₦airaland Forum

analice107:
Oh, he didn't write any? Yet he knows which is fake and which is original? I shd be asking you if you think

Jesus didn't write either they are messengers from God ..why do you doubt?

analice107:
Oh, he didn't write any? Yet he knows which is fake and which is original? I shd be asking you if you think

Jesus didn't write either

analice107:
Hahahahahahahaha. Really? Jesus who taught us to worship our Heavenly Father in spirit and in truth, worship that same God knocking his face to the ground? Did he also pray facing Mecca
Guy, worship your Idol, and wait for judgement.

When a Muslim prays or thanks God he does so in the same fashion and from that was taught to Abraham, Moses, Jesus, and all of the previous Prophets of God (may peace be upon them all). You will find that when a Muslim prays he places his forehead on the ground in total submission to God Almighty. Let us see how the Prophets (including Jesus) prayed according to the Qur'an and Bible:

"These are some of the Prophets whom GOD blessed. They were chosen from among the descendants of Adam, and the descendants of those whom we carried with Noah, and the descendants of Abraham and Israel, and from among those whom we guided and selected. When the revelations of the Most Gracious are recited to them, they fall prostrate, weeping. " – Qur’an English Translation [19:58]

"And he (Jesus) went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed, [/b]saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt." - New Testament (Matthew 26:39)

[b]"And when the disciples heard it, they fell on their face, and were sore afraid." - New Testament (Matthew 17:6)

"And Abram fell on his face: and God talked with him, saying," - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Genesis 17:3)

"Then Abraham fell upon his face, and laughed, and said in his heart, Shall a child be born unto him that is an hundred years old? and shall Sarah, that is ninety years old, bear?" - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Genesis 17:17)

"And Moses made haste, and bowed his head toward the earth, and worshipped." - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Exodus 34:

“And Moses and Aaron went from the presence of the assembly unto the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, and they fell upon their faces: and the glory of the LORD appeared unto them.” - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Numbers 20:6)

"And the LORD spake unto Moses and unto Aaron, saying, Separate yourselves from among this congregation, that I may consume them in a moment. And they fell upon their faces, and said, O God, the God of the spirits of all flesh, shall one man sin, and wilt thou be wroth with all the congregation?" - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Numbers 16:20-22)

And Ezra blessed the LORD, the great God. And all the people answered, Amen, Amen, with lifting up their hands: and they bowed their heads, and worshipped the LORD with [their] faces to the ground. - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Nehemiah 8:6)

"And he said, Nay; but as captain of the host of the LORD am I now come. And Joshua fell on his face to the earth, and did worship, and said unto him, What saith my Lord unto his servant?" - Old Testament (Tanakh) (Joshua 5:14)
@ the bolded, so now you're admitting Jesus didn't ask you to worship him but his God
Confusion

analice107:
Not even one copy survived ? how come the one used long before Muhammed was born is still here, but the one Muhammed wrote, did not survive? you dey think at all?

Did he write?
Do you always just talk without thinking?

truthmans2012:
Muslims say today's Bible is not the original.

Allah said Torah and Injeel were distorted. This means there was never a time original Torah and Injeel existed as the corruption took place right from inception.

Again, one wonders what was it that was actually distorted as the Laws of God then remain the same till today. I hereby challenge muslims to state what are actually missing or distorted in the Jews and Christians Scriptures.

It is a surprise that the same Scriptures allahh said were corrupted or distorted he still recommended to the Jews and Christians:

Quran 10:94
Allah told Muhammad to consult the Jews and the Christians if he was in doubt of the revelations he was receiving: And if thou art in doubt concerning that which We reveal unto thee, then question those who read the Scripture (that was) before thee. Verily the Truth from thy Lord hath come unto thee. So be not thou of the waverers.
Why would allahh refer Muhammad to the distorted or corrupt Scripture ? What is the similarity between allahh's quran and the earlier Scripture he referred him to ?

Qur'an 2:121
Those unto whom we have given the Scripture, who read it with the right reading, those believe in it. And whose disbelieveth in it, those are they who are the loser. Since the Scripture is said to be good for those who read with right reading, why did he condemn the same Scripture again?
We are made to understand that those who read it with right reading and believe in it are on course but those who don't believe it are losers. This shows the Scriptures were never distorted in the writing but the interpretation by some people. Those who read it with the right reading means those who interpret it rightly. It shows it was the interpretation and not that it was distorted in the writing.

