₦airaland Forum

YourMain:
Lol Dont be shy

Ifeann:
Pastorkun yourmain has her muslim moments but a lot of the time she is a decent human to chat with.

PastorKun:
Let me put it this way, they follow the quoran and the teachings of mohammed far more passionately than you do.

YourMain:
Lol decent human? Muslims aren't decent humans no?

YourMain:
Lol okay oo. Well I'm not any kid of extremist. Religion is all about my relationship with God.

PastorKun:
But this people you call extremists are just following the direct teachings of your prophet as expected of true muslims na.

Ifeann:
I have mentioned this on nairaland several times... I have nothing agaisnt muslims...I have muslim relatives..one recently renounced islam.. one of my best friends is a muslim who is pro executing homosexuals(I am agaisnt this but on the whole this person is educated and nice).. however these muslims are moderates who I can have lunch or whatever with but once islam is criticized ...Ka boom ..the spirit of islam kicks in with chants of Allah u snackbar..

Look at my chats with emp.iree 9jafo.rlife etc

YourMain:
Well that's Good for them. I didn't call anyone an extremist. I think we have to input these teachings in the modern world. Where it is not okay to just go killing people.

PastorKun:
I glad you realise it's not ok yet your quoran which mohammed claims is the word of God and is relevant for all time teaches otherwise, does that not call to question the credibility of the quoran and the religion it promotes?

YourMain:
I think they only speak to you like that cause you're really rude. Your intention is to degrade another religion rather than learn something. And your process, the way you speak, its really rude and uncalled for.

Ifeann:
I never use insults on Muslims but I do dicuss Mohammed bluntly as reported from the quran and hadiths. U may consider the words rude but take that up with ur quran and hadiths

For example I usually say that Mohammed was pagan sex addicted slave trader mass murderer illiterate Arab paedophile.

Was he a pagan. Yes, most likely.
For example;
1. Mohammed's Pagan father was called Abdullah, which means slave of Allah long before Mohammed started Islam.
2. The crescent moon and star is seen high above almost every mosque not to mention the moon god was allegedly one of the 360 gods of the kabba.
3. The muslim obsession with black clothes.
4. The Islamic black flag.
5. The kissing of the black stone done by Muslims which was started by Mohammed for no apparent reason.
6. The circling of the kabba.
7. Compulsory pilgrimage for Muslims which was done by pagans in mecca before Islam.
8. Bowing down and facing mecca when praying. Etc
9. Cultural Superstitions and unfounded hate for wall geckos, dogs(mans best friend), cats etc
All these are some of the red flags that indicate that there maybe more to Islam than meets the eye. These pagan practises are not seen in Judaism and Christianity which Mohammed claims are people of the book and says he is one of their "prophets". Could Islam be the worlds largest monotheistic pagan religion.


2.sex addict, yes certainly.
The quran and hadiths are filled with his relationships with his 11 - 13 wives, including sex with his sex slaves. It is everywhere in ur quran and hadiths.
3. slave trader.
Do I need to remind u of all the hadiths of him trading slaves including his exchange of 2 black slaves for one Arab slave ..etc
Here are some reminders for you from ur sources;
Bukhari (34:432)- Another account of females taken captive and raped with Muhammad's approval. In this case it is evident that the Muslims intend on selling the women after raping them because they are concerned about devaluing their price by impregnating them. Muhammad is asked also asked about Reproduction interruptus.
Bukhari (47.765)- A woman is rebuked by Muhammad for freeing a slave girl. The prophet tells her that she would have gotten a greater heavenly reward by giving her to a relative (as a slave).
Bukhari (34:351)- Muhammad sells a slave for money. He was thus a slave trader.
4. mass murderer:
ï won't go into details in this because u know the truth from ur hadiths.
Let me remind u of some quran verses.
Quran 8:39. "And fight with them until there is no more persecution and religion should be only for Allah; but if they desist, then surely Allah sees what they do."
Qur'an (9:29)-"Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued."
Sura 9:5. "When the sacred months are over slay the idolaters wherever you find them. Arrest them, besiege them, and lie in ambush everywhere for them."
5. illiterate:
Muslims are the ones who tell me he was illiterate and he managed to recite the quran, this is in an effort to prove he was a prophet.
6. Arab:
Mohammed was an Arab or was he African.
7. Paedophile: yes he was, he married to Aisha and consummated the the marriage when she was nine years. Several Muslims say it was allowed in the Arab culture back then but I ask is it moral or right. ??
Look I don't even think Mohammed was an illiterate, I also think he was an intelligent man. I get offended when people call him names like silly or silly or any thing disparaging his intellect or not backed up by facts.
I also think Mohammed was brave and fearless. But these attributes do NOT make him a true prophet. Hilter, Stalin etc also had these attributes.

