₦airaland Forum

dotcomnamename:
MickinAbuja,

Some of them do apply personal opinion, infarct lot of them do that and it is not new at all. I'm hearing it from you for the first time that they don't apply personal opinion. I can see Abuja on your name or are you an IrishVisaOfficer in Abuja? . Lot of cases won through oral hearing where applicants representatives proved to courts that decisions was based on personal opinion of the V.officers. My first Irish visa application was refused and i was not given right of appeal. I made a very crazy step, I sent a petition directly to the ambassador, i enclosed my original passport back to the embassy that I don't even need it any more, and i explained in the petition letter that the visa officer's decision was purely based on his personal opinion and bias. But to be sincere i actually took the risk knowing fully well that i may be banned for sending original passport with petition back. This is a case where i met all the required documents one by one even more than the documents they required coupled with the fact that i already have different visas. After few weeks, i received an email to forward a return DHL or UPS envelope within 48 hours, i couldn't get DHL and UPS then, so i used TNT, i received the envelope through TNT in Lagos and the first thing i saw was a Letter of Apology signed by the Assistant to the Ambassador and they issued me a 3 month Irish visa. I visited Dublin then and i spent only 8 days. After then it was renewed to another 3 months. So, that apology letter always look like gold to me and so i always include it in any of my visa application then, though it means nothing to any visa officer. .. My point here is, if you meet visa requirements and you're still refused the visa, i think its not a bad idea to challenge the decision even though issuing you the visa is not your right but privilege. But still, its good to challenge some visa decisions. They're not always right. However, fingers are not equal. I suspect you're a VisaOfficer?

First of all, and lets be clear - I am not a Visa Officer, nor do I know any Visa Officers in any Embassy. What I do know is people that work with me have savage trouble in getting the whole visa process right to UK, EU and Ireland even China and Japan. Also, and correct me if I am wrong, in the Irish, UK and other EU and US Embassies the Ambassador has nothing to with Visas - the visa office is staffed by Dept of Justice/State/Home Office Officials from their countries, whereas the Embassy is staffed by Foreign Office staff, who would find visa issuance beneath them. I can only assume that your petition, once it was seen as a visa matter was given to the appeals officer and he/she treated it as an appeal. I wouldn't think ambassadors would be bothered about individual visa cases, but I could be wrong. I have seen UK, Irish, EU and US visa refusal letters and the Irish and UK give proper reasons for refusal, ones that can be challenged on appeal. Maybe I'm an optimist but I would hope that VO's from all countries would be rules bound rather than opinion based

I do admire the advice you give and it has helped co-workers of mine in their applications

hodus:
Good Evening Bro Justwise and my people in this house, please can someone banned for 10 years by British High Commission in Abuja apply for Republic of ireland visa with the same passport that has UK refusal stamp on it? Though the stamp didn't show any indication that he was banned. It only show the visa refusal number ''80*6*28'' and ''UK Abuja'' on the stamped surface.

justwise:
Chances of refusal is high as both countries share data

Justwise is correct, unless you have an Irish Citizen wife or children - an exception may be made in this case if the ban related to a non declaration or something small, but if has anything to do with document fraud it will be pretty difficult

Vicjustice:
It would have been good to understand what you quoted in its context before before judging it.
There is difference between "depositing lump sums of money into an account which apparently stands in isolation for presentation purpose" and the scenario that you explained.
Other people who had read my post understood what i meant by "Money Lodgement" hence none have objected.

Vicjustice - my post wasn't meant to be an objection, but rather a clarification to explain what type of 'Money Lodgement' may be acceptable. You are correct to say that "depositing lump sums of money into an account which apparently stands in isolation" will not be viewed well by VO's. Keep up the good work

edwapkalmeed:
The U.S. said Monday that it will
impose visa restrictions on any
Nigerian found to have incited
violence or interfered with the
electoral process.
Source: Premiumtimes

Don't worry, the US won't find any of them guilty of incitement to commit violence or interfering with the Electoral process. Their vessel is empty and empty vessels make most noise!!!

dotcomnamename:
You'r every funny .. You think it's easy like that? If it's easy the way you stated, you won't see any such applicant still asking different means to get visa for such status.

