you merely said it's a complex matter. That's a weak response. You should get down to the exact complexities and show what's problematic with it.

Let's lay down some basics which should help explain the issues with use of photo ID for elections.
1. Try not to see issues through Nigerian perspective. Most developed countries have databases through birth, naturalisation, tax, social welfare systems etc. No one single person registered to vote has not been verified and ID confirmed. Ever wondered, for example, when there is an attacked/accident etc. how quickly victims and perpetrators are identified?
2. You asserted ID is virtually used for virtually everything. I agree totally. But, proof of ID and photo ID are not the same. Photo ID is just one of many means to proof ones ID.
3. I can only try to explain complexities of Social issues on why getting photo ID (as simple as it sounds) could disadvantage one group within society more than others. For example, how do you explain two children from the same family, trained the same way, but have contrasting outcomes in life? Life is not binary, there is a lot shrouded in between - greyed out.

My line of work (in the UK) requires peoples proof of identity. I can tell you some people have never had photo ID. They proof their Identity by birth certificate and official government letter addressed to them such as NINO or DWP letters. They will not travel outside their country - no need for passport. They will never drive, so why driving licence? Millions of people live on the fringes, it does not in anyway unqualify them as citizens of the country. This is what I want you to see.
Even in Nigeria, nomadic education was created to meet educational needs of the Fulanis. That is how society should work - catering for everyone. Not, because I can do it, then everyone should be able to do same.

In some countries mostly in the EU, national ID system is automatic. And they use it for a lot of activities - travel, health care etc. So, the use of photo ID for election in those countries is not a big deal. Its been part and parcel of their system. But that is not the case in the UK and USA. More than ten years ago, I recall, UK Labour government wanted to introduce a national ID system, it was roundly rejected because it was seen as intrusive. I am sure, Americans will also reject such scheme.

Those pushing for use of photo ID said photo ID will be issued free of charge in County or Council offices. So, that should solve it! Not quite! Because, I know no one size fits all (complexity). Some will do everything not to deal with government or anything official - lots of them in the US and UK (Gypsy travellers are a good example). Another, group are those who don't trust government, either as a result of historical or current real or perceived injustices. (You will find more Black and other minority groups).

The question then is should people with little or no trust in government be allowed or encouraged to take part in election process? Well, the answer to that is what come first - chicken or egg?

Personally, I am OK with any form of ID for election. Would use of photo ID disproportionately affect certain groups? Absolutely YES!

My initial post which you reacted to, was my response to a clown who, as usual, dump a white supremacy talking point on this issue without any iota of reasoning.

By the way, why fix what is not broken? How many people have been caught with identity theft at elections because of no photo ID? Claiming to be Joe Bloke whilst they are actually John James? (Again, don't look at it though the lens of what happens in Nigeria).

All the best in your quest for knowledge and information on complexities of society.

DeepSight:
I lean left, but I dont think anything can justify standing against IDs for elections. Its only common sense. Even here in vastly retarded Nigeria we use PVCs. How would you feel if a section of the country rose up in arms against the use of PVCs?

Use of PVC for election in Nigeria only confirms backwardness of Nigeria. Even with PVC, elections are still rigged. Right?

The issue of photo ID is not about leaning left or right. It is mainly whether it disadvantages a group or groups in the society. Put differently, any policy that disproportionately affect a group for whatever reason (beyond election), without mitigation, is discriminatory. Any policymaker in developed countries knows this. Please, stop using Nigeria as a Yardstick of a normal and functional society.

Proponents of photo ID use for election present it as if its the only means of verification when in actual fact one's identity has been verified even before registration. You can ask why 'use of photo ID will disadvantage a group or certain groups? After all it is only ID? Absolutely, that is why it is a complex social issue. But, does that make it a non-issue? Absolutely not! I personally would wish everyone has valid photo ID because I have plenty. But, I also know that is me interpretating the society through my lens to the world.

Let me ask you, why is there absentee voting? Why is there mail balloting? Should everyone not be able to cast their votes on election day?
Government could have said if you can't physically cast your vote, then nothing for you. How would those working away, the sick etc vote? Hence, inclusion and adjustment to accommodate those in these category.

Broadly, state (in a democracy) should be seen to promote increase participation across board. At least, we can agree on this!

basilico:
We are gonna see lotso that. Dems don't want voter ID because blacks are too dumb to get an ID yet they have bank accounts to recievee social justice handouts.

You are too shallow to comprehend complex social phenomenon as it relate to ID card issue. Unfortunately, you have shown you lack capacity or unwilling to learn. Nobody will waste their time to educate you. Continue to stew in your ignorance!

I have no doubt that for decades to come, there will be countless studies of the hypocrisy and bold face shamelessness of current day Republicans!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_t_K3jzQ1A

Ibime:
What was the voter turnout in USA last election. Who cares about your North Korea

When GQP can't win election, they cry fraud, so they can steal elections with pen and voter suppression. Which of the following did you have at the age of 18 when you were eligible to vote?

Ibime, these dumb dumb are too limited to understand nuanced social issues. They are programmed to be binary in their thinking. The level of ignorance is just astonishing. No wonder the state Nigeria is in! What chance has a country got with obstinately ignorant folks?

Enugurangers:
Stacey did not invade Georgia with MAGAts cultists but Trump invaded Washington DC

Stacey did not bring touts to smear poop but Trump did

Stacey did not shout stop the steal and encouraged touts to try and stop the certification but Trump did

We could go on and on....

