Eaa247:


i now know why stupidity is ur second name. slowpoke, ve u not mixed-up things b4?
if u quote again it will confirm my suspicion that a goat gave birth to u.

Alas, the relentless cockroach has been found out.

You don't know what you don't know

Stop forming local champion.

bedspread:
how many troops do the DHQ HAVE?

Armed Forces Special Forces (AFSF) Battalion

bedspread:
BROS, CDS CANNOT MOBILIZE TROOPS WITHOUT THE INVOLVEMENT OF THE COAS.
THE COAS HAS THE TROOPS ON GROUND. THATS WHY HE CAN OPEN NEW FORMATIONS WHENEVER JUST LIKE BURATAI LAUNCHED IN KASTINA, PMB HOME TOWN..
CDS NA FIGURE HEAD POST.....

you be novice for military matter!

Wow, naija people can never change. See all the know it all replies on this thread, meanwhile how many of una know the military laws of the British colony aka Nigeria?

Dayum

Emerituz:

then who was the CDS that time?

Domkat Bali was the CDS when Buhari was the head of state. Idiagbon was the chief of staff (supreme headquarters), Bali was no 3 as CDS, Babangida was chief of Army staff, Aikhomu was chief of naval staff, Ibrahim Alfa was Air chief.

However, when Babangida overthrew Buhari to become the president from chief of army position, Abacha was moved from GOC 2nd division to become Army chief, Ebitu Ukiwe was appointed chief of staff [general headquarters] (not supreme headquarters which was scrapped) while all other service chiefs including Bali retained their positions.

About a year down the line, Ukiwe committed a gaffe during a press interview when he admitted that OIC membership was not discussed by the ruling council before Nigeria became a member. At the meeting of the ruling council the following week, he was simply walked out and Aikhomu (the chief of naval staff) took over his position while Nyako became navy chief.

In January 1987, babangida fell sick and was hospitalized abroad for medical treatment that lasted many weeks. The service chiefs jointly ruled the country without identifiable or identified leader among them. When babangida made a broadcast on his return, he thanked them jointly for holding the administration without specifying who actually led the country in his absence.

It should be noted that in Buhari regime, there was no south-west and south-east representation among the chiefs of staff (idiagbon was from north-central), while aikhomu from south-south was the only southerner.
Under Babangida, the brief period that Ukiwe served gave south-east a representation. When he was removed after only a year and Aikhomu moved over to his position from naval chief. Aikhomu's replacement as the naval chief was a northerner, thus the situation reverted to Buhari era scenario of no representation from south west and east.

stanley59:
The CDS is superior by rank (since he's a four star general) but he doesn't and cannot exercise command over the remaining service chiefs( 3 star generals) namely the Chief of Airstaff CAS, the Chief of naval staff CNS , and the Chief of army staff...
Put in mind according to the constitution the CDS is both a member of the NATIONAL SECURITY COUNCIL and NATIONAL DEFENCE COUNCIL, the other service chiefs(CAS,CNS,COAS) are only full members of the national defence council.
The CDS acts as a co ordinator of the other service chiefs even though they don't report to him or the Minister of Defence. The service chiefs act independently and report only to the President(5 star general,GCFR and commander-in-chief),they can't even report to an Acting president who is only a GCON (not a GCFR),each arm of service can therefore maintain autonomy and act independently,whilst still checked by the DHQ (defence headquaters).....
if the CDS exercised command over the service chiefs it would make him the president (commander-in-chief and GCFR).
Bringing in the NSA is inconsequential in this discussion since he's only responsible for intelligence and security related matters not defence,that's why he is only a member of the national security and council and is responsible to the minister of interior not minister of defence.
NB Service chiefs are also GCON in some sense

What is this about GCFR and GCON when discussing military matters? You actually believed they are ranks

Well for knowledge improvement sake, those are national civil honours.

