The serpent deceived Eve and Eve deceived Adam. From the reply that Eve gave to the serpent its obvious that she was aware of God's commandment to them.

tpiadotcom:


the curse began in Genesis 3:14.

but when were the livestock and beasts cursed?

You are correct, I meant to say verse 14 instead of 15, and that was when the curse on all creatures began.

I'll discuss it on the bible study thread.

basically, there is no indication when exactly animals started being cursed, unless we assume they were cursed when adam and eve ate the fruit.

There was no law and no moral and so no sin actually. It was all divinely planned that Eve would be known by evil and very much later Mary would be visited by Good. Man is a partner of God to make the plan to produce evil and good, death and life, darkness and light and man and God work.

you just had to add eve to evil didn't you.

tpiadotcom:


I'll discuss it on the bible study thread.

basically, there is no indication when exactly animals started being cursed, unless we assume they were cursed when adam and eve ate the fruit.

The curse starting from verse 14 to 19 applies to man, woman, animals and to the physical elements, infact the whole of God's creation. This is where the Law of Thermodynamics comes into play. I'll discuss this on a scientific thread.

Let me know when you open it.

My point is God told the serpent it was cursed above all livestock and beasts. However, there was no previous reference to exactly when the other animals got cursed.

tpiadotcom:


Let me know when you open it.

My point is God told the serpent it was cursed above all livestock and beasts. However, there was no previous reference to exactly when the other animals got cursed.

Death and entropy entered the cosmos after Adam sinned. Read Romans 8:19-21.

OLAADEGBU:
Eve was deceived. Adam was not. The argument from the egalitarians is that Eve was deceived, and Adam was not. Therefore, sin entered the world through him because her sin was not as bad as Adams. Discuss.

in God's eyes.. they both sinned.. you know the whole story so why the argument? to what purpose? Positive? and this you can argue when you remove other detail of other books not entered into the Bible in Nicene during the council of trent..

OLAADEGBU:


Death and entropy entered the cosmos after Adam sinned. Read Romans 8:19-21.

when God created the world, he blessed everything but he did not bless the animals.


that was my point.

therefore, its possible the curse on animals may have preceded the events of the garden, just theorizing here.

voltron:


in God's eyes.. they both sinned.. you know the whole story so why the argument? to what purpose? Positive? and this you can argue when you remove other detail of other books not entered into the Bible in Nicene during the council of trent..

According to your apocryphal books through whom did sin come into this world, either or both?

itstpia8:


when God created the world, he blessed everything but he did not bless the animals.


that was my point.

therefore, its possible the curse on animals may have preceded the events of the garden, just theorizing here.

Everything God created and made were perfect, there was no curse before sin set in.

"And God saw every thing that He had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day" (Genesis 1:31).

tpiadotcom:


no, that's not necessarily the reason.


Adam was actually weakened by the creation of Eve, since something went out of him which wasnt replaced.

Hum...Sounds interesting. @bolded

kuss:
the commandment not eat the fruit was given to adam not eve in other word adam knew the law while even did not know

Gen 3:2 The woman answered, "God said we could eat fruit from any tree in the garden...

honourhim:
The serpent deceived Eve and Eve deceived Adam. From the reply that Eve gave to the serpent its obvious that she was aware of God's commandment to them.

The topic makes it clear that Adam was not deceived. That is the bases of this discussion.
See 1Tim 2:14 ... And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.

OLAADEGBU:


Eve was deceived. Adam was not. The argument from the egalitarians is that Eve was deceived, and Adam was not. Therefore, sin entered the world through him because her sin was not as bad as Adams. Discuss.

Suggested answer:

Eve was deceived. Adam was not.
by Matt Slick

This has already been addressed in the paper, Genesis 3, The Fall, and Adam and Eve's sin. But let's take a more narrow look at the issue here. The argument from the egalitarians is that Eve was deceived, and Adam was not. Therefore, sin entered the world through him because her sin was not as bad as Adams.

First of all, even if it were true that her sin was not as bad as Adams, by what logic is it necessary that sin must enter the world through Adam and not Eve? At best, it's a theory--an opinion. Is there any place in Scripture that verifies this assertion? I know of none.

Second, being deceived doesn't excuse a person. We know that Eve was deceived. 2 Cor. 11:3 says, "But I am afraid, lest as the serpent deceived Eve by his craftiness, your minds should be led astray from the simplicity and purity of devotion to Christ." Also, 1 Tim. 2:14 says, "And it was not Adam who was deceived, but the woman being quite deceived, fell into transgression." But, as I said in the article, Genesis 3, The Fall, and Adam and Eve's sin, I searched through the Bible examining all 179 occurrences of deceive, deceived, deceit, deception, etc., and I found none that support the idea that being deceived is less an offense to God or somehow excuses a person from the consequence of that deception. If anything, I found evidence to the contrary.

TBC...

https://carm.org/eve-was-deceived-adam-was-not

OLAADEGBU:


Everything God created and made were perfect, there was no curse before sin set in.

"And God saw every thing that He had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day" (Genesis 1:31).

look at Genesis again.

God blessed living things specifically (referring to their destiny), as opposed to checking his work and seeing it was good.

However, when he created the livestock and beasts, he did not bless them.

tpiar:


look at Genesis again.

God blessed living things specifically (referring to their destiny), as opposed to checking his work and seeing it was good.

However, when he created the livestock and beasts, he did not bless them.

