Akdegreat:


You sound like a deist are you one?

Nope

Are you KingEbukanaija?

Wilgrea7:
Atheists are ready to support anybody as long as they don't follow religion... especially Christianity

sometimes i feel sad for them

MODIFIED

later when the deist starts attacking their disbelief, they'll start denying him/her

did you even read the thread before typing this?

just look at your brothers posts here

hopefulLandlord:


did you even read the thread before typing this?

just look at your brothers posts here

yh i read the thread... i saw some atheists congratulating him and welcoming him.. but lemme stop here.... sorry sir

Wilgrea7:


yh i read the thread... i saw some atheists congratulating him and welcoming him.. but lemme stop here.... sorry sir

lol!

KingEbukaNaija:


There's also a possibility that as a Christian deist , you can reject Jesus' divinity , accept his moral teachings and still worship the Supreme Being

This is the part i dont understand, how do you worship the creator?..read from some text we really do not know the authors, listen to somebody trying to explain these texts, take offering, sing and dance and clap How do we know this creator is really satisfied orr he has accepted all these things....

sonmvayina:


This is the part i dont understand, how do you worship the creator?..read from some text we really do not know the authors, listen to somebody trying to explain these texts, take offering, sing and dance and clap How do we know this creator is really satisfied orr he has accepted all these things....

Its so intricate . I won't advise any Nigerian to be a deist . But the ordinary deist just believes in an impersonal God .

Seun:

What if I say that the universe is a living being, just like God? On that basis, would you accept that, like God, the universe needs no creator?

I'm a deist just like the guy that created the thread. my understanding of the subject matter is that if the universe did evolved or created itself, it (l.e. the universe) is God, and it is through reasoning that we may get to know the universe or God. Deist refers to mother nature as God. God is or was just a term used to name mother nature. on this note I say you and onyeze are on the same page but you just don't understand each other

emmyojo22:


I'm a deist just like the guy that created the thread. my understanding of the subject matter is that if the universe did evolved or created itself, it (l.e. the universe) is God, and it is through reasoning that we may get to know the universe or God. Deist refers to mother nature as God. God is or was just a term used to name mother nature. on this note I say you and onyeze are on the same page but you just don't understand each other

You are a pandeist or pantheist not a deist .

emmyojo22:


I'm a deist just like the guy that created the thread. my understanding of the subject matter is that if the universe did evolved or created itself, it (l.e. the universe) is God, and it is through reasoning that we may get to know the universe or God. Deist refers to mother nature as God. God is or was just a term used to name mother nature. on this note I say you and onyeze are on the same page but you just don't understand each other

that's panthiesm not deism

KingEbukaNaija:


Its so intricate . I won't advise any Nigerian to be a deist . But the ordinary deist just believes in an impersonal God .

God is not outside of us...it is in us and we are in it....i guess that is too much for you to understand..

sonmvayina:


God is not outside of us...it is in us and we are in it....i guess that is too much for you to understand..

Are you a pantheist or pandeist ?

KingEbukaNaija:


Are you a pantheist or pandeist ?

i dont go with label, i see what i observe and i observe what i see...

sonmvayina:


i dont go with label, i see what i observe and i observe what i see...

Pantheism was developed out of ignorance . It sees the universe as God . And the fact that science lets us understand that the universe has a creator confutes Pantheism . Because it shows that there is a transcendent realm therefore the universe is not God .

Pandeism tried circumventing the problem of the universe's beginning , so it avers that God ceased existing as a separate conscious being and now exists as the universe .

onyenze123:
I believe in the moral and non mystical teachings of Jesus only

The moral teachings of Jesus are not that great, frankly. Most of them were badly thought through, while he didn't talk about many things which he should have talked about. For example, he didn't denounce the practice of slavery. He didn't denounce domestic abuse or accept it as a legitimate reason for divorce. He didn't agitate for gender equality and was arguably sexist himself: of the many women who were following him about and caring for him, none of them was ever appointed as an apostle. He preached pacifism to the point of stupidity in passages that most Christians wisely ignore. He thought financial planning was a sign of not having faith in God, because God provides for the birds (in reality, most of them die of starvation, disease, and predation, but Jesus didn't know that). You can develop a much better moral system by yourself!