There are two Orders namely Federal Republic (FR) and Niger (N). Note that it is Niger not Nigeria.
Each of the Orders have four classes: Member (MON or MFR), Officer (OON or OFR), Commander (CON or CFR) and Grand Commander (GCON or GCFR)

These are civilian national honours that the president can confer on anybody both Nigerians and foreigners, military or civilian based on advice of the national honours committee.

Shagari conferred the GCFR honour on Awolowo in 1982 when neither president shagari nor Vice President ekwueme had any national honours. Did that make awolowo higher than shagari or ekwueme then?

Jonathan conferred GCFR on Dangote. Was Dangote higher than the sitting VP that had GCON then?

Until this 4th republic when national honours became bastardized, it was successors that conferred honours on the past office holders unlike now that honours are conferrred on the first day in office.

As the name implies, the CDS is more powerful than the COAS. Cos all the serving chiefs are under the CDS. In this present case the rank says it all.

gabng:


Alas, the relentless cockroach has been found out.

You don't know what you don't know

Stop forming local champion.

u actually confirmed my suspicion dat a goat gave birth to u by quoting me again. If I ever reply u again it means I belong to ur class.

bedspread:

Yes, but some corrections
1, Traditionally in Nigeria: Chief of Army staff = COAS (not CAS) - Chief of Air staff = CAS
2, The COAS and CDS do not command troops, the GOCs and Brigade commanders do. NOT JUST COMMANDS TROOPS BUT ALSO COMMANDS THE GOCs AND BRIGADE COMMANDERS
3, The relationships between the CDS or COAS to the troops depends what loyalties they get directly from the troop commanders!
4, The CDS is a FULL 4 star general while the COAS is a 3 star Lt General. The CDS is by far superior and he can contact the Troop commanders directly if he feels the COAS is compromised! The CDS is the top military uniformed commander in the armed forces. The minister of defence and Minister of state for defence only have political and administrative oversight, although they can issue presidential orders to the CDS and COAS!

In the military there are 2 main appointment areas,

---staff appointment (They are usually in staff offices where budget, policy, procurement, plans are made - COAS is there)
-The chief of army staff (as the name says) is a staff appointment - He sits in an office with officers and men who have staff appointments and co-ordinating powers over all units. The COAS DOES NOT COMMAND TROOPS.

---troop (company commander, battalion commander, brigade commander, task force, GOC)
-GOC - General officers COMMANDING (COMMANDING), HE COMMANDS TROOPS IN THE FIELD (Brigades, regiments, battalions as general officer)
-Brigade Commander
-Battalion Commander
-company Commander
-Platoon commander
-Squad commander

Longman6:



Am quite willing to engage you on this issue in as much as you drop the byline Nigerian Mentality" you used

You would agree with me that the closest military advicer to the president is the NSA who's influence on the president is second to none.for the records you mentioned his influence on the office of the COD and COAs and their advice and recommendation to him.

Can you please tell me why a National Security Advicer would want to become the minister of Defence despite the enormous influence at his disposal, compared to the politiking that comes with the post of the minister.

purchasing military equipments isnt just an operational matter a lot of things has to be taken into consideration as there are lots of back deals, international negotiations and deals that go into arms procurement... Arms trade isnt oil or any other business negotiation bro. if you tell me purchasing uniforms, trucks etc the NA procument unit can do that, but when it comes to strategic weapon acquisition the defence headquaters only states its need, the office of the NSA does the sourcing.

why would i want to be the Minister of Defence when i have the following departments under me:.Departments of Internal Security Defence Affairs Economic Intelligence Special Duties Counter-terrorism Centre Lawful Interception Behavioural Analysis Policy and Strategy External Security Administration and Finance Presidential Communication Command and Control Centre. And i have a budget that isnt under the scrutiny of any senate?

None of the NSA have gone on to be Ministers:Andrew Azazi(former COAS,CODS),Sambo Dasuki(ADC to Babangida, coup ploter that lead Buhari into power and lead IBB into Power) Mohammed Babagana Monguno( former chief of defense intelligence), Aliyu Mohammed Gusau (twice NSA, former chief of Army staff) None of this men would leave the most strategic military position in the world to become a celebrity minister as Buhari would put it. The National Security Advisor is appointed by the President but not confirmed by the Senate, which protects the position to some degree from political controversy and partisanship. All other military chief, ministers are subject to this

The Department of State Security is in the office of the National Security Adviser. The National Intelligence Agency also report to him. No army general/Minister would lead a war without proper directive from this agencies.The Minister of Defence only supervises Army logistics. give me an instance where any has done more than that.