Besides, the same Bible that existed in the time of Muhammad, which was divided into Torah (OT) and Injeel (NT) was approved by allahh as authentic:

Quran 29:46
We believe in the Revelation which has come down to us and that which to you; our Allah and your Allah is One and to Him we surrender.
Here we are told that Muhammad and his allahh believed in the earlier revelation, which they said is corrupt. How reasonable is this ? Allah's statement that Torah and Injeel is corrupted should not be taken seriously as he was serious about it himself.

Quran 2:89
And when there cometh unto them a Scripture from Allah, confirming that in their possession.
Here we are told the quran came to confirm and not to correct the Bible (or Torah and Injeel if you like). How can the quran confirm what is corrupted ? Again, how does the quran confirm the the Scripture that is totally different from it ?

Quran 5:43
How come they come unto the (i.e Muhammad) for judgment when they have the Torah, wherein Allah hath delivered judgment (for them)? Yet even after that they turn away. Such (folk) are not believers.
Even at Muhammad's time till today the Torah (OT) was valid for judgment, but only the people turned away from it according to Allah. Why should allah recommend a Scripture that has been corrupted ? Allah must be inconsistent and should not be taken seriously.

Quran 5:47
Let the People of the Gospel judge by that which Allah hath revealed therein. Whoso judgeth not by that which Allah hath revealed: such are evil-doers.
The Gospel was also valid for judgment at Muhammad's time and till date. Why should Allah have condemned it earlier ? Allah or quran should not be taken seriously.

Muslims should think about the Qur'an and islam objectively.

Let's start here
https://www.nairaland.com/3217883/handwritten-draft-king-james-bible

truthmans2012:
Terrorist !!!

Why did your Quran separate the Jews and Christians if Jew is an identity? Are there no Jews by tribe among the Christians?

I wonder where muslims keep their brain.

Why do you think it's okay to label me a terrorist on a forum like this?

analice107:
Wow. Just listen to yourself. Yesterday we were pagans, today we surrender to God. Fine, since the Jews and Christians surrender to God why aren't we muslims. Why aren't we knocking our faces on the ground?

But Jesus did knock his face on the ground
And I didn't say you are because you worship three gods.. Jesus worshipped one thats y he is, as commanded

analice107:
You are the dumbass here. The Jews are a Nation not just an identity. From it you get their religion Judaism, their location is called Judea, their individuals are called Jews. It's the same thing you guys are trying to steal from them, claiming Islam is a Nation rather than a stupid ideology.

you think you're saying anything different abi? Hahaha...so it's not an identity, yet you said their individuals are so there can't be a Muslim jew right?
Mumu...don't quote me again

truthman2012:
If because Moses submitted to God you call him a muslim, were his followers, the Jews also muslims or was it Moses alone that was a muslim?

It is only reasonable that if Moses was a muslim, his followers must be muslims as well. So by implication, the Jews are also muslims. Then, why did Allah/Muhammad order that they should be fought and forced to pay taxes (Quran 9;29) when other muslims didn't pay?


Again, why is islam about Abraham, Ishmael and Hagai alone? What about other members of Abraham's family?

Jew is an identity, a tribe not religion dumbass

peteregwu:
So Mohammed came before Jesus, right? And where is it written that Jesus is a Muslim in the Bible, Moses is a Muslim? Or where is Mohammed in the Bible? Pls I need you to do so that I can be converted.

It was neither written Jesus was a christian, I said clearly, Islam means submission (to one God) a muslim is one who submits to the will of God...Many religions have a concept of surrender to God. In Jewish history, when the ancient Hebrews obeyed God’s commands, they had a long period of prosperity and stability.

In Christianity, surrendering to God is a way of putting your life into more capable hands – in fact, Jesus asked many of his disciples to surrender their livelihoods and follow him.
So all the prophets of God were Muslims -they did surrender to God's will

peteregwu:
Bros does it mean you can't find your Quran baseless. Why do you people lye? Why do you claim Mohammed is in the Bible, Jesus is a Muslim Moses is a Muslim? Bros abeg is it true? It was one of so called immam that was saying sometime ago in my neighborhood, even ffrom his mosque, is it true?

