UyiIredia:


There is no way that you can seperate atheism from belief as long as it is named. As long as atheists have REASONS for not believing those REASONS ARE BELIEFS having to do with atheism and therefore atheism can be defined as a belief. Why do you atheists not get this?

you just said a lot of things without saying anything lol

Saverin:


I am neither a deist nor an atheist. I have no label. If you must tag me, then maybe "free-thinker" will suffice.

To your question: You don't understand my point. My point is without the invention of microscope, the arguments on microbes will vary. Now any person can pick a microscope and say for sure what it looks like.

I don't know for sure the physical impact God has on the world. My thoughts on the existence of God run wide. Until we invent that "microscope" nobody can say for sure. If you look throughout human history and records, you will see the repetition of a supreme energy and eternal consciousness in all cultures. My position is instead of saying God doesn't exist because there is no definite proof, let's think and investigate

And what makes you think atheists dont do that?

Let me ask you a simple question, Do you accept the definition of God as described in the bible, yes or no?

UyiIredia:


There is no way that you can seperate atheism from belief as long as it is named. As long as atheists have REASONS for not believing those REASONS ARE BELIEFS having to do with atheism and therefore atheism can be defined as a belief. Why do you atheists not get this?

I find it amusing when people attempt to impose their world view on others. I just can't but wonder why the greatest idea of the 20th century flew completely over their heads. If it had, and they'd bothered to look up at the time, there is no way Einstein's theory of General Relativity could have passed them by without their realising that each individual has eyes with which they see and no two individuals have to see things the same way.

Do read my view on 'belief' here if you can be bothered.

KingEbukasBlog:


Let's go with your definition of atheism and see how rational it

"An atheist is someone who doesnt see the evidence for the existence of a God and rejects it, its as simple as that."

Let's use this definition with some entities that have been conferred that godhood status or deified or seen as a God . Let's go . Very simple and easy exercise


1."An atheist is someone who doesnt see the evidence for the existence of the universe and rejects it, its as simple as that."

2. "An atheist is someone who doesnt see the evidence for the existence of the Sun and rejects it, its as simple as that."

3. "An atheist is someone who doesnt see the evidence for the existence of the Moon and rejects it, its as simple as that."

4. "An atheist is someone who doesnt see the evidence for the existence of the First Cause and rejects it, its as simple as that."

Do you see how irrational your definition is ?

Now let me show how your definition is based on ignorance

Look at no 4 - the First Cause - do you know that there are atheists who admit the existence of the First Cause and that there are theists who reject the existence of the First Cause ?

So now , do you agree with the OP that your atheism is an irrational worldview ?

This is fallacious sir.

1. We can see the universe, we live in it. Its existence is beyond doubt
2. We can see the moon. Its existence is beyond doubt
3. We can see the sun. Its existence is beyond doubt

But...

4. The first cause only exists in an abstract fallacious argument. Its existence cannot be proven.


To put these four things as the same is dishonest, sir

UyiIredia:


There is no way that you can seperate atheism from belief as long as it is named. As long as atheists have REASONS for not believing those REASONS ARE BELIEFS having to do with atheism and therefore atheism can be defined as a belief. Why do you atheists not get this?

Reasons are beliefs?

So if I chose not to eat rat poison so that I will not be sick, is that a belief?

Sir, kindly go and sit down. You have to go and learn some basic logic.

superhumanist:



Reasons are beliefs?

So if I chose not to eat rat poison so that I will not be sick, is that a belief?

Sir, kindly go and sit down. You have to go and learn some basic logic.

nit eating rat poison = choice thinking you wob't be sick = reason/belief

budaatum:

I find it amusing when people attempt to impose their world view on others. I just can't but wonder why the greatest idea of the 20th century flew completely over their heads. If it had, and they'd bothered to look up at the time, there is no way Einstein's theory of General Relativity could have passed them by without their realising that each individual has eyes with which they see and no two individuals have to see things the same way.

Do read my view on 'belief' here if you can be bothered.

Ignorance often breeds arrogance as Darwin said all the while being blind to his cogntive bias and fallacies.

Atheism is a lack of belief in God or deities quite allright but this hardly means atheism i not a belief and has no belief. It only means atheism is not a belief IN GODS. All atheists must believe there is no credible evidence for deities.

The escapism by atheists is silly.

UyiIredia:



nit eating rat poison = choice thinking you wob't be sick = reason/belief

Sir, there not much to be gained from discussing with you if you can equate "reason" to "belief" in the example I gave.