The office is mostly responsible for the oversight functions of the President security vote.

Yes he does coordinate i agree with you but i hope you know no one his kind of influence on National security.

If you want to engage on this issue you should come armed with some research and facts!
NO, I do not “agree that the closest military adviser to the president is the NSA”
-The NSA is NOT a military adviser BUT A SECURITY adviser. The military adviser is the Defence minister.

The NSA can only influence the president MILITARILY based on the specific issue OR he is a very close confidant of the president (nothing to do with his job)

THE NSA is nothing more than assistant to the President for National Security matters.
The influence and role of the NSA varies from president to president, Sambo Dasuki's influence is nothing to do with that of the current guy.

The NSA is a co-ordinator of the nation’s security based on the intelligence he gets from local and global sources, uses it to advice the president on course of action.
It is a staff position in the Office of the President and does not have line or budget authority over DHQ, unlike Defence minister, who is Senate-confirmed official with statutory authority over his department.

The NSA is able to give daily advice (due to proximity) to the President.

The NSA updates the president on security related activities as they happen and if the military are involved in such security related intervention he reports the security aspect of it while the Defence minister will report the military aspects of it or they can both co-ordinate.

The roles may interlope but the defence minister is a more sought after role in any country!

There is a clear reason why senate approves the defence minister and not care much for the national security adviser role! NSA na security secretary and administrator, although some influential people have occupied the role and broadened their portfolio.

The NSA is not even inside the line of succession if president is out of action, the VP, Senate president, Foreign affairs minister and Defence minister are considered.

winj3:


If you want to engage on this issue you should come armed with some research and facts!
NO, I do not “agree that the closest military adviser to the president is the NSA”
-The NSA is NOT a military adviser BUT A SECURITY adviser. The military adviser is the Defence minister.

The NSA can only influence the president MILITARILY based on the specific issue OR he is a very close confidant of the president (nothing to do with his job)

THE NSA is nothing more than assistant to the President for National Security matters.
The influence and role of the NSA varies from president to president, Sambo Dasuki's influence is nothing to do with that of the current guy.

The NSA is a co-ordinator of the nation’s security based on the intelligence he gets from local and global sources, uses it to advice the president on course of action.
It is a staff position in the Office of the President and does not have line or budget authority over DHQ, unlike Defence minister, who is Senate-confirmed official with statutory authority over his department.

The NSA is able to give daily advice (due to proximity) to the President.

The NSA updates the president on security related activities as they happen and if the military are involved in such security related intervention he reports the security aspect of it while the Defence minister will report the military aspects of it or they can both co-ordinate.

The roles may interlope but the defence minister is a more sought after role in any country!

There is a clear reason why senate approves the defence minister and not care much for the national security adviser role! NSA na security secretary and administrator, although some influential people have occupied the role and broadened their portfolio.

The NSA is not even inside the line of succession if president is out of action, the VP, Senate president, Foreign affairs minister and Defence minister are considered.

Hello . . . . @the bolded, you just copied whats obtainable in the United States from wikipedia, replaced with the positions that's obtainable in Nigeria i.e: "replaced secretary of state with Foreign affairs minister" and pasted here. Nawa o.

blackgig:


Hello . . . . @the bolded, you just copied whats obtainable in the United States from wikipedia, replaced with the positions that's obtainable in Nigeria i.e: "replaced secretary of state with Foreign affairs minister" and pasted here. Nawa o.

The Nigerian NSA is modelled out the same in America and many other countries with the same role.
The Nigerian NSA is exactly as I decribed.

What is your evidence the functions are not the same?

