LeSudAfricaine:
You see? Are Nigerians facing the same with their immigrant population? If not. Shut up man you don't know what we're facing

Anecdotal evidence to fit your narrative.

for every one of these so called Somali spaza criminals there are a 100 Somalis minding their business and living out their daily lives.

Your reasoning is like comparing the success rate of a rapper in the hoods of America making it to become a Jay z.

for every Jay z, there are a 1000 rappers who will never make it but because you see Jay z rapping on TV everyday you believe that 50% of rappers will make it and make money.

Olodo!

TMKsouth:


These pics were making the rounds on WhatsApp last week

I applaud these efforts. I have nothing against tackling individuals or organizations who engage in criminal activity be it Foreign or domestic. They harm everyone that lives in the society and not only "SOUTH AFRICANS".

a Pakistani selling monkey brained shawarma will sell it to a Congolese or Rwandan not so?

Now of the estimated 5 million legal immigrants, illegal migrants, economic migrants and refugees can you give us an estimate of the proportion that you think are involved in all forms of criminal activity as a percentage of the entire 5 million immigrant population is SA?

In addition can you juxtapose this to the statistical number of reported crimes ( all levels) of South Africans and juxtapose it to your entire population.

In other words if I had a daughter living any where in Gauteng what would be the probability of her being attacked by a South African as opposed to a foreign national??

here are your stats on foreign nationals jailed in SA prisons

https://www.pressreader.com/south-africa/cape-times/20190716/281715501194044

Lionessza6:


Are you high?
Why do you think every sane nation is scared of the influx or illegals......they are difficult to trace which makes it difficult to bring them to justice.

yet South the commissioner of police can safely state that 60% of suspects of violent crimes in "GAUTENG" are foreign nationals. Hmmm?

Lionessza6:

A South African criminal or permanent resident is easier to catch.........fingerprints and id ....they have to use an id at the bank, school,work etc. If cops really want to find a SA criminal they usually do. So jail and prison stats wont reflect the he whole picture. And this is SA,so it would be silly to think that they'd be more foreign prisoners than locals. But we can't overlook that there are certain heinous crimes dominated by aliens.

To rebut the point on the so called inability for law enforcement to identify NON SOUTH AFRICANS during arrests means when you catch a Malawian foreign national, arrest him, finger print him and he comes up no within the system, you can't investigate further to determine that he has no "South African" identity at that point? Hmmm?

So a Nigerian criminal can claim origins in South Africa just by stating that he is Zulu neh!. There are not other means to determine if he is non South African when he is apprehended. Bunch of bull crap.

As against your little dubious post there on 60% of arrests in Gauteng being foreign nationals here is an excerpt from an article countering the so called stats on that information. This is why you guys need to investigate such statements.

JAWBONE:


Don't mind them. The same South African men are notorious for killing and raping their women.

No wonder their women always run to Nigerian men. We do know how to give some good good loving

just last week one in Soweto chopped up his side chick to pieces and stuck her parts in the Freezer.

another one who was pissed that he got caught cheating and his girlfriend left him, killed the girlfriend, tried to kill girl friends sister and then went across town to kill his side chick but ended up killing the sister.

JAWBONE:


Wow. So every hijacker, love-vendor, drug dealer in SA is a Nigerian.
And you think there are no South Africans involved in this vices that if every Nigerian leaves SA today, South Africa will be drug, love-vendor, hijack free?

The Nigerians who run legitimate businesses there and add value to your economy are suddenly lumped among the drug dealers. South Africa has a serious unemployment, crime and drug problem. It has nothing to do with Nigerians. How many Nigerians are in South Africa to start with.
I'm not sure they are up to 500k yet they are the cause of the entire South African problem. Do you know how far South Africa is from Nigeria?

It is the mark of laziness to keep blaming others for your own problems

Tell Iron galaxy to dig up the stats for you, his country keeps really good records on everything else but for some reason this one is not common knowledge to the populous.

Apparently the Nigerians who occupy the small metropolitan spaces of down town Joburg and Pretoria are somehow the ultimate problem of a large land mass that constitutes the geography of South Africa.

There's Nigerian drug dealers everywhere hiding in plain site stealing their women and infiltrating their deepest villages.

IronGalaxy:
You should know, aren't you always lurking in the shadows observing all things South African?

