₦airaland Forum

derecho:
You can't understand what sin is, until the Holy Spirit teach you.

I deliberately ask those basic questions to show you that all those dictionary definition of sin, law etc are too basic.
And you need understanding.

Or you thought I learnt this from books or Church?

There are things you can NEVER KNOW no matter what you read.
Spiritual things are spiritually discerned and God's Word is Spirit and life.

Since your definition of sin does not seem to be according to God's own declaration, ofcourse I can't understand it since what I have understanding of is God's Word, not the lies of men.

Ever read James 2:10?

Kobojunkie:
Ok. I will bite again... How does breaking Jesus Christ's one law on adultery in Matthew 5 vs 27 - 28 result in this multitudes of sins you claim?

Where in scripture did God or Jesus Christ in form you that when you commit one sin, you commit this multitudes/uncountable sins you seek of?

derecho:
Ever read James 2:10?

You know simple human language comprehension is what it takes to understand what is written in scripture..

Here's what James said to you in His epistle instead of what you claim..

10 You might follow all of God’s law. But if you fail to obey only one command, you are guilty of breaking all the commands in that law.
11 God said, “Don’t commit adultery.” The same God also said, “Don’t kill.” So if you don’t commit adultery, but you kill someone, you are guilty of breaking all of God’s law. - James 2 vs 10

Now read the above passage and tell me how it corresponds to any of what you have claimed so far?
Where do you go off the multitudes and uncountable sins you yap on about?

Breaking just one command equals breaking all

Is that difficult to understand? Or you just want to argue?

Kobojunkie:
You know simple human language comprehension is what it takes to understand what is written in scripture..

Here's what James said to you in His epistle instead of what you claim..
Now read the above passage and tell me how it corresponds to any of what you have claimed so far?

I expected you to have read what Jesus said about the Holy Spirit about convicting the world of sin and teaching us ALL things
So you thought I made that up?
Guy you no dey read your Bible o..but I understand you read it the wrong way.

Reading the Bible for argument sake or showoff would surely embarrass you.

Honestly,
It's clear why you can't know or understand the word of God because you don't even know that it doesn't make sense to the carnal man and it's Spiritually discerned.

Kobojunkie:
Since your definition of sin does not seem to be according to God's own declaration, ofcourse I can't understand it since what I have understanding of is God's Word, not the lies of men.

derecho:
1. I expected you to have read what Jesus said about the Holy Spirit about convicting the world of sin and teaching us ALL things

2. So you thought I made that up?
Guy you no dey read your Bible o..but I understand you read it the wrong way-Reading the Bible for argument sake or showoff would embarrass you

1. Go back to read what Jesus Christ actually said in John 16 so you can understand what He meant instead of what you pretend here.

2. You did make it up because clearly what James said isn't what you claimed at all. James affirms my statement that sin isn't arbitrarily defined but is instead as defined in God's Law.

Recall how we got to this point in the conversation before you attempted to wriggle about by claiming James instead said there were uncountable sins, which turned out to be a lie?

I had told you that sin was not arbitrarily defined, and explaned there where God gave to us about 100 commandments in the New Covenant, it meant that there where about 100 sins in the New Covenant. But you attempted to argue instead that that wasn't the case and went as far as to introduce James' statement as support for your claim that there were uncountable sins.

However, James instead affirmed my point that there are only as many sins as are defined by God in His particular Law.

derecho:
Breaking just one command equals breaking all

Is that difficult to understand? Or you just want to argue?

Go back through this entire conversation to see how you have been shifting goalposts in order to escape having to facts the Truths from scripture placed before you.

Here's what I posted to ask you some comments ago..

---

Again...When Jesus Christ declared Sexual lust in one's heart, after a woman, sin in Matthew 5 vs 27 - 28, for instance, how many sins do you think that amounts to?

Sin is defined as direct disobedience of God's commandment.

---

This right before you decided to shift the discussion to the breaking of commandments, this without in fact answering the question asked..

