₦airaland Forum

1Sharon:
You're only saying this because a Nigerian man is the accused

If the accused was SA or even indian, you won't make this comment.

I maintain my stand irrespectiveof who is involved, these are manipulators. If the accused was an SA or even an Indian, she won't come online to be shedding crocodile tears.
Because the gentleman is a Nigerian she is trying to manipulate people into hating and probably inciting violent attacks on Nigerians( calling dudula). If the man was that bad how come she had 1,2,3 ,4 kids for him. Shame on her.

@Sepukku

Thanks for your videos. I actually watched one of them to the end. Trusts were mentioned and just as in the last video you shared, I wonder if it is black South Africans who own these trusts or white South Africans. But even in the video, it was stated clearly that black South Africans own most of the lands in the country. But a man who wants to engineer an equal society sounds like bad news to me. There is nothing like equality in a diverse society. It is a mirage.

Lioness5280:
In the last election, the DA didn't lose nor did gain any more supporters...it's still where it was in the last election. The EFF lost voters .So none of the 3 major parties grew.

So how come there had to be a coalition?

But then again there have been a couple of interviews of ANC big wigs from a couple of years back ....predicting that the ANC would have to go into a coalition with the other parties and that they hoped the ANC would atleast recieve 45% . Who says things like that if they weren't putting it out there . Predictive programming if you ask me.....so they knew they had a duty to lose voters *incompetence and the I don't care attitude that started taking over the party in recent years*..... it's very clear many of the things people were crying about were done deliberately to piss them off ....so that they wouldn't vote for the party.

I am genuinely curious, why would the ANC strive towards the emergence of a white man as president? Do they forget the anguish of Apartheid?

@the bolded....most of his followers are a certain section of our population who want an eye for an eye under the guise of equalizing the country....but what they don't get is that even if all the mlungus left in one day, they still won't be at peace because their master Juju will make them fight for his affections with migrants . And mostly importantly the most equal countries are usually poor shytholes with desperately poor citizens who cannot even afford the KFC they love here . Equalisers are always witches anyways ...people can never be equal in any competitive society ...that's just a mirage sold by mini -dictators like Juju to hungry people.

Sure. Any politician who says he or she is gunning for an equal society is a liar. Equal outcomes never exist in any diverse society.

Gerrard59:
So those are the policies supported by the EFF? Am I correct? If in power, SA will slide into abject poverty o. But then, with the rise of the DA, do you see a scenario where a white man becomes the country's president in the near future? That said, EFF still got votes and seats in parliament notwithstanding the bold text. What do you make of that?

South African Government
https://www.gov.za › files › l...PDF
LAND AUDIT REPORT


Above is the last land Audit report published in 2018.

I'm trying to show you the bogus lie that is all over the media ,social media and ofcourse promoted by the "radical "oppositions that 70% of the landmass of SA is owned by white people. It never made sense even before the audit and it can never make sense to any SA who is capable of using atleast a quarter of his or her brain. This is a campaign tactic for anyone who want to be seen as a "saviour and liberator "of the people. fortunately very few people get worked up by this rubbish now .

Now let's go back in history a bit:

After the boeres lost the Anglo-boere war, they were driven away from their farms into concentration camps by the Anglos. In 1913 the Anglos enacted the first Land Act. This was essentially an official land grab Act. Now they were introducing paperwork into the mix. The Africans and the boeres had no title deeds to any land except for about 7 to 13% of the African population. This is why the boeres came up with their own Land Act when they got power...to make sure they were titled-up before any democracy. And they moved fast

Remember there is no history of title land ownership in Africa, Infact in most African countries today most of the land owners wouldn't be land owners by SA law because they posses not title to the land they occupy. Funny but that's where the real issue lies in SA....two very different cultures colliding.

If you notice in the Land report white people start being the obvious dominant land owners when the issue of titles comes in. Black SA occupy more land in SA but have historically (like most of Africa) never been culturally conditioned to value deeds because...its their land,so who will chase them out?. That's where the white man hid his secret to wealth away from the niggas.....in the books. You can never create wealth when you don't own the best asset;land.

Now to recent history:

During the Zuma administration, a lot of the middle class and rich black class had woken up to this and started making demands to fasten up the titles for every black land owner. A lot of black farm and commercial land owners benefited from this . And that administration made the biggest black dollar millionaires than any other, and this was a big part of that. And today black SA have the biggest number of dollar millionaires after Afro-Americans. This opened a lot of doors in terms of government funding and ofcourse export licenses etc. And guess who had the biggest opposing voice against this ?. Yup! The black people liberator Juju.

He claimed that the poor and unemployed would end-up selling their legacies to the already rich and squander the money only to become landless and homeless ; very reasonable point I must say. But those who opposed him came up with possible policies to prevent this, but during this time the Zuma must go protests erupted all over SA. I'm not saying he was an innocent man but it was too convenient. And guess who lead those protests ? Yup! Juju , marching hand in hand with white people "the enemy". White people can never come out in numbers unless they're really pained. And this is about the time white males became number 1 in suicide in the whole country. No one hates competition and dominance or a threat of than a white man.

So Zuma left, and Ramaphosa came in and guess what? Only few titles were issued druning his first , I know this because I live in the rural areas and all those who applied for those titles were left stranded . And a year later Ramaphosa's government came out and said the "title issue is being reviewed and re-assesed with the traditional leaders to make it easier for our people to access " and it wasn't long before King Zwelithini of Zululand(the custodian of the Ingonyama trust; the biggest private land owners in SA) died, and ofcourse a few months later the *cheeky *wife followed.....covid-19 😏. So anyone who had doubts knew now that Ramaphosa wasn't here to play ....he had to keep his promise to De Klerk I guess . This is why white people don't attack him personally for the fckuries of the ANC but the opposite was the case with his predecessor.

So much to say so little time.

But basically, SA doesn't need no revolution to destroy the "white man's economy " , why destroy something that works? That is such a Karl Marx thing. And Marx died a broke arze loser in foreign land. Yet some moronic black men think of him as some grand-ideaologist. The bastard died without even owning a house , he died in a mould-infested small flat in England with his kids committing suicide all over the place . Now he is someone whose ideals we must follow?. I'm starting to believe that the man was the greatest satanist in recent history....his juju is timeless. Everyone who can't build but wants chaos and destruction always qoutes his manifesto lol.

