₦airaland Forum

yomi007k:
Can you guarantee safety and security in those areas?

If you were Dangote, can you put your money in such a place? I hope you have done businesses before. Supervison and management alone is a serious task.

It is enough risk building a refinery. It is much bigger risk siting them in such locations.

And if you are talking about impact on environment, I am sure they wont want to be negligent as alot of educated persons are around and will be ready to take it up.

If you know the number of oil n gas company in Niger delta, u won't open ur mouth to talk this trash.

Nairalandmonika:
If you know the number of oil n gas company in Niger delta, u won't open ur mouth to talk this trash.

Is it the ones that you attack frequently or the one you kidnap the workers. Slowpoke.

Pele ooh pipeline from Nigeria to Europe

BlueSparks:
Go and dig up your research or ask people in the industry. Cause I believe you just woke up to international issues and all a decade ago.

Obasanjo brokered this deal in his second term as president.


So because you don't know a thing or were not informed makes it beer parlour gist abi.


Tell me. What was the stability of Libya like in 2003 and Co.


Would Italy just sit back as the presence modern era of Libya while Germany pulls of a mega deal with them. Use your brain


Is the Nordics not exposed to the exact or rather even more extreme weather conditions than Germany who was sourcing for what it termed stable alternative to gas



Please. Go do your studies about the successes of Gazprom and Russia as a while around the 2000/2004 window as against the time after Gazprom became a hit. Even if we assume it considered Russia.


I feel sorry for all your abroad living. You're nothing but a fool who sits on the fence has nothing to contribute to societal issues but only seeking for loopholes to puncture to drag colour and discredit..


After you date back your thinking faculty to the window of this deal, then ask yourself the conditions of those your so called alternatives. Even to as far as Iraq and Iran that recently came onstream


Olodo

seunny4lif:

Pele ooh pipeline from Nigeria to Europe

Emotional clap back. How unsurprisingly. Want to do an intellectual discuss, please pick a time and date.

The matter taya meself
Pipeline from Nigeria to Europe?
You even have time to reply to him
He doesn't even know how much Russia paid Poland and Ukraine every year.
One of the reasons Russia and Germany want NS2 is to cut the massive money of middle countries.
The guy funny

SavageResponse:
If you need proof that I have the money say so and I will show you an extract of the balance in my US$ dom account.

I can afford to wager that amount because I know you will never be able to prove the nonsense you're blabbing about!

Building a pipeline from Nigeria to Europe is akin to importing coal from South Africa to be used in Enugu when even a fo0l knows that Enugu is sitting on a huge coal deposit; only an idiot would embark on such a project.

I'm sure you're most likely an ignorant backroom technician or engineer in an oil installation somewhere who is not even in the decision making cadre but who wants to run his mouth by arguing blindly.

Let me tell you something, it's the financial guys like myself that determine whether a project in the oil sector gets done or not!

We do this by building financial models and risk heat maps etc to determine the economic viability of a project.


Analysis of quantitative and qualitative factors for an undersea pipeline from Nigeria to mainland Europe
- It costs an average of $200,000 to construct one mile of oil pipeline on land; that cost will triple if you want to do it underwater

- For each mile of oil pipeline depending on the diameter you need to have a compression station to pump the oil; an undersea pipleline of that length would require thousands of compression stations and each would would have to be powered with electricity supply.

- Crude oil is thick and viscous therefore you would need to heat it depending on the viscosity; under water this cost would more than triple because sea water is cold therefore you would need more heating capacity to keep the crude in a fluid state.

- The environmental impact of a ruptured under sea pipeline is more severe than that which happens on land

- It takes more time to determine where the actual leak happened, when tracing a leak time is of the essence

- Even when you and able to determine the leak and shut off the supply from the nearest valve or compression station the crude oil that is already in the pipeline alone would be enough to fill a super tanker of VLCC class due to the length of the pipeline; all this oil will leak into the ocean and the damage would be catastrophic.

- The world is gradually moving a way from fossil fuel to electric vehicles; a project of this scale would take at least 20 years to complete and by that time 80% of the cars in Europe would be electric powered.

- There are other factors which I have not included but which also have huge financial implications for the project

Cost
The sheer cost of this project alone is more than enough to build a fleet of at least 300 ULCC supertankers which is a better alternative to ferry crude from Nigeria to Europe.

Availability of crude in Europe
Europe already has oil in the North sea, Norway and Russia which are nearer therefore it is just plain foolish to want to run a pipe from Nigeria. Even if they want to run a pipeline it makes more sense to do it from the middle east which has the best grade sweet crude available in the market

OPEC quota
Another challenge is that Nigeria is a member of OPEC and has an allocated quota of crude. It does not make any economic sense to build a pipeline with an infinite capacity when you know that you have a quota which you cannot exceed. it means that once the pipeline is able to meet Nigeria's monthly quota in 3 or 4 days it will have to be shut down for the rest of the month resulting in underutilisation of installed capacity...how very wasteful!

