An eerie observation of stupidity
I have no other way to describe what i am about to say besides the above caption. First is there a price tag on salvation?, i dont recall any point in time when jesus charge or placed monetary or legal values on his doctrines. If i recall he did say that the word of God is for everyone who wants to hear it, not unless of course he meant anyone who could afford it. Let's reiterate to the bibles recollection of jesus lashing out near physically at people selling stuff in his temple/ church as u prefer. Considering that was thousands of years ago and also the dynamic nature of today's concept of a market, what excatly would u call selling of this book rhapsody of reality, hummm? and what would u call the existence of trade marks on the house of God hmmm? I know u twisted minded BLW zealots, have more than enough responses borne from ur twisted understanding of the bible, indoctrinated into ur nibble minds by a man trying to play God, but whats worse is how stupidly u contradict ur own beliefs to serve one man. What are the benefits and adversities of making posts of this book which i assume is enhancing your fantasy (not faith)
Benefits i assume are, broader communication, greater reach, convinces, indirect communication (i.e. some of contrasting faith reading and drawing upon its stupidity) and generally enhancing a bandwagon of mediocre. Not bad, for the so described
Adversities would then be restriction to only those who want to hear but cannot afford, delay in comprehension of the word, because equating the lags means those who don't have and cant afford it need to borrow and hence wait until owners have finished, hence creating a disposition procrastination (also related to availability per household), humane and regional factors some people are not within proximity but other forms of media communication exist such the post made of its content and the list goes on
Then there is the other personal adversity such copy right and legal implication which only one seeking to make profit. (Faith for sale eh? great business concept thinking ill try this)
Of all there conditions which is most beneficial to the actual spread of Christianity or to the so called spiritual welfare (Absolutely daft) of a christian
Second since when did Christianity become a tool for profit making , i thought it was for charity, well maybe pastor chris gives all the profit from this book to charity (Yeah right)
And third to the one who said pastor chris and pastors are givers (Are u for real?), Seriously did such less than intelligent conception come out of human being.Or is just that for argument safe u were pushed to the wall and needed a recovery response so u said something as unguided as that. Since when are millionaires the greatest givers, dont u know that give more to collect thrice as much or have u forgotten your churches are now INC and PLC, Profit making organization not non-profit making if he gave so much how come there are more broke people in your congregation than well to do. If he converted his assets to lets say micro finance loans for poor people in BLW, do u know how many of the low income earners in your church that would help, infact how many lives it would change in a single instant, Giver indeed. Hey dont get me wrong oh, if it were me i wouldn't give a cent to anyone, if i give at all it just for CSR; i mean since when does the farmer decide he needs to give corn or crop money, that's just stupid business.
Ill be stupid to say don't fool urselves because u already have, and beyond any hope for that matter. If u can sit and worship God in a highly organized market, then whats the point, if the one rule of ur doctrine u simply cast to the wind because one man made u forget who u are and what u stand for, whats the point, the bible indeed says there will be false prophets but i think u all never considered the false prophet resides in your business enterprise not church.

The question of whether good or occultic is unrelated. Making use of your subconcious is a principle used by ad agencies, chruches and medically. Your subconsious mind is that part of your mind that sort of imprints on perosnallity. It is penetrable or open in a state of relaxation or deep relaxation. An example, u come home at 7pm tired from work, u seat on the sofa and watch TV, feeling genrally relaxed, ad agencies target this time because that when u acutally absorb information that is comminucated visually. In short whatever u see in this state kind of sticks in ur memory.

LagosShia:

another bible thumper and his loser attitude.

again changing the subject of this thread from one about the fallible bible to one on the Quran is a loser's attitude the bible thumper exhibit to no avail.your doubts only reveal your ignorance.there were no so called "satanic verses" and Muhammad (sa) did see the angel face to face as the Quran clearly states.you can read more about the fictitious story of "satanic verses" that you devils like propagating like parrots (losers!):