Yes I am a Vigilant Watcher. I am here to check you Saffers so you don't get out of line with some of these newbies on Nairaland who don't know you for what you all are here on nairaland.

IronGalaxy:
It was a greeting not an attack Relax Mr Try too much

listen Mfethu the only point I will agree with is that a mass of illegal immigrants constitute a nuisance to a society

However the word "nuisance" and the interpretation of it is where your so called political parties are playing politics with.

The basic definition is some one causing an annoying feeling or an incovienience to another person because of their presence.

That does not constitute criminal activity.

IronGalaxy:
Hey Depaak Chopra

Attack the points not the personality.

IronGalaxy:
You are hijacking our buildings, pimping our sisters, importing drugs etc and want tyet want to avoid blame? Stop using Apartheid as a crutch, your people were caught again Dehli. India importing drugs and you want Indians to blame who? Jesus Christ? You are a problematic nationality the sooner you are accept the better.

Comparing SA and Nigeria is pointless, you aren't experiencing what we're experiencing

Hijacking buildings in another man's country with what army

Pimping a grown ass woman by what means Muti?

Importing drugs from where? If you didn't know the biggest importers of contrabands into SA are the Chinese and Pakistanis but then again you wouldn't care.

JAWBONE:


I know you people are in love with your oppressors so much. That's your business. If you want South Africans to be exclusively for South Africans, then come clean and deport every other African there. Simple.

We are tired hearing about these attacks and blame for your misfortune. Every problem in South Africa is caused by African immigrants.
It's as if South Africans themselves are so good that all their problems come from outside.
Everyday blame Zimbabwe, blame Malawi, blame Nigeria, blame Ghana. It's never South Africans

Yes sir!

man after my own mind!

JAWBONE:


Until you people realise how bad the damage of apartheid was up to this present day, you will continue to blame everyone but yourselves for your problems.

Nigeria has problems and those problems are 100% the fault of Nigerians not Ghanaians or Beninoise or Cameroonians.

We tried sending the Ghanaians back sometime ago, it still didn't solve our problems. You should probably learn from that.

Thank you sir for seeing what is actually there and not what these nicumpoops keep propagandizing.

IronGalaxy:
Lol, it seems there's a narrative that you want to believe and you are dead set in believing it. Let's say 80% percent of black south africans live in shacks that's most of the country right? then most of the country would be made up of shacks isn't it? But as things stand South Africa is one of earth's most beautiful countries and if we mostly live in shacks why then do we also make the biggest middle class? Yes,

The point is not about the landscape of the country therefore the beauty of the country is irrelevant to the argument.

You do make up the biggest middle class in comparative terms and not absolute terms.

TMKsouth:


Foreigners that dodge paying taxes like in their home countries but leech off free State services? Those are the people who will collapse the SA economy?

How much on aggregate do you think all foreign owned businesses would potentially contribute to the your treasury. I am curious?

Foreigners indirectly pay taxes on everything else barr business taxes so your point is mute.

IronGalaxy:
sorry I always find it hilarious when you start acting like Deepak Chopra but go on...

You haven't addressed any point I made because you can't debunk my logic.

SImpleton

IronGalaxy:
I as a South African has nothing to be grateful to a Nigerian for, a Nigerian never died for our course. I'm sorry if it hurts.

As a Nigerian I agree we did not do anything for you guys so deserve no special treatment

I urge my Nigerians to stop using this argument.

IronGalaxy:
Ey man you can type a bible for all I care, as long as they clean you out I'm happy

Like I said simpletons do not think deep about issues. that's why they must be silenced and exposed as the retards that they are.

IronGalaxy:
Lol, when you specify "black South Africans" do you know the stance of other South Africans with regards to foreigners because I can tell you right now there's a general consensus among South Africans regarding this issue, people are tired man! we can't be Africa's Santa Claus, South African people must come first.

Step 1 tell your government to withdraw their signatory to the Hague. That would be the first step but alas you will loose plenty benefits when you do that which is why your government doesn't want you to know that they are bound by certain international law in terms of refugees.

Step 2. Revamp your immigration laws, stop giving visas to countries you deem undesirable to enter you shores but then again your government knows that diplomatically that would put you in an economic conundrum, your big businesses need to cast their wide net across Africa in terms of capital movement but the other economic effect to prosperity is the inflow of labor to where is exploited the best which unfortunately is SA at this point in time.