SA needs to pace up on the policies already in place . Destroying white people won't help us build ourselves. Most of us prefer to learn from both their mistakes and their strengths.

The funny part is that Boeres aren't eve opposed to land redistribution as is widely believed but no one would want to lose everything they have. Many commercial farmers like Nederberg wines have come forward with a sharing recipe: they give out a stake to those who were affected by the land seizures and the long-term employees. Their children get scholarships and benefit from skills transfer and funding assistance to build up their own small and medium scale farms. This has uplifed many budding wine farmers.

Now if these people had opted to grab the whole thing instead of the "crumbs"...who would be their biggest market? Remember most of these wines are exported to Europe, you think they'd still buy them? Ask Zimbos . They say pride comes before a fall. You cant learn to run before walking.

Gerrard59:
So how come there had to be a coalition?


I am genuinely curious, why would the ANC strive towards the emergence of a white man as president? Do they forget the anguish of Apartheid?


Sure. Any politician who says he or she is gunning for an equal society is a liar. Equal outcomes never exist in any diverse society.

None of them grew but some lost a lot of votes ; the ANC being the biggest loser. So in SA to govern you need 50%: and more . The ANC didn't make the 50% mark, so they had to form a coalition to get majority .

I don't think they are necessarily striving towards a white president, that's why I also included Malema as a possible future preside that will be negotiated-in. I think the instructions from Davos were the same with some countries; it looks like a new trend is being tested ...checkout the list of countries with coalition governments ...its growing. I doubt they had a choice. I don't think the WEF wants a country that will have a strong and decisive government. Remember it's difficult to manipulate a group that has one dominant set of rules, laws,ideologies, vision etc. But you can easily control and have your way with a diverse leadership structure as they'll be constantly backbiting each other. So the coalition is not for SA but for outsiders to manipulate us easily. Diversity produces better results when there's one dominant way of life.

Well it's becoming clear that we are nearing the New global order and different countries are being made to test different aspects of the order. We are seeing how the West is losing the values that made it what it was, today they're fast turning into third world shytholes. Their cultural, religious and political hegemony is fast being eroded, I wouldn't be surprised if their leaders will be armed-twisted to introduce Sharia law ...its coming.

It's like something evil is sweeping over the world; every normal thing is being demonised and every demonic crap glorified and promoted😏😭😂. It looks like the only safe and sane places on earth will be in East Asia.....unless they'll be sank by the turning of the tectonic plates😏🙈.....how else can one explain why they seem to be the only region who arent being bombarded with all these weird changes we have to deal with 😭.

Lioness5280:
Above is the last land Audit report published in 2018.

I'm trying to show you the bogus lie that is all over the media ,social media and ofcourse promoted by the "radical "oppositions that 70% of the landmass of SA is owned by white people. It never made sense even before the audit and it can never make sense to any SA who is capable of using atleast a quarter of his or her brain. This is a campaign tactic for anyone who want to be seen as a "saviour and liberator "of the people. fortunately very few people get worked up by this rubbish now.

Thanks for refuting the mendacious tale with cold hard facts that whites own most of the lands in SA.

Now let's go back in history a bit:
After the boeres lost the Anglo-boere war, they were driven away from their farms into concentration camps by the Anglos. In 1913 the Anglos enacted the first Land Act. This was essentially an official land grab Act. Now they were introducing paperwork into the mix. The Africans and the boeres had no title deeds to any land except for about 7 to 13% of the African population. This is why the boeres came up with their own Land Act when they got power...to make sure they were titled-up before any democracy. And they moved fast

Remember there is no history of title land ownership in Africa, Infact in most African countries today most of the land owners wouldn't be land owners by SA law because they posses not title to the land they occupy. Funny but that's where the real issue lies in SA....two very different cultures colliding.

Thanks for bringing that up because I read about it but forgot to include it.

Now to recent history:
During the Zuma administration, a lot of the middle class and rich black class had woken up to this and started making demands to fasten up the titles for every black land owner. A lot of black farm and commercial land owners benefited from this . And that administration made the biggest black dollar millionaires than any other, and this was a big part of that. And today black SA have the biggest number of dollar millionaires after Afro-Americans. This opened a lot of doors in terms of government funding and ofcourse export licenses etc. And guess who had the biggest opposing voice against this ?. Yup! The black people liberator Juju.

The bold is true. It reminds me of a Nigerian disputing the claim that SA has the highest number of dollar millionaires in Africa. The Youtubber (a British-Nigerian) only mentioned it as a passing statement, but the Nigerian argued that Nigerians have the highest number of black dollar millionaires in Africa, which was not the topic but the number of dollar millionaires. SAns in the comment section countered it by ensuring he focused on the initial statement of dollar millionaires and also refuted the claim that black SAns aren't the majority of the dollar millionaire population. They referenced that most SAns dollar millionaires live in Johannesburg, which I believe has more black people than say Cape Town. After realising everyone is focused on the initial statement - the highest number of dollar millionaires in Africa - he changed to Lagos being the city with the most black dollar millionaires even after seeing the links I and SAns put up to dispute his mendacious claim. These links were from Henley and Partners, the authoritative voice for millionaire migration in the world.

Typical Nigerian whose ignorance is laced with arrogance.

He claimed that the poor and unemployed would end-up selling their legacies to the already rich and squander the money only to become landless and homeless ; very reasonable point I must say. But those who opposed him came up with possible policies to prevent this, but during this time the Zuma must go protests erupted all over SA. I'm not saying he was an innocent man but it was too convenient. And guess who lead those protests ? Yup! Juju , marching hand in hand with white people "the enemy". White people can never come out in numbers unless they're really pained. And this is about the time white males became number 1 in suicide in the whole country.

Which is hypocritical. Also, regarding white males being number 1 in suicide (not murder?). I recall Elon Musk crying out in defence of white males in SA and questioning Juju's statements that white males should be killed. Donald Trump also mentioned the same situation about white males while as president. What do you think of their incursions and defence of their cousins in SA as powerful white men in the US?

P.S. Why do you call the Malema dude "Juju"?

No one hates competition and dominance or a threat of than a white man.

This is true. See the way the West is attacking China left, right and centre. Even in the Olympics, the white man is scared of the Chinese as they have refused to be allies vassals like Koreans and Japanese.