KingEbukaNaija:


Pantheism was developed out of ignorance . It sees the universe as God . And the fact that science lets us understand that the universe has a creator confutes Pantheism . Because it shows that there is a transcendent realm therefore the universe is not God .

Pandeism tried circumventing the problem of the universe's beginning , so it avers that God ceased existing as a separate conscious being and now exists as the universe .

The bolded is a fallacy. No branch of science has any provision for any god. Scientists start their enquiries and research from available data and observations without putting putting any god into their equation. Any unknown is simply regarded as such - unknown and not attributed to any god or gods.

wirinet:

The bolded is a fallacy. No branch of science has any provision for any god. Scientists start their enquiries and research from available data and observations without putting putting any god into their equation. Any unknown is simply regarded as such - unknown and not attributed to any god or gods.

Lol wirinet

You have been a proponent of an nonexistent eternal universe . The universe CANNOT be eternal . It has a cause and a beginning and this means it has a creator . Or what else do you think it suggests ?

Why do you think you atheists wish the universe were eternal ? Because it would mean that no creator exists .

Even the universe could have not been born in a black hole because the problem of infinite universe which is not realistic will arise .

Seun:

The moral teachings of Jesus are not that great, frankly. Most of them were badly thought through, while he didn't talk about many things which he should have talked about. For example, he didn't denounced the practice of slavery. He didn't denounce domestic abuse or accept it as a legitimate reason for divorce. He didn't agitate for gender equality and was arguably sexist himself: of the many women who were following him about and caring for him, none of them was ever appointed as an apostle. He preached pacifism to the point of stupidity in passages that most Christians wisely ignore. He thought financial planning was a sign of not having faith in God, because God provides for the birds (in reality, most of them die of starvation, disease, and predation, but Jesus didn't know that). You can develop a much better moral system by yourself!

Oga seun, you are just attempting to use a basket to fetch gas by attempting to discus the character of Jesus. Jesus is a very nebulous character created by the roman empire. This character was a mosaic of roman - Jewish - Egyptian and Persian mythologise. Even most of the characters surrounding jesus bears latin names and not Jewish. Even the title Jesus Christus is a roman name and title.
Jesus never wrote or even actually said anything, if you read the new testament, all of Jesus's speeches are hearsay. It is almost always preceded by "he said" as someone narrating a story of what some character said.

wirinet:


Oga seun, you are just attempting to use a basket to fetch gas by attempting to discus the character of Jesus. Jesus is a very nebulous character created by the roman empire. This character was a mosaic of roman - Jewish - Egyptian and Persian mythologise. Even most of the characters surrounding jesus bears latin names and not Jewish. Even the title Jesus Christus is a roman name and title.
Jesus never wrote or even actually said anything, if you read the new testament, all of Jesus's speeches are hearsay. It is almost always preceded by "he said" as someone narrating a story of what some character said.

Uncle wiri wiri

This is called the fallacy of exclusion

Read this : https://www.nairaland.com/3381123/atheism-logical-fallacies-here-10

and this https://www.nairaland.com/3206535/23-reasons-why-scholars-know

KingEbukaNaija:


Lol wirinet

You have been a proponent of an nonexistent eternal universe . The universe CANNOT be eternal . It has a cause and a beginning and this means it has a creator . Or what else do you think it suggests ?

Why do you think you atheists wish the universe were eternal ? Because it would mean that no creator exists .

Even the universe could have not been born in a black hole because the problem of infinite universe which is not realistic will arise .

