₦airaland Forum

wirinet:
Well said. That is why quantum entanglement or the wave function would not work in the macro scale.

johnydon22:
Both are ruled by different laws in each level, Laws of the quantum world (even though we know nothing of it yet) breaks down in the macro-scale and that of the macro-world breaks down in the quantum world.
But the Quantum level is the fundamental ground level upon which the macro- is built.

I want to jog your minds a little.

Have you watched ant man? The superhero with the ability to shrink himself or matter?

In the movie, he shrunk himself down to the quantum world and nearly died. His scientist mentor noted that the quantum level is an abyss in which no one understands the rules.


What do you think would happen if we could manipulate things at the quantum level.

johnydon22:
So i take it that the 1,000,000 was not won? no answer!

I know kingebukasblog more than he knows himself.

Tufanja:
Thought you wld have logic mind enough to understand that the problem was not a lack of understanding of the slang, but the medical explanation to it. Just dont contribute further to ignorance. If somebody finds ignorance funny, the sense of humor is pretty fraudulent. Same for the lack of civilisation when addressing others. Play on the ball, not on the person.

Of course, what Ishilove said was nonsensical but we understood the point she was making. You fail to understand that craw-craw means many things in Nigerian English.


You are forcing me to defend ishilove's clowning. Don't do it again, okay?

More drama, please!

Tufanja not understanding Nigerian slang as usual and Ishilove picking fights here and there.

https://www.relatably.com/m/img/eating-popcorn-memes/5c6261e5f6bdb1e9fc9cd42db22df193.jpg

KingEbukasBlog:
Specious argument bro .

In the same vein as omnipotence paradox . God is infinite and Supreme . He precludes infinite regression . There is none greater - it is impossible for one to be greater . All Powerful .

So it is illogical to ask God create someone greater than him . It does not make any sense .`

How the hell is it illogical to ask God to create someone greater than him?

God can always reduce his powers, can't he?

Or if God's powers are infinite, there is always infinity plus one.




But if we read the bible, we start to even realise a new twist- Yahweh is not all powerful. He was an angry, jealous, racist and vindictive God. Showing that he gave into his emotions. This means that he could be manipulated.

johnydon22:
The society literally is too large for one person to change, it is a task more tedious than that of Hercules.

But since you cannot hope to change the society at once you can change the immediate society around and can start by changing yourself.

You cannot necessarily sweep the whole market but you can contribute to sweeping the market by sweeping your own part of the market.

So that's why we are mostly here, contributing our own little cents to the intellectual evolution of our society.

Plato's allegory of caves can actually illuminate the effects of trying to change that conventional societal view

Nice concept. I would love to delve further into this but I think it is a discussion for another time. Our society has a myriad of problems which can be talked about for days.

dblackninja:
I hope so I can tolerate anybody in this world--different sets in my hood.
Just that when the religious fervent ones occupy this thread.. erm erm

lol...nothing of that sort. The word "secular" in the title to them is like a cross to a vampire. Only the strong-willed among them can navigate these waters of secular thought.

johnydon22:
Exactly my boss. . . I am beginning to shape myself and mind to remove the trait of using degrading invectives on mind i dim ignorant, i am evolving past that condescending level.

Fully shown on my signature.

Believers of superstition and pseudoscience we must also consider are also humans with emotions and just like all of us are trying to figure out how the world works and our role in it.

Even thought their views and beliefs may mostly be consonant with science and secularism as proponents of the modern world, let us none the less tamper our sceptic criticism with kind words.

none of us really comes fully prepared or knows it all

Guy, you don't have a problem. You are much calmer than I am.


When I first came to nairaland, I was cool. Until I got my first ban for no reason other than I was the only vocal atheist at the time. I complained and got other bans while some religious peeps were cheering. It left a bitter taste in my mouth and I became very harsh. You should see my previous verbal assaults and smackdown matches with other people in the past. lol


Funny enough, I got over it and started realising that if I waste time bashing people and delving in such hate, my humanistic message gets lost.

So I'm much calmer now. Live and let live. I am not perfect but I try to hold back the insults now......I fail once in a while but I still try.


It's hard to take the high road

johnydon22:
The society shapes the thoughts only a few can press further and reach beyond the influence of their immediate society in cultivating their school of thought...

I do not necessarily blame them but the society that molded them.

So are you ready to change the society?

^^
That there, is the main issue

sukkot:
aww hell nahhhh I aint dat nigga

I don't know who is more mental- you with your weed inspired preaching of doom or ishilove with her multiple personality disorder alter-ego, dagr8est.


Allow me to relax and sip tea while the madness continues


https://www.reservations4six.com/uploads/3/8/5/9/38593801/8453134_orig.png

dblackninja:
Wow! Nice thread Logicbwoy and interesting so far!
But first let me travel to earth 2 and check whether the thread is going to be raided and raped to oblivion by some religious fanatics

No one is going to raid anything.