So Zuma left, and Ramaphosa came in and guess what? Only few titles were issued druning his first , I know this because I live in the rural areas and all those who applied for those titles were left stranded . And a year later Ramaphosa's government came out and said the "title issue is being reviewed and re-assesed with the traditional leaders to make it easier for our people to access " and it wasn't long before King Zwelithini of Zululand(the custodian of the Ingonyama trust; the biggest private land owners in SA) died, and ofcourse a few months later the *cheeky *wife followed.....covid-19 😏. So anyone who had doubts knew now that Ramaphosa wasn't here to play ....he had to keep his promise to De Klerk I guess . This is why white people don't attack him personally for the fckuries of the ANC but the opposite was the case with his predecessor.

What is this deal you talk about? No successor to King Zwelithini of Zululand?

But basically, SA doesn't need no revolution to destroy the "white man's economy " , why destroy something that works? That is such a Karl Marx thing. And Marx died a broke arze loser in foreign land. Yet some moronic black men think of him as some grand-ideaologist. The bastard died without even owning a house , he died in a mould-infested small flat in England with his kids committing suicide all over the place . Now he is someone whose ideals we must follow?. I'm starting to believe that the man was the greatest satanist in recent history....his juju is timeless. Everyone who can't build but wants chaos and destruction always qoutes his manifesto lol.

I regard communists as unintelligent people any day, any time and anywhere. As for socialists, it might be feasible ONLY in small countries which are homogenous by ethnicity, race and religion. Anything else, capitalism is the answer.

SA needs to pace up on the policies already in place . Destroying white people won't help us build ourselves. Most of us prefer to learn from both their mistakes and their strengths.

The bold is true. It is the same thing East Asians did - learn the strategies and mistakes of the white man. Do away with their bad traits and implement only the good ones. It is the same thing black people should do.

The funny part is that Boeres aren't eve opposed to land redistribution as is widely believed but no one would want to lose everything they have. Many commercial farmers like Nederberg wines have come forward with a sharing recipe: they give out a stake to those who were affected by the land seizures and the long-term employees. Their children get scholarships and benefit from skills transfer and funding assistance to build up their own small and medium scale farms. This has uplifed many budding wine farmers.

I know I am stretching too far, but what is the difference between the Boeres and Afrikaaners? Who is the Anglophone between them?

Now if these people had opted to grab the whole thing instead of the "crumbs"...who would be their biggest market? Remember most of these wines are exported to Europe, you think they'd still buy them? Ask Zimbos . They say pride comes before a fall. You cant learn to run before walking.

This is true. A few years ago, I recall telling a so-called geopolitical analyst on Twitter that the West will always come to the defence of their kith in SA should anything destructive happen to them. He disagreed, but Zimbabwe is an example. Humans are tribal. I think it is also a reason why SA declined to host Putin because the West would have retaliated and their cousins would have been the most affected. I believe they put enormous pressure on Ramaphosa. That said, I believe SA just as every other African country should diversify to serve the Chinese market and fast-growing South East Asian markets. This removes the total dependence on the West which is subject to nose-poking.

Lioness5280:
None of them grew but some lost a lot of votes ; the ANC being the biggest loser. So in SA to govern you need 50%: and more . The ANC didn't make the 50% mark, so they had to form a coalition to get majority.

Thanks for the emendation.

I don't think they are necessarily striving towards a white president, that's why I also included Malema as a possible future preside that will be negotiated-in. I think the instructions from Davos were the same with some countries; it looks like a new trend is being tested ...checkout the list of countries with coalition governments ...its growing. I doubt they had a choice. I don't think the WEF wants a country that will have a strong and decisive government. Remember it's difficult to manipulate a group that has one dominant set of rules, laws, ideologies, vision etc. But you can easily control and have your way with a diverse leadership structure as they'll be constantly backbiting each other. So the coalition is not for SA but for outsiders to manipulate us easily. Diversity produces better results when there's one dominant way of life.

Interesting information from you.

Well it's becoming clear that we are nearing the New global order and different countries are being made to test different aspects of the order. We are seeing how the West is losing the values that made it what it was, today they're fast turning into third world shytholes. Their cultural, religious and political hegemony is fast being eroded, I wouldn't be surprised if their leaders will be armed-twisted to introduce Sharia law ...its coming.

Truly, the West has lost it. But what I find surprising is that if the New World Order analogy is true, I am sure it comes from elites mostly composed of Westerners and domiciled in the West. So, why are they instituting an order which is antithetical to their existence? As for Sharia, well, it is inevitable, especially for France and maybe Spain. Rather than a NWO, don't you think history is repeating itself? I see the world drifting to the traditional way of life pre-WW1/2. As birth rates plummet due to changing ideologies, not necessarily the cost of living as peddled, countries will forced to find solutions other than immigration which disrupts social cohesion.

It's like something evil is sweeping over the world; every normal thing is being demonised and every demonic crap glorified and promoted😏😭😂. It looks like the only safe and sane places on earth will be in East Asia.....unless they'll be sank by the turning of the tectonic plates😏🙈.....how else can one explain why they seem to be the only region who arent being bombarded with all these weird changes we have to deal with 😭.

You know I smiled when I read the bold. I reside in Japan, so I understand your perspective and concerns. Another "sane place" will be South East Asia especially as the region becomes wealthier. As for East Asia, it has not been easy resisting the cultural changes as the US under this present administration continues to put pressure on Japan and South Korea to legalise transgender mumbo-jumbo rights. The only saving grace is China due to the CCP's overwhelming resistance and dominance. The language and Confucian systems, I think, are the major factors behind East Asia's resistance to every "evil" ideology out there.

Gerrard59:
Thanks for refuting the mendacious tale with cold hard facts that whites own most of the lands in SA.


Thanks for bringing that up because I read about it but forgot to include it.


The bold is true. It reminds me of a Nigerian disputing the claim that SA has the highest number of dollar millionaires in Africa. The Youtubber (a British-Nigerian) only mentioned it as a passing statement, but the Nigerian argued that Nigerians have the highest number of black dollar millionaires in Africa, which was not the topic but the number of dollar millionaires. SAns in the comment section countered it by ensuring he focused on the initial statement of dollar millionaires and also refuted the claim that black SAns aren't the majority of the dollar millionaire population. They referenced that most SAns dollar millionaires live in Johannesburg, which I believe has more black people than say Cape Town. After realising everyone is focused on the initial statement - the highest number of dollar millionaires in Africa - he changed to Lagos being the city with the most black dollar millionaires even after seeing the links I and SAns put up to dispute his mendacious claim. These links were from Henley and Partners, the authoritative voice for millionaire migration in the world.