We are now at the point where even James reveal that when you sin, the maximum number of sins you are found guilty of is the maximum number defined in God's Law, in the case of the New Covenant, about 100 sins. I hope you are not going to keep arguing stupidly about an uncountable number of sins at this point so we can bring this all back to the starting issue from this point?,

Friend, forget all this attempt to waste time.
James 2:10 is clear.
You wanted to know how I arrived at breaking one law can be same as committing uncountable sins.Your reference was Sexual lust.I don't need to explain in details. I just asked "ever read James 2:10?"

The John 16:8 was to help you know the HolySpirit does a better work of defining sin..NOT your textbook definition that couldn't help you answer a simple question for 10mins

Kobojunkie:
1. Go back to read what Jesus Christ actually said in John 16 so you can understand what He meant instead of what you pretend here.

2. You did make it up as what James said isn't what you claimed at all.

Remember how we got to this point in the conversation before you attempted to wriggle in by claiming James instead said there were uncountable sins, which turned out to be a lie?

I had told you that sin was not arbitrarily defined, and explaned there where God gave to us about 100 commandments in the New Covenant, it meant that there where about 100 sins in the New Covenant. But you attempted to argue instead that that wasn't the case and went as far as to introduce James' statement as support for your claim that there were uncountable sins.

However, James instead affirmed my point that there are only as many sins as are defined by God in His particular Law.

derecho:
Friend, forget all this attempt to waste time.
James 2:10 is clear.
You wanted to know how I arrived at breaking one law can be same as committing uncountable sins.Your reference was Sexual lust.I don't need to explain in details. I just asked "ever read James 2:10?"

The John 16:8 was to help you know the HolySpirit does a better work of defining sin..NOT your textbook definition that couldn't help you answer a simple question for 10mins

I am afraid I am done with this "road to nowhere" at this point. Since it has become more than apparent you are in this again today, to argue for the sake of arguing, I would rather go off elsewhere.

Shifting posts?
You are viewing it as an argument but my mission to to flay you.

I have been asking questions to be sure what you mean but you keep evading them with ambiguous explanations.
Check my questions and tell me if you answered them

Kobojunkie:
Go back through this entire conversation to see how you have been shifting goalposts in order to escape having to facts the Truths from scripture placed before you.

Here's what I posted to ask you some comments ago..

---

Again...When Jesus Christ declared Sexual lust in one's heart, after a woman, sin in Matthew 5 vs 27 - 28, for instance, how many sins do you think that amounts to?

Sin is defined as direct disobedience of God's commandment.

---

This right before you decided to shift the discussion to the breaking of commandments, this without in fact answering the question asked..

Kikikiki
I don't argue, I discuss.
There's a difference

I'm glad you realized this thinking will lead you no where..

Kobojunkie:
I am afraid I am done with this "road to nowhere" at this point. Since it has become more than apparent you are in this again today, to argue for the sake of arguing, I would rather go off elsewhere.

However, the important thing is

1.The Priest was right and,
2.It's clear your opinions lacks biblical basis. Hence,should remain yours

canada2022:
Am very sure you did not read the write up. He was giving you background information from the old testament and you just jump into conclusion

I didn't know you also saw the emptiness in his post. Such an embarrassment.

Kobojunkie:
God's Law for Marriage is not stated in the Old Covenant of Moses, but instead in Genesis 2 vs 24. . So there is no "background" to be had in God's Old Covenant Law of Moses to be had for those who be had for those who are called instead according to Jesus Christ.

Stop allowing ordinary men deceive you with their lies..

You are the one that should stop deceiving others with your empty gospel.

SWATMan:
You are the one that should stop deceiving others with your empty gospel.

I have no gospel of my own unless you are insinuating God's own Law to you is nothing but emptiness.

You sef dey see the boldness and muscle he uses to misquote and misapply scriptures?

SWATMan:
You are the one that should stop deceiving others with your empty gospel.

Kobojunkie:
His very opinion God never decreed against polygamy(Polygyny and Polyandry alike) even from the beginning else God would have been said to have contradicted Himself when He gave many wives to even His own servants.

Among all the Bible quotations Kelvin Ugwu made in this post, is there any one that does not exist in the Bible? If yes, which one?

Among all Kelvin's explanations of the Bible verses he quoted, is any of the explanations wrong? If yes, point out that one and give the right explanation.