Let me guess, you have none except making words "bold"

Eaa247:


u actually confirmed my suspicion dat a goat gave birth to u by quoting me again. If I ever reply u again it means I belong to ur class.

You must indeed be delirious son

You cant be my class when you don't have the brain matter for an IQ test.

You know not what you don't know.

Admit it & learn or remain in denial.

Liljeez:
Are you a Cfite??

UAE123:
The Chief of Defence Staff control the 3 members of the armed forces which are the Army,Navy & Air force because their heads report to him & it is his constitutional duty to oversee all of them & give direction where necessary but the Chief of Army Staff only control the Army.

are you a leaner? chief of defence is a figurehead. COAS is the one that has the power to orchestrate or stop coups

NNAMDIII:
you be novice for military matter!

I LAUGH U SPIRTUALLY....
BY GOD'S GRACE I AM A PRODUCT OF RHE NN FROM NURSERY SCHOOL TO SECONDARY.
I HV BEEN IN MILITARY SURROUNDINGS FOR OVER abt 22yrs...
In military knowledge you cannot know it as I do.
My old man served in the military until being a one star general....
Check your facts..or maybe you are a product of this Facebook military boys we hv now

bedspread:
I LAUGH U SPIRTUALLY....
BY GOD'S GRACE I AM A PRODUCT OF RHE NN FROM NURSERY SCHOOL TO SECONDARY.
I HV BEEN IN MILITARY SURROUNDINGS FOR OVER abt 22yrs...
In military knowledge you cannot know it as I do.
My old man served in the military until being a one star general....
Check your facts..or maybe you are a product of this Facebook military boys we hv now

What if i told you that i passed through the grounds of yamuza zakari and my uncle was the former Director General of NYSC! Nairaland is a faceless forum,anybody can claim anything! CDS is superior to COAS!


I don't like arguing with anonymous people, if you still believe that COAS is superior to CDS, i can still ask a nairalander here who's also a Major in NA! I'll just mention your moniker so that he could clear your doubts! How's your morale ex-boy?

birdman:

are you a leaner? chief of defence is a figurehead. COAS is the one that has the power to orchestrate or stop coups

na wah o.

-This person is basing their argument on certaIN ROGUE COAS like IBB and Abacha for their comment.
--A GOC, Brigade commander or even ADC can initiate coup, succeeding does not make these lower rankers anything more than OPPORTUNISTS!
---Seniority is in the dustbin in a coup (yes only coup) situation!!!

The CDS is the tri-Service commander and is a senior rank compared to COAS. The CDS has the power to gather troops from army, Airforce and NAvy to form a joint task force, unit or armed forces special forces team! COAS cannot do that!!!
The CDS can do that because he outranks the COAS, CAS and CNS!

The CDS controls the discipline, moral and professional life of everything in the armed forces (Defence staff), including the COAS, CAS and CNS. He is the CHIEF (yes chief) of defence staff (all defence staff) - if you wear a military uniform he is your boss!

So please shut up and stop displaying your ignorance!

win2kwire:

na wah o.

-This person is basing their argument on certaIN ROGUE COAS like IBB and Abacha for their comment.
--A GOC, Brigade commander or even ADC can initiate coup, succeeding does not make these lower rankers anything more than OPPORTUNISTS!
---Seniority is in the dustbin in a coup (yes only coup) situation!!!

The CDS is the tri-Service commander and is a senior rank compared to COAS. The CDS has the power to gather troops from army, Airforce and NAvy to form a joint task force, unit or armed forces special forces team! COAS cannot do that!!!
The CDS can do that because he outranks the COAS, CAS and CNS!

The CDS controls the discipline, moral and professional life of everything in the armed forces (Defence staff), including the COAS, CAS and CNS. He is the CHIEF (yes chief) of defence staff (all defence staff) - if you wear a military uniform he is your boss!

So please shut up and stop displaying your ignorance!