YourMain:
Look at your signature. I'm not in the mood for a lecture about your opinion. I really couldn't care less what you think about Muhammad. And I thought we were going to have a nice conversation.

Ifeann:
Its not about my signature or what I think of Mohammed. . I get my information about Mohammed from ur quran and hadiths..notice I always use verses to back up my assertions... that is by the way..
Now run along if saying the truth about your prophet offends u.

OREMUSSANCTUS:
Ifeann, u just nid to know dat YourMain is not all dose tartar9 kind of islam. Shez dose kinds dat just say islam cos she was born dere. She no too carry am for head like d guyz, dip down inside her she knows dat her religion kinda harsh, shez just like d gationo kind of islam dat don't believe in hadith dey re d reformed muslimz.

YourMain:
Lol okay oo. Well I'm not any kid of extremist. Religion is all about my relationship with God.

malvisguy212:
religion does not defined a relationship with God.Someone may be thinking “I thought God invented religion!” Sorry, but God
invented Man and Man invented
religion. From the time we are born we learn that the family relationship provides security
and safety and unconditional love. (That
is why we christians call God the “FATHER”). This is why Jesus is called the “BRIDGROOM” and the “Church” (don’t get ahead of me, just keep reading!), which is the entire congregation or number of believers, is called the “BRIDE of CHRIST”.

God created Man for the express
purpose of mutual relationship with him, but gave Man the power of choice and free will. Man chose to break that
relationship and has been trying to find
his own way by inventing religions and
cults of all kinds in an effort to replace
that void left by lack of relationship with
his Creator.

Jesus said “Come unto me… and I will
give you rest.” (Matt. 11:28) Religion can’t save you; only relationship and that comes through humility and repentance.

Christ says in John 10:9 “I am the door:
by me if any man enter in he shall be
saved…” Guilt is the natural state of
Mankind. We are all guilty before God.
This leads to fear of all kinds. Fear of
being found out. Fear of failure. Fear of
change. Fear of the opinion of others. But doing something good (works) will
notchange the fact you are guilty. The
only cure is a relationship with God
through Jesus Christ who took upon
Himself my guilt and fear.

I tell you the truth,God hate religion.thank you and remain blessed.

YourMain:
I Dont agree. God sets basic guidelines through all his Prophets. He asks us to love and obey and not to kill and not to lie. I think everything afterwards is about us and God.

Why do you think God didn't invent religion?

malvisguy212:
why will God created me and ask me to belong to a religion cult before I will be saved? Think my sister, this doesent make sense,

But relationship with God cannot be
found through religion. In fact, religion is the biggest roadblock to seeking a
relationship with God.

Religion is simply Man trying to reach out to God by doing something that he thinks will please God.
“If I can do enough, say enough, pray
enough, give enough, sacrifice enough
perhaps God will show me favor”. Every
religion is based upon this “works
theology”. Neither ceremony, liturgy,
creeds, sacraments nor money have ever brought one soul into a reconciled
relationship to God,do you think you can bribe God with your good deed? Bible say obedient is better than sacrifice, religion performed sacrifice but someone who has a relationship with God obey his father. I wish I can say more but I fear you may not read all my coment.

YourMain:
No Dont worry I'm listening.

I think within every reglion lies guidelines to this life in a way. If there wasn't any religon then I can just kill someone in the hope that it will please God.