Step 3. Your best bet will be protectionist measures. China attempted this strategy and it worked in the short term ,they had issues as a long term sustainable economic policy.

Step 4. Increase funding to border posts, revamp border immigration laws e.t.c.. Have you ever wondered why this is not a priority for your government. Does the Eff have ultimate power in your parliament to oppose any of these laws passing.


Hmmmm You all are a bunch of whinning b.i.tches that don't understand issues on an elementary level.

IronGalaxy:

And to correct you, no one is saying we don't want black Africans here because that's a lie, we generally would welcome skilled Africans from all over the continent, your doctors, engineers etc, we're just tired of the riffrafffs that come into the country with nothing to offer, or to loiter around doing nothing andend up committing crimes just being a burden on our system

the other stuff about "apartheid" is pure trash!

Then have your mayor articulate that clearly and concisely because we have a bunch of illiterate and historically violent driven South Africans who are ready to do harm to innocents in the name of Rhetoric

IronGalaxy:
The fact that the are South African criminals is not an invitation for thousands to come to spoil our country, South African criminals are criminals in their country not in Accra, Kinshasa, Lusaka or wherever{/quote]

Nonsensical point if I might suggest.

[quote author=IronGalaxy post=107741220]
Your Malema must go to hell! he doesn't even understand the logistical and social nightmare that will ensue when we open borders for everyone, no African country does that but why must we? it's honestly not our responsibility to take care of Africa, what are African governments doing for their people?

The narrative being peddled is that SA borders must be set wide open. That to me is not wise, however I fully understand Malema's gesture when he claims he will not betray the African brother for the Capitalist white run system. Open border is not a practicality in any state that seeks to be soverign and if you listen attentively you will understand that Malema does not put his words correctly but is more or less advocating African intra-trade and Africane inter dependence.

IronGalaxy:

Nigerians were almost sorely the nationality that was responsible of highjacking buildings and turning them into brothels or crime dens and Mashaba when he was JHB Mayor, recovered 100+ buildings from undocumented Nigerians, mind you there are actual South Africans without housing but there are illegal aliens occupying our buildings. But somehow we must clap hands for that because the minute we complain is "Xenophobic" Stuff you man

These are criminal elements that must be flushed out of any society. No one is telling you to accept criminality in your borders but the way your "mayor" shapes is the arguments are patronizing to his citizenry in an attempt to stare up hate, xenophobia and resentment.

Simply state that there are open border problems with the country that must be dealt with and the foreign nationals engaged in these nefarious acts will be targeted with the full might of law enforcement.

While we deal head on with these criminal elements in our society, we acknowledge the fact that there are nationals of other African countries who are economic migrants within out borders seeking a better life for themselves. While we are signatories to the Hague convention which requires us to welcome refugees, it has become apparent that most of the foreign residents within South Africa are "economic migrants" who are in competition with our underskilled labor force. This is a problem that must be resolved and will be tackled by making sure resources are channeled to South Africans first as out primary obligation is to our citizenry.

While we acknowledge and sympathize with the plight of these economic migrants in the country it has become unsustainable to carry this burden and it is imperative that we discourage economic migration into the country by taking so and so steps"

Your Mayor cannot even articulate himself in the above manner is a xenophobe in disguise.

IronGalaxy:
The same foreigners that mug people, push drugs, hijack buildings, litter everywhere make demands, etc, that's enough to make anyone frustrated.

I keep asking you Saffers to give us stats on the percentage of Foreign national criminals in your jails, prisons as a percentage of overall crime statistics so we can see. Numbers don't like but Rhetoric travels far.

Point 1. There is an immigration problem in South Africa no doubt about it.

Point 2. There are different types of immigrant groups in South Africa but for convenience they are all lumped into the category of "foreign nationals." once upon a time they were just "foreigners" or "Kwerekwere's" before they got upgraded with the suffix "nationals" as a pretense to give them some sort of dignity as humans.

Point 3. There are approximately 5 million foreign nationals- encompassing of legal immigrants, illegal migrants, economic migrants and refugees.

