fickyola:
. I think Stanbic Bank also failed

Gt bank was successful, 365 days @14.5%.

Gavrelino123:


Gt bank was successful, 365 days @14.5%.

Wow!

VeeVeeMyLuv:



Wow!

364 days

Gavrelino123:


Gt bank was successful, 365 days @14.5%.

How can Gt bank be successful @ 14.5% when the Stop Rate posted was 13.99?.

Something is wrong somewhere..

Please when is the next date for treasury bill auction?

NL1960:


How can Gt bank be successful @ 14.5% when the Stop Rate posted was 13.99?.

Something is wrong somewhere..

I wonder my brother even on the 13.99% they will charge you WHT on the interest now as FGN has instructed banks to start taking WHT effective January this year..14.5% was last bid rate so he should reconfirm. Am sure most bid will fail as they will be projecting 14-15%..

Biakwa:


I wonder my brother even on the 13.99% they will charge you WHT on the interest now as FGN has instructed banks to start taking WHT effective January this year..14.5% was last bid rate so he should reconfirm. Am sure most bid will fail as they will be projecting 14-15%..

How many percentage is the WHT on Treasury bills?

This is false for individuals!!! There is no WHT deduction for individuals

Biakwa:


I wonder my brother even on the 13.99% they will charge you WHT on the interest now as FGN has instructed banks to start taking WHT effective January this year..14.5% was last bid rate so he should reconfirm. Am sure most bid will fail as they will be projecting 14-15%..

VeeVeeMyLuv:

Yes Boss. Tomorrow

Once again Welldone job for creating this amazing forum

Good day. I need to understand something please. What's the difference between going to bank to buy tbills and let's say putting the money inside StanbicIbtc mutual funds.. Is it not the same cbn Treasury bill rates they both use?

Also, must you wait until you get news of an auction before going to the bank to buy treasury bill?

Phraences:


Good day. I need to understand something please. What's the difference between going to bank to buy tbills and let's say putting the money inside StanbicIbtc mutual funds.. Is it not the same cbn Treasury bill rates they both use?

Also, must you wait until you get news of an auction before going to the bank to buy treasury bill?

U mustn't wait for the news to place your bid for the tbills, u can use the last news release to place your bid.

The mutual fund is quite different from tbills. In mutual funds the rate u start with is not rate u will end with, u get the interest at end of tenure/period or when you decide to end it.

Tbills interest is upfront.

VeeVeeMyLuv:

U mustn't wait for the news to place your bid for the tbills, u can use the last news release to place your bid.

The mutual fund is quite different from tbills. In mutual funds the rate u start with is not rate u will end with, u get the interest at end of tenure/period or when you decide to end it.

Tbills interest is upfront.

Ok. Thanks.

Phraences:


Good day. I need to understand something please. What's the difference between going to bank to buy tbills and let's say putting the money inside StanbicIbtc mutual funds.. Is it not the same cbn Treasury bill rates they both use?

Also, must you wait until you get news of an auction before going to the bank to buy treasury bill?

Before I would have just ask you to read the beginning of this thread and the other thread for mutual fund for better understanding but lots of pages have piled up so it won't be easy.


1. As an intending investor, yours is to look at Treasury Bills as a short term government debt. Meaning government borrowing money from you that is willing to invest now for certain reasons and at the end of the day pay you a certain percentage for that money borrowed. Though it is through the banks and other financial houses that the money is collected, the borrower, end user or benefactor is government.

While you should look at Stanbic IBTC mutual funds on the other hand as the asset management arm of Stanbic IBTC collecting/ pooling money from you and other investors to invest in different classes/types of asset (depending on the mutual fund) on your behalf.

2. They don't usually have the same rate. TB Rates are usually guided by the CBN MPR. While mutual fund rates is dependent on the underlying asset class of the particular mutual fund.

3a.For treasury there is primary market auction which is scheduled for every 2 weeks (Here you have 90, 180 and 365 days tenure). The auction day of the week is mostly Wednesdays so you can just go to the bank on Monday of the auction week to put you request.

There is also secondary market auction which could happen every week day depending on the bank and availability of TB disposed to be auctioned. Here the tenure you get is the tenure available. It could be 356, 10, 27, 18, 99 or 63 days etc. Any tenure less than 364 could be available. It also limited to particular time frame. Eg The last I know of Stanbic is from 10 am - 1 pm.


b. For mutual funds you can invest anyday, anytime. It is not particularly tenured per day. You could deposit and withdraw at will.

freeman67:


Before I would have just ask you to read the beginning of this thread and the other thread for mutual fund for better understanding but lots of pages have piled up so it won't be easy.