Conclusion
Your plan of running a pipeline from Nigeria to Europe is just plain daft and stupid; whoever proposes such a foolish project should be shot in the head!!!

Uncle nothing to discuss with you on your beer parlor's stories
Go construct the pipeline yourself from Nigeria to Europe abi na Eurpoe to Nigeria?

BlueSparks:
Emotional clap back. How unsurprisingly. Want to do an intellectual discuss, please pick a time and date.

Hollawayn05:
Nairaland harbors Intelligent people ooo
Am Mouuuved

I was surprised too... especially on the first page...so many intelligent views from intelligent people.

seunny4lif:
Uncle nothing to discuss with you on your beer parlor's stories
Go construct the pipeline yourself from Nigeria to Europe abi na Eurpoe to Nigeria?

As usual. Atypical Africans and emotional rants

Don't bother. I won't be indulging your rants.

Anyways bro, I got your point. Unfortunately, I don't know how PH refinery and Eleme Petrochemicals are set up. But I am here, so i know how this one is set up

24SEVEN:
@bolded, while i wouldn't want to sound like a pessimist, it would be instructive to note that Port Harcouirt refinery has same with Eleme petrochemicals, yet we have same chemicals being released from time to time, with its attendant negative impact on the health and safety of the populace and environment.

It is a good thing Lagosians will experience firsthand the fallout Riverians have been living with for over 50yrs. We have 2 refineries, The largest petrochemical plant in West Africa, nay Africa and a very expansive LNG plant. Wetin we dey see for Rivers no be small thing. Add oil spillage and oil bunkering to the mix.

Nigeria is a very unbalanced and immoral society but God go help us.

BlueSparks:
Yes. This was how the forum used to be back 2005/2007 before they destroyed it and made us stop commenting.

They turned the forum to Tonto Dike, DJ cuppy,BBN naija and the likes. Na so we com take original back seat o.

SavageResponse:
If you need proof that I have the money say so and I will show you an extract of the balance in my US$ dom account.

I can afford to wager that amount because I know you will never be able to prove the nonsense you're blabbing about!

Building a pipeline from Nigeria to Europe is akin to importing coal from South Africa to be used in Enugu when even a fo0l knows that Enugu is sitting on a huge coal deposit; only an idiot would embark on such a project.

I'm sure you're most likely an ignorant backroom technician or engineer in an oil installation somewhere who is not even in the decision making cadre but who wants to run his mouth by arguing blindly.

Let me tell you something, it's the financial guys like myself that determine whether a project in the oil sector gets done or not!

We do this by building financial models and risk heat maps etc to determine the economic viability of a project.


Analysis of quantitative and qualitative factors for an undersea pipeline from Nigeria to mainland Europe
- It costs an average of $200,000 to construct one mile of oil pipeline on land; that cost will triple if you want to do it underwater

- For each mile of oil pipeline depending on the diameter you need to have a compression station to pump the oil; an undersea pipleline of that length would require thousands of compression stations and each would would have to be powered with electricity supply.

- Crude oil is thick and viscous therefore you would need to heat it depending on the viscosity; under water this cost would more than triple because sea water is cold therefore you would need more heating capacity to keep the crude in a fluid state.

- The environmental impact of a ruptured under sea pipeline is more severe than that which happens on land

- It takes more time to determine where the actual leak happened, when tracing a leak time is of the essence

- Even when you and able to determine the leak and shut off the supply from the nearest valve or compression station the crude oil that is already in the pipeline alone would be enough to fill a super tanker of VLCC class due to the length of the pipeline; all this oil will leak into the ocean and the damage would be catastrophic.

- The world is gradually moving a way from fossil fuel to electric vehicles; a project of this scale would take at least 20 years to complete and by that time 80% of the cars in Europe would be electric powered.

- There are other factors which I have not included but which also have huge financial implications for the project

Cost
The sheer cost of this project alone is more than enough to build a fleet of at least 300 ULCC supertankers which is a better alternative to ferry crude from Nigeria to Europe.

Availability of crude in Europe
Europe already has oil in the North sea, Norway and Russia which are nearer therefore it is just plain foolish to want to run a pipe from Nigeria. Even if they want to run a pipeline it makes more sense to do it from the middle east which has the best grade sweet crude available in the market

OPEC quota
Another challenge is that Nigeria is a member of OPEC and has an allocated quota of crude. It does not make any economic sense to build a pipeline with an infinite capacity when you know that you have a quota which you cannot exceed. it means that once the pipeline is able to meet Nigeria's monthly quota in 3 or 4 days it will have to be shut down for the rest of the month resulting in underutilisation of installed capacity...how very wasteful!