Ireland immigration system is one of the tough immigration systems
If your wife is Irish it does not mean you will be granted Spouse visa.
I've seen many people deported to 9ja from here all in the name of getting married legally to Irish Citizen... though by their law and Eu law, they should grant it, but at times they apply personal opinion instead of the law

As at now, the fair one is by Zambrano application which means if your child was born here and have the Irish passport, then you can be considered base on Zambrano ruled by the (ECJ).-European Court of Justice

I do not think that VO's apply their personal opinion because if they did the decisions would be overturned through Judicial Review. Sometimes the criteria is not clear to applicants and they have the chance at appeal to clear up any misconceptions, errors and submit extra information, evidence etc. that they may have left out in the application process, through no fault of their own

VicGoodGuy:
Forgive me if I'm wrong, but is he not entitled for a visa by virtue of his being married to a citizen? Irrespective of his being employed or not? has he tried applying for a visa and was refused ma'am?

Actually, No he is not entitled to a Visa. He has to fulfil the requirements as laid down in the INIS website, www.inis.gov.ie which means that the onus is on the spouse in Ireland to ensure that her husband will not be an expense on the public purse and resources. She will have to show an average of €40,000 earnings over the previous 3 years (NOT EVERY YEAR, BUT IN TOTAL OVER THE PREVIOUS 3 Years. This cannot be from the welfare system

sobastical:
Yeah you're right Mr Bayo, I'm sorry for replying late air tel has been wicked lately and that also affected my response to your PM.


Please the best thing to do first is try to write the school of your interest ask about their requirements for getting an unconditional offer. As most things stated on their website might have change cos I find out that most the school website are not updated.

About the visa thingy, the first info I got is that if one is applying for a student you must show a proof that you've pay the required schools with that you're good to go and visa is 80% sure.[i]

That's all I got for now, you can kindly add yours or make some research too to compare and contrast.

You couldn't be more wrong, just because the fess have been paid does not mean you are 80% of the way, what about sponsorship, source of funds, income stream to keep you in Ireland etc, etc. Please read ALL requirements and pay attention to all. I know the VO's will look for good overall applications and not just concentrate on Finances

[quote author=sobastical post=32404628][/quote]Go to www.inis.gov.ie or email the Visa Office abujaembassy@dfa.ie

[quote author=Maximeo post=31482774]@ KoloOyinbo

I condemn all forms of Colonialism but this does not excuse illegal immigration or any fanciful ideas that these people are very badly treated.
As an Irishman I despise Slavery of any form. I am aware Africa suffered from it terribly with first Arabs and then Europeans raiding and stealing slave and more usually simply buying them from other Africans. It is one of the few things I find good about the British that they were the prime force in stopping such an abominable practice and outlawing the slave trade.

There is a forgotten area of slavery that the world never mentions, not even the Irish. Please see http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-irish-slave-trade-the-forgotten-white-slaves/31076 where you will be educated and may come to known about what happened to the Irish Slaves

"They came as slaves; vast human cargo transported on tall British ships bound for the Americas. They were shipped by the hundreds of thousands and included men, women, and even the youngest of children.

Whenever they rebelled or even disobeyed an order, they were punished in the harshest ways. Slave owners would hang their human property by their hands and set their hands or feet on fire as one form of punishment. They were burned alive and had their heads placed on pikes in the marketplace as a warning to other captives.

We don’t really need to go through all of the gory details, do we? We know all too well the atrocities of the African slave trade.

But, are we talking about African slavery? King James II and Charles I also led a continued effort to enslave the Irish. Britain’s famed Oliver Cromwell furthered this practice of dehumanizing one’s next door neighbour.

The Irish slave trade began when James II sold 30,000 Irish prisoners as slaves to the New World. His Proclamation of 1625 required Irish political prisoners be sent overseas and sold to English settlers in the West Indies. By the mid 1600s, the Irish were the main slaves sold to Antigua and Montserrat. At that time, 70% of the total population of Montserrat were Irish slaves.

