Lennycool:

So God punishing a man with the rape of his wife and the death of his baby is moral. You are truly insane for religion.

DeepSight:


I watched my dog give birth to her fourth litter of pups this morning.
Its still rather amazing to me how she knows exactly what to do - biting off the baby sack, licking off the umbilical chord. Protecting the pups even from their father by snarling at him.

It's even more amazing to watch the blind pups pop out of her and immediately know to instantly seek out her nipples and start suckling milk.

Make of this what you will: but there is an over arching force that guides this pulse that is called life.

May that force be with, and for you, and us all.
Good morning.

ValentineMary:

We can't obviously see jealousy or shame but there are empirical analytic approach to know that what u feel is shame or jealousy. For example anger towards someone success can be describes as jealousy, feeling humiliated or publicly disgraced can be seen as shame.

Now my qus is what are the analytic method to logically prove this watchman.

PS: I am not just talking of the Abrahamic God or any specific God.

Scholar8200:
Thank you. But it is normal to commit adultery with another man's wife and kill him without no repercussions?

Scholar8200:
Thank you. But it is normal to commit adultery with another man's wife and kill him without no repercussions?

byteHead:



These behaviors are called innate or instincts.
An innate behavior is any behavior that occurs naturally in all animals of a given species.

It is a hard-wired, inborn behavior that enables a human or animal to cope with its environment.
Eg Cats are natural-born hunters. They don’t need to learn how to hunt. Spiders spin their complex webs without learning how to do it from other spiders.

Lennycool:

He was only human, prone to mistake and sin. God on the other hand is supposed to be a moral compass, and completely perfect and fair.

But what human judge today would punish a murderer and adulterer with the rape of his wives and killing of his innocent baby. Is this fair or even moral?

raphieMontella:

it is not normal...
I wouldnt like such to be done to me...
So i see shouldnt do such to others.

Edenoscar:
Round the clock surveillance and supervision of every single waking and sleeping moment of your life the abolision of any privacy in your life or in your most private thoughts. A conscious watchman i must say is the most extreme form of totalitarianism ever imagined.

DeepSight:


I don't know where you are heading with this, but I doubt you can justify the use of the word "naturally" in the context of this thread if by that word you mean something that requires no program but just happens. Instinct is programmed, in my humble view.

Please note that cats do learn to hunt. In fact, their parents spend painstaking time teaching them. Watch Natgeo Wild.

lordnicklaus:
Reality is experience in the making. It would sound weird to assume that since we cannot physically deduce the cubic expansivity of a liquid, that its fractional increase is abstract. Likewise we might not see God but would it still be logical to assume that God is merely the binding energy of the cosmos? Likewise, the "god matter" is extremely puny to the naked eye, but theoretically, it has been confirmed to be there and to be the supplementing intricate universal constituent. Most scientific facets have not been witnessed in reality but can we deem science as wrong? Likewise the existence of God is not a conceptual piece we should entirely doubt. CC ValentineMary donnffd johnydon22 shadeyinka butterfly88 raphiemontella.

byteHead:


Instincts are programmed in animals through evolution and natural selection. That's how living things adapt to their environments.  Then the best adaptations get passed on to their off-spring.





I am speaking of domestic cats. They are born with a hunting and chasing instinct. But they are not necessarily born hunters that kill for food. Killing and eating prey are behaviors which they learn from the mother cat.A cat can be a skillful mouse killer and yet never eat a single mouse or even desire to eat one.

Scholar8200:
Can you give references to this historical records? I say this because it will help us examine the basis was it customs? Take for example when they were topless(?), was adultery rife? What led to the abolition? Besides, I hope you see how people dress today? And have you heard of naturalists in the west? There were certain things that changed not on the basis of morals but civilisation and exposure to other nations, not a change in morals. There was a time we lived in huts and ate with calabash or clay plates. That we now use modern provisions does not indicate a change in morals. The European example is purely religious-pointing to a standard though misapplied for ulterior purposes.

Then why didnt they stop at that? Why include the aspect of morals that . Recall that man then was naturally such as ,"did not like to retain God in their knowledge". The very nature of man rebels against a Holy God, what then? Infact, the idols they invented as substitutes say much about what sought of god man can invent! Take for example baal and ashtoreth. These two idols were shaped like copulatory organs and worshiped accordingly. These idols had no commands that were positively beyond the natural man but rather had rituals that helped him explore the darkness of his depraved nature to the fullest.

But history has shown that morality as we find it in the Bible can not be man's creation. The reaction of average man to laws should be enough to show that the last thing natural man will consciously invent is a holy God. He may forge gods that agree with his depravity but not One that disagrees with same.