It is true my brother
Islam means "submission" (to God alone)
A Muslim" is an Arabic word meaning "one who submits (to God)". A female Muslim is sometimes called a Muslimah. A muslim is a person who has dedicated his worship exclusively to God...Islam means making one's religion and faith God's alone

Scholar8200:
Let's slow down here!

ANY reference to the House of God/courts of God etc by the psalmist refers to the Temple where the Ark was placed!

That Temple was located in Jerusalem/Zion Pslam 84Vs 7, not Mecca or Baca!

Besides, that verse 6 mentions Baca not as a destination but one of the many places they pass through on their way to Zion/Jerusalem

No slowing down
It could also mean a religious community or its site, regarded as chosen by God and under his special protection
Zi·on (zī′ən) also Si·on (sī′ən)
n.
1.
a. The historic land of Israel as a symbol of the Jewish people.
b. The Jewish people; Israel.
2. A place or religious community regarded as sacredly devoted to God.
3. An idealized, harmonious community; utopia.


b. a religious community or its site, regarded as chosen by God and under his special protection
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Zion

truthman2012:
Muslims and their deceptions. Why did you quote the Bible half way to give it your own meaning?

Psalm 84:5-7New International Version (NIV)

5 Blessed are those whose strength is in you,
whose hearts are set on pilgrimage.
6 As they pass through the Valley of Baka,
they make it a place of springs;
the autumn rains also cover it with pools.[a]
7 They go from strength to strength,
till each appears before God in Zion.

The Israelites make pilgrimage to Zion as you can see in verse 7 not Mecca. By the way, do people pass through Mecca to go to Zion? That should show you that Baca is not Mecca. The pilgrims only passed through the Valley of Baka, it was not their destination.

Besides, islamic record has it that it was Abraham who dug zamzam in Mecca but according to that Bible passage, it was the travellers to Zion who dug the well (spring). Then, how did you call it zamzam? You better discard with the lies they taught you in your islamic school.

Don't be a dumbass..read!
It could also mean a religious community or its site, regarded as chosen by God and under his special protection
Zi·on (zī′ən) also Si·on (sī′ən)
n.
1.
a. The historic land of Israel as a symbol of the Jewish people.
b. The Jewish people; Israel.
2. A place or religious community regarded as sacredly devoted to God.
3. An idealized, harmonious community; utopia.


b. a religious community or its site, regarded as chosen by God and under his special protection
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Zion

truthman2012:
Muslims, be honest to yourselves, why would Abraham exclude his main wife and other children from islamic worship in Mecca if he was truly the founder of islam there?

I challenge muslims to show where other members of Abraham's family: Sarah, Isaac, Jacob and other Bible prophets participated in islamic worship in Mecca.

I also challenge muslims to prove that Adam was living in Mecca to have solely built Kaaba.

If you cannot answer the questions, it shows islam is a deception and it is an insult on your
God-given intelligence to be cheaply deceived by the Devil.

There is no valley on earth called Baca (or Bakkah) that contains a house of worship and a spring of water (Zamzam), in which one prayer is better than a thousand prayers offered anywhere else, other than Makkah al-Mukarramah.

Baca (Bakkah) is one of the names of Makkah. This name is mentioned in the Holy Qur’an, where Allah, may He be exalted, says (interpretation of the meaning)”

“Verily, the first House (of worship) appointed for mankind was that at Bakkah (Makkah), full of blessing, and a guidance for Al-Alameen (the mankind and jinns)”

[Aal ‘Imraan 3:96].

But the translators and commentators of the Old Testament distorted the word Baca to buka’ [weeping or crying; the Hebrew cognate denotes the same meaning], even though the meanings of place names should not be translated; rather the name should be transliterated, and even though the meaning of the (original) name has nothing to do with crying or weeping, as a result of their desire to eliminate all references to anything that is proven in the Holy Qur’an, such distortions occurred.

The following verses are from The Bible's book of Psalms, Chapter 84.

Pslams is believed to be revealed to Prophet David (Dawood) (peace be on him). The Holy Quran refers to the book as Zabur, which is not extant in its original form.
The text below is taken from the NIV version of The Bible (http://bible.gospelcom.net )
Psalm 84 :: New International Version (NIV)


1 How lovely is your dwelling place,
O LORD Almighty!
2 My soul yearns, even faints,
for the courts of the LORD ;
my heart and my flesh cry out
for the living God.