Wise up and stop this grammar. COAS is the presidents kinsman or very close buddy while CDS is the figurehead used to appease other groups. Check Buharis govt fir example. Wise up..dont be like GEJ who replaced Ihejirika, his ally as COAS with someone else. You see how it ended? For the third time i tell you, wise up... And pay attention

birdman:


Wise up and stop this grammar. COAS is the presidents kinsman or very close buddy while CDS is the figurehead used to appease other groups. Check Buharis govt fir example. Wise up..dont be like GEJ who replaced Ihejirika, his ally as COAS with someone else. You see how it ended? For the third time i tell you, wise up... And pay attention

THE QUESTION WAS.................... Chief Of Defence Staff Vs Chief Of Army Staff: Which Position Is More Superior?

NOT NIGERIAN POLITICAL OR MILITARY POWER PLAY, NEPOTISM AND FAVOURTISM! If you pay attention to the most basic detail you will have the most basic commonsense response!

tdayof:


Marines are boot in ground. The US Army are more in use /deployed than any other branch of the US military.

mr, I don't know if you're a fan boy or internet reader but it's obvious you're not getting your facts right. Nigerian military is a formidable force with the navy being the most aggressive, dangerous and most equipped of all three. The most lethal unit in the Nigerian military is the navy SBS. These guys conduct Air/Sea/land missions.

The Nigerian AFSF guys are the next in line. These guys are being trained by Russian FSB and some by Israeli.

Mr, the Nigerian military has been more effective since Buhari came in. Not because he did something better but because uncle Sam sells him weapon. Ex uncle Sam didn't sell GEJ military hardware. The issue should be Nigeria developing a capable defence industry and stop relying on some military hardware from other countries.

NIA intelligence gather is on point. I have said it before you are either a fan boy or internet reader.
Nigeria has military deployed in up to seven African countries, the Nigerian military is capable of defending itself against external aggression. The Nigerian airforce without a 4th generation jet and some equipments has been able to inflict much damage on BHT. Don't tell me about the bombing that happened. The US Air Force with her 4th generations jets bombed civilians locations twice after the Nigerian incident already mistakenly.
Facts remains most Nigerians know less about the capability of their country militarily.

I have met with US service chiefs at AOC gathering. I have seen them speak. The US Army remains the most deployed troops of the US military.

Something must be wrong with your head for this statement. Na Nigeria military u dey hype like this? Nigeria no get military pls. Travel out there and see the true definition of military.

Eaa247:
chief of defence staff is superior. in USA its calld d
efence secretary or secretary of defence

..
I think that post is equivalent to the honourable minister of defence here in Nigeria.

Give me COAS and take CDS.

I don't about Nigerian military doctrine, but in the USA, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs is just a mere administrative and advisory position.

Command information flows directly from the President to the Unit commanders. This is the reason, it is impossible to carry out a coup in the USA.

Each of the Divisions receives their instructions directly from the President not through any Joint Chief.

BlackMbakara1:
Strategically the COAS is the strongest, while CDS administratively is the strongest.

COAS commands more loyalty, whereas CDS commands less...

The CDS is more suprerior and has more power, but the COAS commands more loyalty in the army structure. The army is the most powerful and respected arm of the Nigerian military and that's why they are usually the ones involved in coups. If any of the two should partake in a coup, the COAS will be more successful because he has more loyalty from soldiers and officers. In coups, you need enough loyalty from soldiers in as many units as possible.

This superiority of a thing between CDS and COAS shouldn't be an argument. The chief of defense staff is the most superior. Immediately you're appointed to that office, the president upgrade you to the rank of General.. General is the highest rank in the military, making all other ranks to salute first.
If you're in doubt of superiority, check this on youtube "The arrival of four star general" Buratai saluted his boss before the General inspected the quarters guard..... Just like university settings where we have the Vice chancellor as the head.. He can't make decision on his own without the approval of the Governing council which is the Senate. COAS get approval from CDS. CDS has the power to mobilize troops from the three formations in the army. COAS power is limited to the Army alone.....



We shouldn't argue baselessly. Is just like saying buhari has the superior power over everyone, why then does he have to get the approval of the senate before doing things?


That's what we called "rule of law". There's always an hierarchy in every parastatal.