Religion, in a way, is God's rules to enter salvation. They mightn't make sense at times I think but some rules just don't

YourMain:
I think they only speak to you like that cause you're really rude. Your intention is to degrade another religion rather than learn something. And your process, the way you speak, its really rude and uncalled for.

sod09:
Too long
What's ur point?

justlove91:
Though am also an ex Muslim (doesn't mean am a Christian or atheist now), [size=1pt] came across this testimony a couple of years ago and just like to share it with you today, you wouldn't regret the read.
From Belief to Enlightenment:
The treacherous and arduous path

by Ali Sina
I was born into a moderately religious
family. On my mother’s side I have a few
relatives who are Ayatollahs. Although my
grandfather (whom I never met) was
somewhat a skeptic, we were believers.
My parents were not fond of the mullahs.
In fact, we did not have much to do with
our more fundamentalist relatives. We
liked to think of ourselves as believing in
“true Islam,” not the one taught and
practiced by the mullahs.
I recall discussing religion with the
husband of one of my aunts when I was
about 15 years old. He was a fanatical
Muslim who was very concerned about
the fiqh (Islamic jurisprudence). It
prescribes the way Muslims should pray,
fast, run their public and private lives, do
business, clean themselves, use the
toilet, and even copulate. I argued this
has nothing to do with true Islam, that it
is a fabrication of the Mullahs, that
excessive attention to fiqh diminishes the
impact and importance of the pure
message of Islam, to unite man with his
creator. This view is mostly inspired by
Sufism. Many Iranians, thanks to Rumi's
poems, are to a great degree Sufis in
their outlook.
In my early youth I noticed
discriminations and cruelties against the
members of religious minorities in Iran.
This was more noticeable in provincial
towns where the level of education was
low and the mullahs had a better grip
over gullible people. Due to my father’s
work we spent a few years in small towns
out of the capital. I recall one of my
teachers who planned to take the class
swimming. We were excited and looked
forward to it. In the class there were a
couple of kids who were Baha'i and
Jewish. The teacher did not let them
accompany us. He said they are not
allowed to swim in the same pool that
Muslims swim in. I cannot forget the kids’
disappointment as they left school with
tears in their eyes, subdued and
heartbroken. At that age, maybe nine or
ten, I could not make sense of and was
saddened by this injustice. I thought it
was the kid’s fault for not being Muslims.
I believe I was lucky for having open-
minded parents who encouraged me to
think critically. They tried to instill in me
the love of God and his messenger, yet
upheld humanistic values like equality of
rights between man and woman, and love
for all humankind. In a sense, this is how
most modern Iranian families were. In
fact, the majority of Muslims who have
some education believe Islam is a
humanistic religion that respects human
rights, that elevates the status of women
and protects their rights. Most Muslims
believe that Islam means peace. Needless
to say, few of them have read the Quran.
I spent my early youth in this sweet
dream, advocating “true Islam” as I
thought it should be, and criticizing the
mullahs and their deviations from the
real teachings of Islam. I idealized an
Islam that conformed to my own
humanistic values. Of course my
imaginary Islam was a beautiful religion.
It was a religion of equality and peace. It
was a religion that encouraged its
followers to go after knowledge and be
inquisitive. It was a religion that was in
harmony with science and reason. In fact,
I thought that science got its inspiration
from this religion. The Islam I believed
was a religion that sparkled with modern
science, which eventually bore its fruit in
the West and made modern discoveries
and inventions possible. Islam, I believed,
was the real cause of modern civilization.
The reason Muslims were living in such a
miserable state of ignorance, I thought,
was all the fault of the self-centered
mullahs and religious leaders who for
their own personal gain had
misinterpreted the real teachings of
Islam.
Muslims honestly believe that the great
Western civilization has its roots in Islam.
They recall great Middle Eastern scientific
minds whose contributions to science
have been crucial in the birth of modern
science.
Omar Khayyam was a great
mathematician who calculated the length
of the year with a precision of .74% of a
second. Zakaria Razi can very well be
regarded as one of the first founders of
empirical science who based his
knowledge on research and
experimentation. Avicenna's (Bu Ali Sina)
monumental encyclopedia of medicine
was taught in European universities for
centuries. There are so many more great
luminaries who have “Islamic names” who
were the pioneers of modern science