Typical Nigerian whose ignorance is laced with arrogance.

Don't have much time on my hands today to write long epistles ....so I'll address one paragraph at a time whenever I get the chance.


Correction:

White people still have the highest number of dollar millionaires in South Africa, but SA have the highest number of black dollar millionaires in Africa and the second in the world. The same is true for better living standards, white people still have better living on average. But the average black SA fairs better than Africans elsewhere.

But for obvious reasons (numbers)...Black SA now have more middle class people than white and therefore the purchasing power. But if we went by percentage of each group then the white people's early advantages will show and we will sink lower.

So we still have a long way to go , but we started out with a lot of baggage from a huge population of poor and under-skilled people to now here . That's why there's this love and hate relationship between the natives and the ANC. Even though they failed in somethings, but they definitely outdid themselves in others. Now we have a lot of skilled and educated people but no employment, hence so much money in the latest budget is being incubated into entrepreneurship programs to fund the qualifying graduates who have the potential to be employers. Hopefully it work as planned.

Gerrard59:
I regard communists as unintelligent people any day, anytime and anywhere. As for socialists, it might be feasible ONLY in small countries which are homogenous by ethnicity, race and religion. Anything else, capitalism is the answer.

@Gerrard59. I am curious to know why you regard communists as unintelligent and why you believe capitalism is the best economic system we have.


As far as understanding the political spectrum in South Africa, the linear graph would read as such; The EFF to the radical left, the MK party to the progressive left, The ANC somewhere to the center left. The DA to the center-right, The FF Plus to the right and then some parties to your extreme right.

The development of a black middle class in South Africa had always been part of the overall containment plan of the nationalist/Western Liberal backed party (now DA) after Apartheid in an effort to pacify the struggle movement and retain the overall economic power in the country.

This new elitist "class" would act as a buffer between the working/poor/labor class that was strategic in maintaining an efficient capitalist system, the end goal ultimately being the continuous control of the means/factors of production.

The EFF's radical approach seeks to dismantle this alliance ( your so called GNU) in creating a more socialist system that seeks to redistribute wealth by breaking up the power of the Oligarchy aka White monopoly power who pretty much have heavy if not total influence on the political systems in the South African society.

Capitalism in its purest form or definition seeks to deploy capital "effectively" across other factors of production in creating wealth/goods and services and redistribute that wealth proportionately in accordance to contributions from each factor of production. The problem with capitalism in the form it is practiced today in most societies is that you now have an elitist class of Oligarchy's who wield an enormous amount of capital seeking to exploit/control the other factors of production, labor in particular in achieving the maximization of profits at the detriment of the majority working/poor class in the society instead of lifting them out of poverty.


The fact still remains that a majority of South Africans are poor and South Africa continious to be one of the most unequal societies in the word. This is the reason for the EFF who are advocating for free higher education, free housing, free health care, expropriation without compensation of "lands" that should be given back to right owners. Fundamentals necessary in any society to set give them the ability to move themselves out of perpetual poverty. The current economic system is not doing that but rather has enabled a "black" middle class of so-called African millionaires emerge not through capitalist mechanisms but through a corrupt manipulation and undeserved redistribution of wealth by the Oligarchy (white monopoly capitalist) class and the well-connected( Political class) in the society.

Sepukku:
@Gerrard.59. I am curious to know why you regard communists as unintelligent and why you believe capitalism is the best economic system we have.

I am baffled that is a question when China and Eastern European countries exist. Capitalism REMAINS the only economic system that has pulled more people out of poverty than any other economic system. It is the only economic system that aligns with human's basic concept of greed.

The EFF's radical approach seeks to dismantle this alliance ( your so called GNU) in creating a more socialist system that seeks to redistribute wealth by breaking up the power of the Oligarchy aka White monopoly power who pretty much have heavy if not total influence on the political systems in the South African society.

Where else has "redistribution" worked in a similar SA context?

Capitalism in its purest form or definition seeks to deploy capital "effectively" across other factors of production in creating wealth/goods and services and redistribute that wealth proportionately in accordance to contributions from each factor of production. The problem with capitalism in the form it is practiced today in most societies is that you now have an elitist class of Oligarchy's who wield an enormous amount of capital seeking to exploit/control the other factors of production, labor in particular in achieving the maximization of profits at the detriment of the majority working/poor class in the society instead of lifting them out of poverty.

While I agree that present-day capitalism has its problems, no other economic system can substitute it.

The fact still remains that a majority of South Africans are poor and South Africa continious to be one of the most unequal societies in the word. This is the reason for the EFF who are advocating for free higher education, free housing, free health care, expropriation without compensation of "lands" that should be given back to right owners. Fundamentals necessary in any society to set give them the ability to move themselves out of perpetual poverty. The current economic system is not doing that but rather has enabled a "black" middle class of so-called African millionaires emerge not through capitalist mechanisms but through a corrupt manipulation and undeserved redistribution of wealth by the Oligarchy (white monopoly capitalist) class and the well-connected( Political class) in the society.

Where will the money come from? From taxes of productive citizens in a capitalist environment. Pull the carpet off capitalism and watch how multidimensional poverty kicks in. Equal opportunities are what you should advocate, not equal outcomes. Socialism works best in countries with a max of 10 million people who are homogenous by ethnicity, race, culture, language and religion. Preferably, they have natural resources such as lithium, cobalt, gold or oil. Namibia and Botswana can implement such, not South Africa.

Gerrard59:
Which is hypocritical. Also, regarding white males being number 1 in suicide (not murder?). I recall Elon Musk crying out in defence of white males in SA and questioning Juju's statements that white males should be killed. Donald Trump also mentioned the same situation about white males while as president. What do you think of their incursions and defence of their cousins in SA as powerful white men in the US?

P.S. Why do you call the Malema dude "Juju"?

Well, both men ;Elon and Trump are both friends of the right-wing and white nationalists movements in America and have white fans and followers all around the world who identify with those movements and SA is not left out. Some right-wing groups in SA have been all over the net claiming there's white genocide in SA and some right-wingers in the West and specifically in the USA fell for the scam
(even though many have since been exposed to the shameless-ness of their cousins). My take was that Trump needed to play to the gallery: " I'll take care of all white people no matter where they're " . Sort of like how Malema has positioned himself as some sort of black protector. Trump's supporters must have wanted to hear that. And also it's suspicious how he said this during the Zuma administration when Zuma was really stabbing the West in the eye; from joining BRICS , and championing many policies that would have SA more friendlier with the East than the West. Not to mention that this was the same period that white people were crying all over the streets of SA during working hours for Zuma to go. So I don't know, but I think the answer is somewhere in there or inbetween🤷‍♀️

I think the JuJu is a nickname derived from the name Julius .