A course writer for an e-book is needed asap. Chat me up for on 08159985841

immortalcrown:
Among all the Bible quotations Kelvin Ugwu made in this post, is there any one that does not exist in the Bible? If yes, which one?

Among all Kelvin's explanations of the Bible verses he quoted, is any of the explanations wrong? If yes, point out that one and give the right explanation.

Scripture isn't ever the problem. The problem, as Jesus Christ pointed out in Matthew 15 vs 1 - 14 & Mark 7 vs 1 - 13 is your use of it, in much the same as the Pharisees before you all, to advance your many doctrines and traditions of men, lies, which have absolutely nothing to do with God or His Law to us in Jesus Christ. .

Here is a simple issue here... and this wrote an epistle on it, sighting many irrelevant examples and laws from the Bibles, all so he can forward his own opinion and view as if of God.

The key here should instead be that since God never decreed Polygamy a sin(Polyandry or Polygyny) , not by His definition of Marriage in Genesis 2 vs 24 and certainly not in His Law, Jesus Christ to Christians. Any man who decrees it sin installs himself as God since what he does is attempt to add commandments to God Law and that is sin against God.

Kobojunkie:
Scripture isn't ever the problem. The problem, as Jesus Christ pointed out in Matthew 15 vs 1 - 14 & Mark 7 vs 1 - 13 is your use of it, in much the same as the Pharisees before you all, to advance your many doctrines and traditions of men, lies, which have absolutely nothing to do with God or His Law to us in Jesus Christ. .

Here is a simple issue here... and this wrote an epistle on it, sighting many irrelevant examples and laws from the Bibles, all so he can forward his own opinion and view as if of God.

The key here should instead be that since God never decreed Polygamy a sin(Polyandry or Polygyny) , not by His definition of Marriage in Genesis 2 vs 24 and certainly not in His Law, Jesus Christ to Christians. Any man who decrees it sin installs himself as God since what he does is attempt to add commandments to God Law and that is sin against God.

You are just trying to dodge my questions. My two questions are clear.

One, did Kelvin Ugwu, in this post, give a quotation that does not exist in the Bible? If yes, where is it in the post?

Two, did Kelvin Ugwu, in this post, misinterpret a part of the Bible? If yes, quote his wrong interpretation and give your correct interpretation.

immortalcrown:
You are just trying to dodge my questions. My two questions are clear.

One, did Kelvin Ugwu, in this post, give a quotation that does not exist in the Bible? If yes, where is it in the post?

Two, did Kelvin Ugwu, in this post, misinterpret a part of the Bible? If yes, quote his wrong interpretation and give your correct interpretation.

Again, here's your original claim..

immortalcrown:
Catholic no be your mate. Catholic dey train priests well. No be to carry microphone dey shout. Na to preach truth and wisdom.

And my explanation again is this.... Nothing of what the man claims here constitutes Truth and Wisdom where God is concerned and this mainly because he spuriously quotes scriptures that have absolutely nothing to do with that which God infact commands on the issue, only so he can promote his opinion on the issue as if of God.

Again.... Scripture isn't ever the problem. The problem, as Jesus Christ pointed out in Matthew 15 vs 1 - 14 & Mark 7 vs 1 - 13 is your use of it, in much the same as the Pharisees before you all, to advance your many doctrines and traditions of men, lies, which have absolutely nothing to do with God or His Law to us in Jesus Christ. .

Here is a simple issue here... and this wrote an epistle on it, sighting many irrelevant examples and laws from the Bibles, all so he can forward his own opinion and view as if of God.

The key here should instead be that since God never decreed Polygamy a sin(Polyandry or Polygyny) , not by His definition of Marriage in [b]Genesis 2 vs 24 and certainly not in His Law, Jesus Christ to Christians.[/b]. That is what God's Truth and Wisdom is.

Any man who decrees it sin installs himself as God since what he does is attempt to add commandments to God Law and that is sin against God.

Kobojunkie:
Again, here's your original claim..

And my explanation again is this.... Nothing of what the man claims Truth and Wisdom where God is concerned and this mainly because He spurious quotes so many scriptures that have absolutely nothing to do with that which God infact commands on the issue, only so he can promote his opinion on the issue as if of God.