Look at Genesis again and see if He did not bless them.

"And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven. And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good. And God blessed them, saying, Be fruitful, and multiply, and fill the waters in the seas, and let fowl multiply in the earth" (Genesis 1:20-22).

^He blessed all livings things as they were created, except for the livestock and beasts, which he did not bless specifically.

tpiar:


^He blessed all livings things as they were created, except for the livestock and beasts, which he did not bless specifically.

Are you saying livestock and beast are not included among every 'living creature that moveth'?

Every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly.

are you saying animals came from the waters?

OLAADEGBU:
Eve was deceived. Adam was not. The argument from the egalitarians is that Eve was deceived, and Adam was not. Therefore, sin entered the world through him because her sin was not as bad as Adams. Discuss.

I think the serpent gets a bad rap. It merely spoke the truth.

The serpent, who by the way was definitely more than just a lowly snake, (he could converse with Eve), evidently preceded Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden and according to other Jewish writings he walked upright and maintained the place. The serpent knew the truth about the tree of Knowledge, it spoke like a man, had an intellect far above that of Man as well as the stature to challenge God. We are told that the land was rich in Gold, Bdellium and Onyx, his job it seems was to supply Gems to his superiors.

when the serpent is tempting Eve, he says:

"You are not going to die. No, the gods (Elohim) will know that the moment you eat it your eyes will be opened and you will be the same as the gods (Elohim) in telling good from bad."

Clearly the serpent was the very first rebel, but I see no deception.

tpiar:


Every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly.

are you saying animals came from the waters?

Animals came from both water and land and they were blessed to be fruitful and multiply and to produce after their own kind. And it was perfect.

the animals which came from the water were blessed, the animals which came from land were not blessed specifically.

Adam was blessed after he was created.

And creation was "good", not perfect, many people substitute the two words.

itstpia8:


the animals which came from the water were blessed, the animals which came from land were not blessed specifically.

Adam was blessed after he was created.

And creation was "good", not perfect, many people substitute the two words.

All that God created and made were blessed there was no curse in it. Genesis 1:31.

OLAADEGBU:


Eve was directly created out of Adam while their descendants were procreated.

Yes, God made Eve from Adam(his rib), they are flesh and mortal
diffrent persons but the same spirit - the human spirit

in a similar way before creation, when all there was, was God, God bought forth the Word from Himself,
they are Spirit, and Eternal
diffrent persons but the same spirit, the Holy Spirit of God

Joh_4:24 God is a Spirit: ....

1Co 15:47 The first man(Adam) is of the earth, earthy: the second man(Jesus Christ) is the Lord(kurios-Supreme God) from heaven.

God and the Word is God
the Word is the only begotten of God
God is a Spirit
the begotten Word is God's own Spirit

God is a Spirit
the Holy Spirit is of course God
God is God and the Word
God is the Holy Spirit
the Word is the Holy Spirit

Joh_14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

OLAADEGBU:
Eve was deceived. Adam was not. The argument from the egalitarians is that Eve was deceived, and Adam was not. Therefore, sin entered the world through him because her sin was not as bad as Adams. Discuss.

STORY

orunto27:
There was no law and no moral and so no sin actually. It was all divinely planned that Eve would be known by evil and very much later Mary would be visited by Good. Man is a partner of God to make the plan to produce evil and good, death and life, darkness and light and man and God work.

AT THE END ALL WAS REVERSED

I said so above. All was reversed in Mary, The Mother of all Righteousness. and in Jesus Christ, our Lord, that those who truly believe in Him shall sin no more.

Sin means disobey. God established it for man to know Him. In Adam, He came through Eve to test man's obedience's factor. Man disobeyed. In Job, He came directly to test Job ignoring the wife. Job regreted Life. He tolerated himself until God rescued him. In Jesus, the Son of man came to spell the way, the truth and the life out clearly for all sons of men to become Sons and Daughters of God. The Vatican hasn't said that He is not ever coming again, but that He has postponed His coming to give us more chances and better opportunities to repent and be more attuned and suitable to going back to Paradise. In other words, Earth/Heaven; Cain/Abel; disobedience/obedience; Selfishness/Righteousness; son of man/Son of God; wrong/right are all parts of thesame coin and the plan of God to make the earth a "New Jerusalem" like His Godsphere. Please remember we are His friends to know everything about Him now and not His servants anymore. Happy Sunday.

orisa37:
Sin means disobey. God established it for man to know Him. In Adam, He came through Eve to test man's obedience's factor. Man disobeyed. In Job, He came directly to test Job ignoring the wife. Job regreted Life. He tolerated himself until God rescued him. In Jesus, the Son of man came to spell the way, the truth and the life out clearly for all sons of men to become Sons and Daughters of God. The Vatican hasn't said that He is not ever coming again, but that He has postponed His coming to give us more chances and better opportunities to repent and be more attuned and suitable to going back to Paradise. In other words, Earth/Heaven; Cain/Abel; disobedience/obedience; Selfishness/Righteousness; son of man/Son of God; wrong/right are all parts of thesame coin and the plan of God to make the earth a "New Jerusalem" like His Godsphere. Please remember we are His friends to know everything about Him now and not His servants anymore. Happy Sunday.

@bold, Rev_22:9 but he said to me, "You must not do that! I am a fellow servant with you and your brothers the prophets, and with those who keep the words of this book. Worship God."

Many are not His servants, but those who believe what is written are.