Lioness5280:
Don't have much time on my hands today to write long epistles ....so I'll address one paragraph at a time whenever I get the chance

Okay. Please do take your time.

Correction:
White people still have the highest number of dollar millionaires in South Africa, but SA have the highest number of black dollar millionaires in Africa and the second in the world. The same is true for better living standards, white people still have better living on average. But the average black SA fairs better than Africans elsewhere.

This is the data I could find: https://www.businesslive.co.za/archive/2015-03-26-sas-dollar-millionaires-in-black-and-white/
Do you have other data which could be accessible?

But for obvious reasons (numbers)...Black SA now have more middle class people than white and therefore the purchasing power. But if we went by percentage of each group then the white people's early advantages will show and we will sink lower.

True.

So we still have a long way to go , but we started out with a lot of baggage from a huge population of poor and under-skilled people to now here . That's why there's this love and hate relationship between the natives and the ANC. Even though they failed in somethings, but they definitely outdid themselves in others. Now we have a lot of skilled and educated people but no employment, hence so much money in the latest budget is being incubated into entrepreneurship programs to fund the qualifying graduates who have the potential to be employers. Hopefully it work as planned.

Agreed, but as I stated, pivot to China. In my opinion, the Chinese man is the best alternative to offer his market to citizens from developing. Selling to the Chinese, then Indonesians, Vietnamese and later Indians is the last resort to making Africans rich.

Lioness5280:
Well, both men ;Elon and Trump are both friends of the right-wing and white nationalists movements in America and have white fans and followers all around the world who identify with those movements and SA is not left out. Some right-wing groups in SA have been all over the net claiming there's white genocide in SA and some right-wingers in the West and specifically in the USA fell for the scam
(even though many have since been exposed to the shameless-ness of their cousins). My take was that Trump needed to play to the gallery: " I'll take care of all white people no matter where they're " . Sort of like how Malema has positioned himself as some sort of black protector. Trump's supporters must have wanted to hear that. And also it's suspicious how he said this during the Zuma administration when Zuma was really stabbing the West in the eye; from joining BRICS , and championing many policies that would have SA more friendlier with the East than the West. Not to mention that this was the same period that white people were crying all over the streets of SA during working hours for Zuma to go. So I don't know, but I think the answer is somewhere in there or inbetween🤷‍♀️

I think the JuJu is a nickname derived from the name Julius .

Thanks for the explanation. You did well in the analysis.

Gerrard59:
This is true. See the way the West is attacking China left, right and centre. Even in the Olympics, the white man is scared of the Chinese as they have refused to be allies vassals like Koreans and Japanese.

I really like how China isn't backing down for anything and you can see the panick in the West, they've never met a nation that wouldn't bow down and apologise after the West has kicked them in the butt.

I also like that China is venturing outside of the Western markets; they tend to use this against any nation in the long run. I hope that China does the opposite of the West in Africa; helps grow the middle class because this would be beneficial for them too; a much bigger market for their high-end products and technology. Most of the luxurious goods consumed by Africans come from the West , and what do we get in return......absolutely nothing but more exploitation . China should focus on displacing the leeches out of Africa completely 😅.

But the Africans shouldn't be caught sleeping this time (over-reliance).Whilst they help us industrialise we should insist on providing all the basics to our markets. Not China flooding our markets with plastic dishes and cups we could produce ourselves even with their "primitive " machinery.

But I don't trust the Chinese people also ....they're too robotic for my liking; they seem soul-less and programmed 😏. I'm afraid of what they'll do to us when we default on those infrastructural loans 😮😭😅. They don't look like the type that's ready to negotiate 😭

One can only dream😅.

Gerrard59:
I am baffled that is a question when China and Eastern European countries exist. Capitalism REMAINS the only economic system that has pulled more people out of poverty than any other economic system. It is the only economic system that aligns with human's basic concept of greed.

I am not a proponent for the complete annihilation or supplanting of capitalism by socialism or communism by any means. Capitalism remains the only system in play only because other systems were systematically and politically suppressed during and post the cold war era not because it withstood the test of time.

Capitalism as it practiced today and unchecked remains a very serious danger to the future economic world order because it systematically is trying to suppress collective progress. I would go further to conclude that capitalism in the West is actually "dead" and what we have now is an emerging form of neo feudalism (re-centralizing power into the hands of a few) trying to camouflage itself under the principles of capitalism.

China practices a far better government involved socialist/ market economic system bridging the gap between concern for the collectivism of the welfare state and the allowance of individual achievement monitored by the state. Something which would probably work better in the case of South Africa judging from its history of exploitation of the poor/working class and its communal social structure.

The EFF remains a vital counter check to the excesses of capitalism/neo feudalism being that as a far-left radical party it appeals mostly to the youth/poor class of the South African society because it offers the best chance of creating a collectivism approach required to pull itself out of the class they have been "relegated to"

If not can you elaborate how this class would be propelled out of their predicament because trust me supply side, trickledown economics is not working that side.

Gerrard59:
Where else has "redistribution" worked in a similar SA context?

I don't understand the question. If you mean can redistribution of wealth occur in a different fashion other than what capitalism offers. Yes. Where has it occurred in that context- China, Russia.

Gerrard59:
While I agree that present-day capitalism has its problems, no other economic system can substitute it.

I don't believe that is true. Capitalism has played its part as has lifted many particularly in the late19th century to 20th century, out of poverty. A new more balanced system needs to take shape if a larger group of people around the world are to be moved out of poverty. The richest 1% of the wealthiest people are holding too much sway on the resources and wealth of the world monetized in "capital". There is too much power centralized in the owners of the means of production.

Gerrard59:
Where will the money come from? From taxes of productive citizens in a capitalist environment. Pull the carpet off capitalism and watch how multidimensional poverty kicks in. Equal opportunities are what you should advocate, not equal outcomes. Socialism works best in countries with a max of 10 million people who are homogenous by ethnicity, race, culture, language and religion. Preferably, they have natural resources such as lithium, cobalt, gold or oil. Namibia and Botswana can implement such, not South Africa.