Conclusion
Your plan of running a pipeline from Nigeria to Europe is just plain daft and stupid; whoever proposes such a foolish project should be shot in the head!!!

You have done a balance analysis of your view,your points raised are equally convincing atleast for a layman and an expert.
From your analysis,I can guess the IoC that you operate from.

awumen:
They turned the forum to Tonto Dike, DJ cuppy,BBN naija and the likes. Na so we com take original back seat o.

Yes. It used to only be topical societal issues that made front page. Chai you remembered me. Brilliant stints back and forth.

Chai

BlueSparks:
As usual. Atypical Africans and emotional rants

Don't bother. I won't be indulging your rants.

@BlueSparks, I have followed your write up on this topic with keen interest. A simple Google search shows information on a gas pipeline from Warri in Nigeria via Niger Republic to Algeria linking Europe.

Hence, if this is possible, it is not beyond the realm of possibility that what you mentioned can achieved.

However, for the sake of knowledge and being better informed, can you provide a link to this information pertaining to the link of either crude oil or its refined products from Nigeria to Europe.

Many thanks as you provide information on this.

Regards.

hawwal84:
@BlueSparks, I have followed your write up on this topic with keen interest. A simple Google search shows information on a gas pipeline from Warri in Nigeria via Niger Republic to Algeria linking Europe.

Hence, if this is possible, it is not beyond the realm of possibility that what you mentioned can achieved.

However, for the sake of knowledge and being better informed, can you provide a link to this information pertaining to the link of either crude oil or its refined products from Nigeria to Europe.

Many thanks as you provide information on this.

Regards.

Now someone who I can reason with on very mature level not the noise makers and kids claiming smart earlier


This is what brilliant minds should do. When we hear things before we discard information or call information lies, pull out facts, put on thinking cap and break it down pieces by pieces


Let me start with this. The ocean floor is filled with large connecting cables, we have plans for massive geo-sub water trains and roads connecting distances kilometers apart, we have massive ocean/land sequestration/land project. Why can't the world see more. Ambitious projects. Hence for example, Facebook is committing seriously into deep ocean sub sea installations as even Bill Gate is seriously Investing in top companies around the world scaling up subsea cables for global communication

This brings to mind that companies and organisations see profits in spending heavily to reach very far parts to reach their target markets and offer their services.


I'll be back. Work duties. Damn. Oooh


So during the 2001/2003 post gulf war era, Germany started to seek alternative energy sources from sources that weren't exposed to conditions they were just incase.


Cold... The Norwich though has lots of crude like us had the same weather conditions.. Perhaps a reason they didn't look in that direction



Iran was under embargo at the time



Iraq.. Inconsistency. Throughout this window Iraq was experiencing heavy wars on all sides even against oil installations.


Russia they wanted to keep away from


Nigeria had cheap oil and had very free sulphur free crude once of the purest reserves in the world, which makes refining cheaper and easier. Research can be looked into this

Nigeria had very little purchasing countries for its crude then. Asides the United States and India we couldn't match countries like Saudi and Co who had already captured the market before our new democratic era



Lots of people don't know the volume of gas in the Niger Delta for example and why it's hot bed for any Westerner country to cast it's eyes. Let's say we lump crude and gas together.

Niger Delta as of in the past decade not recently produced information is estimated to have 93 Million cubic feet of gas. That's like saying the crude oil gotten, Niger Delta and Nigeria by extension was tapping into less than 35% of its potential.



Now, you see why Germany would cast green eyes in this direction?


Under utilisation


Lack of technical knowhow


The desperate for Nigeria who's earning then was grossly poor and the country's financial system still in the woods.



Ofcourse it wast purely for energy needs or alternative power. But to exploit. The project had a 20 years masterplan to have the pipeline construct designed and installed. I can bet ten million on my info. I have never and will never give false or concocted information




But my God who saw my prayers and hears my prayers because many Nigerians eyes weren't opened at the time for some reasons the project went silent and under cover. It can be taken up like a thread created and we can all begin to seek, search and find. I'm sure we will find information sources on this if we do. But black men would always like to argue from illogical emotional point rather than search critically



Doubters can search and read on the complexity of the German/Eastern Eurpoe proposed Russian-Alternatve Gas pipeline and see the cost and ambioutouness of that project. If this can be checked and investigated, despite within close terrains you would agree to Nigeria was pretty easier. Another thing it possibly didn't want to obstruct the project.. Beauracracy


Done here back to work


I stay in the realm of the gods. Not mere men

BlueSparks:
The community didn't take bribe

Will any industry on Earth tell you they would be realewsojg toxic henicals into your environment


Go to YouTube and check how some Chinese companies damaged rivers in Kenya deliberately and how fishes in hundreds of thousands were dying


Speak objectively Sir.