Again.... Scripture isn't ever the problem. The problem, as Jesus Christ pointed out in Matthew 15 vs 1 - 14 & Mark 7 vs 1 - 13 is your use of it, in much the same as the Pharisees before you all, to advance your many doctrines and traditions of men, lies, which have absolutely nothing to do with God or His Law to us in Jesus Christ. .

Here is a simple issue here... and this wrote an epistle on it, sighting many irrelevant examples and laws from the Bibles, all so he can forward his own opinion and view as if of God.

The key here should instead be that since God never decreed Polygamy a sin(Polyandry or Polygyny) , not by His definition of Marriage in [b]Genesis 2 vs 24 and certainly not in His Law, Jesus Christ to Christians.[/b]. That is what God's Truth and Wisdom is.

Any man who decrees it sin installs himself as God since what he does is attempt to add commandments to God Law and that is sin against God.

I have been following you on this forum - Check you following list- You are highly intelligent.

Kobojunkie:
Again, here's your original claim..

And my explanation again is this.... Nothing of what the man claims here constitutes Truth and Wisdom where God is concerned and this mainly because he spuriously quotes scriptures that have absolutely nothing to do with that which God infact commands on the issue, only so he can promote his opinion on the issue as if of God.

Again.... Scripture isn't ever the problem. The problem, as Jesus Christ pointed out in Matthew 15 vs 1 - 14 & Mark 7 vs 1 - 13 is your use of it, in much the same as the Pharisees before you all, to advance your many doctrines and traditions of men, lies, which have absolutely nothing to do with God or His Law to us in Jesus Christ. .

Here is a simple issue here... and this wrote an epistle on it, sighting many irrelevant examples and laws from the Bibles, all so he can forward his own opinion and view as if of God.

The key here should instead be that since God never decreed Polygamy a sin(Polyandry or Polygyny) , not by His definition of Marriage in [b]Genesis 2 vs 24 and certainly not in His Law, Jesus Christ to Christians.[/b]. That is what God's Truth and Wisdom is.

Any man who decrees it sin installs himself as God since what he does is attempt to add commandments to God Law and that is sin against God.

Why did you quote only my main comment? Why didn't you quote your first response?

Your first response is "Which truth and wisdom?"

My first reply is "Point out any falsehood or foolishness in the post."

So, if you cannot point out any falsehood in the post, then there is no foolishness in the post.

immortalcrown:
Why did you quote only my main comment? Why didn't you quote your first response?

Your first response is "Which truth and wisdom?"
My first reply is "Point out any falsehood or foolishness in the post."
So, if you cannot point out any falsehood in the post, then there is no foolishness in the post.

Again, your assertion that there is Truth and Wisdom to be had from what is the opinion of this man is what concerns me this since Truth and Wisdom is that which instead comes from God and nothing of the claims He made recons with what God decreed as far as this issue is concerned.

According to Jesus (God's only begotten Son) Paradise is designed for obedient mankind and God laid the foundation in the garden of Eden with Adam and Eve (a pair) so if anyone wants to live forever in Paradise where there will be no hatred, jealousy or strife leading to SORROW then we must revert to the standard God set in the BEGINNING! Matthew 19:4

This may be heard for many to adapt that's why Jesus said from the day of John the baptist the Kingdom of heaven has become difficult to gain entrance and only the strong at heart can get in! Matthew 11:12

WHY?

Because God declared people who were polygamist "RIGHTEOUS" as they're able to live by the standard they understood while they're awaiting the Christ who will teach them how to live in Paradise! Deuteronomy 18:18-19 compare to Act 3:22

But after John the baptist Jesus' ministry has begun and all what those people missed back then are now taught and whoever failed to abide by the law of the Christ will not enter God's Kingdom even if such a person perfected all the laws before the coming of Christ! Luke 18:18-25

Some of God's servants in the past pursued riches and became rich but after Jesus whoever pursue riches is no longer on the path of righteousness! Matthew 6:24

Likewise before Christ some of God's servants like Abraham, Jacob, Elkanah, David and Solomon lived with more than one woman but after Jesus' statement as recorded in the Bible book of Matthew 19:4, whoever goes back to what those people did and wants to live by it is on his own.
None of us (if we have a say) will like our dad to marry another woman to come and become rival to our mum or allow his son in-law to bring in another woman and become a rival to our daughter {Matthew 7:12} so that's the new light only those who welcome it are God's children! John 3:19

God bless you and may you have PEACE!