In fact, religious people are invited. All we need is decorum and tolerance

johnydon22:
One thing about science is that it does not aim at establishing immutable dogmas but rather through consistent studies reaches truthful approximations without at any point claiming absolute truth has been reached always open to doubt and scepticism to improve the quality of truth.

Science is driven by doubt as long as it is for the right reasons, enquiry and out of intellectual honesty, that fuels study that increase the quality of truth.

But if this doubt is fueled by 'personal belief systems and gut feelings' then such doubt is not only misplaced but nonsensical.



This is absurd if you ask me, i do not advocate for abortion not in least, but the case above is a reasonable excuse..

Interesting.

You'd be surprised at the funny things Nigerian students in Nigerian universities say.

johnydon22:
So true but i'd rather term it a Theological idea. . . .

-Philosophy though proposes problems mostly leaves them open to diverse approach.

-Theology on the other hand approaches a question not with the aim of satisfying the question truthfully but rather satisfying the questioner therefore thinks less of what is true but rather what feels good.
this is why theology is the parent of faith based belief, myths and most superstitions

-Science approaches a question objectively aimed at satisfying the question itself uncaring what feels good to the questioner, objective facts are not opinions.

Bros, I am not joking- you should be a lecturer.

I swear, you would be a blessing to the current indomie generation that are learning rubbish from a failed education system.

We have a resident (final year) student doctor here on nairaland that refuses to believe in evolution and has clearly stated that he would rather allow his wife to die in childbirth than to abort a problematic pregnancy ( a pregnancy that would kill both mother and child if it comes to full term).

johnydon22:
It will happen in space so we possibly can't be there to witness the danger, the people inside will be perfectly safe though

seen.

https://45.media.tumblr.com/8156b581f741dc82544e55985d487cfb/tumblr_mv6p26hij91sykqw3o1_500.gif

johnydon22:
Therefore doesn't know everything and bang!!! Omniscience shattered

Being all-powerful, all-good, all knowing are all problematic abilities since they all contain logical paradoxes.


An all powerful, personal God is a half baked philosophical idea.

Lilbrown007:
GOOD QUESTION I GUESS IS TO SERVE HIM JUST LIKE ROBOTS N WORSHIP HIM TOO THE QUESTION NOW WILL BE WHY DID GOD MAKE HUMANS

I actually find it ridiculous that God would just sit down in space being bored then decided to create earth and humans. Was he that jobless that he had to create "play things" that should worship him?


Can God create another god more powerful than himself?



Kingebukasblog, I will give you 1,000,000 naira if you answer the above question directly. Make I bend

johnydon22:
Warp drive more or less is not really moving at all. . . It entails bending of space/time that the fabrics of space/time becomes shrunk in front of the space ship.

E.g using a rubber sheet, you want to travel from Point A to point B. . instead of travelling straight, you shrink the sheet to an extent that the point you want to travel is directly in front then when outstretched you are now at that desired point.

Instead of travelling through space/time, warp drives brings space/time to us.. Crazy right?

Space travels faster than light, so the ship doesn't really need to move space transport it rather

Yeah but it is theoretically plausible and i've seen videos of NASA scientists remarking about NASA working on such a project..

Still a subject of Sci- fi but literally everything we have now should be Sci-fi 2,000 years ago

I see.

But a "warp machine" would be dangerous. Imagine being near when space/matter/time are being folded for the warp jump.

Lilbrown007:
ON THE MUSLIM POINT OF VIEW THEY BELIEVE THAT ANGELS RECORD EVERYTHING WE DO DURING OUR LIFE TIME SO MAYBE GOD DOESN'T REALLY REMEMBER EVERYTHING BUT HAS A RECORD OF EVERYTHING

YES, why would a God that can do everything himself need angels in the first place?

johnydon22:
Logicbwoy lets have some fun with this beautiful paradox, apologies to the religious folks who might find it hard to swallow.

The paradox of omnipotence.

Can something omnipotent create something that i cannot lift?

-If it cannot then it is not omnipotent

-if it can then by virtue of it's inability to lift it, it is still not omnipotent...

Crazy right?

Reveals the outright inconsistency in such meaningless attributes of an infinite ability

Ah, my favourite paradox!

There is also the "omniscient paradox"


Religious people believe that God knows everything. If God knows everything, then he cant forget because he always knows everything. However, if he can't forget, then he can't truly know the experience of forgetting something.

johnydon22:
I do not doubt the possibility of anything though i can point out why speed of light travel is almost elusive to us.

Special relativity shows that speed of light is the upper limit to the relative motion of matter.