when Europe was languishing in the
medieval Dark Ages. Like all Muslims, I
believed all these great men were
Muslims, that they were inspired by the
wealth of hidden knowledge in the Quran;
and that if today's Muslims could regain
the original purity of Islam, the long lost
glorious days of Islam would return and
Muslims would lead the advancement of
World civilization once again.
Iran was a Muslim country but it was also
a corrupt country. The chance of getting
into a university was slim. Only one in ten
applicants could get into the university.
Often they were forced to choose
subjects that they did not want to study
because they could not get enough points
for the subjects of their choice. Students
with the right connections often got the
seats.
The standard of education in Iran was not
ideal. Universities were under-funded, as
the Shah preferred building a powerful
military might to become the gendarme
of the Middle East rather than build the
infrastructure of the country and invest in
people’s education. These were reasons
why my father thought I would be better
off to leave Iran to continue my education
elsewhere.
We considered America and Europe, but
my father, acting upon the counsel of a
few of his religious friends, thought
another Islamic country would be better
for a 16 year old boy. We were told that
the West’s morality is too lax, people are
perverted, the beaches are full of nudes,
and they drink and have licentious
lifestyles, all of which are dangers to a
young man. So I was sent to Pakistan
instead, where people were religious and
thus it was safe and moral. A friend of
the family told us that Pakistan is just like
England, except that it is cheaper.
This, of course, proved to be untrue. I
found Pakistanis to be as immoral and
corrupt as Iranians. Yes they were very
religious. They did not eat pork and I saw
no one consuming alcohol in public, but I
noticed they had dirty minds, lied, were
hypocrites, were cruel to women, and
above all, were filled with hatred of the
Indians. I did not find them better than
Iranians in any way. They were religious
but not moral or ethical.
In college, instead of taking Urdu I took
Pakistani Culture to complete my A level
FSc (Fellow of Science). I learned the
reason for Pakistan's partition from India
and for the first time heard about
Muhammad Ali Jinah, the man Pakistanis
called Qaid-e A’zam, the great leader. He
was presented as an intelligent man, the
Father of the Nation, while Gandhi was
spoken of in a derogatory way. Even then,
I could not but side with Gandhi and
condemn Jinah as an arrogant, ambitious
man who was the culprit for breaking up
a country and causing millions of deaths.
You could say I always had a mind of my
own and was a maverick in my thinking.
No matter what I was taught, I always
came to my own conclusion and did not
believe what I was told.
I did not see differences of religion as
valid reasons for breaking up a country.
The very word Pakistan was an insult to
the Indians. They called themselves pak
(clean) to distinguish themselves from
the Indians who were najis (unclean).
Ironically I never saw a people dirtier
than the Pakistanis both physically and
mentally. It was disappointing to see
another Islamic nation in such intellectual
and moral bankruptcy. In discussions with
my friends I failed to convince anyone of
“true Islam.” I condemned their bigotry
and fanaticism while they disapproved of
me for my un-Islamic views.
I related all this to my father and decided
to go to Italy for my university studies. In
Italy people drink wine and eat pork, but
they were more hospitable, friendlier, and
less hypocritical than Muslims. I noticed
people were willing to help without
expecting something in return. I met a
very hospitable elderly couple, who
invited me to have lunch with them on
Sundays, so I would not have to stay
home alone. They did not want anything
from me. They just wanted someone to
love. I was almost a grandson to them.
Only strangers in a new country, who do
not know anyone and cannot speak the
language, can truly appreciate the value
of the help and hospitality of the locals.
Their house was sparkling clean, with
shiny marble floors. This contradicted my
idea of Westerners. Although my family
was very open towards other people,
Islam taught me that non-Muslims are
najis (Q. 9:28 ) and one should not
befriend them. I still have a copy of the
Farsi translation of the Quran I used to
often read from. One of the underlined
verses is:
“O you who believe! Take not the Jews
and the Christians as awliya’ (friends,
protectors, helpers, etc.), they are but
awliya’ to one another… Q.5: 51
I had difficulty understanding the wisdom
of such a verse. I wondered why I should
not befriend this wonderful elderly couple
who had no ulterior motives in showing
me their hospitality than just making me
feel at home. I thought they were “true
Muslims” and I tried to raise the subject
of religion hoping they would see the
truth of Islam and embrace it. But they