I agree, that to large extent that the bible and some of its accounts are relatively in accurate, one such notion are the accounts of the Jews being enslaved in Egypt and migration of the Jews  across the desert. Not only is there no fact supporting this but based well documented Egyptian account before, within and post migration of the Jews from Egypt, there is absolutely no account of Jews being enslaved in Egypt.  By my understanding the quran equally speaks of Jewish enslavement in Egypt, thus making it a provider of equally without fact and untrue accounts of history, this also includes accounts in the Jewish Tora, which once again Mohammad drew from in his scripting or assumed scripting of the quaran. To be honest the Koran is actually the bible, the Tora and other  pagan perspectives (extracts of religions at least a 100 years before Muhammad this facts are known).
A more laughable account is the one you call upon that Mohammad saw an angel face to face, what did u honestly expect him to say in order to give greater credibility to his political fairy tale. Would you  believe the quran if he didn't say that, and to further ensure no one else used the same scam he comfortably said he was the last one. Its funny that u claim the bible is fallible without considering the implications, not that i don't agree, infact i concur, but i think you are not considering the other perspective of this. Define a fake that is coined from a fake, and what do you have, If there is one book on this planet, that is a gross bamboosom and fraud, it is the quran, abrogation exists in a total of 71 chapters out of the 114 quran chapters, so the abrogation is existing in about 62.28% of the quran (62.28% is the percentage of Soura's which has been claimed to contain abrogated verses) and yet it was Allah, that wrote it right?  Ok if u say so

@Bashy Demy
My honest opinion is that no religious book in the world permits violence, Yes it is true that every society is equipped with a radical group that gives into violence as a means to resolve misunderstanding, but like i said in other posts, whilst each society has one radical group it also has one radical Islamic sect, willing and ready for violence the math of this is like 1: 1000. All that it took was for a German pastor to say he wants to burn a Koran and already Muslims are ready to react violently. Yeah its stupid to burn the Koran not to mention MAD, but why must it translate to violence. It almost like Muslims are hoping for someone to screw up so they can go on rampage. I don't believe this is what Islam represents but your brothers are doing a good job convincing the world otherwise

@Vedaxcool
Geeze man relax with the insults, then again i guess you are Muslim so such aggression at the smallest opinion against Islam is expected. But to respond to your post. Yes Hitler killed six million jews and probably even more communists, after which he was gunning for negors. in every settlement there is a boold thirty citizen but also a blood thirsty Muslim so do the math for every hitler there are at least 1000 eager Islamic Fundametalist (Vedaxcool) till this date.

Of course 911 was condemed just like many other terrorist acts perpetrated by Muslim. However, does it seem like you guys are listening, Your killing spree seem to be on the rise. I even narrowed my arguments to the last ten years,  and still Muslims carry the majority in in terrorist acts.

vedaxcool:

As for the Nine Christians chrged with anti govt plot, have you asked yourselve what if they succeed? the difference between Sokoto, Jos(as if christians didn't Murder innocent people) and the America situation is the Govt in America is strong enough to thwart this plot, unlike the Nigerian govt that is weak and incompetent.

Dude why on earth am i asking myself what if,   MUSLIMS ARE ALREADY PULLING OF SUCCESSFUL BOMBING AND KILLING LOTS AND LOTS OF INNOCENT PEOPLE AND YOU ARE STILL WANDERING WHAT IF? THE REASON WHY I CANT GIVE A poo ABOUT A PROBABILITY OF DANGER IS BECAUSE THAT SAME DANGER IS RIGHT IN FRONT OF ME AND HAS BEGUN TO KILL ME AND THE ONES I LOVE.

The Nigerian Government is weak? How is that related to the fact that Jos and Sokoto incidents were perpetrated my Islamic fundamentalist? Okay maybe you mean the Government is too weak to thwart Islamic Uprising, well i agree, i means this guys as so cold blooded even soldiers are afraid of them.

In Sokoto and Jos   was it Non muslims that begun the violence, ? Be real here, Who begun killing in these incidents. Which sect danced around a market place with the head of their victim screaming Allah, hmmmm. Ofcourse Christian killed innocent muslims, but wasnt that as a ressult of a clash that begun with killing of Christians. Face it dude, you can call me ignorant all you want, But it dosent change the fact that inscribed on your genetic codes,  is Carnage and Violence.