Kobojunkie:
Again, your assertion that there is Truth and Wisdom to be had from what is the opinion of this man is what concerns me this since Truth and Wisdom is that which instead comes from God and nothing of the claims He made recons with what God decreed as far as this issue is concerned.

You are just making noise. When you are ready to sound sensible, point out any falsehood in Kelvin's statement.

immortalcrown:
You are just making noise. When you are ready to sound sensible, point out any falsehood in Kelvin's statement.

Abeg Waka pass me!

Kobojunkie:
Abeg Waka pass me!

Remain a noisemaker.

canada2022:
Understanding The Scriptural Teaching On Polygamy

In the same way that we do not allow every random person who is without qualification to treat us when we are sick, or be our pilot when flying or lawyer when in court, we should not also allow any random social media influencer and scriptural wannabees to teach or interpret the sacred scriptures to us.

If the Bible is left in the hands of these wannabees, it can be used to justify every damn thing, thereby causing more confusion.

For example,

There is nowhere in the bible that slavery was outrightly condemned. Even St Paul did not really help matters when he wrote to Philemon concerning the slave boy Onesimus. People who quoted the bible out of context in those days found justification for their slave trade.

Again, there are many cases in the Bible where it appears God explicitly permitted and even commanded that certain persons guilty of certain offenses should be killed.

I will show you ten examples (there are more though); these people, God demanded that they should be killed or stoned to death.

1. Those who commit adultery (man and woman) should be killed (Lev 20:10)(Deut 22:22-24)

2. Rapists must be killed (Deut 22:25)

3. The daughter of a priest who became a prostitute will be burnt alive (Lev 21:9)

4. An idolater must be stoned to death (Deut 17:2-5)(Num 25:1-5)

5. Those who break the Sabbath law must be killed (Ex 31:14)(Ex 35:2)(Num 15:32-36)

6. A woman having sex before marriage must be stoned to death (Deut 22:21-22)

7. Homosexuality (Lev 20:13)

8. A blasphemer (Lev 24:10-16,23)

9. A man whose ox kills someone after previously goring other people (Ex 21:28-29)

10. A sorceress or a witch (Ex 22:18)

As Christians, there is a basic tool we must carry in mind once we are interpreting the old testament laws and putting them side by side with the teachings of Christ. The tool is:

What God allowed then due to people's stubbornness of heart VERSUS the original plan of God right from the beginning of creation.

With this rule, you will understand why,

1. God, through Moses, allowed a man to divorce his wife for any reason by just writing a letter, but Christ told us that it was not so in the beginning. (Matthew 19:.

2. People can be put to death for carrying or doing anything on the Sabbath day, but Christ told the man he cured on Sabbath day at the pool of Bethesda to carry his mat and go. (John 5:.

3. If you are caught in adultery, following the law, you should be stoned to death, but Christ preached forgiveness and reconciliation because God’s name is Mercy. (John 7).

So, this brings us to the issue of polygamy. I did all that preliminaries to make you have a foundation in understanding the issue at hand.

I have read where some of your “online deep biblical scholars” are justifying polygamy because according to them many Godly men in the bible were polygamists and God permitted it. People like Abraham, Jacob, Elkanah, Solomon, etc made the list.

Now, listen. . .

When you mention Abraham as a reason to hold on to polygamy, don't forget to add that Sarah his wife was his half-sister. Don't also forget that Hagar, the woman Abraham slept with just to have a son, was his wife's maid. Don't also forget how he regretted it and sent her away. Finally, don't forget how the son from Hagar is the root of the Islamic religion.

When you mention Jacob, don't also forget to add the fact that Jacob married two blood sisters Rachel and Leah. No one should edit the story that led to him marrying the two sisters because it was not his original plan.

You should not also edit the part of the story where the two women became a torment to him due to their jealousies and how each of them even offered him their maidservants, Bilhah and Zilpah, for sex so as to have children. In the end, Jacob married four sisters, all daughters of Laban because Bilhah and Zilpah are half-sisters to Leah and Rachel.

