Dhugal:

I see that you keep letting slide my assertion you're Bini and not Ika,as you've tried to fool some here with.
Good.
Now,stop beating about the bush.Which town/settlement is named "Anioma",for Nnewi to have borrowed words from?.Bearing in mind before colonialism we rarely,if not hardly,associated with towns across the river.

Please stop. I've always been Ika and will always remain Ika. Anybody well versed in Ika language, culture and traditions must also know much about Edo because there are lots of similarities. I'm not claiming to be well versed in Ika but the little I know helped me in understanding Bini to a great extent

RedboneSmith:


Okay, you are actually being downright silly at this point.

No, you tell me.

Were there migrations from Imo, Abia,Ebonyi, Enugu, Oyigbo, Asa, Ndoki,Egbema into Agbor?

Where does that leave your ridiculous "Populous ancient Igbo people whose Population spilled into Anioma" story?

You see how you make a public fun of yourself?

RedboneSmith:
I can't quote your comment for some reason.

I doubt that someone majoring in medieval European history is unaware of the severe limitations of the Holy Roman Empire. You're most likely an enthusiast and nothing more. Many small-time adventurers held the pope captive at various points in history. Norman the Conqueror wasn't even a king, but a duke when he overran England. So I don't know how sacking a territory could be proof of the imperial might of the Holy Roman Emperor.

If it wasn't late, I would have gone to my study and quoted copiously to demonstrate that the HRE was an empire only in name, and played ZERO role in the Germanization of former slavic territories in Brandenburg and Prussia. The Germanisers were migrant farmers and a band of knights - The Teutonic knights.

Austria-Hungary came much much later in history to be of any relevance to the issue at hand.

You see your life?.
What you called an "Empire in name only" controlled armies,sacks cities n kings at will,yet have limited powers?.That shit you're smoking is very strong,I tell you.

BTW,it's William the Conqueror.Not Norman.
The invasion was tagged Norman invasion cos he was Duke of Normandy,wielding powers much like a king in his territory,n was supported by Norman nobility.Capetian France,in it's early days,was a confederation,with the King more of a figurehead and real powers residing with the dukes and counts.It was Phillip II Augustus that really changed that.That's an aside.

The Austrian empire was REFORMED much later in history into the Austro-Hungarian empire,under Franz Jozef.Austrian empire had existed for centuries before that and was in fact the successor state to the HRE.

Oh,the Germanisers,as you call them,established the Baltic states,which to all intents n purposes are still Slavic in outlook n somewhat in language.
Try again.

BTW,aside Phillip IV the Fair of France,leading to the 100-year Avignon papacy,I will like to know which "small-time adventurer(s)" held the Pope captive and at what time in history.
I did warn you to hit the books first before making any allusion to European history you know nothing about,didn't I?.

Cire80:
Please stop. I've always been Ika and will always remain Ika. Anybody well versed in Ika language, culture and traditions must also know much about Edo because there are lots of similarities. I'm not claiming to be well versed in Ika but the little I know helped me in understanding Bini to a great extent

You want to have yourself exposed for all to see,ekwa?.
Being Bini doesn't stop you contributing to ika debate,same as I.
What I'm against are the lies and revisions.
I would advise you take back this particular lie.

Dhugal:

You see your life?.
What you called an "Empire in name only" controlled armies,sacks cities n kings at will,yet have limited powers?.That shit you're smoking is very strong,I tell you.

BTW,it's William the Conqueror.Not Norman.
The invasion was tagged Norman invasion cos he was Duke of Normandy,wielding powers much like a king in his territory,n was supported by Norman nobility.Capetian France,in it's early days,was a confederation,with the King more of a figurehead and real powers residing with the dukes and counts.It was Phillip II Augustus that really changed that.That's an aside.

The Austrian empire was REFORMED much later in history into the Austro-Hungarian empire,under Franz Jozef.Austrian empire had existed for centuries before that and was in fact the successor state to the HRE.

Oh,the Germanisers,as you call them,established the Baltic states,which to all intents n purposes are still Slavic in outlook n somewhat in language.
Try again.

Any lord with enough coins to hand out could raise large armies in feudal Europe.

