Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. - Christianity Etc (4) - Nairaland
Nairaland Forum › Nairaland General › Christianity Etc › Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. (7693 Views)
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by zionmade(m): 2:35pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
Also do well in answering my questions on islam views on Jesus impersonation and ascension just as am answering ur own |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by zionmade(m): 2:38pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
Now on sahendrin matter or dat of d council ur gave a wrong bible verse. I know its in d bible but bring up d accurate verse of scripture den i will address it. As u can see clearly ur writings are copy and paste |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by Rilwayne001(op): 3:09pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
zionmade:I've made my points on both the first and second page of this thread but since you are shying away from it, i had to bring it down for you to address. Copy and paste or not, address it. On the issue of 1st corr 15:3 paul didnt give an exhaustive list of those who saw Christ.What list was he then giving? Partial list And it is boldly written in verse 4 "according to the scriptures" in reference of d account of luke, Matthew and john(if u open a reference bible u will see it)Good that you acknowledge this as well. If he was indeed giving the list according to the gospel of Luke Matthew and john, how then did he miss mentioning the women among those that saw Jesus, despite the fact that those women saw him first according to those gospel? How come he missed mentioning the empty tomb despite the fact that those gospel he was allegedly referencing made mention of it? The accounts of Paul on resurrection is our earliest source of knowing what happened, owing to the fact it was written twenty to thirty years after Jesus’s death. Scholars typically dates Mark, the first Gospel, to be written probably around 65-70 ce; Matthew and Luke were written about fifteen to twenty years after that, say, 80-85 ce; and John was written last, around 90-95 ce. What is significant here is the time gap involved. Now our earliest account of the resurrection made no mention of the women and the empty tomb, if really Paul received the story of the women and the empty tomb from those that narrated it to him, how come he missed it in all his letters? This points to only one thing; that the stories of Jesus’s resurrection were indeed being expanded, modified, and possibly even invented. This, i want you to disprove. showing u wat i said before dat paul himself was not a physical witness.No one says he was a physical witness of the event, but from what he got before writing his letters, there's no story of women and empty tomb, they are all later expansion, modification and invention of the story by the anonymous author that wrote the gospels. Paul referenced to his encounter with Jesus on his way to damascua (acts 9:4) to and not after his resurrection.Okay. Pls always use a reference bible anytime u want to find ur Fault. As at d time paul wrote dat epistle he was d last person dat encountered Jesus. If am clear on this bring up ur next questionNo, you are not done. Address my refutation and answer my 1, 3 and 4th question. |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by Rilwayne001(op): 3:22pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
zionmade:Mark 14:55-65New International Version (NIV) 55 The chief priests and the WHOLE SANHENDRIN were looking for evidence against Jesus so that they could put him to death, but they did not find any. 56 Many testified falsely against him, but their statements did not agree. 57 Then some stood up and gave this false testimony against him: 58 “We heard him say, ‘I will destroy this temple made with human hands and in three days will build another, not made with hands.’” 59 Yet even then their testimony did not agree. 60 Then the high priest stood up before them and asked Jesus, “Are you not going to answer? What is this testimony that these men are bringing against you?” 61 But Jesus remained silent and gave no answer. Again the high priest asked him, “Are you the Messiah, the Son of the Blessed One?” 62 “I am,” said Jesus. “And you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven.” 63 The high priest tore his clothes. “Why do we need any more witnesses?” he asked. 64 “You have heard the blasphemy. What do you think?” They ALL condemned him as worthy of death. As you can see, THE WHOLE SANHENDRIN ie. ALL OF THEM condemned him to death. According to this same Mark15:43 Joseph of Arimathea, a prominent member of the Council, who was himself waiting for the kingdom of God, went boldly to Pilate and asked for Jesus' body. Whereas this unknown person, Joseph, was one of the people who had called for Jesus’s death just the night before he was crucified. Isn't this an obvious inconsistency in an attempt to invent the burial and the empty tomb of Jesus? Anybody with sense will see this. |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by zionmade(m): 3:52pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