were not interested and politely changed
the subject. I was not stupid enough at
anytime in my life to believe that all non-
believers would go to hell. I read this in
the Quran before but never wanted to
think about it. I simply brushed it off or
ignored it. Of course, I knew that God
would be pleased if someone recognized
his messenger but never thought he
would actually be cruel enough to burn
someone in hell for eternity, even if that
person only does good deeds, just
because he was not a Muslim. I read the
following warning:
If anyone desires a religion other than
Islam (submission to Allah), never will
it be accepted of him; and in the
Hereafter He will be in the ranks of
those who have lost (All spiritual
good). Q 3:85 ,
Yet I paid little heed and tried to
convince myself the meaning is
something other than what it appears to
be. At that moment this was not a
subject that I was ready to handle. So I
did not think about it.
I hung around with my Muslim friends
and noticed that most of them lived a
very immoral life of double standards.
Most of them found girlfriends and slept
with them. That was very un-Islamic, or
so I thought at that time. What bothered
me most was the fact that they did not
value these girls as real human beings
who deserved respect. These girls were
not Muslim girls and therefore were used
just for sex. This attitude was not
general. Those who made less show of
religiosity were more respectful and
sincere towards their western girlfriends
and some even loved them and wanted to
marry them. Paradoxically. those who
were more religious were less faithful
towards their girlfriends. I always thought
that true Islam is what is right. If
something is immoral, unethical,
dishonest or cruel, it cannot be Islam. I
could not see how the behavior of these
immoral and callous Muslims could be the
result of what was taught in Islam.
Years later I realized that the truth is
exactly the opposite. I found many verses
that were disturbing and made me revise
my whole opinion of Islam.
As I saw it, the tragedy was that the very
same people who lived unethically and
immorally were the ones who called
themselves Muslims, said their prayers,
fasted and were the first to defend Islam
angrily if anyone raised a question about
it. They where the ones who would lose
their temper and start a fight if someone
dared to say a word against Islam.
Once I befriended a young Iranian man at
the university restaurant, later
introducing him to two other Muslim
friends of mine. We were all about the
same age. He was an erudite, virtuous,
wise, young man. My other two friends
and I were captivated by his charm and
high moral values We used to wait for
him and sit next to him during lunch
hour, as we always learned something
from him. We used to eat a lot of
spaghetti and risotto and craved a good
Persian ghorme sabzi and chelow . Our
friend said his mother sent him some
dried vegetables and invited us to his
house the next Sunday for lunch. We
found his two-room apartment very
clean, unlike the houses of other guys. He
made us a delicious ghorme sabzi which
we ate with great gusto and then sat back
chatting and sipping our tea. It was then
we noticed his Baha’i books. When we
asked about them, he said he was a
Baha’i.
That did not bother me at all, but on the
way home my two friends said they did
not wish to continue their friendship with
him. I was surprised and asked why. They
said that being a Baha’i makes him najis
and had they known he was a Baha’i, they
would not have befriended him. I was
puzzled and enquired why they thought
he was najis if we all were complementing
him on his cleanliness. We all agreed he
was a morally superior man than all of the
Muslim young men we knew, so why this
sudden change of attitude? Their
response was very disturbing. They said
the name itself had something in it that
made them dislike this religion. They
asked me if I knew why everyone disliked
the Baha’is. I told them I didn’t know,
and that I liked everyone. But since they
disliked the Baha’is, perhaps they should
explain their reasons. They did not know
why! This man was the first Baha’i they
knew this well, and he was an exemplary
man. I wanted to know the reason for
their dislike. There was no particular
reason, they said. It’s just they know that
Baha’is are bad.
I am happy I did not continue my
friendship with these two bigots. From
them I learned how prejudice is formed
and operates.
Later I realized the prejudices and hatred
that Muslims harbor against almost all
non-Muslims is not the result of any
misinterpretation of the teachings of the
Quran, but is because this book teaches
hate and encourages prejudice. Those
Muslims who go to the mosques and
listen to the sermons of the mullahs are
affected. There are many verses in the
Quran that call believers to hate non-
believers, fight them, call them najis,
subdue and humiliate them, chop off
their heads and limbs, crucify them, and
kill them wherever they find them. [/size]