No. Germanisers did not establish the Baltic states. Balts (close cousins of the Slavs) did. Germanisers didn't go further than Brandenburg and Prussia. You are a history student. Go check out how those two areas became German, and come and tell me how it was all due to the Imperial might of an all-German emperor.

Igboid:


No, you tell me.

Were there migrations from Imo, Abia,Ebonyi, Enugu, Oyigbo, Asa, Ndoki,Egbema into Agbor?

Where does that leave your ridiculous "Populous ancient Igbo people whose Population spilled into Anioma" story?

You see how you make a public fun of yourself?

Again, ridiculous question. Don't even know how we are talking about Ebonyi and Ndoki here. You are simply being absurd.

But since y'all respect Onwuejeogwu so much, I know you have heard his theory about movement of people from the Owerri zone ( a well- populated area, both in pre-colonial times and today) into Ikaland.

RedboneSmith:


Any lord with enough coins to hand out could raise large armies in feudal Europe.

No. Germanisers did not establish the Baltic states. Balts (close cousins of the Slavs) did. Germanisers didn't go further than Brandenburg and Prussia. You are a history student. Go check out how those two areas became German, and come and tell me how it was all due to the Imperial might of an all-German emperor.

*sigh*
This is much like taking candy from a child.
Hellooooo!
Ever heard of the Northern Crusades,the Livonia Crusade,the Teutonic Knights?.
Only much of Lithuania escaped,and that by merging with Poland after beating back the Knights.
You're a gift that just keep giving.
Stop typing and go hit the books for a while,please.

Any local lord can raise armies in medieval Europe?.
Are you for real?.
Which and which local lord did that and when,pray tell?.
Don't mention William,he was a Duke.The equivalent of a small king or sovereign grand duke today.

Dhugal:

*sigh*
This is much like taking candy from a child.
Hellooooo!
Ever heard of the Northern Crusades,the Livonia Crusade,the Teutonic Knights?.
Only much of Lithuania escaped,and that by merging with Poland after beating back the Knights.
You're a gift that just keep giving.
Stop typing and go hit the books for a while,please.

Any local lord can raise armies in medieval Europe?.
Are you for real?.
Which and which local lord did that and when,pray tell?.
Don't mention William,he was a Duke.The equivalent of a small king or sovereign grand duke today.

One example out of like thousands. Count Charles of Anjou, a vassal Lord under the king of France. Conquered for himself a kingdom in Italy. In fact, the king of France was, in feudal times, so much in fear of his vassal lords that his word meant very little outside of the small area around Paris.

What's all that about crusades and knights and Lithuania? Are you under the assumption that you are telling me something I did not know?

My premise was and is that the HRE's imperial authority meant practically nothing, and German communities, some of them as small as 300 people, operated without any deference to it and regarded themselves as fully independent in every sense of the word.

Dhugal:

The "German hypothesis" falls flat to start with,there was a Germanic empire prior to Bismarck's Iron and Blood unification of northern Germanic states under Prussia.
Heck,there were two,counting the Habsburg's Austrian Empire.
You guys should be informed before bringing in false equivalencies here.

Can I buy you a ittke of guiness pls

RedboneSmith:


Again, ridiculous question. Don't even know how we are talking about Ebonyi and Ndoki here. You are simply being absurd.

But since y'all respect Onwuejeogwu so much, I know you have heard his theory about movement of people from the Owerri zone ( a well- populated area, both in pre-colonial times and today) into Ikaland.

And these Owerri people came to ika land and colonised them right ? Pls show us archeological and sociological evidence of Igbo colonising them. I was thinking that Igbo are humans never knew they are super humans...They colonise physically, mentally and linguistically that all elements of Benin names and culture are eroded in one swoop

Unlike Britian ,Igbo colonisation takes no prisoners.i am impressed. So those owerre people made the gullible Benin people to change their language and names automatically.


Pls can you give us date when this happened. Is it Eze Chime that did that or some great NRI priest.

This is soooooooo funny

RedboneSmith:


Olumbanasaa is a group name, like Mbammili (Riverine people), not the name of one community. All the communities that make up Olumbanasaa don't have Igbo names. They have Igala names. Yoruba is a group name. Not the name of one community. The communities that make up the Yoruba nation don't have Hausa names.