Good i wanted u to land there. D gospels were not written by Matthew nor Mark nor Luke now leave John out of it for now. It was clearly written in d bible THE GOSPEL ACCORDING TO MARK OR LUKE OR MATTHEW. The terms used in these writings were clearly for the third person angle. I.e d writer was not also a player. Matthew was the account of Matthew. Now Matthew was present and they all gave their accounts. Bible scholars have it that these accounts were written in piece in piece (meaning bits by bits) by other disciples of Jesus and some came in oral forms. These were the things compiled at Ad 70 or thereabout. The account according to Matthew is tentamount to the biography of Jesus as narrated by Matthew and not actually written by him. He If u think dats why u call d bible corrupt den be ready to research on the author of Adams and eve in which islam stands on. I mean moses was born more dan 300yrs after it happened Now on the issue of paul in 1st corr 15:4 he said himself "according to d scriptures ref psalm 2:7 and hosea 6:2 But in verse 5-8 he didn't say according to scriptures rather a reference was made to the accounts of mtt mark and luke which were written in the books of mtt, mark and luke. Meaning at dat time these accounts were delivered to him orally by luke(who himself went with paul in almost all his missionary journies). And there were other disciples who communed with him like peter and James. About Paul not mentioning d woman said at d tomb or d tomb to itself, paul never narrated exquisitely wat the happened during d death and resurrection unlike d accounts of Mtt mark and co. So there is nothing like pauli account of Jesus death and resurrection as i said before paul himself was not a witness. D purpose of 1corr 15:1-11 was not to narrate d death and resurrection of Jesus rather its a subject of the salvation through death and resurrection See how am tackling ur questions but u re running away from one simple question i asked. Dat is how islam is. U are not even proud to tell ua how mohammad told u guys dat God used a machinery |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by zionmade(m): 3:59pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
Rilwayne001:Now let me answer u. Luke 23:50-51 And behold there was a man named Joseph A COUNSELLOR and he was a good man and a just. 51 THE SAME HAD NOT CONSENTED TO THE COUNSEL AND DEED OF THEM. dats all |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by zionmade(m): 4:11pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
FriendChoice:All am asking u is to defend this. Is it too much to ask of a muslim professor. Tell me how God invented d use of machineries. I mean d lies in quran are absolutely senseless |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by Empiree: 5:05pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
zionmade:ACADIA NIGERIA www.acadip.net Now you paying games. You said earlier that you are better offline debate. Now you backtracked suggesting you may be hurt if you have to debate with Muslim in person. Abeg, commot for my side jare. |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by manmacho: 5:12pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
zionmade:God bless you Bro. you like commando in the camp of the enemy, gunning down every lies thats been rearing its ugly head keep raising the banner of truth and God continue to reload your arsenal LIE SURELY MUST BOW TO THE TRUTH but on a second thought am beginning to see the fruitlessness of argument. the diagnosis is showing a spiritual mis-normal can only be treated as such lets pray that their eyes of understanding be enlighten that they may see the glorious gospel of Jesus. bro. only prayer can resolve this not this non ending argument peace out |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by zionmade(m): 5:16pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
Empiree:Yes because by d time d person starts shouting dat terrorism anthem allahu akbar den d story will change. As if u dnt know how deadly ur fellow paedophiles can become. What happened to people dat challenged mohammad (piss and poo upon him) authority openly, their heads went off dats how pissful u guys can be. Rubbish since u re too blind to see where i wrote "those that i trust" |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by zionmade(m): 5:19pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
manmacho:Leave dem for me bro. Some people think they can just copy all this Rubbish they are deceivee with and paste dem here. We are not even done soon i will bring up d adulterous life life of mohammad and let dem defend it |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by Empiree: 5:24pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
zionmade:waste of time |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by zionmade(m): 5:24pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
manmacho:Bro am ready for dem, instead of to focus on their adulterous mohammad life they will always try to poke their nosea into Christianity matter. Comparing a paedophile who killed and maimed to my Jesus who healed and raised d dead. By d time i bring up d life of mohammad they will scamper for safety. Can u imagine someone who died in between armature breast is coming to claim greater than Jesus |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by zionmade(m): 5:28pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
Empiree:Yeah waste of time indeed. Thank God am in the south now let me hear someone scream allah akbar near me i will kill d person in self defense. Even God doesn't killing in self defense. Afterall who doesnt know dat after every five shouts of allah akbar at least 10heads go rolling on d ground |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by Empiree: 5:41pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
zionmade:trash. All you do is, you succeeded in derailing this thread. You have a good day |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by zionmade(m): 5:53pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
Empiree:Dont u have eyes to see i waa having a nice conversation with d op befor u brought ur useless rant. I shud go and face acadia nonsense as if u re still a toddler. If u dnt have any meaningful input just shut up and listen |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by Rilwayne001(op): 8:32pm On Jan 10, 2017*. Modified: 8:54pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