3 Even the sparrow has found a home,
and the swallow a nest for herself,
where she may have her young-
a place near your altar,
O LORD Almighty, my King and my God.
4 Blessed are those who dwell in your house;
they are ever praising you.
Selah

5 Blessed are those whose strength is in you,
who have set their hearts on pilgrimage.
6 As they pass through the Valley of Baca,
they make it a place of springs;
the autumn rains also cover it with pools.
7 They go from strength to strength,
till each appears before God in Zion.

8 Hear my prayer, O LORD God Almighty;
listen to me, O God of Jacob.
Selah
9 Look upon our shield, O God;
look with favor on your anointed one.

10 Better is one day in your courts
than a thousand elsewhere;
I would rather be a doorkeeper in the house of my God
than dwell in the tents of the wicked.
11 For the LORD God is a sun and shield;
the LORD bestows favor and honor;
no good thing does he withhold
from those whose walk is blameless.

12 O LORD Almighty,
blessed is the man who trusts in you.

BACA IS MECCA: the holy Ka'ba built by the prophet Abraham (PBUH) and his son Ishmael (PBUH) is in Mecca.

The name Mecca (Makkah) is mentioned in the Holy Qur'an in 48:24. Another name for Mecca is Bakka, depending on the dialect of the tribe: this is also mentioned once, in Sura 3:96

"Verily, the first house (of worship) appointed for mankind was that in Bakka (Mecca), full of blessing, and guidance for all people." Amazingly enough, this word Bakka is mentioned by the prophet David (PBUH) in the Bible:

"Who passing through the valley of Baca make it a well, the rain also filleth the pools." (Psalm 84:6)

The well here is the well known well of Zam-Zam, still present now, close to the Ka'bah; after thousands of years.

truthman2012:
I have debunked this long ago.

It is obvious
Try again

truthman2012:
So you mean islamic calendar does not follow the sequence of days? If the moon comes out on the 27th of March the following day is the 1st of April?

Even with that, following the moon to determine your calendar still shows your allegiance to the moon as there are other means of counting days.

Occultists and people who make charms also have such allegiance to the moon. They would tell you the waxing or weaning moon in doing certain spells. The true God has all days for Himself, moon or no moon. Observance of moon in determining anything is pure occultism and idolatry.

Sunday: Old English Sunnandæg (pronounced [ˈsunnɑndæj]), meaning "sun's day." This is a translation of the Latin phrase dies Solis. English, like most of the Germanic languages, preserves the original pagan/sun associations of the day. Many other European languages, including all of the Romance languages, have changed its name to the equivalent of "the Lord's day" (based on Ecclesiastical Latin dies Dominica). In both West Germanic and North Germanic mythology the Sun is personified as a goddess

ifenes:
Moon worship has been practiced in Arabia since 2000 BC. The crescent moon is the most common symbol of this pagan moon worship as far back as 2000 BC.

In Mecca, there was a god named Hubal who was Lord of the Kabah.

This Hubal was a moon god. This moon god was also referred to as "al-ilah". This is not a proper name of a single specific god, but a generic reference meaning "the god". Each local pagan Arab tribe would refer to their own local tribal pagan god as "al-ilah".

"al-ilah" was later shortened to Allah before Muhammad began promoting his new religion in 610 AD.

There is evidence that Hubal was referred to as "Allah".

When Muhammad came along, he dropped all references to the name "Hubal" but retained the generic "Allah".

Muhammad retained almost all the pagan rituals of the Arabs at the Kaba and redefined them in monotheistic terms.

Regardless of the specifics of the facts, it is clear that Islam is derived from paganism that once worshiped a moon-god.

Although Islam is today a monotheist religion, its roots are in paganism which is all about Astrology.

Before you copy and paste, make sure that you are sure it's so. Now "al ilah" means the god, ilah means god
You even believe that there was a "god". Just because the Arabic word for god is Allah that makes it paganic? Na waa o

OLAADEGBU:
What do you know?

What you don't know...obviously

tonytony208:
....but your Qur'an asks you to believe the Bible, not so?

Not the bible...injeel, the one sent to jesus pbuh. Now what

tonytony208:
And your "final testament" said you should believe in the Gospel of Jesus Christ, remember?