1. As an intending investor, yours is to look at Treasury Bills as a short term government debt. Meaning government borrowing money from you that is willing to invest now for certain reasons and at the end of the day pay you a certain percentage for that money borrowed. Though it is through the banks and other financial houses that the money is collected, the borrower, end user or benefactor is government.

While you should look at Stanbic IBTC mutual funds on the other hand as the asset management arm of Stanbic IBTC collecting/ pooling money from you and other investors to invest in different classes/types of asset (depending on the mutual fund) on your behalf.

2. They don't usually have the same rate. TB Rates are usually guided by the CBN MPR. While mutual fund rates is dependent on the underlying asset class of the particular mutual fund.

3a.For treasury there is primary market auction which is scheduled for every 2 weeks (Here you have 90, 180 and 365 days tenure). The auction day of the week is mostly Wednesdays so you can just go to the bank on Monday of the auction week to put you request.

There is also secondary market auction which could happen every week day depending on the bank and availability of TB disposed to be auctioned. Here the tenure you get is the tenure available. It could be 356, 10, 27, 18, 99 or 63 days etc. Any tenure less than 364 could be available. It also limited to particular time frame. Eg The last I know of Stanbic is from 10 am - 1 pm.


b. For mutual funds you can invest anyday, anytime. It is not particularly tenured per day. You could deposit and withdraw at will.

Thank you.

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Kalu Aja
@FinPlanKaluAja1
Let's assume Pure Water is sold for N20 a bag.

Then FGN says it must be sold for N5, what happens .

1. Purewater at N5 will vanish from all stores.
2. A black market will develop for pure water at N50. Why N50? It was N20 b4. Well supply has dropped, so prices rise

How do you eliminate a black market?

3. You allow incrrased supply.

If more folks start selling pure water, the price falls, from N50 to say N30.

To make if fall below N20, you completely open the market and reduce cost of making a bag of pure water e.g., Power cost

You "kill" a black market not by looking for people illegally selling pure water at N50 but by creating conditions to allow more producers to supply more pure water to the market, so price falls to N10.

Supply is increased by productivity gains not chasing "illegal" markets

QuinModah:
Kalu Aja
@FinPlanKaluAja1
Let's assume Pure Water is sold for N20 a bag.

Then FGN says it must be sold for N5, what happens .

1. Purewater at N5 will vanish from all stores.
2. A black market will develop for pure water at N50. Why N50? It was N20 b4. Well supply has dropped, so prices rise

How do you eliminate a black market?

3. You allow incrrased supply.

If more folks start selling pure water, the price falls, from N50 to say N30.

To make if fall below N20, you completely open the market and reduce cost of making a bag of pure water e.g., Power cost

You "kill" a black market not by looking for people illegally selling pure water at N50 but by creating conditions to allow more producers to supply more pure water to the market, so price falls to N10.

Supply is increased by productivity gains not chasing "illegal" markets

That is exactly what this regime did to virtually all products and services esp rice & Forex creating artificial scarcity. Now people are buying a 50kg bag of rice for 40k+! something that used to be around 8k under Good luck regime.

Same with forex. It is so messed up that even people bringing in their own Forex cannot assess it!

So easy to say when you analyze it this way. But you forget the hypothetical pure water in question (as used in this context) is not something we produce or can produce enough locally.
Instead think of it like this.

1. Purewater is not produced in Nigeria, so we have no control over its cost. (dollar, ditto for imported products)

2. Purewater is needed to tend to the sick, drink as normal source of water and to water flowers.

3. The number of purewater entering the country begins to reduce or the demands begins to increase so that we cannot catch up, so what do you do?
You begin to pririotize because the factors of producing this pure water used in this scenario are out of your control. So, you remove those who use the pure water to water flowers away from those you will supply essential pure water to and try to focus on the sick and for normal use.
But the people who still want to use it for watering their flowers do not want to back down. They keep searching for that scarce pure water. Then a blackmarket opens to fill up that demand. So, rather than the black market find other ways to get pure water, they try so hard to deprive the sick people and normal water usage of pure water to satisfy the needs of those want to use that pure water to keep watering their flowers.

That is where I think we are today.

QuinModah:
Kalu Aja
@FinPlanKaluAja1
Let's assume Pure Water is sold for N20 a bag.

Then FGN says it must be sold for N5, what happens .

1. Purewater at N5 will vanish from all stores.
2. A black market will develop for pure water at N50. Why N50? It was N20 b4. Well supply has dropped, so prices rise

How do you eliminate a black market?

3. You allow incrrased supply.

If more folks start selling pure water, the price falls, from N50 to say N30.

To make if fall below N20, you completely open the market and reduce cost of making a bag of pure water e.g., Power cost

You "kill" a black market not by looking for people illegally selling pure water at N50 but by creating conditions to allow more producers to supply more pure water to the market, so price falls to N10.

