adetayo234:


First off, there was no distinction between brother, cousin or other male relatives in the ancient days. You can only tell if she had other children if the Bible actually mentioned that she or Joseph has other kids, but the Bible never said that.

Secondly, when Jesus was dying at the cross, he handed his mother to one of his disciples. Why would he do that if Mary had other kids? I mean, Mary could have just gone to her other kids now. And Jesus wouldn't have needed to even bother about such an issue since her mother had other kids.

Mark 6:3.."Is not this the carpenter, the son of Mary and brother of James and Joses and Judas and Simon, and are his sisters here with us?"

Luke 8:19 "..Your mother and your brothers are standing outside, wanting to see you,”

John 2:12 "..he went down to Capernaum with his mother, his brothers, and his disciples; and they remained there a few days."

Jesus' brothers were with him at his early ministry, but he you search the bible afterward, he was essentially with his disciples. They were not there with him during the persecution, and it was not mentioned that they were there either at the foot of the cross...definitely none of them were one of his disciples...Jesus know John and he is the disciple he loved more and he knows that John was a believer....It is not uncommon for a dying christian leader to handle over the care of his mother to someone whom he loved and who is also a believer that has been following his around and who was also right there by his dying bed side.

joey150:


Sometimes people make me laugh. Catholics compiled the bible. You are studying their book, yet you don't want to take lessons from them.

Like it or not, the Catholic church is the root of Christianity. They have the final say on all bible teachings. They personally vetted the bible. If you doubt their stance on Mary as a virgin and not having any other kids, then you better also doubt the last supper and the rest of the bible.

This is for you and other protestant Christians, that are quick to act smart.

Wonderful write up.

Syncan:



The first bold: You can never show me where you got that assumption from scripture, so you are now the one speaking where the bible was silent.

Second bold: Which error are you talking about, I have shown you who the mother of those mentioned is, Scripture clearly pointed it out, so you won't be in this error, but you still fell into it.

Chronology of events:

1. The names were mentioned as brothers of Jesus (Note:not children of Mary), Mk.6:3 "Is not this the carpenter, the son of Mary, the brother of James, and Joses, and of Juda, and Simon? and are not his sisters here with us? And they were offended at him.

2. The mother of those brethren of Jesus is mentioned .......MK.15:40 "There were also women looking on afar off: among whom was Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James the less and of Joses, and Salome".Mk15:40

3. The woman is identified properly... john19:25."Now there stood by the cross of Jesus his mother, and his mother's sister, Mary the wife of Cleophas, and Mary Magdalene".

4. The earlier mentioned Jude confirms he is brother of James, who is also son of the other Mary in Jude 1:1 "Jude, servant of Jesus Christ and brother of James".

5. This James called brother of Jesus is also His apostle, James the less. Gal 1:19 "But other of the apostles saw I none, save James the Lord's brother"

Now from the above, counting from

5. We see that James the less is the apostle of Jesus and mentioned as his brother,
4, we see that this James has a brother who is Jude,
3, We see wife of cleopas identified
2, we see that James has another brother who is Joses, and their mother is "wife of cleopas" as seen in 3.
1, All three brothers are mentioned including Simon as brothers of Jesus, but we have already now identified them as Children of the other Mary, wife of cleopas.

This is scripture.

Assumptions again. The Bible stated what was clear for anyone to read.

Matthew 1:25 talked about future sexual intercourse after the birth of Christ. So, there was no assumption to the first bold texts. The virginity of Mary ended after the birth of Christ.

In all, the Bible remains the sole authority.

Investnow2017:


It was Luke who reported Elizabeth being the COUSIN of Mary. If the biological brothers of Jesus were cousins or nephews Luke would have indicated that when writing the book of Acts of the apostles Chapter 1:14.

If Joseph had other children BEFORE Jesus, where does the Bible say that?

Mary was bethrothed to Joseph before Jesus was born. Why would Joseph want to marry if he had no need to have children. If he never wanted a child would he not have voiced his complaint when he noticed that Mary was pregnant. Was it the custom of the Jews back then to marry without the prospect of raising children?

Those who knew better referred to Jesus as having brothers and sisters as reported in the Holy Scriptures.Mark 6:3, 1st Cor 9:5 etc.

Of most important though is the vital role of Jesus Christ in the outworking of God's purpose to sanctify his illustrious Name.

You are just going in circles. The use of brethren for relatives is indisputable in scripture, secondly I have already shown the mother of those mentioned from scriptures. I repeat, no where in scripture will you find it those people called "Children of Mary", NO WHERE.