zionmade:Good you acknowledge this. If what we have as the gospels today were not written by Matthew, mark and luke, then whose gospel are we reading and how reliable are they that what we have in them are really gospel of Jesus? Take note also that all these gospel were not written until many years after Jesus. This only goes to show that they are not reliable whatsoever. It's not the gospel by Jesus neither wasn't by Matthew and co, but rather it's the gospel by ghost, yet you want me to put my trust in it? now leave John out of it for now.Why? It was written almost 100 years after Jesus. How is it different from others? It was clearly written in d bible THE GOSPEL ACCORDING TO MARK OR LUKE OR MATTHEW.How can we be so sure that it was indeed according to them?? The terms used in these writings were clearly for the third person angle. I.e d writer was not also a player.Fine. You should answer the question i asked up there. He If u think dats why u call d bible corrupt den be ready to research on the author of Adams and eve in which islam stands on. I mean moses was born more dan 300yrs after it happenedI see another attempt to derail. w on the issue of paul in 1st corr 15:4 said himself "according to d scriptures ref psalm 2:7 and hosea 6:2Okay. But in verse 5-8 he didn't say according to scriptures rather a reference was made to the accounts of mtt mark and luke which were written in the books of mtt, mark and luke. Meaning at dat time these accounts were delivered to him orally by luke(who himself went with paul in almost all his missionary journies). And there were other disciples who communed with him like peter and James. About Paul not mentioning d woman said at d tomb or d tomb to itself, paul never narrated exquisitely wat the happened during d death and resurrectionFair enough. However, he mentioned those that was buried but forgot to mention by who and where. He also mentioned that he (Jesus) appeared to Cephas and to James, which i suppose are not really relevant since he's not giving an exquisite account as you wanted us to believe. Whereas a sane man will expect him to briefly mention the important accounts like the the person that buried him and not simply say he was buried. He was expected to mention the empty tomb and the women that he appeared to first, since they are more important in other accounts narrated by other gospels than both James and Cephas in this scenario. He didn't. Obviously he didn't mention these important ceases because there was nothing like that in the early Christian believe if the resurrection. They were later additions concocted to make the whole cork and bull story real. unlike d accounts of Mtt mark and co. So there is nothing like pauli account of Jesus death and resurrection as i said before paul himself was not a witness. D purpose of 1corr 15:1-11 was not to narrate d death and resurrection of Jesus rather its a subject of the salvation through death and resurrectionHe was summarizing it. And i believe you were taught in school that whenever you are told to summarize something, you are to point out the important message in that passage. Here Paul left out the important scenario and was mentioning the unimportant ones. I don't blame him. He was writing what was in circulation at that time before some other anonymous people came to embellish and add sauce to the story to make the whole thing look real. See how am tackling ur questions but u re running away from one simple question i asked. Dat is how islam is. U are not even proud to tell ua how mohammad told u guys dat God used a machineryYou are trying to derail and I'm not ready to give in for that. And btw, you are yet to answer my 1, 3 and 4th question. Kindly see to them as well. |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by Rilwayne001(op): 8:40pm On Jan 10, 2017*. Modified: 9:21pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
zionmade:Olodo, you still don't get it. Are you willing to lie now that Luke didn't copy from Mark? Mark was before Luke. apparently Luke copied the story of Joseph of Arithmatea from Mark . And so in other to make him look real and make him the good guy among the Sanhendrin, Luke embellished and Polish him by calling him a good man and Just. Something Mark never did. Anybody with sense will see that Luke polished him after he must have read what Mark said about him on how he buried Jesus. Whereas Mark had shot himself in the foot when he said the WHOLE OF SANHENDRIN had condemned him to death. So a wise man will notice that Luke was trying to correct the mistake Mark made in Mark 14:55-65. |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by zionmade(m): 8:49pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
Rilwayne001:Bros why will u be d one asking all d questions. D simple one i asked u re running away from it just like a typical muslim who can stand and answer questions on wat he believes. Now dis was supposed to be a two challenge not one way. I will answer every single question u put up only wen u answer d simplest ones i give u. U know wen Muslims start asking all d useless questions just give dem one simple question and they wont defend it because d quran is so ridiculous i mean if d lies there were well constructed it will be beta but its just as if an psychopath wrote d whole thing I am defending my Bible defend ur quran or forget it |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by zionmade(m): 8:52pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
And wen u re done with the first question answer dis one Was the quran handed to Mohammad by angel Jibrin or watever u guys coiled d name to be or was it written by mohammad Also wat was written in the part of quran that was eaten by a goat. |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by Rilwayne001(op): 8:57pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