Of this 5 million mathematically reduce their numbers to just males, you will get an approximate 2.5 million

of this 2.5 million males remove youngers btw the ages of 0- 18 who are less likely to commit crimes or heinous crimes for that matter, we get about 1. 8 million males over the age of 18 and potential criminals.

of this 1.8 million remove another 30 % of skilled labor,who are approximate for legal immigrants such as lawyers, doctors, teachers etc, we are left with about 1.2 million

of the 1.2 million remove men engaged in the informal sector in jobs under-skilled remove another 30 % and we are left with an approximate 880,000 potential deviants.

of this 880,000 factor in different types of criminal activity- so your fraud, petty theft, cyber crimes, heinous crimes such as rape, hijackings. killings etc and only about 30% of this group would engage in the most despicable of crimes.

That comes out to about 260,000 foreigner all nationalities as the highest degree of a threat to the SOuth African society in comparison to a population of about 50 million blacks, whites, coloreds and Indians.


When you do the math we come to realize that the "propaganda" of foreign nationals" s the bain of South Africa is exactly what it is. PROPAGANDA!!!!!

Bantukiller:
We are superior to you bantu apes!

Superior in what, bridged nose length[/quote]

Bantukiller:

Bleep you niggers! Somali pride bitch!

An Abeed calling another Abeed, Abeed.

Go to the deep south and see what they call you there.

Bantukiller:

Our women are the best in the world!

You use your religion to hide your women folk so don't taste real West African ".ick". Leave them let them come this side and see what happens.

TMKsouth:


There was once a Nigerian newspaper that entered the SA market back in the 2000s - I think This Day - and it failed spectacularly. I've heard many others have suffered the same fate.

What was this Day reporting news on, SA affairs? Ridiculous.

TMKsouth:

Earlier this year one of your banks - Access I think - bought a majority stake in some unknown SA bank. Check that story out.

There have been plenty of opportunities for u to enter the market and u bombed. Don't blame it on us.

How did the bomb, can you expantiate?

because from what I understand any bank that attempted entry into SA from Nigeria, were heavily frustrated by your regulatory bodies in an attempt to stifle competition in the banking sector. If one was to examine your banking sector right now in comparison to the ones in West Africa we can see that your banks are indeed "thieves" who have charges coming out the wazoo for every thing, from a simple day to day transaction fee to a simple foreign exchange transfer out of the country.

TMKsouth:


Your big business is not professional or competitive enough to enter or survive in the sophisticated SA economy.

Why not let them enter and fail so your assertion above is valid. Please don't sound foolish, its tantamount to parroting the national party accusing the ANC of not being professional or sophisticated enough to run the economy of South Africa, no?

TMKsouth:

Your existing (small & informal) businesses operate on the margins of society in underprivileged communities - that's why they're prone to xenophobic attacks.

There goes a display of your own S.tupidity again. All this further demonstrates is the underlining xenophobic tendency of the underpriviledged South African who can be easily manipulated to see another poor underpriviledged person who is able to make a better way as "the enemy".

Self hate is a predominant effect of a people oppressed for a long time. Sociology 101. You must have been asleep the day that lesson was taught, no?

TMKsouth:


Nigeria doesn't have big business in SA - only taverns, barbershops and ponmo stalls. What else should I have used as a comparison?

How can we have any big businesses when your xenophobic protectionist azzes block any businesses from competing in your territory.

TMKsouth:


MTN and DSTV in Nigeria should fill all posts with South Africans or Ghanaians, and "occassionally" employ Nigerians and see how you feel about that.

False comparison. You are reaching now. Which big multinational or even national company in South Africa employs African foreigners on a large scale? minus the health care industry which you have a huge shortage of Doctors please give me the list.

You must be talking about farm workers, domestics and waiter-servers of which your own people are shying away from leaving the gap for these underskilled migrants to fill. Maybe you believe in a capitalist system like yours the jobs are just suppose to be there sitting for you for when you having finished drinking at the Shebeen on sunday, expect to just wake up and head to "your" job on Monday.

TMKsouth:


I keep saying you don't know what the heck you're talking about...

Point 1 this is what is called Anectdotal evidence you m.oron.

Point 2. look very carefully at the statement he is making. In the formal sector, South African law requires that any available job posting must be geared towards South Africans first before anyone else is considered for the position( implicit discriminatory practice but I will concede that point). In other words If I walk into FNB and apply for a job only if there is not a qualified SA available to fill that position will I get the job or if the Job is listed as one which requires "critical skills" i.e. extraordinary skills to be taken into consideration. Your Mayor knows this very well. What he does is go to the informal sector where there are zero skilled labor to complain that SA are not given job preferences over "others". Can't you see how s.tu.pid that is.