And when you mention Solomon as a polygamist, remember also that he had 300 concubines and God still allowed it.

The point is: since we are looking for anything to hold on to and people as role models to our bodily inclinations, let us hold on to everything. No cherry-picking! Go and marry your sister, go and marry four siblings, go ahead and impregnate your maids and marry them, gather for yourself enough concubines. . . after all, according to you, God permitted it. Nonsense!

I read also where they are justifying polygamy with 1 Timothy 3:2. According to the writer, "Polygamy is only forbidden for Bishops, overseers, and elders in the church."

So, what he is saying, in essence, is that, if you are not an elder or bishop, you are free to have more wives. Hmmmmm! Interesting!

Let me quote 1 Timothy 3:2, so we read it for ourselves:

"That is why the presiding elder must have an impeccable character. Husband of one wife, he must be temperate, discreet and courteous, hospitable and a good teacher."

If not that common sense is not common these days, common sense would have let anyone quoting this passage see that the passage is in itself a strong line against polygamy. The passage pointed out qualities that a leader should have. It is like saying, even if others are doing the wrong thing, a leader must be an example. Those qualities are the ideals of all Christians. It means it is a good thing, that was why St Paul recommended it.

Because if their logic is to be true, it then means other qualities listed in 1 Timothy 3:2 are not for every Christians as well. So, it is only the elders that should be temperate or discreet, or courteous and a husband of one wife. Odiegwu!

More importantly, how will you also justify St Paul's message to the Ephesians, where he kept mentioning wife and husband in the singular.

"However, let each one of you love his wife as himself, and let the wife see that she respects her husband." Ephesians 5:33.

Dear friends, I know this is long, but this is important. . .some people may want to save this post. Let me just put it all out.

The key to understanding the true scriptural teaching on polygamy is for us to go back to the answer Christ gave the scribes and Pharisees when they came to question him about marriage and divorce. Christ pointed them to the way it was "in the beginning" (Matthew 19:.

"IN THE BEGINNING" is a powerful unlocking phrase to this problem. This was why Jesus said:

“Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning made them male and female, and said, ‘Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh?’

So they are no longer two but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let not man separate.” Matthew 19:3-6

Note that Jesus was quoting Genesis 2:24. . .the emphasis there is that "THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH."

So we ask ourselves, what was the original plan of God in the beginning? When he made Adam and discovered that he needed a helpmate, why did he not provide him with two or three women? Would it have been difficult for him to remove four ribs and make four women for him?

You see ehn if any of you want to marry more than one woman following what some of you regard as your African culture, you should go ahead, but don't find justification in the bible because there is NONE.

By the way, saying polygamy is an African culture does not make it valid, there are many of the other so-called African cultures that you left behind and chose what we can best describe as "western" culture. It is better if you stop confusing yourself. If you want to be full African in the traditional way, adopt everything African and leave western things aside. Don't wait for an argument like this before you remember you have a culture.

Finally, regarding my opinion on polygamy.

I see polygamists as the most selfish people on earth. The only time you can convince me to even start looking at polygamous men as less selfish is if they will also allow their women to practice polyandry.

Nobody has the monopoly on exploring and enjoying different-sex partners, there are lots of married women that have not even known what orgasm feels like and there are those that are bored with one man...they too can have three to four husbands to satisfy them since we all want to be mad.

Instead of people to start looking for how to deal with their inability to control their sex organs and hormones they are looking for bible passages to hold on to. Go and ask Solomon, even with 700 wives and 300 concubines, e no still do am, he was still looking for the queen of Sheba.

#FacebookTelevision

https://www.facebook.com/100047214812954/posts/520308709552952/

all the examples he mentioned that stands for his justification to annulled polygamy still failed.... David married more than 5 wives right? Did God condemn him for doing so? No but was condemned killing someone and married off his wife, even God confirmed it through Nathan that if he want more He will give it to him... Even till today they are still Christ the son of David, the polygamous... One thing people refused to understand is it polygamous is never a sin if not he could have been written in ten commandments but is not... 12 tribe of Israel were mostly sons of polygamy still Christ came from there... The teaching is simple any condition that will deter you from God should be scrutinized very well if you can do it , go ahead and if you can't don't...

canada2022:
Understanding The Scriptural Teaching On Polygamy

In the same way that we do not allow every random person who is without qualification to treat us when we are sick, or be our pilot when flying or lawyer when in court, we should not also allow any random social media influencer and scriptural wannabees to teach or interpret the sacred scriptures to us.