Yes sir...the one you have, Jesus don't know about it nor did he read it, remember?

tonytony208:
Aside what you guys were told by Mohammed, what other evidence is there to show that this is true? Virtually all the prophets in the bible had another prophet or prophets to testify to the truthfulness of what the other prophet had said or revealed. But the case is different with Mohammed. No one spoke of his coming and no one had receive message from heaven to back up his claims.

The entire bible you have was not read by Jesus, he didn't even know about it...how is that? What heaven? Says who?

OLAADEGBU:
Psalm 2:7 is referring to our Lord Jesus Christ and He remains the only begotten Son of the Father.

"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life" (John 3:16).

Now I know you're lying
He is not the only begotten son...it is referring to David Psalms ain't about Jesus

truthmans2012:
Typical muslims' reasoning.

Does where I got my information matter ?

What is important is the truth of the information. We got to know so much about islam on the internet and discovered the religion is false.

OLAADEGBU:
There may be many sons of God in the Bible but there is only one begotten Son of the Father.

Well then, was Jesus the only begotten son of God? Read Psalms 2:7
"I will declare the decree: the LORD hath said unto me (King David), Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee.".
How many sons does the Bible tell us that God Almighty has?
1.Jacob is God's son and firstborn: "Israel is my son, even my firstborn" Exodus 4:22.
2.Solomon is God's son "He shall build an house for my name, and I will establish the throne of his kingdom for ever. I will be his father, and he shall be my son": 2 Samuel 7:13-14.
3.Ephraim is God's firstborn: "for I am a father to Israel, and Ephraim is my firstborn." Jeremiah 31:9 (who is God's firstborn? Israel or Ephraim?).
4.Adam is the son of God "Adam, which was the son of God." Luke 3:38.
5.Common people (you and me) are the sons of God: "Ye are the children of the LORD your God" Deuteronomy 14:1
So Jesus is not the only son of God nor the only begotten son
Such terminology can be found quite extensively throughout the Bible.

OLAADEGBU:
I have no doubt that Muhammad is the messenger of Allah and that Allah has no son. It's just that Yahweh has a Son and His name is Jesus.

There are many sons of god in the Bible

^^^

truthmans2012:
You guys have quoted Ibn Kathir's Tafsir extensively on this thread to support your argument but refused to believe the same man because the truth he told about muslims going to hell didn't go down well with you. Why must you be deceiving yourselves?

You don't even believe Quran 3:85 that says all muslims will go to hell at death and some to be removed on the Day of Resurrection. So you only believe what your brain tells you and not what your god told you. Smh !!!

You copy and paste from anti Islamic websites that's why. Believe wat u want

true2god:
I don't insult you. I insulted Mohammed (heat be upon him) because he was the first to insult me (qurann 98:6).

If he was sent only to the children of Israel why did your prophet, an Arab, call him the Messiah (qurann 9:30)?

I didn't say you insulted me..I said no insults
These verses are out of context. I jus dey watch u

OLAADEGBU:
I realised that you sidestepped answering my penultimate post and pretend as if you did not see it, did you not. It is only cults that argue since Jesus prayed to the Father, He could not truly be God.

Again biblically speaking, it was in His humanity that Yeshua prayed to the Father. Since Yeshua came as a man -- and since one of the proper duties of man is to worship, pray to and adore God -- it was perfectly proper for Jesus to address the Father in prayer. Positionally speaking as a man, as a Jew and as our High Priest -- "in all things He had to be made like His brethren" (Hebrews 2:7) -- Jesus could pray to the Father. But this in no way detracts from His intrinsic deity.

What you wrote up here doesn't change the fact he is not god. Explain plainly... i don't get it

true2god:
He was sent to the children of Israel but your prophet, who was never a Jew, acknowledged his messiahship (qurann 9:30). What does that tell you? Read Matthew chapter 28, you will understand the universality of the gospel of Christ.

We are all sons of God by adoption and not by the works of the flesh, that is sex (read john chapter 1). Our relationship with God is not a master-slave relationship, as we have in Islam, but a father-children relationship.

You can choose to remain the slave of allahh and his criminal apostle.

It tells me that he was sent to children of israel..not the world.
No be only adoption na orphanage.
If u can't reply without insults then don't bother