You ask where the money is coming from. You do know that a majority of government revenue emanates from large multinationals in SA as well as the wealthiest class in SA. The budget/taxes of South Africa is squandered; from multiple trips for MP's to sit in parliament in cape town to wasteful spending on diplomatic parties hosted by their embassies abroad ( believe me I have been to some of those events), to corrupt tenders and moneys syphoned into the pockets of cronies. The money is there but the "elite" class under the auspices of the "ruling" class are not distributing wealth appropriately. Multinationals in SA in cohoots with the political class are allowed to move taxable monies out of South Africa to havens in mauritius and the rest leaving the working class no sufficient safety nets to fall back on. I can on and on but let me stop with these few examples.

No my friend, there are aspects of socialist ideologies that are necessary in an environment like South Africa.

Don' t let anyone fool you the past heroes of South Africa were communist and socialist in idealogy because they knew it fit their society a lot better than a crony capitalist system. Mandela had to capitulate in this aspect and draw more to the center of the political spectrum. That was his biggest mistake.

Please do listen to the video below. It will give you a better perspective of my position in term of the practice of these economic systems.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CLPGrdRid7Y

Gerrard59:
I regard communists as unintelligent people any day, any time and anywhere. As for socialists, it might be feasible ONLY in small countries which are homogenous by ethnicity, race and religion. Anything else, capitalism is the answer.

Communists are actually very dangerous people in my opinion😏 😅. They're equalisers and equalisers hardly have any personal ambition...they're the quintessential "village people "😭😂. They love distributing things they never worked for 😭....they want this and they want that but don't want to be responsible for maintaining a damn thing. That is why most mainstream Pan-Africanists are drug dealers, scammers violent protestors, armed robbers, prostitutes etc 🙈😂😅😅😅

The current-mixture of socialism and capitalism in SA is correct con.sidering where we come from.

The SA government already provides the following for the citizens:

1. Free healthcare,this includes operations.
2. Free education from primary to high school level. And has an Nfsas grant-loan system that is offered to poor students in Universities and Tvet colleges. You only pay bay back I think the 40% loan part that is interest-free once you become gainfully employed
3. Free houses to those living in shacks
4. Monthly payments to unemployed parents per child
5. Monthly payments to people over the age of 60
6. Free breakfast and lunch in public schools in poor areas
7. Free public school transportation in rural schools (for the kids who used to walk long distances to school)
8. Anyone who is involved in a car accident in any of our public roads gets compensated handsomely ( if no drinking and driving was involved).
9. Now, unemployed people from 18 to 59 get monthly payments as well
10. Orphanage homes are well funded yearly.
11. Free water and sanitation in all poor communities

These are some of the benefits I could remember that the government offers already, so I don't get what more these Marxists want 🤦‍♀️. Maybe the government should pay people to wipe their arses for them now. Nonsense.

They say it's only the political class that gets rich in SA...very funny losers. Ofvourse there are corrupt elites and what not especially in the mineral sector, which country doesn't have that ?

But most young millionaires in SA are in the Agric, food processing, auto, fashion, education, healthcare etc. These people are mostly funded by municipalities, regional & provincial economic development department etc. And anyone can walk in and apply after gathering all the needed documentation, political elite don't even care about these "crumbs" , they have much bigger fish to fry. If there's corruption in these centres and institutions,then deal with those who run these places because Ramaphosa and his gang don't give a damn about that, they're busy stealing gold mines😅. It's between the affected community and their servants.

Malema despises the black middle class not because it was created to" pacify blacks " ...nope ...he hates this group because they have refused to have their collective intelligence insulted by a liar, blackmailer and a bully. And most importantly because he can't control them with half-truths and propaganda...they're faced with the system everyday and they get to experience everything themselves; both evil and good. Also the black middle class are an inspiration and the backbone of black families in SA. They're the ones who fund the education of their siblings. They're the ones who take out loans for family members to start their businesses etc. Guess what the Marxist wizards are doing during all this time ? .....plotting to go and protest against some white person or business (and possibly burn down the place )😅😂(Karl Marx spirit of chaos and destruction don finish those ones😅.) And they'll come back to undermine these people :"house niggas"😂 who don't want to control their wealth....how about they start controlling their urge to destroy first ?😅😅 and then continue to get control of their destinies instead of searching around for who to destroy next 🤦‍♀️.Mainstream Pan-Africanists(Marxists) should be declared level 1 terrorists globally😂.

I'd love to see a communist success on our African soil . They're always pushing this rubbish down our throats in their Pan-African gatherings but why not practice it where they come from? . Why not show us the way. Dey play😅

Lioness5280:
The current-mixture of socialism and capitalism in SA is correct con.sidering where we come from.

The SA government already provides the following for the citizens:

1. Free healthcare,this includes operations.2. Free education from primary to high school level. And has an Nfsas grant-loan system that is offered to poor students in Universities and Tvet colleges. You only pay bay back I think the 40% loan part that is interest-free once you become gainfully employed.3. Free houses to those living in shacks.4. Monthly payments to unemployed parents per child.5. Monthly payments to people over the age of 60.6. Free breakfast and lunch in public schools in poor areas.7. Free public school transportation in rural schools (for the kids who used to walk long distances to school).8. Anyone who is involved in a car accident in any of our public roads gets compensated handsomely ( if no drinking and driving was involved).9. Now, unemployed people from 18 to 59 get monthly payments as well
10. Orphanage homes are well funded yearly.11. Free water and sanitation in all poor communities

These are good social schemes to enable people help themselves. However, for these schemes to be sustainable in the future, SA must expand, advance and protect its productive side of the economy. This is because the productive economy funds these schemes. The key to balancing socialism is by ensuring the economy is very productive enough to outweigh the social schemes. Also, borders must be tightened to ensure non-citizens don't take advantage of the system. You cannot have a welfare state with open borders.

These are some of the benefits I could remember that the government offers already, so I don't get what more these Marxists want 🤦‍♀️. Maybe the government should pay people to wipe their arses for them now. Nonsense.

As I stated, they are unintelligent, and as you opined, they are dangerous. I am very wary of a black person regardless of nationality or location who supports communism. I try not to engage them in any conversation because I always consider communists to be unintelligent.

They say it's only the political class that gets rich in SA...very funny losers. Ofvourse there are corrupt elites and what not especially in the mineral sector, which country doesn't have that ?