Choosing not to eat rat poison so that I will not be sick is a belief? I can imagine the lengths you are willing to twist logic to claim that atheism is a belief.

superhumanist:



Sir, there not much to be gained from discussing with you if you can equate "reason" to "belief" in the example I gave.

Choosing not to eat rat poison so that I will not be sick is a belief? I can imagine the lengths you are willing to twist logic to claim that atheism is a belief.

" Reason is the capacity for consciously making sense of things, establishing and verifying facts , applying logic, and changing or justifying practices, institutions and BELIEFS based on new or existing information"

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reason

The sloppythink in atheism never fails to amuse and annoy me.

UyiIredia:


All atheists must believe there is no credible evidence for deities.

One really should not have to believe in the evidence if it is credibly evident. It obviously isn't to you, hence your choosing to believe it, or not. That is your choice.

I do not believe there are no gods. Having checked the evidence available to me, I have come to the conclusion that there are indeed no gods, and I have no reason to not say so.

I after all would not believe in gods who evidently exist! I would unequivocally know that gods exists, and claim so. Or would you claim I were ignorant or arrogant or blind to my own cognitive bias and fallacies, if I were to say, "I know gods exist", as opposed to the not quite so sure, believing gods exist?

You may insult me in whatever way pleases you (though you might wish to mind appearing blind to your own cognitive bias and fallacies). But your opinion has no bearing whatsoever on me. It is just another belief you have. Reality has nothing to do with your position.

KingEbukasBlog:


An unnecessarily long post .

You are not an atheist simply because you deny or reject the existence of the First Cause .

Oh was that post of his to heavy 4 you or you think its everyone that would fall 4 this your silly tricks? i think most people are begining to understand how you twist things argue

superhumanist:



This is fallacious sir.

1. We can see the universe, we live in it. Its existence is beyond doubt
2. We can see the moon. Its existence is beyond doubt
3. We can see the sun. Its existence is beyond doubt

But...

4 The first cause only exists in an abstract fallacious argument. Its existence cannot be proven

To put these four things as the same is dishonest, sir

KingEbukasblog someone has very well exposed your fallacious argument.

budaatum:

One really should not have to believe in the evidence if it is credibly evident. It obviously isn't to you, hence your choosing to believe it, or not. That is your choice.

I do not believe there are no gods. Having checked the evidence available to me, I have come to the conclusion that there are indeed no gods, and I have no reason to not say so.

I after all would not believe in gods who evidently exist! I would unequivocally know that gods exists, and claim so. Or would you claim I were ignorant or arrogant or blind to my own cognitive bias and fallacies, if I were to say, "I know gods exist", as opposed to the not quite so sure, believing gods exist?

You may insult me in whatever way pleases you (though you might wish to mind appearing blind to your own cognitive bias and fallacies). But your opinion has no bearing whatsoever on me. It is just another belief you have. Reality has nothing to do with your position.

You trip and piss on yourself with poor logic.

People please look.

I do not believe there are no gods. Having
checked the evidence available to me, I have
come to the conclusion that there are indeed no
gods,

IMPLICATION!

Abeg KingEbukasBlog come o! Food don done.

donnffd:


And what makes you think atheists dont do that?

Let me ask you a simple question, Do you accept the definition of God as described in the bible, yes or no?

1. I have read countless threads, posts and articles that make me to think so

2. Nk. The contradictions are mind boggling

I do not believe that atheism is not wise. Having checked tshe evudence before me I have come to the conclusion that atheism is not wise.

UyiIredia:


" Reason is the capacity for consciously making sense of things, establishing and verifying facts , applying logic, and changing or justifying practices, institutions and BELIEFS based on new or existing information"

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reason

The sloppythink in atheism never fails to amuse and annoy me.

Dishonesty will not allow you use a dictionary to define words. Sir, use a dictionary.

UyiIredia:


IMPLICATION!

Abeg KingEbukasBlog come o! Food don done.

I think you think you are discussing with some child who has a need to regard your opinion? Just so you know, I am rolling on the floor laughing my head off. If I were you, I would have called god, and not KEB.

OP, you're in self inflicted error and infantile misinformation. Atheism is simply a response position, to unsubstantiated claims of existence of Gods. Nothing more, nothing less.

Your caption betrays the depth of your ignorance, and a deep seated cognitive dissonance, which has brought you great anguish.

UyiIredia:


You trip and piss on yourself with poor logic.

People please look.



IMPLICATION!

Abeg KingEbukasBlog come o! Food don done.

I've told him how illogical that declaration is but he is an atheist so you'd expect that he would never understand .

UyiIredia:
I do not believe that atheism is not wise. Having checked tshe evudence before me I have come to the conclusion that atheism is not wise.