Dude terrorisim was very popular in the early centuries, but then it was looked upon as war strategies, Accroding to Sun Tzu, An Efficient General Must First Strike Terror in hearts of his opponent, Rather than take prisoners they killed all women and children and burnt villages to the ground to set examples to anyone who opposed them. Others simply slaughtered all the males in society the entire settlement was wiped clean of existience. It is on recorded some civilizations became extint via such methods. Alexandra The Great, Ghangis Khan, Atilla the Hun, The Knight Templer, Even Mohammed you name it all of whom in one way or the other subscribed to terrorist methods. But a lot has changed since then, a lot except for  Islam, till this date these are values upheld by Muslim,,  Kill women and children in name of Allah, Kill the women and children of our oppressors right? Political reason you say,  i agree, Political reason with heavy religious undertones sounds more like it

Killing of women and children Afgahnistan is terrorism indeed, I wonder what started all  of that, O yes i remember, Guys Like You Blew Up the Twin Towers resulting in the deaths of over 2000 people including women and children as a ressult america and other European nations declared a war on terrorism and terrorist nations. Like i said it always begins with Islamic Violence

Did you say Parkistan, if i recall guys like you burst into an open street and opened fire on once again innocent women and children right, if i recall thats the Mumbai incident

Oh and in Isreal, did the Isrealies just decided that palestinians were fit for extermination and shoot them or did Islamic fundametalists like Huzbella go around firing motars into market places resulting in the deaths of once again men women and children. Are you aware that Huzubulla is known for staging their attacks in schools settlements and residencies so that when a  the Isrealies returned fire, innocent Palestinian women and children would be killed, tell me that not crazy but its the true picture of Islam self sacrifice.
Oh yes let me remember this one, Isreali Olympians killed by Palestinians, a day the world would know as black September an event so horrible it would go down in history. Yes Israel does have its share of terrorist acts against palestine, and i am in firm support that the land does not belong to Isreal. But i do not support Killing innocent people to prove that point. Especially Killing innocent non muslims who always seem to be the target.

Someone draws a cartoon of Mohammed and all of Islam goes around burning churches and attacking non Islamic sects, the videos of this are still on CNN website

You say the list i posted is incorrect, well thats what every killer says when he is presented with evidence, ITS FALSIFIED, IT WAS MADE BY PEOPLE WHO ARE AGAINST ME, sure we heard that before.

Give it a rest Vedaxcool and be like your friend Bashy Demy who seems like the Peace Islam is meant to be, at least he wants to correct an assumed misconception while you prove to be as aggressive as the world paints all Muslims to be, already your loosing control and resulting to insults i wonder what u do if i was standing next to you.

bashy_demy:

then most you join them in saying what you are not sure of?

Dude you re still missing my point. Lets assume your right and the Koran does make any such promises to suicided bombers and terrorists. Lets even assume the Koran condemns it completely. Then why is it still perpetrated by Muslims, Why are Muslims so eager for violence and bloodshed screaming Allah as the commit murder, this is precisely the angle i am coming from. Just look the number of known existing terrorist groups, and compare the number Islamic to non Islamic, dude the ratio is off the scale.
I honestly applaud the fact that you guys are stepping to correct this according to you supposedly wrong presumption of the Koran, but its honestly not enough. If you feel the Koran has been misquoted, then tell your bothers to stop living up to the misquotes because they provide people like me( who are not sure) with reason to believe that indeed such repose is provided for in the koran. In other words SAY IT LOUD ENOUGH FOR ALL ISLAMIC YOUTHS TO HEAR AND LET THEM KNOW YOU SAID IT MORE SO CONDEM THEIR VIOLENT ACTIONS

@vedaxcool

vedaxcool:

q: Is Alqaeda that trained this radical Christian with all the prosperity? their country has.
Nine members of a radical US Christian militia planning to kill a police officer in Michigan and then attack his funeral to rally sympathisers for a widespread anti-government uprising have been charged in an indictment unsealed on Monday.
http://www.france24.com/en/20100330-nine-christian-militants-charged-anti-govt-plot

Dude the link you sent me reads Nine Christian Malitia Charged With anti govt plot,  seriously dont you think this undermines your argument, i dont see 1000 or two thousand deaths in religious uprising. Vedaxcool this is a plot not with no recorded deaths, its not the same as Jos, Sokoto 911 and black September. Do more research especially on ATF (American Task Force) agents and Christian Malita groups you find a better base for your argument.