9jaforlife:
Hmm... That was a long read. I find the writer questionable anyway. Why would anyone live for decades among people of shared faith (Muslims in this case, including his own family) and claim that everyone (or most) of them are bad natured? Isn't it funny how he claimed that the first time he ever experienced hospitality was in Australia or so, when an old couple offered him food for free, in a clean environment. Meaning that nobody was ever that nice to him for decades in his home country? And he didn't see clean environments back home? A family that is comfortable enough to send him for schooling abroad? I would even doubt the integrity of anyone who claims that people of different faith are bad. In every religion and even among atheists, you find good and bad people. I don't know why some individuals think that they MUST bash those who hold contrary opinions just to make theirs look good. He claims that he's a smart thinker but he quotes the Quran in a less than smart way. The issue of people twisting Quran verses intentionally to denigrate Islam (or ignorantly misinterpreting them) is now boring but not outdated. Ifeann, aka parisbookaddict and some others do it so well on NL. I posted about 3 comments to point out to ignorant readers who might fall for it here

https://www.nairaland.com/9jaforlife/posts

Anyway, you said you're an ex-Muslim and implied that you're neither a Christian nor an atheist. That makes you a theist, a believer that God exists. Is it possible to be a theist, and yet, not belong to any religion? Just curious, no offence intended. Religion is so diversified these days that it's almost confusing

Ifeann:
9jaforlife tartar9 rilwanye001 tola9ja empiree abuamam yourmain mathematical mrolai, ypeace, ayinba7 permit me to mention you to read these articles posted in this thread. Empiree 9jaforlife mrolai rilwanye001 u may want to note what this ex muslim says about why u Muslims are quick to get angry and insult.
Peace.

Ifeann:
I have mentioned this on nairaland several times... I have nothing agaisnt muslims...I have muslim relatives..one recently renounced islam.. one of my best friends is a muslim who is pro executing homosexuals(I am agaisnt this but on the whole this person is educated and nice).. however these muslims are moderates who I can have lunch or whatever with but once islam is criticized ...Ka boom ..the spirit of islam kicks in with chants of Allah u snackbar..

Look at my chats with emp.iree 9jafo.rlife etc

justlove91:
Read the synthesized version I posted but you will love the full version.

malvisguy212:
as a religious lady, have you ever had a personal relationship with God? Has God revealed himself to you? The reason so many people have not encounter God is because they show more emphasis on religion then to give God there heart.” In
fact that is exactly what He expresses
here in Isaiah 29:13, “ Forasmuch as this people draw near me with their mouth, and with their lips do honor me, but have removed their HEART far from
me …”(Jesus quoted this passage in Matt. 15:8-9 adding “…in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the
commandments of men .”)
The word" commandment of men" mean religion men invented

Religion is man reachout for God but Christianity is the other way round, Abraham was a sherperd when God reachout for him, Moses was in the wilderness when God called him infacte when Samuel came to anoint David, David father even forgot he has a son named David cause David was in the wilderness when God reachout for him, and when Jesus come he say "they kingdom come" he bring the kingdom to us, all you have to do is accepts him.

When the disciples ask Jesus to teach them how to pray, Jesus say when you want to pray say "OUR FATHER".... when you say" our father" it mean God is your father and you are his daughter, I am your brother and we are family, God is our father. That is how God will reveal himself to you(his daughter)

Empiree:
That's it. You nailed it. She doesn't think. See, she thinks we are stupid. Yourmain, i am telling you, it's evangelism tactics. I know those fellas. They would tell you "we love muslims". "We dont have anything against muslims" etc. While at the same time smear Islam....exactly what she's been doing. Islam is not passive religion. We respond to how people present themselves. You can see sample below. She's a liar!

9jaforlife:
Lol. You NEVER miss the chance to tell us about your imaginary friends who converted from Islam to Christianity. As if christians aren't converting to Islam too. And, why would you call someone your friend and then go ahead to criticize their religion? That's in bad taste! That's why I call you a bigot. And you think they don't have a right to be angry? I'm just trying to imagine what you'd have told them... "Your Prophet is a paedophile", "You're worshipping idol" etc. You say such s*tupid things and expect them to smile?

You people don't know how it feels because Muslims are not in the business of insulting other people's faiths.