Ominije was the name of just ONE community, not a collective group name, like Olumbanasa and Yoruba. Your analogies are deceptive.

All community that make up olumbanasa don't have Igbo name but what is olumbanasa....? I was thinking that you are intelligent


Olumbanasa is an Igbo name meaning the voice of seven towns ..Yet you said that they don't have Igbo name but chose Igbo name as a group.

Are you really ok ?

Tufiakwa

Cire80:
I didn't see this. What's so special about this? The greetings? Or the Ogele? There are many royal greetings and praise names for Ika kings and that's one of them. I remember when I was little during the Owowor, Ibiewere and Igue festivals, all the songs are music during this festival is for the king. The most popular greetings for Agbor kings is Do Dein; Ni tor nein fe. Is Ogele Igbo ? Please tell me.

Ogele is Igbo

Meaning voice or instrument that is used to convene a town in ancient

It can be used as tithe also

ariesbull:


All community that make up olumbanasa don't have Igbo name but what is olumbanasa....? I was thinking that you are intelligent


Olumbanasa is an Igbo name meaning the voice of seven towns ..Yet you said that they don't have Igbo name but chose Igbo name as a group.

Are you really ok ?

Tufiakwa

You are the guy that thought Ipa and Sampa are Igala words for 'land', aren't you? Please, have you gotten any smarter than the last time you quoted me? I just want to be sure you are not here to waste my time again.


(Okay, after a quick perusal of the two mentions from you, I don't see our conversation going any differently than the last time. So I am wasting no time on you. Run along.)

ariesbull:


Ogele is Igbo

Meaning voice or instrument that is used to convene a town in ancient

It can be used as tithe also

oooh!!! Where dis one take come out? Funny human being . But typical Igbo man. Do you care how our own Ogele is pronounced?

ehikwe22:
oooh!!! Where dis one take come out? Funny human. But typical Igbo man. Do you care how our own Ogele is pronounced?

Funny man, now you are not asking if ogele is Igbo ? You are now asking of pronouncing

Ok write the pronounced ogele with accent signs


I will debunk you and also tell us the meaning

Atulu

RedboneSmith:


You are the guy that thought Ipa and Sampa are Igala words for 'land', aren't you? Please, have you gotten any smarter than the last time you quoted me? I just want to be sure you are not here to waste my time again.


(Okay, after a quick perusal of the two mentions from you, I don't see our conversation going any differently than the last time. So I am wasting no time on you. Run along.)

Lousy fellow...What is the meaning of olumbanasa if the towns are not Igbo but they took up Igbo name for all of them

Pristine buffoonery

ariesbull:


Funny man, now you are not asking if ogele is Igbo ? You are now asking of pronouncing

Ok write the pronounced ogele with accent signs


I will debunk you and also tell us the meaning

Atulu

They are not the same thing. If you read the previous posts, we talked about words having same spelling but different pronunciations and different meanings. This is one of them. But like we earlier said, all you guys need to ascribe an Igbo meaning to any Ika word is similar spelling. You guys have even tried to give Igbo meaning to words that don't even have any similar Igbo word like Ominijie, Agbon, Dein and many other Ika words but you've failed.

RedboneSmith:
You are the guy that thought Ipa and Sampa are Igala words for 'land', aren't you? Please, have you gotten any smarter than the last time you quoted me? I just want to be sure you are not here to waste my time again.

(Okay, after a quick perusal of the two mentions from you, I don't see our conversation going any differently than the last time. So I am wasting no time on you. Run along.)

I just dey observe! Una no go take laugh kill person for here....hehehe!

Cire80:
They are not the same thing. If you read the previous posts, we talked about words having same spelling but different pronunciations and different meanings. This is one of them. But like we earlier said, all you guys need to ascribe an Igbo meaning to any Ika word is similar spelling. You guys have even tried to give Igbo meaning to words that don't even have any similar Igbo word like Ominijie, Agbon, Dein and many other Ika words but you've failed.