Einstein's relativity theory E=MC²

this shows the relativity of mass and energy (C) is a constant 'the speed of light'.

so from that equation, the faster a body goes the more mass it bears and the more energy needed for propulsion.

So if a body runs at the speed of light, it's mass will be almost at infinite and therefore the energy needed will be E² more like infiniti²..

So is nearly impossible to achieve.

If a particle possess mass then it cannot exceed the speed of light but if it doesn't then it is possible.

Yeah running at the speed of light is more or less like disappearing pooooooof!!!

I think Warp drives could be more feasible than aiming for the speed of light

How is a warp drive different? Are you not still going to go fast with it?

johnydon22:
since we don't actually think wormholes exist in the macro-level (fingers still crossed on that)..

Michio once said: They are looking for ways to capture a micro-wormhole from a quantum field and enlarge it to a micro-scale and achieve stability.

I replied your comment too early!

Anyhoo, have you wondered the possibilities if we could create those micro-wormholes here on earth?

Do you watch the flash tv series? The flash ran so fast that he travelled through time and another time, he entered an alternate earth.

It is fiction but if you think about it, if you run faster than the speed of light, you are technically disappearing. Can one run faster than time and space itself?


Sorry, I did not study science- I'm a business student and so, I might not use the correct physics terminology.

johnydon22:
Yeah i have . . . Quite an interesting one, gives a bit of an insight on the future of space travels.

But i think we'd be using Warp drive instead or laser beam propulsions (already in existence)

But no one has been through a wormhole.

I think they should try and send something through a wormhole. That would be interesting.


However, I believe that we would find aliens if we travel far enough into the galaxy

wirinet:
I on the other hand disagree with kingebuka on this.


Yes, i agree that marriage counseling committees in churches should handle family planning, but the overall doctrine of a church is determined by the pastor or church. What do you want a marriage counseling committee to counsel when the church or pastor preaches against the use of contraceptives and condom and says children are gifts and blessings from god


The responsibility is put on religious institutions because in Nigeria, religious institutions has a huge influence on the populace. Peoples believe and listen to their pastors, imams, etc, than any other person.
You want to start teaching teens about family planning? Are they planning to start a family? Secondary school children should be taught sex education and how to avoid sexually transmitted diseases and unwanted pregnancies, not to determine how many children they should have.

The China controls cannot work here. IBB tried something similar with his one wife 4 children policy, it failed woefully . The policy would fail because of Traditional, cultural and religious values of Nigerians. How will you tell an igboman with 4 daughters and no sons not to have any more children, when the igbo society is a highly patrilineal society. Similar issues will arise with yoruba, hausa and other societies.

Well said. I must have missed that part about the counselling committee vs the pastor.

johnydon22:
Yeah of course these are theoretical speculations only proven within the pages of a mathematical representation.

-Wormholes conventionally do not take us back in time or further rather works like a folded bridge of space/time.

E.g: On a flat sheet of paper you make two points on each end, now their nearest distance is a straight line but when you fold this sheet of paper that the two ends are meeting each other, their shortest distances becomes almost an instantaneous reach to each other.

Practically a wormhole has never been observed in the macro-universe but has been in a quantum field where bubble-like pathways pop in particles into existence and they pop out again.

For time travel let me explain the theoretical rationale behind it and why i told you time never runs backwards.

everything in this universe travels in a 4 velocities at 2 distinct dimensional reach. . 3 travel at a spatial dimensions and 1 in the time dimension..

and the sum of these are equal to the speed of light (C)... so to keep this equilibrium the faster your in spatial dimensions the slower your time dimension becomes so to balance the sum of the total velocity to C.

mathematical representation.

X + Y+ Z+ T = C.

where (XYZ) are spatial velocities and (T) is velocity in time, (C) is the speed of light.

So if you reach a velocity that equals C in your spatial dimensions .. Like (making T the subject of formular) T= C - XYZ

But since XYZ = C, T = 0.

(Since T= 0 means Time is at a stand still)

But if you reach a speed greater than that of light in the spatial velocities, XYZ > C.

(> ) greater than.

So since XYZ > C, T now runs at a negative value...

therefore you are now ahead of time since time is now behind you... That is the theoretical rationale behind forward time travel.

Do not think there it can ever travel backwards unless of course (XYZ) runs at an infinitely negative value of (C) therefore becomes behind (T)

You must be a physicist!

Anyhoo, I see your point now. I was not truly looking at it from a mathematical perspective.

But have you seen the movie "Interstellar"?

johnydon22:
You see spiritualism is a vague concept, it is used in various religions and cultures in different context.