vedaxcool:

There is none that is no Qur'anic verse that condones Suicide talkless of Suicide Bombings, if there is then show us or forever remain Silent in Ignorance, and based on the Obvious? eh? wouldn't call Chriatians the Most Violent poeople with Two world wars, Two documented Genocide,30 years long sectarian conflict in europe,Church Sanction Torture(the Iquisition), topping the top 10 countries with the Most Murder see for your self:

vedaxcool, the list you posted is statistic on crime in the respective countries, this topic is narrowed down to terrorism and not crime in general. I am sure if you do more research on which religious groups has perpetrated more acts of terrorism your fact and figures would change.


Question
what would you say is the ratio of non Islamic terrorism  to Islamic terrorism, I dare you to answer this question honestly

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_designated_terrorist_organizations
a list of known terrorist groups please do me the honor and count how many are Islamic

Vedaxcool, I am not ingorant and i most defiantly state the Obvious

@ ayinba 1

Dude the ancient scripts will always be an amazing read to me and nothing more, there is are reason why they are two thousand years old, but it like you still dont get it. It has nothing to do with the Quran, or what it says, it just Muslims being Muslims and whats worse is that you claim the quaran does not permit such act. Then why do Muslims perpetrate the act, hmmmmm, why is it always a Muslim thats killing others in the name of God, if it is as you say the quran does not permit it, dont you think something is wrong here. If u have read my post you probably would see that my perspective on this issue does not really concern itself with the doctrines of the bible or the quran, but rather events happening in your country and my country. Based on events that have taken place over the last decade can you honestly say that your safe having a muslim as your neighbor knowing at at the first call for carnage in the name of Allah, he will be coming to your house with a dagger to kill you and your family. You might want to relate this fact to tribes and ethnic groups but it still doesn't change the fact that the non  muslim/ Islamic parts of these tribes and ethinic groups do not go around killing others in the name of Allah, ONLY MUSLIMS do this. From Kano to Sokoto to Abuja even Lagos and Ibadan Muslims always have a score to settle, and settlement that must always involve violence and blood shed. I am sorry ayinba, i   use to think the quaran does not support such act, but based on what we see every year,  i  am forced to think otherwise. It has nothing to do with the crowed and if you are true to yourself you would know that what i have just posted is true. Face it the world is a better place without Islam because if we go by the standard set by MUSLIMS then indeed Islam means death and not peace.

bashy_demy:

well were you alive during the Biafra war? if not go and ask your father to tell you how Ojukwu training young boys how to handle gun and fight during the war.

@ Bashy
This was a war, not an act of terrorsim, the motive for the war was nor religiously driven

bashy_demy:


about the virgin i have asked with couple of times and said can you give me an evidence from the Holy Quran where it says 72 virgin cos that is the only Book i believe in

Honestly if this is untrue then, we must give in to the possibilities of demonic possession, because, what else would cause normal humane beings to want to kill others the way Islamic fundamentalist do. Are you honestly saying there is no the Koran doesnt promise them anything for suicide bombing cause the frequency of its occurrence speaks other wise.

Dont get me wrong i choose not to subject  belief and judgment to ancient scripts, but rather, i make my analogies based on the obvious

@bashy
My brother there are no questions to be directed, i would rather you proffered solutions instead.

I live in a country that has no excuses for religious violence because we have socio-economic issues yet to be addressed and believe me they are more than enough to deal with. This Islamic cry of western oppression seems a bit over beaten dont you think. I dont see any western oppression here in my country yet there is religious violence always propagated by Islamic sect.

Nigeria is neither an Islamic nation nor Christian Nation but, always Muslims find a reason to create discord, Chopping peoples heads off because it was assumed that they allegedly used a portion of the Koran as toilet tissue,, every time someone expresses his opinion about Islam there is civil unrest with large number of deaths; which always begins with the burning of churches, Miss World beauty pageant and the next you know Muslims are on the riot.