If the Bible is left in the hands of these wannabees, it can be used to justify every damn thing, thereby causing more confusion.

For example,

There is nowhere in the bible that slavery was outrightly condemned. Even St Paul did not really help matters when he wrote to Philemon concerning the slave boy Onesimus. People who quoted the bible out of context in those days found justification for their slave trade.

Again, there are many cases in the Bible where it appears God explicitly permitted and even commanded that certain persons guilty of certain offenses should be killed.

I will show you ten examples (there are more though); these people, God demanded that they should be killed or stoned to death.

1. Those who commit adultery (man and woman) should be killed (Lev 20:10)(Deut 22:22-24)

2. Rapists must be killed (Deut 22:25)

3. The daughter of a priest who became a prostitute will be burnt alive (Lev 21:9)

4. An idolater must be stoned to death (Deut 17:2-5)(Num 25:1-5)

5. Those who break the Sabbath law must be killed (Ex 31:14)(Ex 35:2)(Num 15:32-36)

6. A woman having sex before marriage must be stoned to death (Deut 22:21-22)

7. Homosexuality (Lev 20:13)

8. A blasphemer (Lev 24:10-16,23)

9. A man whose ox kills someone after previously goring other people (Ex 21:28-29)

10. A sorceress or a witch (Ex 22:18)

As Christians, there is a basic tool we must carry in mind once we are interpreting the old testament laws and putting them side by side with the teachings of Christ. The tool is:

What God allowed then due to people's stubbornness of heart VERSUS the original plan of God right from the beginning of creation.

With this rule, you will understand why,

1. God, through Moses, allowed a man to divorce his wife for any reason by just writing a letter, but Christ told us that it was not so in the beginning. (Matthew 19:.

2. People can be put to death for carrying or doing anything on the Sabbath day, but Christ told the man he cured on Sabbath day at the pool of Bethesda to carry his mat and go. (John 5:.

3. If you are caught in adultery, following the law, you should be stoned to death, but Christ preached forgiveness and reconciliation because God’s name is Mercy. (John 7).

So, this brings us to the issue of polygamy. I did all that preliminaries to make you have a foundation in understanding the issue at hand.

I have read where some of your “online deep biblical scholars” are justifying polygamy because according to them many Godly men in the bible were polygamists and God permitted it. People like Abraham, Jacob, Elkanah, Solomon, etc made the list.

Now, listen. . .

When you mention Abraham as a reason to hold on to polygamy, don't forget to add that Sarah his wife was his half-sister. Don't also forget that Hagar, the woman Abraham slept with just to have a son, was his wife's maid. Don't also forget how he regretted it and sent her away. Finally, don't forget how the son from Hagar is the root of the Islamic religion.

When you mention Jacob, don't also forget to add the fact that Jacob married two blood sisters Rachel and Leah. No one should edit the story that led to him marrying the two sisters because it was not his original plan.

You should not also edit the part of the story where the two women became a torment to him due to their jealousies and how each of them even offered him their maidservants, Bilhah and Zilpah, for sex so as to have children. In the end, Jacob married four sisters, all daughters of Laban because Bilhah and Zilpah are half-sisters to Leah and Rachel.

And when you mention Solomon as a polygamist, remember also that he had 300 concubines and God still allowed it.

The point is: since we are looking for anything to hold on to and people as role models to our bodily inclinations, let us hold on to everything. No cherry-picking! Go and marry your sister, go and marry four siblings, go ahead and impregnate your maids and marry them, gather for yourself enough concubines. . . after all, according to you, God permitted it. Nonsense!

I read also where they are justifying polygamy with 1 Timothy 3:2. According to the writer, "Polygamy is only forbidden for Bishops, overseers, and elders in the church."