Lol
You guys are still on I see.
How you all cleverly avoided explaining how Nduka Ezeagwuna came to be the name of a king in Ika land is still d topic...just Incase...
Also, this talk of ascribing Igbo meanings to words that are already Igbo betrays your ignorance of the topic under discussion.
Like I mentioned in previous threads...you lots need to travel further to the east and find out really what you ACTUALLY share.
Your denials will only end up making you look funnier than the Onichas in Anambra when they were confronted with the fact...that there were more Onichas in the Igbo hinterlands...than Onicha Mmili and Onicha Ugbo.
So which came first?
The Eze in Ika or the Eze in SE Igbo land?
Or the Umu Eze Chima's Onicha came before the many more Onichas around?
Apparently, inherited ignorance and an inherited attitude towards all things Igbo will make a man bearing Emeka Esogbue...in a country sharply divided along ethnic lines..deny the Igboness of his name...and the language he speaks...while affirming another identity of a people right next door...who do not speak his language or bear the same name as him.
Point is...you Ikas and Aniomas have a boatload of history to set right.

Cire80:
They are not the same thing. If you read the previous posts, we talked about words having same spelling but different pronunciations and different meanings. This is one of them. But like we earlier said, all you guys need to ascribe an Igbo meaning to any Ika word is similar spelling. You guys have even tried to give Igbo meaning to words that don't even have any similar Igbo word like Ominijie, Agbon, Dein and many other Ika words but you've failed.

Tell us the meaning ....That's what I am asking

ariesbull:


Tell us the meaning ....That's what I am asking

Of course I know the meaning but I'm not going to tell you because it makes no difference. You guys have been asking for meanings since and when meanings get provided, you twist your comments. Very mischievous lot

Cire80:
Of course I know the meaning but I'm not going to tell you because it makes no difference. You guys have been asking for meanings since and when meanings get provided, you twist your comments. Very mischievous lot

No mind dem...they're a bunch of revisionists.

ariesbull:


And these Owerri people came to ika land and colonised them right ? Pls show us archeological and sociological evidence of Igbo colonising them. I was thinking that Igbo are humans never knew they are super humans...They colonise physically, mentally and linguistically that all elements of Benin names and culture are eroded in one swoop

Unlike Britian ,Igbo colonisation takes no prisoners.i am impressed. So those owerre people made the gullible Benin people to change their language and names automatically.


Pls can you give us date when this happened. Is it Eze Chime that did that or some great NRI priest.

This is soooooooo funny

Well put.
These people are shameless.
Was about replying him, but this your rebuttal will suffice.

RedboneSmith:


One example out of like thousands. Count Charles of Anjou, a vassal Lord under the king of France. Conquered for himself a kingdom in Italy. In fact, the king of France was, in feudal times, so much in fear of his vassal lords that his word meant very little outside of the small area around Paris.

What's all that about crusades and knights and Lithuania? Are you under the assumption that you are telling me something I did not know?

My premise was and is that the HRE's imperial authority meant practically nothing, and German communities, some of them as small as 300 people, operated without any deference to it and regarded themselves as fully independent in every sense of the word.

Charles of Anjou was the third son of Louis VIII and brother to Louix IX,the crusader.He was not just any "vassal lord"
Charles conquered the two Sicilies with the French army.
Heck,you're even confusing periods.The Capetians started out without power,but gained absolute power under Phillip II.
The HRE,however,started out and stayed all powerful throughout its span.Right from Charlemagne down to Habsburg-Lorraine.
Dude,give it up.Your "German hypothesis" holds no water at all.A strong empire existed,to have germanised Berlin.Prussia was inherited and then established by force of arms,by the elector of Brandenburg.
That,however,is not the case a la Ika and the rest Igboland east of the Niger.
Now,for the last time,stick to Igala, Anioma and bits of Igbo history and culture you know of.Stop dabbling in European history for your false equivalencies,tis way beyond your ken.

Cire80:
Of course I know the meaning but I'm not going to tell you because it makes no difference. You guys have been asking for meanings since and when meanings get provided, you twist your comments. Very mischievous lot

Oga go sodon

Cire80:
Please stop. I've always been Ika and will always remain Ika. Anybody well versed in Ika language, culture and traditions must also know much about Edo because there are lots of similarities. I'm not claiming to be well versed in Ika but the little I know helped me in understanding Bini to a great extent

Enyi...there's a difference btwn being versed in ika and being an ika. And just like everyone is suggesting, you're not ika

cheruv:

Enyi...there's a difference btwn being versed in ika and being an ika. And just like everyone is suggesting, you're not ika

I don't know what to tell you.