Every country has corruption. The key is ensuring the corruption does not affect the important sectors and should not impede growth in the economy.

But most young millionaires in SA are in the Agric, food processing, auto, fashion, education, healthcare etc. These people are mostly funded by municipalities, regional & provincial economic development department etc. And anyone can walk in and apply after gathering all the needed documentation, political elite don't even care about these "crumbs" , they have much bigger fish to fry. If there's corruption in these centres and institutions,then deal with those who run these places because Ramaphosa and his gang don't give a damn about that, they're busy stealing gold mines😅. It's between the affected community and their servants.

Good to know. I am glad something good is happening in Africa. Well, other than Nigeria, South Africa is the next big economy and Kenya.

I'd love to see a communist success on our African soil . They're always pushing this rubbish down our throats in their Pan-African gatherings but why not practice it where they come from? . Why not show us the way? Dey play😅

Unfortunately, communists don't like to live in communist countries, but in capitalist societies. I never take them seriously. Again, very unintelligent set of people. Communism has failed everywhere because it goes against the human characteristic of greed.

Lioness5280:
I really like how China isn't backing down for anything and you can see the panick in the West, they've never met a nation that wouldn't bow down and apologise after the West has kicked them in the butt.
I also like that China is venturing outside of the Western markets; they tend to use this against any nation in the long run. I hope that China does the opposite of the West in Africa; helps grow the middle class because this would be beneficial for them too; a much bigger market for their high-end products and technology. Most of the luxurious goods consumed by Africans come from the West , and what do we get in return......absolutely nothing but more exploitation . China should focus on displacing the leeches out of Africa completely 😅.

Truth is: most of the Global South are fed with the West: the arrogance, bullying, invasion, servitude by mumbo-jumbo loans, interference in local issues etc. China offers hope of a peer nation that can stand as an economic buffer. For instance, Brazilian farmers care less about the EU's refusal to agree to a trade deal which has been deliberated upon for 20 years because it is the biggest supplier of soybeans to China. This means the country could call the EU's bluff and nothing will happen. Brazil overtook the US to the pole position.

Yes, the Chinese are venturing outside the country to mainly Southeast Asian neighbours - factories, open markets for goods, tourism etc. I think a few months ago China traded more with SEA than the US did. Africa is also getting Chinese investment, but not as SEA for largely incompetence by the African political elites such as not ensuring political stability, not negotiating hard enough and still in bed with the West, aka neither here nor there. However, Chinese investment still forms the bulk of FDI in the real sector. It is Chinese trains that ferry passengers in Lagos, run port services there too, open factories in the North Central, and build roads in the Eastern region. Apart from Julius Berger, I have yet to see a Western company which is at the forefront of Nigeria's infrastructural development and industrialisation.

As for the bold, that is what China is doing in SEA, and I believe shortly will do the same across Africa. What African countries should do now is to find what they can sell to the Chinese - extract and process it then sell. China is a massive market. As for the luxurious goods, I think you meant "White goods". If so, most of them come from China. Luxury goods is one industry the West will always own since it is an aspirational product. Even Chinese millionaires look towards buying German cars. However, in automobiles especially EVs, this will not hold again soon.

But the Africans shouldn't be caught sleeping this time (over-reliance).Whilst they help us industrialise we should insist on providing all the basics to our markets. Not China flooding our markets with plastic dishes and cups we could produce ourselves even with their "primitive " machinery.

You see, one of the reasons I appreciate the Chinese is because it has a listening ear. China listened to the complaints of African countries that the trade was not balanced. In response, it opened its agricultural markets to African countries and reduced tariffs by more than 90%. I am not joking. I read this on Baker and McKenzie's website about the trade between South Africa and China. It is the reason wineries in SA are investing in advertising in the Chinese market or Tanzania investing to sell avocados to China. The Chinese market is open and more trade hubs are established. One is in Hubei, I think the biggest in China.

As for selling plastic dishes and cups to Africans, those are bought by Africans to sell to their kith. Nowadays, the Chinese are opening factories in Nigeria to produce those products as they have become too expensive to manufacture in China and costly to sell due to currency fluctuations in most African countries.

For the US-China trade war and other global issues, more can be found here: https://www.nairaland.com/7801886/multipolarism-versus-hegemonism-great-power

But I don't trust the Chinese people also ....they're too robotic for my liking; they seem soul-less and programmed 😏. I'm afraid of what they'll do to us when we default on those infrastructural loans 😮😭😅. They don't look like the type that's ready to negotiate

Better to have the robotic person who is brutally honest with you ab initio than the lovey-dovey person who smiles at you but has evil intentions. As for loans, it is not true that African countries are so much indebted to China when compared to Western-controlled institutions. I recall SA was loaned $20BN to build so-called green energy systems. However, the truth is that such systems are not the immediate energy systems SA requires to industrialize at cheap rates. Although China installs more solar panels than elsewhere, new coal plants are still built every quarter. Cheap and readily abundant energy are important factors in industrialisation. For Nigeria, we owe China the most as a single country, but less than 10% of our total debt is to China. We owe the IMF and the World Bank more than China combined.
See here (Bloomberg): https://archive.md/PqOfN (free-to-read).

---

That aside, what is the true nature of the crime rate across South African cities? Are they high as peddled by Western media? If so, why are they so high and what is the government doing about it?

What do you think of Namibia as a country? And its discovery of crude oil deposits?

Thank you.

@Sepukku,
I will reply you later. I need to create time to watch the video you posted.

Gerrard59:
What is this deal you talk about? No successor to King Zwelithini of Zululand?

I really don't know what the deal was; but the passion in his voice and he sounded threatening 😏..like "Ramaphosa had better stick to the plan else...".
He said it in that tone, not the exact words used ofcourse but it was implied.

As I mentioned before the Zulu kingdom is the custodian of the Ingonyama trust( the biggest privately owned land in SA). Zwelithini was a vocal anti- globalist king and didn't buy into the scam of the mainstream Pan-Africanism. He became an enemy of those who are puppets and adherents of the above movements and he became more dangerous when he started engaging white nationalists groups like Afriforum "an Afrikaner lobby group ". Having the two most militant and organised groups in SA (who have a lot of land to protect ) talking in secret got a lot of people nervous within and outside SA. And Zwelithini had the utmost loyalty of the Zulu people across all classes; from the wealthy to the poorest. From the most educated to the most illiterate ones.