I never said Joseph had any other Children before Jesus, don't know where you got that from. Those people mentioned are children of Cleopas, some theologians say he is a brother to Joseph. Scripture didn't say exactly who he was, but must be a relation.

You talk of Joseph voicing out complain, well he was planning on how to send Mary home, have you forgotten? There's so much speculations in your post, let us stick to what is revealed.

Hati13:
Investnow2017,

The Ethiopian Bible is the most completed one compared to others.

Please help me tell him.

Nauttyprof:


Assumptions again. The Bible stated what was clear for anyone to read.

Matthew 1:25 talked about future sexual intercourse after the birth of Christ. So, there was no assumption to the first bold texts. The virginity of Mary ended after the birth of Christ.

In all, the Bible remains the sole authority.

Hahahaha, Please from 1-5, which one is not from Scripture? But this your statement "They are the ones given birth to after the birth of Christ" is purely a figment of your imaginations, else quote me a single place that says this.

Investnow2017:


Oh i like your references and persuasion. Yet this is not to be taken that Mary never had other children. She continued to remain the wife of Joseph after the birth of Jesus. If the equation of Joseph is refutted of what essence was he in the entire picture?

Reading the gospel account leaves no room to draw conclusion that Mary continued to remain a virgin. Those said to be BROTHERS of Jesus were actually his half brothers, children of Mary by Joseph. Where the context suggests otherwise it would have been indicated.

For instance, Elizabeth was referred to as Mary's COUSIN, Luke 1.36. And the other gospel writers make clear that Jesus had sisters too.

As there were many Marys so there were many Josephs, Judahs, Simeon, etc. And to a large extent some of these are actually related in some way. If those referred to as BROTHERS of Jesus were cousins or nephews, this would have been captured.

Joseph might have died before Jesus, hence Jesus handed his mother over to John his disciple-friend closest to him. Why? Apparently because his own half brothers by Mary were not yet believers according to John 7:5. But after his death, they became believers that is why subsequent Bible writers like Paul while writing endeavoured to differentiate the direct brothers of Jesus as he did in his letters at Galatians 1:19 and 1st Corinthians 9:5.

The apostle Luke who identified Elizabeth at Luke 1:36 would have done the same while referring to Jesus' half brothers as BROTHERS at Acts 1:14.

Yes, Mary had other children after her virgin birth of Jesus, hence Jesus is rightly called Mary's FIRSTBORN son, Luke 2:6-7.

In all, however, it does not justify praying through Mary or in her name when there is a clear command and principle that prayers should be said to God THROUGH Jesus Christ, who himself says I am the Way, the Truth and the Life, no one comes to the Father except through me, John 14:6

Matthew 1:25 clearly tells us that the Virginity of Mary ended after the birth of Christ

Investnow2017:


You did not answer the question: Why was Jesus referred to as Mary's FIRSTBORN son? Luke 2:6-7

Jesus is the first son and only son.
If there is any second, third, etc show me in the bible where she gave birth to her second son.
Please don't divert our attention , have you read the bible reference of my first quote.

valentineuwakwe:
Hi,

Naiarlanders, wishing you guys the very best of christmas as you are celebrate the season, please am not too good in reading the bible so i want to ask did Mary the mother of Jesus christ had other biological children after the birth of Jesus?

That's a very irrelevant question.

The regular question is **WHY DID MARY LIVE IN THE HOUSE OF A MAN SHE ISN'T MARRIED TO?**

The brothers of Jesus listed in Matthew 13: 55 are James and Joseph and Simon and Jude.

Gal 1.19 Identifies one of the apostles James (the less) as the brother of Jesus. (Note two of the twelve apostles bear James. One the son of Zebedee and the other son of Alpheus)

Luke 6:15: Says James father is Alpheus (not Joseph, ).
Luke 6:16: identifies the apostle Jude as the brother of James the less.
Mark 15: 40 Acknowledges that the mother of James the less is also the mother of Joseph. Hence James and Joseph are brothers. So with this we can see that James the less, Jude and Joseph listed as brothers of Jesus in Matthew 13:55 have been identified .
John 19:25 Identifies Mary of Cleopas(Alpheus) as the sister of Mary the mother of Jesus.( Note Cleopas is the Greek version of the Aramaic name Alpheus).

So we are left with just one of the brothers of Jesus to identify. That's your assignment

some people brain det work for Nairaland

Nauttyprof:


Assumptions again. The Bible stated what was clear for anyone to read.