Ireland quickly became the biggest source of human livestock for English merchants. The majority of the early slaves to the New World were actually white.

From 1641 to 1652, over 500,000 Irish were killed by the English and another 300,000 were sold as slaves. Ireland’s population fell from about 1,500,000 to 600,000 in one single decade. Families were ripped apart as the British did not allow Irish dads to take their wives and children with them across the Atlantic. This led to a helpless population of homeless women and children. Britain’s solution was to auction them off as well.

During the 1650s, over 100,000 Irish children between the ages of 10 and 14 were taken from their parents and sold as slaves in the West Indies, Virginia and New England. In this decade, 52,000 Irish (mostly women and children) were sold to Barbados and Virginia. Another 30,000 Irish men and women were also transported and sold to the highest bidder. In 1656, Cromwell ordered that 2000 Irish children be taken to Jamaica and sold as slaves to English settlers.

Many people today will avoid calling the Irish slaves what they truly were: Slaves. They’ll come up with terms like “Indentured Servants” to describe what occurred to the Irish. However, in most cases from the 17th and 18th centuries, Irish slaves were nothing more than human cattle.

As an example, the African slave trade was just beginning during this same period. It is well recorded that African slaves, not tainted with the stain of the hated Catholic theology and more expensive to purchase, were often treated far better than their Irish counterparts.

African slaves were very expensive during the late 1600s (50 Sterling). Irish slaves came cheap (no more than 5 Sterling). If a planter whipped or branded or beat an Irish slave to death, it was never a crime. A death was a monetary setback, but far cheaper than killing a more expensive African. The English masters quickly began breeding the Irish women for both their own personal pleasure and for greater profit. Children of slaves were themselves slaves, which increased the size of the master’s free workforce. Even if an Irish woman somehow obtained her freedom, her kids would remain slaves of her master. Thus, Irish moms, even with this new found emancipation, would seldom abandon their kids and would remain in servitude.

In time, the English thought of a better way to use these women (in many cases, girls as young as 12) to increase their market share: The settlers began to breed Irish women and girls with African men to produce slaves with a distinct complexion. These new “mulatto” slaves brought a higher price than Irish livestock and, likewise, enabled the settlers to save money rather than purchase new African slaves. This practice of interbreeding Irish females with African men went on for several decades and was so widespread that, in 1681, legislation was passed “forbidding the practice of mating Irish slave women to African slave men for the purpose of producing slaves for sale.” In short, it was stopped only because it interfered with the profits of a large slave transport company.

England continued to ship tens of thousands of Irish slaves for more than a century. Records state that, after the 1798 Irish Rebellion, thousands of Irish slaves were sold to both America and Australia. There were horrible abuses of both African and Irish captives. One British ship even dumped 1,302 slaves into the Atlantic Ocean so that the crew would have plenty of food to eat.

There is little question that the Irish experienced the horrors of slavery as much (if not more in the 17th Century) as the Africans did. There is, also, very little question that those brown, tanned faces you witness in your travels to the West Indies are very likely a combination of African and Irish ancestry. In 1839, Britain finally decided on it’s own to end it’s participation in Satan’s highway to hell and stopped transporting slaves. While their decision did not stop pirates from doing what they desired, the new law slowly concluded THIS chapter of nightmarish Irish misery.

But, if anyone, black or white, believes that slavery was only an African experience, then they’ve got it completely wrong.

Irish slavery is a subject worth remembering, not erasing from our memories.

But, where are our public (and PRIVATE) schools? Where are the history books? Why is it so seldom discussed?

Do the memories of hundreds of thousands of Irish victims merit more than a mention from an unknown writer?

Or is their story to be one that their English pirates intended: To (unlike the African book) have the Irish story utterly and completely disappear as if it never happened.

None of the Irish victims ever made it back to their homeland to describe their ordeal. These are the lost slaves; the ones that time and biased history books conveniently forgot."