You on the other hand have been a proponent of an nonexistent eternal god . A GOD or GODS CANNOT be eternal . It must have a cause and a beginning. The argument that a God is outside space and time is meaningless.

To me the universe was, is and always be. To me the big bang does not represent the universe, but a phase of our own universe. If the universe is everything in existence, there is no way anyone can know everything that can exist. But some people including scientists see the universe as everything we can see.

wirinet:


You on the other hand have been a proponent of an nonexistent eternal god . A GOD or GODS CANNOT be eternal . It must have a cause and a beginning. The argument that a God is outside space and time is meaningless.

Meaningless ? The doctors' jargon is meaningless to a carpenter . The astronomers' jargon is meaningless to a painter .

To me the universe was, is and always be. To me the big bang does not represent the universe, but a phase of our own universe. If the universe is everything in existence, there is no way anyone can know everything that can exist. But some people including scientists see the universe as everything we can see.

Gosh ! You guys excoriate religious people when it appears that science contradicts religious texts but when science impugns your atheistic beliefs you still remain intransigent that the universe is eternal ? Unbelievable !

An eternal universe is illogical and unscientific !!

Seun:

The moral teachings of Jesus are not that great, frankly. Most of them are badly thought through, while he didn't talk about many things which he should have talked about. For example, he didn't denounced the practice of slavery. He didn't denounce domestic abuse or accept it as a legitimate reason for divorce. He didn't agitate for gender equality and was arguably sexist himself: of the many women who were following him about and caring for him, none of them was ever appointed as an apostle. He preached pacifism to the point of stupidity in passages that most Christians wisely ignore. He thought financial planning was a sign of not having faith in God, because God provides for the birds (in reality, most of them die of starvation, disease, and predation, but Jesus didn't know that). You can develop a much better moral system by yourself!

dude don't mind Ebuka jare
You need too see what he said on Lennycools thread "why we should NOT teach our children religion"

KingEbukaNaija:


Meaningless ? The doctors' jargon is meaningless to a carpenter . The astronomers' jargon is meaningless to a painter .

Wrong analogy. A carpenter can understand doctor's if he is interested. Ditto for a painter and an astronomer. But on religious issues it is not a matter of understanding, it is a matter of faith. I have to have faith that a god can exist outside time and space, not understanding.
In digression, if I were to the a theist, I would prefer to be a polytheist. It makes far more sense than monotheism. If one entity or consciousness can exist outside space and time, why not 2 or 1000. Why would the process that produce one God not able to produce multiple? Remember there had been thousands of Gods throughout man's history. It could be that each of these gods chose a particular people to God over. So there should be either no God at all or there are multiple gods.

[l
Gosh ! You guys excoriate religious people when it appears that science contradicts religious texts but when science impugns your atheistic beliefs you still remain intransigent that the universe is eternal ? Unbelievable !

An eternal universe is illogical and unscientific !!

Please explain how an eternal God is scientific and logical.

wirinet:

Wrong analogy. A carpenter can understand doctor's if he is interested. Ditto for a painter and an astronomer. But on religious issues it is not a matter of understanding, it is a matter of faith. I have to have faith that a god can exist outside time and space, not understanding.
In digression, if I were to the a theist, I would prefer to be a polytheist. It makes far more sense than monotheism. If one entity or consciousness can exist outside space and time, why not 2 or 1000. Why would the process that produce one God not able to produce multiple? Remember there had been thousands of Gods throughout man's history. It could be that each of these gods chose a particular people to God over. So there should be either no God at all or there are multiple gods.

Can you stop worrying about the number of gods outside space and time and simply acknowledge that the universe is indeed designed ?Simplicity to complexity necessitates a designer .

wirinet:
Please explain how an eternal God is scientific and logical.

Will you accept the idea of infinite universes ? No ? Why do you assert that the universe is eternal ? Isn't for logical reasons like infinite regress?