DeepSight:


I watched my dog give birth to her fourth litter of pups this morning.
Its still rather amazing to me how she knows exactly what to do - biting off the baby sack, licking off the umbilical chord. Protecting the pups even from their father by snarling at him.

It's even more amazing to watch the blind pups pop out of her and immediately know to instantly seek out her nipples and start suckling milk.

Make of this what you will: but there is an over arching force that guides this pulse that is called life.

May that force be with, and for you, and us all.
Good morning.

DoctorAlien:


Human beings report contact with a Watchman in many ways. It can be through a divine revelation, a miraculous healing/intervention, or even an unusual feeling of peace, joy and happiness.

While you might be quick to blow away these as hearsay and unsubstantiated, remember that each of the characteristics humans exhibit when they feel shame can also be exhibited by them even when they are not feeling shame.

ValentineMary:

It's because of the bold text that I don't trust people's testimony. It could be biased by many factor. That's why a more logical step by step approach would be better appreciated.

lordnicklaus:
Reality is experience in the making. It would sound weird to assume that since we cannot physically deduce the cubic expansivity of a liquid, that its fractional increase is abstract.

Likewise we might not see God but would it still be logical to assume that God is merely the binding energy of the cosmos? Likewise, the "god matter" is extremely puny to the naked eye, but theoretically, it has been confirmed to be there and to be the supplementing intricate universal constituent. Most scientific facets have not been witnessed in reality but can we deem science as wrong? Likewise the existence of God is not a conceptual piece we should entirely doubt. CC ValentineMary donnffd johnydon22 shadeyinka butterfly88 raphiemontella.

ValentineMary:

Science has actually done a great job in giving ans to that. It's called ancestral knowledge. That's the same reason birds can build nest.

DeepSight:


I doubt that birds start building nests as soon as they slip out of the egg.
I hope you understand my point here.

I am talking blind, barely conscious creatures.

At all events, Ancestral knowledge itself, is evidence of a code; a program.

New born turtles race to the sea: Birds that have never migrated before accurately do so in season and time using the earth's magnetic poles as compasses.

Bow down before that which is greater than you.

ValentineMary:

Actually ancestral knowledge is an evolutionary trait. And not some code.

DoctorAlien:


I would really like to know what you consider a logical way of analyzing the claim of the existence of a Conscious Watchman.

While we are allowed to take everything we hear from people with a pinch of salt, I believe there isn't much we can do empirically in the quest to ascertain the existence of a Conscious Watchman.

A proper analysis of the popular definition of this Conscious Watchman will reveal this.

ValentineMary:

There were somethings in science that were once thought impossible to deduce eg the amount of Dark matter but by ingenuous methods we have actually unlocked those. By using already laid down procedures by our predecessors.
Now in the field of religion is there no way we can deducd the existence of this watchman people so claim with analytical method as laid down by predecessors ?

DeepSight:


How are the two in bold mutually exclusive?

And please if you are going to have a discussion with me kindly stop this irritating girlish habit of having everything you write in italics - unless you wish to emphasize a particular word or phrase.

No offense intended.

Tell me - how are evolution and codification mutually exclusive?

Etesam:
I always thot that atheists say there is no God.

hopefulLandlord:


you thought wrong

atheists say there's no proof for the existence of gods

Etesam:

I thought it was agnostics who said that.

Deicide:
What of deist,?

ValentineMary:

[i] Writing in italics is my style and I like it that way.

DeepSight:


The existence of such has since been deduced in logic and philosophy however some persons reject simple notions such as the cosmological argument (Whatever begins to exist must have a cause) and various other derivative arguments which show that man is not, and cannot, be alone.

Etesam:
Wld a kind Nairalander show me what to make of all these terms?!

DeepSight:


The existence of such has since been deduced in logic and philosophy however some persons reject simple notions such as the cosmological argument (Whatever begins to exist must have a cause) and various other derivative arguments which show that man is not, and cannot, be alone.

ValentineMary:

Agnostic theist : Someone who believes in God but he does not claim he is right. He is open to the possibility of being wrong in future
Gnostic theist : Someone who believes in God and he is certain he is on the right path.
Agnostic atheist : Someone who does not believe in God but does not claim to be right. And accepts he/she could be wrong.
Gnostic atheist : Someone who does not believe in God and claims to be on the right path.
Deist Someone who believes in a non interacting God. That has nothing to do with human affairs.

ValentineMary:

The argument of a first cause has been used a lot by theologians but modern science has shown that we can have reactions without actions especially in the quantum world where classical mechanics break down.