E.g Jainism which can be called a non-theistic religion (broadly atheistic) centers on a spiritual idea of non violence towards all things living, proposes an eternal universe and prides the conquering of all passions to a state of an almost godly level.

so there are different uses of that word "spiritual" different ideas of it, the conventional idea i dismiss But just as you have saidvabove, i completely agree.

If there is anything that can be said to be "spiritual" in a sense of it's effect on the human or even animal mind, it's ability to harmonize or to disrupt the vibrations and calibrations of a neurological pattern.

it is un-doubtable Music

Notice how almost every religion depends on it in their practise of their different ideas of spiritualism.

Music triggers the very end of our our emotions and stretches them to their limits, i can cry while listening a certain type of music/song, i can have a profound feeling of love while on some that.

while some fills me with an alien sadness that is hard to explain other can make me wild, some soothing and some calm me down.

Music stretches the very depth of the human conscious self and connects us to our deepest reaches of emotional lap even without us knowing.

While conventional spirituality may be an idea of reaching reality, unconnected from a material manifestation.

Music on the other hand reveals a rather deep and harmonious untapped our existence, a journey within self unknown to us and a connection towards nature that eludes my perfect understanding.

I'd say if there is anything spiritual in the sense of it's effect on a mind, its ability to drive a mind beyond the reaches of it's limit (unconventional at it is), you term in psychological, a neurological outstretch or anything but this is Music

P.S: It is also a wrong view to hold that atheists are not spiritual in a conventional way, many atheists does and also exercise beliefs in connection to this conventional spiritualism and i have corrected this naive impression many times.

It is only many of of us who tend to employ a scientific world view "Empirico-rationalism" that mostly tend to dismiss these conventional idea of spiritualism."

If i find anything "spiritual" (not in a conventional way) then it is a profound realization of me being a part of nature, a bit and a child of nature and like the tiny atoms up to the gigantic galaxies.

every piece alongside me and everything, brings in unity a totality of a chaotic but beautiful cosmos (nature) and the reaching out of the ordinary level of automatic uncontrolled reach of deep consciousness only Music can give.

This is one of the most beautiful posts I have ever read on nairaland.

Please, allow me some time to digest it.

Lilbrown007:
SEARCH ON YOUTUBE "THROUGH THE WORMHOLE IS TIME TRAVEL POSSIBLE "

OK HERE'S THE LINK

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tQ9FRiBT5WI&itct=CCkQpDAYASITCN_5yPvsv8wCFdM8FgodOzoNo1IhVGhyb3VnaCB0aGUgd29ybSBob2xlIHRpbWUgdHJhdmVs&hl=en&client=mv-google&gl=NG

Thanks, I will watch it!

freecocoa:
Lol, you made a choice, live with it.

I could always create another username

menesheh:
Is this comment not in opposition to the Genesis account of "multiply and fill the world?" because that's the basic ideology some ignorant Nigerians and religious leaders go about disseminating to the populace.




The issue of birth control is potentially alien to we uneducated Africans who are being driven by selfish gene. Other animal species selfishly seek the good and wellbeing of its specie hence unconsciously making it a point of duty to replicate and spread wider in order to ensure the continuous existence of its survival machine.


We are relatively in the same baggage of reasoning like other animal species. Leaving footprint of oneself is remotely our individual utmost priority without actually considering the lethal harm it posses to our wellbeing in a country ravaged by hunder, diseases, scrambling for survival etc.

The sort of leaders propelling the affairs of the country are not in anyway helping matter in the issue of overpopulation and the need to curb the popular notion of over breeding.

Truly, I wonder how these church leaders will react if some anti-overpopulation policies come in place. The catholic church for instance, is opposed to condoms.

johnydon22:
hello logicbwoy, nice thread you've got here and interesting discussion so far....

I'm open to questions now

In Christianity and Jewish mytholoy angels sing. Music is divine.

Even as an atheist/humanist, I have always felt music to be spiritual. Have you ever wondered why some music tracks scare us (eg horror movies- foghorn and haunting piano tunes)?

Have you ever wondered how music makes us move our heads and feet? Have you ever felt some lyrics touching deep down into your soul?



When I was depressed, listening to music help me to be a little bit happy. I kept listening to Notorious BIG and how he turned his life from negative to positive.


To me, the relationship between music and the brain is far more than biology. A hardcore biologist would just claim that music is a form of communication patterns and the brain is just reacting to it. However, jazz music defeats such a mentality- it is nonsensical and harmonic at the same time. It speaks differently to different people, so what is it communicating? Jazz sometimes has no pattern.


Sometimes, I listen to daft punk and I feel like i'm being transported into the future. There is nothing like electro house music for me. It makes me dream of the future.


One can also relate music to the string theory of the universe. The universe is a symphony of vibrating strings.



cc Kingebukasblog who thinks that there is nothing spiritual about atheists