RedboneSmith:


Ominijie was not a collection of communities in the sense that Olumbanasaa is. That we know. It was just ONE community. In fact, it wasn't even as big as the present Agbor Town. It was the nucleus settlement that grew and grew to become the present Agbor.

According to Bini traditions, the name of Agbor was Igidi at the time they invaded, not Ominijie. The Ominijie era had already ended before Bini became a force to reckon with, so you can forget trying to pin the Ominijie name on Bini imperialists.

Was this not what I said earlier and that Cire80 was talking rubbish
But according to your submission, are you trying to say that before 1577, that agbor was called Igidi...kos 1577 is the year the Bini attacked and destroyed agbor. Also according to that document, Igidi was a kingdom in present day Anioma that was destroyed at the turn of the 15th century.. Though the report wasn't sure what led to its destruction.
Secondly, the Ominijie issue shows that one ND report I read sometimes ago on agbor was actually correct in contrast to what ehikwe was saying
Truly history is sacred

cheruv:

Was this not what I said earlier and that Cire80 was talking rubbish
But according to your submission, are you trying to say that before 1577, that agbor was called Igidi...kos 1577 is the year the Bini attacked and destroyed agbor. Also according to that document, Igidi was a kingdom in present day Anioma that was destroyed at the turn of the 15th century.. Though the report wasn't sure what led to its destruction.
Secondly, the Ominijie issue shows that one ND report I read sometimes ago on agbor was actually correct in contrast to what ehikwe was saying
Truly history is sacred

Destruction of Agbor is just a figment of some people's imagination. There's a myth about an ancient Ogidi Kingdom that was destroyed sometime around that period you mentioned. I hope that's not what you're talking about. Is it the same Kingdom between Onicha Ugbo and Igbodo? And is Agbor between these Kingdoms? Even Umunede was formerly called Agidi. So if there happened to be a kingdom between Onicha Ugbo and Igbodo that answered a gidi sounding name, you would attribute it to the so called Ogidi?

What Niger Delta report are you talking about? The one that faked an interview with the Dein of Agbor where the Dein said Agbor is Umuleri? Ain't you ashamed to be quoting such things? Do you think we're here for child's play?

Cire80:
Destruction of Agbor is just a figment of some people's imagination. There's a myth about an ancient Ogidi Kingdom that was destroyed sometime around that period you mentioned. I hope that's not what you're talking about. Is it the same Kingdom between Onicha Ugbo and Igbodo? And is Agbor between these Kingdoms? Even Umunede was formerly called Agidi. So if there happened to be a kingdom between Onicha Ugbo and Igbodo that answered a gidi sounding name, you would attribute it to the so called Ogidi?

What Niger Delta report are you talking about? The one that faked an interview with the Dein of Agbor where the Dein said Agbor is Umuleri? Ain't you ashamed to be quoting such things? Do you think we're here for child's play?

That destruction stuff you're denying is what I read directly from an Edo website... Or are you trying to say that your Edo people are now liars
You're the one who thinks we're playing here...kos most of the facts that have been thrown at you are ones you can't do anything about

cheruv:

That destruction stuff you're denying is what I read directly from an Edo website... Or are you trying to say that your Edo people Sounds cool!!. In my leisure time I read good books, walks on the beach and cozy candlelight dinners. I enjoy movies, television, music, traveling, the quietness of the mountains, the ocean, sunrises and sunsets. I am comfortable in jeans or a nice suit. I believe in enjoying the good life and am high on it. I have a healthy attitude about life.
I am a very outgoing person, who loves to dine out, travel and enjoy the simple life. I am a hopeless romantic and very affectionate. I have a good sense of humor. now liars
You're the one who thinks we're playing here...kos most of the facts that have been thrown at you are ones you can't do anything about

And what makes you think Edo website represents Edo? What website is that? What makes you think Edo website can't lie? Website was written by an individual and do you know that the Benin Royalty has dispelled lots of the things Egharavba wrote in his book? Which shows it was just his opinion and not fact. Have I ever told you I'm Edo? And what about the other points I made? How did they add up with your fabrications you called fact?