Mr community didn't take bribe, were you there? investigate well you will discover that someone from that community is protecting the company. it is the inthing everywhere in the SS. someone is cashing in. at the end of the day, the same community will be crying environmental pollution

SavageResponse:
We're talking about a refinery here not an oil rig or oil production platform...It's in oil rigs that they normally flare gas which is more or less regarded as a by-product of crude production.

Most of these guys commenting and talking rubbish do not even know the difference between drill ship and a semi submersible but they're here pretending to be Energy industry experts!

Dnt insults guys who knew more than U.

motherlode:
I am also glad there is a focus shift away from the aspect of crude waste. However, this area shouldn't be totally ignored.

About that heat of a thing?

The truth is that there is no certainty that this won't happen again in Lagos with respect to the refinery being built. I schooled in Badagry (A boarding secondary school in between Iworo and Ajido community) and i can categorically tell you that we felt tortured by the heat waves emitted due to excessive gas flaring from West African Gas Pipeline Company Ltd (WAGPCo) jointly owned by Chevron West African Gas Pipeline Ltd, Nigerian National Petroleum Corporation, Shell Overseas Holdings Limited, Takoradi Power Company Limited, Societe Togolaise de Gaz and Societe BenGaz S.A.. You can imagine in a boarding school where we couldn't sleep in our hostels due to abnormal heat and low air quality, we had to make do with the front of our classrooms and the open fields. Just so pathetic!

The communities are still being affected today and nothing is being done as we speak. So many agitations yet no result! The fact that institutions in this country don't check the gross inadequacies of these companies is a big blow on how much justice the communities around can get.

The Nigerian legislation with respect to gas flaring as stipulated in 1969 mandates every company to cease such acts within 5 years of establishment. There was zero achievement with this legislation and another was set up in 1979 called the Associated Gas Re-Injection Act Number 99 of 1979, where the Nigerian government required oil corporations operating in Nigeria to guarantee zero flares by January 1, 1984. I don't need to tell you this is 2021 already!

Besides, do you also know that the Nigerian government makes money from gas flaring. The Act as established in 1979 allowed some conditions for specific exemptions or the payment of a fee which as subsequently shot up to $3.50 for every 1000 standard cubic feet of gas flared as at January, 2008. These fines are quite very easy to pay by these companies given the fact that majority of these fines would still go unremitted!

Last time i checked, Nigeria is the 6th largest gas flaring country in the world and the 2nd largest in Africa. In 2016, a 2020 target was set to achieve zero gas flaring by the then minister of state for petroleum (Ibe Kachukwu)... This is 2021, gas is still being flared heavily and rumour says there is another push for 2030!

We will get there someday!

Word!

Aconomist:
Dangote chose the perfect location for his refinery because Lagos is the only functional state government in Nigeria. He had originally planned to locate in it [Oyo], but the fools over there frustrated him. By choosing the Lekki free trade zone, he doesn't have to worry about the land use problems that face other parts of the country.

In terms of safety and pollution, refineries are only dangerous to people living within a 30 mile radius, and Dangote's site is roughly 40 miles away from mainland Lagos. Obviously, the people who live in Lekki will face much more risk. But it can't be much more dangerous than their dirty gasoline fumes you inhale every day. Dangote's refinery will also be made to a Euro V standard which will minimize some of the health risks.

Obviously, even with this, a project like this would never be allowed in a modern country. But welcome to Nigeria.

You made very valid points here!

Even in some Caribbean island countries that have refineries, some oil spills take place into
the ocean while transfering
crude oil from oil tankers to the petrochemical refineries and this has consequences for the beaches and tourism sector in these island countries. I have a 1973 hard copy of Black Enterprise magazine that focussed on the effects of these oil spills on the Caribbean islands with refinery installations.


NOTE:
Dangote Refinery was originally planned for Ondo State being that the onshore and offshore Ilaje region produces oil and gas,
NOT Oyo State as you stated.

Bureaucracy on the part of
the previous FG and Ondo governments made him move
the refinery project to Ibeju-Lekki, which Oando was originally planning to build as part of
their own refinery division.

sulaak:
Common Guys,

When will that happen? ...and you are still going to be using large trailers that have completely polluted Apapa. Apapa in the 1980s was like Ikoyi, today Apapa is a rundown extension of Ajegunle.

We need to ensure that the surrounding health of the community is not taken for granted, development must go hand in hand with environment protect and community health and safety.


The original plan was to locate the refinery in the Olokola FTZ which has natural deepsea facilities but his excused was that the compensation to the community would have amounted to 50% of the project cost ($4 billion) , I doubt that the local communities in Ondo would asked for $100 million.
The like of Tinubu and Fashola have as usual, sold out the Lagos communities , just look at all those oil tanks farms and their trailers that are causing havoc in Satellite town.

Reasonable Human Beings knows that Nigeria's Future is bleak.