So, what he is saying, in essence, is that, if you are not an elder or bishop, you are free to have more wives. Hmmmmm! Interesting!

Let me quote 1 Timothy 3:2, so we read it for ourselves:

"That is why the presiding elder must have an impeccable character. Husband of one wife, he must be temperate, discreet and courteous, hospitable and a good teacher."

If not that common sense is not common these days, common sense would have let anyone quoting this passage see that the passage is in itself a strong line against polygamy. The passage pointed out qualities that a leader should have. It is like saying, even if others are doing the wrong thing, a leader must be an example. Those qualities are the ideals of all Christians. It means it is a good thing, that was why St Paul recommended it.

Because if their logic is to be true, it then means other qualities listed in 1 Timothy 3:2 are not for every Christians as well. So, it is only the elders that should be temperate or discreet, or courteous and a husband of one wife. Odiegwu!

More importantly, how will you also justify St Paul's message to the Ephesians, where he kept mentioning wife and husband in the singular.

"However, let each one of you love his wife as himself, and let the wife see that she respects her husband." Ephesians 5:33.

Dear friends, I know this is long, but this is important. . .some people may want to save this post. Let me just put it all out.

The key to understanding the true scriptural teaching on polygamy is for us to go back to the answer Christ gave the scribes and Pharisees when they came to question him about marriage and divorce. Christ pointed them to the way it was "in the beginning" (Matthew 19:.

"IN THE BEGINNING" is a powerful unlocking phrase to this problem. This was why Jesus said:

“Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning made them male and female, and said, ‘Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh?’

So they are no longer two but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let not man separate.” Matthew 19:3-6

Note that Jesus was quoting Genesis 2:24. . .the emphasis there is that "THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH."

So we ask ourselves, what was the original plan of God in the beginning? When he made Adam and discovered that he needed a helpmate, why did he not provide him with two or three women? Would it have been difficult for him to remove four ribs and make four women for him?

You see ehn if any of you want to marry more than one woman following what some of you regard as your African culture, you should go ahead, but don't find justification in the bible because there is NONE.

By the way, saying polygamy is an African culture does not make it valid, there are many of the other so-called African cultures that you left behind and chose what we can best describe as "western" culture. It is better if you stop confusing yourself. If you want to be full African in the traditional way, adopt everything African and leave western things aside. Don't wait for an argument like this before you remember you have a culture.

Finally, regarding my opinion on polygamy.

I see polygamists as the most selfish people on earth. The only time you can convince me to even start looking at polygamous men as less selfish is if they will also allow their women to practice polyandry.

Nobody has the monopoly on exploring and enjoying different-sex partners, there are lots of married women that have not even known what orgasm feels like and there are those that are bored with one man...they too can have three to four husbands to satisfy them since we all want to be mad.

Instead of people to start looking for how to deal with their inability to control their sex organs and hormones they are looking for bible passages to hold on to. Go and ask Solomon, even with 700 wives and 300 concubines, e no still do am, he was still looking for the queen of Sheba.

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in 1timothy 3:2 talks about a bishop which simply means pastor should marry one wife what about if you are not a pastor nko? What will you do? Even the Reverend father is not even biblical ... So Paul only gave his own advice and not a commandment.... Even moses said it to the Israel that their king must a single wife.. From king Saul to the rest of kings in Israel non of them Marris one wife and no prophecy that came for them concerning how many wives they should take... Marriage is a thing of the earth and it ends on earth .. After life no marriage..

This is a very true message from the Catholic Church, but it was not necessary for the Rev. To bring back the practices of the old testament to further explain his points. He already gave enough scriptural backups from new testament. Saying slavery wasn't totally condemned by Bible is somehow, because if we practice what Christ preached (love), we definitely would not like to treat any other human as a slave'.

LilMissFavvy:
This is a very true message from the Catholic Church, but it was not necessary for the Rev. To bring back the practices of the old testament to further explain his points. He already gave enough scriptural backups from new testament. Saying slavery wasn't totally condemned by Bible is somehow, because if we practice what Christ preached (love), we definitely would not like to treat any other human as a slave'.

Um.... in Jesus Christ, you are a slave to a Master.

All this dribbling to in the end advance what is your opinion over God's Truth...na wa ooo!