This information is contained in a book "White Cargo" published in 2008 and written by Don Jordan and Michael Walsh

funkybaby:
i disagree with your comment that they share the same immigration database.just because i was refused an entry visa by UK or Ireland does not mean Netherlands or the USA will refuse me too. even if these countries share the same database as you claim, do they have the same immigration law, visa requirements, etc ?? How can you say that because someone was refused visa to Ireland, the person is automatically banned from applying to the UK

you need to understand that each country is sovereign with its own immigration law, requirements, policies, etc. it down to the applicant to meet the specific visa requirements of the country he is seeking to visit/reside.

can you show me a link from the Irish immigration law that states anything on 10 years visa ban

d2ddayo, clearly stated that after the refusal from the Irish embassy, he went ahead to reply for a french visa and he was granted. If we are to go with your argument, then Ireland and France should be 'sharing the same immigration data' - after all, they are both in the EU. so why was he not refused by the French embassy? so your argument holds no water. like i said to you in a previous thread. . . . . when was the last time you applied for a visa? No be Irish passport you get? so why do you stand with such authority like you know how these things work?

Ireland and the UK do indeed share information. Every Irish applicant gives fingerprints, photo, passport number etc. These are transmitted to the UK where they are checked against the UK database and the results sent back to the VO's who process the applications. I do know that having a UK refusal does NOT automatically mean that you will be refused an Irish Visa. Even having a UK 10 year ban will mean that it is very difficult to get an Irish visa, but it has been known to happen. Many people that were deported from the UK are surprised when the Irish Embassy tells them that in the refusal letter. By the way Ireland does not dish out 10 year bans, with them its a 5 year ban for deception only.

The reason for this information sharing is the Ireland and the UK are outside the Schengen area and share a 'Common Travel Area' in that there are no travel restrictions put on Irish or English citizens travelling over and back. Irish and English people don't even need a passport - a drivers licence will do (unless the airline insists on it). This means that by sharing information they are protecting their borders and doing the job they were employed to do and that is - ensuring as far as possible that as many as possible genuine applicants get visas.

A lot of people make the mistake of making deposits into their bank accounts prior to visa application; this action is called "Money Lodgement" which is an express ground for visa refusal: Do not naively commit this violation (by depositing lump sums of money into an account which apparently stands in isolation) for presentation purpose.
Such account does not meet the requirement of an acceptable bank statement so, applying for a visa with it will only give you a definite result, REFUSAL.

By Vicjustice

This is not quite true, if a lump sum lodgement in an account is backed up be documentary evidence such as Maturity of Savings Bonds, sale of property, rental agreements - all tis will be taken into consideration, especially in study applications where VO's recognise that in genuine applications parents will have been planning this for a long time and may have had money tied up in Bonds, shares and property and other saving accounts - as long as the 'evidence trail' is visible and plain to see VO's will of course take this into consideration.

dotcomnamename:
Calm down, relax, sit down and coll down yourself, have a breath, read the refusal letter carefully again, read it again and again and try to figure out the embassy reason for refusal. Go ahead with your Irish Student Visa, add more documents if possible. I still believe that the Irish Embassy will still issue you the visa, provided that you make the correction. Going from one embassy to another may cause you confusion, and might even think of something else for the reason you were refused visa by Irish, so go ahead with it, at least you still have chance!

What are the documents you submitted at first?

All reasons for refusal should be addressed in any appeal. If the term 'no evidence' was used, then in any appeal evidence should be provided. Study the reasons for refusal very carefully and address each one by on attaching an appendix of evidence or documentation to back u your case. When you have this done re read what you are submitting and give the letter of appeal to a friend and ask them their opinion before submission.

I do know that the Irish VO's do take the appeal process seriously

atkin8:
There was new rules in Jan 2014 for sponsors of tourist visas that they must show 40K over 3 years income . I am redundant but have savings in access of 70K . I did send a letter to INIS to find out what savings would be adequate for a C 90 day visa but they avoided the question .

This is incorrect the €40k over 3 years relates to Family reunification cases ONLY - where the reference in Ireland must show as least this amount of earnings