But sorry , science says the universe has a cause and beginning and this explicitly suggests that the universe has a creator who is immaterial and transcendent . And for logical reasons , God is eternal and this precludes infinite regression . God is called the Supreme Being - that means that the chain of plausible causation ends with It .

wirinet:

Wrong analogy. A carpenter can understand doctor's if he is interested. Ditto for a painter and an astronomer. But on religious issues it is not a matter of understanding, it is a matter of faith. I have to have faith that a god can exist outside time and space, not understanding.
In digression, if I were to the a theist, I would prefer to be a polytheist. It makes far more sense than monotheism. If one entity or consciousness can exist outside space and time, why not 2 or 1000. Why would the process that produce one God not able to produce multiple? Remember there had been thousands of Gods throughout man's history. It could be that each of these gods chose a particular people to God over. So there should be either no God at all or there are multiple gods.

Please explain how an eternal God is scientific and logical.

help me ask am o

jonbellion:
that's panthiesm not deism

The main issue is not being a deist, atheist or a pandiest but having the freedom to reason logically which Christianity and other religion restricts.

The goal of atheism, deism and pandeism which were originally the thoughts of those who started them is to free oneself from the bondage of not being able to apply reason to all things. Most persons after leaving religion tends to be either deist or atheist depending on which one made them to be converted, but as time goes by, they naturally tend towards being a free thinker.

emmyojo22:


The main issue is not being a deist, atheist or a pandiest but having the freedom to reason logically which Christianity and other religion restricts.

The goal of atheism, deism and pandeism which were originally the thoughts of those who started them is to free oneself from the bondage of not being able to apply reason to all things. Most persons after leaving religion tends to be either deist or atheist depending on which one made them to be converted, but as time goes by, they naturally tend towards being a free thinker.

Deism is very logical . Pandeism is not original , it just conflated ideas in deism and pantheism . Atheism restricts logical thinking , supports close-mindedness especially shown by atheists .

KingEbukaNaija:
Deism is very logical . Pandeism is not original , it just conflated ideas in deism and pantheism . Atheism restricts logical thinking , supports close-mindedness especially shown by atheists .

Are you a deist? What do you believe?

Seun:
Are you a deist? What do you believe?

I am not a deist . I am a Christian .

I do not believe , I know God exists .

I'm just fascinated by deism because it is purely intellectual .

Why do you controvert science's observation of a universe with a cause and a beginning ?

Please peruse this : http://www.hawking.org.uk/the-beginning-of-time.html

Even Hawking admitted people reject proof the universe has a beginning and cause because it strongly suggests that the universe has a supernatural creator . He also stated facts to buttress his stance . Please read and tell me what you think .

Seun:

The moral teachings of Jesus are not that great, frankly. Most of them were badly thought through, while he didn't talk about many things which he should have talked about. For example, he didn't denounce the practice of slavery. He didn't denounce domestic abuse or accept it as a legitimate reason for divorce. He didn't agitate for gender equality and was arguably sexist himself: of the many women who were following him about and caring for him, none of them was ever appointed as an apostle. He preached pacifism to the point of stupidity in passages that most Christians wisely ignore. He thought financial planning was a sign of not having faith in God, because God provides for the birds (in reality, most of them die of starvation, disease, and predation, but Jesus didn't know that). You can develop a much better moral system by yourself!

I get your point though.

A popular teaching like "it is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God" was debunked in a book I was reading - "the Jewish phenomenal"

This teaching according to the book discourages Christians from pursuing abundant wealth and wealth creation.

onyenze123:


I get your point though.

A popular teaching like "it is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God" was debunked in a book I was reading - "the Jewish phenomenal"

This teaching according to the book discourages Christians from pursuing abundant wealth and wealth creation.

Lol

Please read this: https://gotquestions.org/camel-eye-needle.html

onyenze123:


He is a spirit with unlimited intelligence

it is a consciousnesses...which could either be positive or negative, from mans point of view.