Nice one

superhumanist:



This is fallacious sir.

1. We can see the universe, we live in it. Its existence is beyond doubt
2. We can see the moon. Its existence is beyond doubt
3. We can see the sun. Its existence is beyond doubt

But...

4. The first cause only exists in an abstract fallacious argument. Its existence cannot be proven.


To put these four things as the same is dishonest, sir

Read my comment and understand or visit this thread for more explanation . You've made no point sir .

https://www.nairaland.com/3944605/there-atheists-acknowledge-existence-creator

dalaman:


KingEbukasblog someone has very well exposed your fallacious argument.

His comment has absolutely nothing to do with the point I made , so what fallacy is he exposing ?

Universe is god to a pantheist
Ancient Pharaohs were gods to the Egyptians
Ancient Emperors were gods to the Chinese and Japanese
Mary the mother of Jesus is a goddess in Collyridianism
The Sun and Moon are gods to pagans

Ignorance from an atheist :

budaatum:
Having checked the evidence available to me, I have come to the conclusion that there are indeed no gods, and I have no reason to not say so.

Saverin:


1. I have read countless threads, posts and articles that make me to think so

2. Nk. The contradictions are mind boggling

Then you, my good sir is an atheist.

You claim to be a free thinker but you break the first rule of free thinking, Always be logically consistent.

Atheism is not a claim that God doesnt exist, it is just the rejection of claims.

Now you dont want to identify as an atheist but that doesnt stop you from being one.

I would assume you a honest person, so many yahoo boys do bad things and are Nigerians, does that mean you are not a Nigerian, or does it mean all Nigerians are yahoo boys?...being Nigerian has nothing to do with ur morality, or political views or stuffs like that, all that is involved to be a Nigerian is to be born in Nigeria, simple.

So it is here, all it takes is to reject the claim of a gods existence, it has nothing to do with your free thinking, or with your own personal idea of God or what have you, Atheism is not mutual exclusive from free thinking and being agnostic for that matter.

I personally am an agnostic atheist and also a free thinker and yes i see some atheists on here spill nonsense but that doesnt change the fact that i am what i am and it by no means that all atheists are like that, that would be a fallacy of generalization.

KingEbukasBlog:

Universe is god to a pantheist
Ancient Pharaohs were gods to the Egyptians
Ancient Emperors were gods to the Chinese and Japanese
Mary the mother of Jesus is a goddess in Collyridianism
The Sun and Moon are gods to pagans

Ignorance from an atheist :

And stones are gods to some. And someone deified their girlfriend recently. And if they all limited themselves to that, I really have no problem. But you lot then do a Nebuchadnezzar, and claim some invisible non-existing thing is not only your god, but that I too should acknowledge its existence and worship it! And I say, tufia, god forbid that I should worship any other gods but me! After all, since we all seem able to make up god entities as we wish, why can't I? Not that I need your permission, mind.

But I'd like to hear the opinion of the person who called you on me to see what he thinks about your god version. I'm sure he didn't mean all these gods you've mentioned!

superhumanist:



Dishonesty will not allow you use a dictionary to define words. Sir, use a dictionary.

You are the one being silly and dishonest. I will even use 2 online dictionaries.

reason: (Logic) A premise of an argument in support of a BELIEF, especially a minor premise when given after the conclusion.

https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/reason


reason: a statement presented in justification or explanation of a BELIEF or action

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/reason


Some other definitions do not use the word belief and use the word justification, explanation (Merriem Webster); conviction which is another word for a strong belief (Free Dictionary) and motive which also means reason. The crucial point is whatever statement you give as a reason for a position you hold must be something you believe and as such is a belief. It's that simple.

donnffd:


Then you, my good sir is an atheist.

You claim to be a free thinker but you break the first rule of free thinking, Always be logically consistent.

Atheism is not a claim that God doesnt exist, it is just the rejection of claims.

Now you dont want to identify as an atheist but that doesnt stop you from being one.

I would assume you a honest person, so many yahoo boys do bad things and are Nigerians, does that mean you are not a Nigerian, or does it mean all Nigerians are yahoo boys?...being Nigerian has nothing to do with ur morality, or political views or stuffs like that, all that is involved to be a Nigerian is to be born in Nigeria, simple.

So it is here, all it takes is to reject the claim of a gods existence, it has nothing to do with your free thinking, or with your own personal idea of God or what have you, Atheism is not mutual exclusive from free thinking and being agnostic for that matter.

I personally am an agnostic atheist and also a free thinker and yes i see some atheists on here spill nonsense but that doesnt change the fact that i am what i am and it by no means that all atheists are like that, that would be a fallacy of generalization.