Now the kingdom is in disarray; in-fighting and all. His successor is a son who spent all lot of his years in England 🤔. The one who was to succeed Zwelithini was killed in his own home by "robbers" 😮. Basically the most formidable kingdom in South Africa is gone. And Malema is now targeting their biggest ally across the border; Swazi kingdom....he wants to give them "democracy "😉😅. And you can see the campaign is well sponsored;he busses in thousands of protesters from the SA side of the border to cause problems in Swaziland. And buses-in thousands within Swaziland to protest in the Capital and ofcourse vandalize infrastructure. I'm no fan of King Mswati but this seems too convenient .

And ofcourse oil was discovered in KwaZulu Natal 😉😅. And one village they woke up with glassy stones littered all over their yards and roads....it turns out it wasnt diamonds but the stones were bought with some good cash from the villagers by "rare stone collectors ". The Batswana and Namibians always say before the mining of diamonds the in their territories , the very same stones would appear overnight. Zwelithini refused the removal of these villagers by the state, but his dear son has okayed it " for the safety of his people " I guess incase the stones come out again, and this time bury his people in 😅😅. But I trust Zulus, people wey get strong head pass?😅 , they won't move front that village not without heavy compensation or full-blown war with the army😅😅😅.

Gerrard59:
@Sepukku,
I will reply you later. I need to create time to watch the video you posted.

Take your time. I am in no hurry.

Gerrard59:
Truth is: most of the Global South are fed with the West: the arrogance, bullying, invasion, servitude by mumbo-jumbo loans, interference in local issues etc. China offers hope of a peer nation that can stand as an economic buffer. For instance, Brazilian farmers care less about the EU's refusal to agree to a trade deal which has been deliberated upon for 20 years because it is the biggest supplier of soybeans to China. This means the country could call the EU's bluff and nothing will happen. Brazil overtook the US to the pole position.

Yes, the Chinese are venturing outside the country to mainly Southeast Asian neighbours - factories, open markets for goods, tourism etc. I think a few months ago China traded more with SEA than the US did. Africa is also getting Chinese investment, but not as SEA for largely incompetence by the African political elites such as not ensuring political stability, not negotiating hard enough and still in bed with the West, aka neither here nor there. However, Chinese investment still forms the bulk of FDI in the real sector. It is Chinese trains that ferry passengers in Lagos, run port services there too, open factories in the North Central, and build roads in the Eastern region. Apart from Julius Berger, I have yet to see a Western company which is at the forefront of Nigeria's infrastructural development and industrialisation.

As for the bold, that is what China is doing in SEA, and I believe shortly will do the same across Africa. What African countries should do now is to find what they can sell to the Chinese - extract and process it then sell. China is a massive market. As for the luxurious goods, I think you meant "White goods". If so, most of them come from China. Luxury goods is one industry the West will always own since it is an aspirational product. Even Chinese millionaires look towards buying German cars. However, in automobiles especially EVs, this will not hold again soon.


You see, one of the reasons I appreciate the Chinese is because it has a listening ear. China listened to the complaints of African countries that the trade was not balanced. In response, it opened its agricultural markets to African countries and reduced tariffs by more than 90%. I am not joking. I read this on Baker and McKenzie's website about the trade between South Africa and China. It is the reason wineries in SA are investing in advertising in the Chinese market or Tanzania investing to sell avocados to China. The Chinese market is open and more trade hubs are established. One is in Hubei, I think the biggest in China.

As for selling plastic dishes and cups to Africans, those are bought by Africans to sell to their kith. Nowadays, the Chinese are opening factories in Nigeria to produce those products as they have become too expensive to manufacture in China and costly to sell due to currency fluctuations in most African countries.

For the US-China trade war and other global issues, more can be found here: https://www.nairaland.com/7801886/multipolarism-versus-hegemonism-great-power


Better to have the robotic person who is brutally honest with you ab initio than the lovey-dovey person who smiles at you but has evil intentions. As for loans, it is not true that African countries are so much indebted to China when compared to Western-controlled institutions. I recall SA was loaned $20BN to build so-called green energy systems. However, the truth is that such systems are not the immediate energy systems SA requires to industrialize at cheap rates. Although China installs more solar panels than elsewhere, new coal plants are still built every quarter. Cheap and readily abundant energy are important factors in industrialisation. For Nigeria, we owe China the most as a single country, but less than 10% of our total debt is to China. We owe the IMF and the World Bank more than China combined.
See here (Bloomberg): https://archive.md/PqOfN (free-to-read).

---

That aside, what is the true nature of the crime rate across South African cities? Are they high as peddled by Western media? If so, why are they so high and what is the government doing about it?

What do you think of Namibia as a country? And its discovery of crude oil deposits?

Thank you.

I want to make time to come and address some issues you raised :
*Crime in SA
*The Chinese market for SA products
*Why the "Westerners"are collapsing their own Wedt
*You in Japan
*Chinese relations with both Africa and the West

I found the above really interesting and I'll certainly reply you during the week when I have enough time .

Gerrard59:
These are good social schemes to enable people help themselves. However, for these schemes to be sustainable in the future, SA must expand, advance and protect its productive side of the economy. This is because the productive economy funds these schemes. The key to balancing socialism is by ensuring the economy is very productive enough to outweigh the social schemes. Also, borders must be tightened to ensure non-citizens don't take advantage of the system. You cannot have a welfare state with open borders.


As I stated, they are unintelligent, and as you opined, they are dangerous. I am very wary of a black person regardless of nationality or location who supports communism. I try not to engage them in any conversation because I always consider communists to be unintelligent.


Every country has corruption. The key is ensuring the corruption does not affect the important sectors and should not impede growth in the economy.


Good to know. I am glad something good is happening in Africa. Well, other than Nigeria, South Africa is the next big economy and Kenya.


Unfortunately, communists don't like to live in communist countries, but in capitalist societies. I never take them seriously. Again, very unintelligent set of people. Communism has failed everywhere because it goes against the human characteristic of greed.

I totally agree with everything you said here.


The bolded got me laughing hard. They're like Muslims, when they migrate they hardly move to Muslim countries where Sharia law is practiced....they want go move to the most Western nations . Samething with these black frauds called Pan-Africanists ....they'll never move to full black countries to promote their black unity and pride but will move to mixed-race countries to bytch and whine about everything under the sun . Jokers.