Supply is increased by productivity gains not chasing "illegal" markets

.

ojesymsym:
So easy to say when you analyze it this way. But you forget the hypothetical pure water in question (as used in this context) is not something we produce or can produce enough locally.
Instead think of it like this.

1. Purewater is not produced in Nigeria, so we have no control over its cost. (dollar, ditto for imported products)

2. Purewater is needed to tend to the sick, drink as normal source of water and to water flowers.

3. The number of purewater entering the country begins to reduce or the demands begins to increase so that we cannot catch up, so what do you do?
You begin to pririotize because the factors of producing this pure water used in this scenario are out of your control. So, you remove those who use the pure water to water flowers away from those you will supply essential pure water to and try to focus on the sick and for normal use.
But the people who still want to use it for watering their flowers do not want to back down. They keep searching for that scarce pure water. Then a blackmarket opens to fill up that demand. So, rather than the black market find other ways to get pure water, they try so hard to deprive the sick people and normal water usage of pure water to satisfy the needs of those want to use that pure water to keep watering their flowers.

That is where I think we are today.

You are wrong in your analysis, QuinModah: analysis is right.

You kill black markets by making sure there is excess supply of a resource or product. You do not kill black markets by chasing after people that supply that resource.

In your analysis, the people that need water for flowers are valid users of water, that is an industry on its own, you do not go and stifle their business because you want to prioritise other industries.

The solution is to make sure there is adequate supply and all industries get normal supply of water.

Take for example when there is fuel scarcity in nigeria. Most times it is caused because the cost of suppling fuel is no longer profitable but the government wants to control the price.

What the fuel marketers that bought fuel at 180 and being told to sell at 10 naira loss do is to stop selling and find people that will buy it at higher price so they can make a profit. If they do not make profit their business will collapse.

ositadima1:
.

This bald head man go just dey type and delete. Wetin you dey fear? Who send you for here

Kindly find below November 2022 FGN bond auction results.

skydiver01:
Kindly find below the FGN bond auction for November 2022.

From my previous limited interaction, I see even some gnarled investors here are confused by the T'bill / bond allocation process and have inadvertently passed wrong information to enquiring newbies.

The link below is a 'friendly' writeup on the jargon and process (perhaps, read in conjunction with the results table above for reference) ...

https://mailchi.mp/afrinvest/invest-as-low-as-n5000-in-fgn-savings-bond-earn-quarterly-income-at-11244-and-12244-october-2019-dmo-offer-634728?e=dc9601418b

Good day.

NL1960:


Treasury bills is a bid and offer process. If a bank bids 10% and CBN offers 13%, the bank gets 10%. If the bank bids 13.1%, the bid fails.

RayRay06677:
He was right. Stop rate gives max rate for that bidding. If you bid within the range, you get what you asked for but if outside range your bid is deemed failed and your money returned to you. That's the reason different banks get different rates on same auction.

If you have 50m and above, you can place your bid independently from the bank, if within range then you get exact what you asked for.

Thanks for reading my submission though not professional.

eg, These are patently wrong.

Good day.

Actually you are wrong and they are both right (NL1960 & RayRay06677)

jabolo:

eg, These are patently wrong.

Good day.

skydiver01:
Actually you are wrong and they are both right (NL1960 & RayRay06677)

Just out of interest, is anyone here following developments in the crypto space/markets..... (implosion )

skydiver01:
Actually you are wrong and they are both right (NL1960 & RayRay06677)

I saw the post. I just decided to ignore as i no get time for round and round arguments. TBs wen person don dey do even before the N50m rule and also when rates went as high as 17% and then crashed to 2%.

Excellent decision to not waste time on back and forths . Experienced investors have the liberty of ignoring incorrect information being posted but there is also the risk of misleading newbies.

NL1960:


I saw the post. I just decided to ignore as i no get time for round and round arguments. TBs wen person don dey do even before the N50m rule and also when rates went as high as 17% and then crashed to 2%.

The bolded below took me down memory lane

NL1960:


I saw the post. I just decided to ignore as i no get time for round and round arguments. TBs wen person don dey do even before the N50m rule and also when rates went as high as 17% and then crashed to 2%.

skydiver01:
Excellent decision to not waste time on back and forths . Experienced investors have the liberty of ignoring incorrect information being posted but there is also the risk of misleading newbies.

You are right in pointing it out.

The guy wanted to sell his market by disrediting other people.

What about it?

skydiver01:
Just out of interest, is anyone here following developments in the crypto space/markets..... (implosion )

Just wondered if anyone here feels it is a fantastic buying opportunity.

SMJay:
What about it?