How can an intelligent person who claims to be a visionary be fighting for "menial job employment" employment opportunites for his people in Pakistani tuck shops. Instead of pushing for training programs, assistance programs, overseas job training opportunities, venture capital funding, Micro financing to small up coming businesses, tax reliefs and business incentives for small start ups, he is busy rallying you xenophobic buffons against small scale informal foreign enterprises that don't even make up to a million rand a year in profits as the bain of your society.

Like I said before the man is a Mampara!

TMKsouth:
ps... Learn the meaning of "occassionally".

Okay sorry African Foriegners occasionally employ South African locals. Happy now.

The point however remains, South Africans are employed by foreigners.

TMKsouth:

While u were focussed on p*ssy I was studying sociology for a semester and checking my surroundings in Johannesburg. I know a whole lot more than you do

You got it twisted fam, The nyanshing was just extra. I was busy studying the country much more in-depth than you probably have ever but you think just because you live in a country you must as a default fully understand it better. Your sociology studies obviously didn't benefit you that much.

TMKsouth:


Yes he is. South Africans are also dissatisfied with them

i will believe that when I see it but most his speeches always lean towards hair dressers, uber drivers and spaza shop owners. We know who he is referring to eh Mfethu.

TMKsouth:

No South African will allow himself to be caged up inside a Somali container spaza the whole day. They hire Southern Africans from poor countries. I think you can't tell the difference between Southern Africans if you say you've seen it with your own eyes

This unfortunately is a big lie but hey we can't prove with way can we but I dare you to run a study on this and see what you come back with.

TMKsouth:

The only LEGITIMATE Nigerian businesses capable of creating employment are bars and internet cafes. Barbershops don't hire. I only see Zim girls selling in Nigerian pubs with Nigerians, Congolese, and occasionally Zulus as security

SMH.
I have seen many a mechanic shops with South African men working as apprentices all over the place, may a Nigerian restaurants and bars where South African women work. You should really visit parts of your country my man, you will be shocked.

PS aren't these Zulu's you refer to South African. Hmm?

TMKsouth:


I lived in Joburg CBD, Hillbrow and Braamfontein throughout a span of 2 decades since my varsity years son. I've seen it all - you can't tell me jack. I know what I'm talking about, whereas you still can't even differentiate between a South African and Malawian

A Malawian substitutes his "L" for his " R"and vice versa when he speaks plus their women are taller and have more central African features thus are,very easy to differentiate from you lot.

I have frequented Yeoville, Hillbrowand your Bramfontein where I smashed a whole bunch of your college honies and partied so please keep quiet with your 2 decade BS. The point continues to be do these foreigners hire South Africans and the answer is a resounding Yes! Yes Yes!

TMKsouth:


I told u all Somali, Pakistani, Ethiopian, Nigerian and most Chinese shops hire African migrants exclusively to avoid legal wages and paying taxes. That's their handout.

SMH.

Point 1. Please remove Pakistani and Chinese from the above list. I specifically said African immigrants. We all know Mashaba is not going for the above 2 other nationalities you mention above.

Point 2. That leaves the Somali, Ethiopian and Nigerian Shops. Somali's typically run spaza shops and do employ South Africans. I have seen this with my own two eyes so please don't say it is a lie. What they do however is keep their own people in higher positions or duties within these enterprises as a protective measure against infilitration of their illicit supply chain activities so they stay comparatively competitive.

Point 3.. The Nigerians employ the same tactics. The Nigerians overwhelmingly employ South Africans in their businesses but do not give them higher positions because of the same competitive edge reason as the Somali.

Point 4. The Ethiopians I cannot honestly comment on because I have not done any comprehensive observations on this particular community. What I do know is that they are extremely reclusive and pose no imminent economic danger to the South African masses at large in any way I have so far observed.

So you see my slow friend the fact of the matter is that these are instances of comparative economic 'competition" and not economic advantages, eliminate this threat s or "ACT" as if you are trying to eliminate this threat as your beloved would be Mayor continues to aspouse to you dimwits will gain you the support of people who don't realize the real economic game that is being played.

Good luck with your "ghana must go strategy".