"Atheism is not a claim that God doesnt exist"

Pure stupidity. This is why I became less active on NL. How do you expect me not to insult a person this dishonest and making poor use of their brain?

Now BTW I know how inadequate Wikipedia can be but here you go

"Atheism is, in the broadest sense, the absence
of belief in the existence of deities .[1][2][3][4] Less broadly, atheism is the rejection of belief that any deities exist. [5][6] In an even narrower sense, atheism is specifically the position that there are no deities."

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atheism

Now I even disagree with this definition in some respects and I am certain Christians and atheists argued on the talk page before concluding it. But the bolded makes it clear a belief there is no god or deities is atheism.

How silly and dishonest to deny this in order to pretend you have nothing to defend.

UyiIredia:


"Atheism is not a claim that God doesnt exist"

Pure stupidity. This is why I became less active on NL. How do you expect me not to insult a person this dishonest and making poor use of their brain?

Now BTW I know how inadequate Wikipedia can be but here you go

"Atheism is, in the broadest sense, the absence
of belief in the existence of deities .[1][2][3][4] Less broadly, atheism is the rejection of belief that any deities exist. [5][6] In an even narrower sense, atheism is specifically the position that there are no deities."

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atheism

Now I even disagree with this definition in some respects and I am certain Christians and atheists argued on the talk page before concluding it. But the bolded makes it clear a belief there is no god or deities is atheism.

How silly and dishonest to deny this in order to pretend you have nothing to defend.

You have said it all. In a nutshell an atheist assumes the role that ONLY they can say if God exists or not based on their own terms so until they say so then every other belief in God or gods by anyone else is stupid and insane.

Bunch of hippies.

KingEbukasBlog:




I've told him how illogical that declaration is but he is an atheist so you'd expect that he would never understand .

No, he understands. He is just a bloody liar like many other atheists. Nigerians just copy things from the West same with our atheists. Earlier on, atheists didnt argue this crap. I dont recall Tai Solarin arguing whether atheism was ONLY lacking a belief in God or belueving in no God and he was an agnostic atheist.

It's New Atheists that came up with this silly trick,obviously to deflect pressure away from them on beliefs they pretend not to have.

It's stupid really.

It's so bad some insane atheists on Quora categoricallyy denued that atheism is a rejection of a belief in deities. And see the stupid reason some gave: that rejection suggests the belief in god is tfue but they deny it. Which is silly; you can reject a true and a false belief, rejection doesnt make a thing true.

UyiIredia:


You are the one being silly and dishonest. I will even use 2 online dictionaries.

reason: (Logic) A premise of an argument in support of a BELIEF, especially a minor premise when given after the conclusion.

https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/reason


reason: a statement presented in justification or explanation of a BELIEF or action

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/reason


Some other definitions do not use the word belief and use the word justification, explanation (Merriem Webster); conviction which is another word for a strong belief (Free Dictionary) and motive which also means reason. The crucial point is whatever statement you give as a reason for a position you hold must be something you believe and as such is a belief. It's that simple.

Now, that you have given "selected" definitions of "reason", is "reason" the same as "belief" in your definition? Reason means justification it does not mean belief.


With regards to the argument I was making, "reason" means "solid justification". This is not belief.

Here is the oxford dictionary

REASON
1.1-mass noun- Good or obvious cause to do something.
‘we have reason to celebrate’
https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/reason

butterflyl1on:


You have said it all. In a nutshell an atheist assumes the role that ONLY they can say if God exists or not based on their own terms so until they say so then every other belief in God or gods by anyone else is stupid and insane.

Bunch of hippies.

Sir, is this a sensible conclusion from you? Which atheist told you this?

UyiIredia:


"Atheism is not a claim that God doesnt exist"

Pure stupidity. This is why I became less active on NL. How do you expect me not to insult a person this dishonest and making poor use of their brain?

Now BTW I know how inadequate Wikipedia can be but here you go

"Atheism is, in the broadest sense, the absence
of belief in the existence of deities .[1][2][3][4] Less broadly, atheism is the rejection of belief that any deities exist. [5][6] In an even narrower sense, atheism is specifically the position that there are no deities."

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atheism

Now I even disagree with this definition in some respects and I am certain Christians and atheists argued on the talk page before concluding it. But the bolded makes it clear a belief there is no god or deities is atheism.

How silly and dishonest to deny this in order to pretend you have nothing to defend.

i wont stoop to your level...because if you dont understand that a wikipedia page can be editted by anyone then whats the need engaging with you?