zionmade:Open a new thread on that and i will address your questions. This thread is for my own questions and you are expected to address them. Don't let us derail. |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by zionmade(m): 9:02pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
Now u call me olodo i will start from there. First of dnt u see how educationally miserable u are wen u bend down like a woman to urinate? And u wash ur Rubbish with water from one dirty kettle Cant u see how senseless u are believing dat d devil sleeps in ur nose at night, of course why won't d devil sleep there wen all u dream about iss to follow d footsteps of a paedophile whose only miracle which he boasted of is his ability to sleep with all his wives in one night. All ur desire is go to ur Xvideo shooting center called paradise and get ur own supernatural erecction and start performing wonders on virgins. I mean u re really an idiot to be a muslim. |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by Rilwayne001(op): 9:06pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
zionmade:Hmmmmmm |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by zionmade(m): 9:08pm On Jan 10, 2017 |
Wait am not yet done. I also heard dat ur mohammad introduced d word thighing into d dictionary . I mean dnt u feel disgusting following a short pot belly man who would fix his thing in between d thighs of a 6yr old girl and pour out his sperm. I mean 6yr old. Next time u feel like calling someone olodo pls look at ur miserable mohammad and call urself olodo first |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by zionmade(m): 9:36am On Jan 13, 2017 |
Empiree Rilwayne001 and FriendChoice why are u guys running come and defend ur paedophilic model mohammad the great in bedmatics. I saw how empiree was running away from this thread https://www.nairaland.com/3239137/lets-read-book-people-vs/1 Hahaha u guys shud come out ooo. I heard dat devil touuched mohammad back and front and dat Satan romances every muslim at birth No wonder allah akbar sounds more deadly dan d sound of a bomb. Because a bomb can kill only those around but after d allah akbar shout d killing is scattered everywhere All of u come out let me teach u guys how to stick ur mouth into ur god forsaken religion and leave Christianity alone. Anyway i heard dat devil urinated inside Empiree ears. Lai ila ila alhmakuradoiiiiik allah nkubarrrrri |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by zionmade(m): 9:45am On Jan 13, 2017 |
Rilwayne001:I also heard dat one kafir use jazz make mohammad impotent for six months a whole powerful prophet. Kai lai ila ila ila. Come oo aisha also said mohammad was mad. Lai ila ila ila. I also u can use gutter water to do ablution afterall water cannot be defiled lai ila ila ila. I have keenly followed d way u guys poke nose into christian matters and today am ready. Come oout u paedophiles |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by zionmade(m): 10:01am On Jan 13, 2017 |
I also heard mohammad raped saffiyya and killed all members of her family and chibok girls comes to my mind. Lai ila ila ila alhaallmadiriuuukubi allah akbariiii |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by Empiree: 10:03am On Jan 13, 2017 |
zionmade:You have MP |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by zionmade(m): 10:16am On Jan 13, 2017 |
Empiree:I told u i have mp so lets keep it civilized ur paedophilic colleague was busy calling me olodo now i don craze Is it true dat wen mohammad enter into a new city he will shout allah akbar rape dem all kill dem all take d girls with tiny back and front leave d big one for me. If x videos is to act a movie called the life of mohammad dem spartacus dey learn work. Lai ila ila ila alhaallmadiriuuukubi rape dem all |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by Rilwayne001(op): 11:12am On Jan 13, 2017*. Modified: 11:33am On Jan 13, 2017 |
Zionmade, you lost the argument, deal with it, instead of wailing around. You mounted the thread like a civil and intelligent man, but I'm starting to doubt you are really civil and intelligent. If you were offended by my calling you "olodo", I'm sorry about that. I apologize. Nevertheless all these vitrioles and cussing are uncalled for. If you are offended by any of my posts, call My attention to it and I will correct myself; and that's expected of an intelligent and civil person, which i believe you are, unless you want to further prove me wrong by continue the shenanigans you are doing, which only cowards do whenever they are losing. I'm not saying you've totally lost the argument, but this attitude you are displaying makes it seems so. Kindly address this post, then answer my question 1, 3 and 4 if really you are not a coward. |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by zionmade(m): 11:27am On Jan 13, 2017 |
Rilwayne001:My broda i have a serious beef with islam as a religion because of a painful personal experience dats why i tried to hold and answer ur questions but i begged u thrice not to use some words because it will bring out dat beef. I have addressed all ur questions whether right or wrong in ur own perspectives but a football match is played on both sides answer my own little questions before continuing answering urs. But my rantings wouldn't stop if FriendChoice dont come here and explain to me why he said dat apostle paul who i reverence just as u reverence mohammad wrote a porn book included in my Holy Bible |
| Re: Historically Analyzing The Crucifixtion And Resurrection Claim. by Nobody: 11:32am On Jan 13, 2017 |
zionmade:I don't intend to answer you before but your statement made it necessary. You reverence Paul? I expect you to give reverence to Jesus before any other human. I give reverence to Jesus Pbum but I have nothing to do with those that fabricate lies against my prophet Jesus Pbum. |
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