Are you aware that in Nigerian Universities, only Islamic Student have been recorded to beat and strip ladies of their closing simply because they find their dressing offensive. I mean there are other bads stuff done by people we can comfortably be brand as societal bads, but ISLAM, honestly i dont know what to say, it seems the doctrines of ISLAM preach more savagery than peace, This is not an Insult or slight, but rather it right in front of your eyes, in this century you still think its okay to stone people to death I mean the they may have done so in the past, but, NOW, to consider such as solution to adultery is just , inhumane, Or take lives screaming the name of God while doing it. Cutting people heads off on the internet and having the audacity to call Gods name while committing murder Here's the one that personally ticked me off, did you know muslims rejoiced and threatened to take to the streets after 911. After all of this can you honestly say ISLAM is a religion of peace or the world is actually safe with Muslims around
Like i said there are no questions to be directed. Oppression can be dealt with in other ways besides murder,

I honestly think the real question should be, is the world a better place without Islam, dont get me wrong, i dont hate Muslims or Christians, infact it is my honest opinion that Muslims have more integrity than Christians. But as to weather or not the world would be a better place without Islam, my answers is a big yes. Two decades ago i might have said otherwise. You can quote as many bible verses aswell as quaran verses, but it still does not change the fact, that my heart jumps every time a board a plane and some named abudul enters or someone wearing a turban or even Arabic attainer. I actually thought as bad as Nigeria was the last thing we would ever do was participate in global terrorism, i thought we were to selfish for that kind of thing. But Islam has proven me wrong on that. MUTHALLAB.

AN ARABIC TERRORIST IS UNDERSTANDABLE HE CLAIMS HE HAS A CAUSE. A NIGERIAN TERRORIST IS AN ABOMINATION, BECAUSE HE HAS NO CAUSE BUT IN THE NAME OF ISLAM  THIS ABOMINATION WAS GIVEN LIFE.

I have gone through this thread twice and i must say that the arguments of my Muslim brothers are singular, almost myopic and void of point. Once again i do not say this out of anger or hatred. I just feel you have not been paying attention to what going on around or you have and you support it, either way your views identify your participation in the problems. It does not matter what the bible says or the quran. Most if not all religions were meant to transcend from fanaticism to tolerance and finally respect for life. Classical case is Buddhism, Hinduism and even Voodoo or what is commonly referred to as paganism. Based events that have happened within the last decade, it is obvious that whilst all religions have truly evolved only Islam holds its cruel prehistoric nature. I do not see what purpose or cause killing over two thousand people serves, i dont not see the need for the blood shed carried out in the name of the Holy Prophet. If in truth these quotes exists in the bible and quran then denounce these doctrines and respect the existence of your fellow man. Just because someone expresses his opinion about Islam and Mohammed, does not give you the right to take his or her life, that is just SAVAGE, are you going kill everyone who thinks Mohammed is evil, because thats exactly where Islam is headed. You breed death, destruction and terror in little children, indoctrinate them to take lives in the name of some jihad, Why? I am sorry but no matter what anyone says or tries to defend this accusation, it is the truth and anyone who is not a fool or lair can see what happening. And if indeed Islam is doctrine of peace, then how come there is consistency in Islamic terrorist activities. Every year over 100 lives are claimed in the name of Islam. I am sorry But Islam does breed terrorism not because the quarn may prove to say so but because more than often than not terrorist are of the Islamic sect and supported by the Islamic Sect.

You may post as many insults as you want after reading this post, trust me i dont give a flying F, k and if i feel like it i might insult you back, trust me it would be fun, but it wont change that which is truth and not matter how many verses you quote, a murderer is a murderer weather he was sent by God or not. Sure, in the old times you could use God as your excuse, but not today. Any religion that preaches war and death as a solution to any problem, is hand written by the Devil, thus and i quote, IF  INDEED THE QURAN SAYS SUICIDE BOMBERS AND TERRORIST WHILE GO TO HEAVEN WITH VIRGINS THEN, NO DOUBT MOHAMMED IS A THIEF AND MURDERER, IN THE SAME VEIN IF THE BIBLE SAYS SIMILAR, THEN THERE ARE SIXTY DOCTRINES OF LAIRS AND MURDERERS. In my opinion there is no devil, only man, who uses the devil as his excuse to commit evil.
Yes Islam Begets Terrorism, and the only way to say otherwise is for Muslims who do not believe this to stand up and prove otherwise