I can't believe there is debate on conceding election. But, that is how low Trump pulled reasoning. Anything that has to do with him, reason takes it leave!

raumdeuter:
From the desk f Hilary Clinton

Suddenly Democrats care about conceding elections

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2020-election/hillary-clinton-says-biden-should-not-concede-2020-election-under-n1238156

https://thehill.com/homenews/media/513527-hillary-clinton-biden-should-not-concede-under-any-circumstances

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-election/hillary-clinton-joe-biden-donald-trump-us-election-2020-a9688361.html

So you only read headlines?

raumdeuter:
Has Stacey Abrams conceded that the 2018 Georgia Governorship election was lost and Kemp won fairly?

Stacey did not concede, therefore Trump should not concede! Classic Trumpism!

ono:
The one thing that has distinguished Trump - from other presidents (like Obama de o dumber), is that he doesn't like to chicken out, especially when he's got hard evidence that a crime has been committed.

Take for example, the Russian Hoax saga, the Ukrainian president's phone call saga, the stolen election of 2016 (Russian puppet) etc etc. Trump said all those were fabricated lies against him and his office. Over time, and with a little effort on his part (Special Counsel Durham), he's been proven right - all the time.

Why will his claim that the presidential election of 2020 was rigged be different?

What are the odds that he's lying and cannot be trusted? What has he got to lose? He's a wealthy man already - a septuagenarian who should be resting and enjoying his wealth.

There is an audit trail convincing enough for me to believe him. The election was rigged.

Audit trail? Like thousands of dead people voting? Voting machine switching votes? More votes than registered voters? Bamboo ballots?
Ono, proofing voter fraud is not rocket science! If I label you a thief and keep repeating it, does that make you one? But, Trumpism is a disease that has infected a lot of people. So, I understand your plight.

benalvino3:
Sedition is a crime from the mouth. Insurrection is an action, a physical crime. The guy was not at the capitol or attacking anyone, I don't think they will succeed on this one. Just as they failed with the Russia collusion BS. The DOJ is Desperate to put people under investigation so as to affect their political aspirations. they are afraid of trump running again.

Nope! Anybody who is not ready to or incapable of abiding by the rules of a game should not partake in the game. Even Nairaland have rules everyone on the platform are expected to keep, failure which could lead to suspension. Footballers gets red carded when they breach rules of their game. Trump has shown he is incapable of abiding by rules of election,since in his deluded mind, he cannot lose election.

Until he acknowledges he lost 2020 election, he should not qualify to contest in any future election.

Fashionista01:
In the olden days thieves don't rule a community but these days thieves are crown King, Worshipped and celebrated in the community.

#Things fall apart.

You have a very valid point. Nigerian politicians are not satisfied with the destruction they have caused in the polity, they are hell bent on destroying what is left of traditional institutions through imposition of people with questionable characters. This is one example!

ButterBurger:
The Oba no support Buhari APC

That Oba was imposed by APC led Ajimobi government against the kingmakers' nomination. There are several cases in court regarding his Obaship before he arrogantly attacked the other village - holding some of them captives and destroying their farm. If there is a land dispute, the lawful thing to do is to go court for resolution.

basilico:
What infuriates me is stuff like that. Pelosi has a commission investigating Trump
They leak anything damaging to Trump.
The worst of the worst is media lying , hiding and pushing a narrative. Acting in unison with goolag to censor such videos because they bury the myth.
What infuriates me is that simpletons cant see the lies.

benalvino3:
they see it but they don't care. They know it is all lies. a good example is the Governor Whitmer kidnapping scandal. they see the FBI in full force doing illegal stuff but it is okay with them because the FBI claimed to be going after a right-wing group.

mass formation Psychosis is in play.

by pushing out their own narrative and hiding any other counter-narrative, they tend to control what the mass thinks... these are mainly based on people with a bit of open-mindedness but, when you look at some who have confirmation bias... they go about searching for the media lies.

Dumb and dumber having a field day! Irony of Trumpists labelling people of having mass formation psychosis. Do you guys have any reflection of what you believe or post here at all?

Basilico, after disgracing yourself for believing several, wacky nonsense about 2020 election, you still have the effrontery to call anyone simpleton!

By the way, any updates from Cyber Ninjas?

Rawtruth1:
I completely agree with all the above submission. I want to add too that as a married couple, the only godly way of having se*x is the missionary position. Any other one is from the pit of hell. Thanks

According to who? I hope you are being sarcastic! What is your business with how married couple have sex for you to judge? Stop judging from abundance of your ignorance and misogyny whist hiding behind gospel or Christianity.

basilico:
Trump did not lose fairly. I have provided numerous articles showing fraud.
Unfortunately that term mass formation physchosis applies to you perfectly well.
The democrat and PR machine has declared Joe Biden won.
And so Followers can be hypnotized and be led anywhere, regardless of data proving otherwise. A key aspect of the phenomena is that the people they identify as the leaders – the one’s that can solve the problem or issue alone – they will follow that leader(s) regardless of any new information or data

You have been hypnotized to believe Biden won despite all the new information out.

Lets take another case.Russia. Media hypnotized you and I guess you still think Putin helped Trump in 2016 despite evidence that Clinton campaign cooked up stories in conjunction with Glen Simpson to spread the lie.

Another case debunked that you still believe as a result of mass formation physchosis? That Trump built cages to house illegal aliens which we all know were built by Obama.

Hunter Biden laptop was a Russian disinformation? You still believe that?

ISIS was also a JV team? You still believe that?

. You, sir, are a very unwell person!