Matthew 1:25 talked about future sexual intercourse after the birth of Christ. So, there was no assumption to the first bold texts. The virginity of Mary ended after the birth of Christ.


In all, the Bible remains the sole authority.

mat1:25 said 'But he had no sexual relations with her before she gave birth to her son son. Joseph named him Jesus'

So tell me where bible said she had intercourse with Joseph.

Remember Ezekiel prophecy Ezekiel 44:2

Muafrika2:

Apart from the book of Enoch, what other extra books (also not found in the catholic bible) does it have?

The Ethiopian Bible has 88 books and the Catholic one has 66 books.

For example, the Garima gospel books are only found in Ethiopic (Geez) language and it's the earliest Christian manuscripts in the world.

https://www.nairaland.com/4196309/worlds-earliest-illustrated-christian-manuscript#62683840

miraclejoy:

mat1:25 said 'But he had no sexual relations with her before she gave birth to her son son. Joseph named him Jesus'

The original text by KJV Matthew 1:25 And knew her not till she had brought forth her firstborn son: and he called his name JESUS.

So, this mean it ended after the birth

Hati13:

The Ethiopian Bible has 88 books and the Catholic one has 66 books.

For example, the Garima gospel books are only found in Ethiopic (Geez) language and it's the earliest Christian manuscripts in the world.

https://www.nairaland.com/4196309/worlds-earliest-illustrated-christian-manuscript#62683840

Cool

Syncan:


Do you have any proof that he did?

IMAGINE HOW YOU REASON YOU MEAN FOR 12 WHOLE YEARS HE WAS JUST LOOKING AT MARY WITH EYES

Nauttyprof:


The original text by KJV Matthew 1:25 And knew her not till she had brought forth her firstborn son: and he called his name JESUS.

So, this mean it ended after the birth

that's your assumption , read other translation or better get a Hebrew bible.

but can we still regard her as "virgin Mary"

wirinet:


Are you insinuating that Joseph never consummated his marriage to Mary? Do you think that was possible?

You people rush to defend your dogma without thinking deeply, a better excuse would have been that Jesus's brothers were children from joseph's previous marriage. So they would be half brothers. There is no where in the bible that cousins were referred to as brothers, they specifically define them as brother's children or sisters children.

Bros, you have no point. Can you think deeper than the church? Imagine your point of view, very shallow. Mary gives you people problem because she is honoured. God gave her to the world, and the world as shall call her blessed. Go read your Bible the gospel of Luke. when she was praising God, She said, '' All generation shall call me Blessed." Who are the generation? By the way, why do you people have problem with the Catholics honouring Mary, if you are asked who first honoured her, was it not God, when the message came from the Angel, "Hail, full of grace, the Lord is with you?" So who are Angels, messengers of God, so who has that statement, "Hail, full of grace, the Lord is with you?" We shouldn't be deceived by petty pastors. Well, it has been said in Revelations that , The woman will crush the head of the serpent.
Sin came through Adam and Eve, Eve persuaded Adam to eat from the fruit, so Eve caused the sin and what is happening to man, but in order for God to redeem man, He sent His son Jesus, through a Woman, Virgin Mary to redeem man, Who is the new Eve. Sin came through Woman, and was redeemed through woman, which is Mary who gave birth to the Redeemer, which is Jesus, saviour of the world. What are your points of arguments, what else do you need to know? Leave the Blessed ever virgin Mary, sinless and spotless. Her miraculous wonders shall forever continue.

Mary had four other sons, Joseph, James, Jude, and Simon. Because of the virgin birth, Joseph was not the father of Jesus so these were the half brothers of Jesus. The last three mentioned are not to be confused with those who were disciples of Jesus by the same name. Here are some passages where the other sons of Mary by Joseph are mentioned (Matt. 12:46; 13:55 ; Mark 6:3 ;
John 2:12; 7:3, 5, 10; Acts 1:14 ; 1 Cor. 9:5 ;
Gal. 1:19 ).

Emyogalanya:
IMAGINE HOW YOU REASON YOU MEAN FOR 12 WHOLE YEARS HE WAS JUST LOOKING AT MARY WITH EYES

We all don't reason same way my dear, that's life. My question to you is this "Is it impossible "?

HeyCorleone:
Even if she did I don't see of how much importance it is. Our focus in the Bible, and thru out History have always been on the people who made impact, not their relatives.

Then she shouldn't be called Virgin Mary. She has had dick several times. Why call her a virgin

miraclejoy:

that's your assumption , read other translation or better get a Hebrew bible.

Assumption? I have shown you the Bible from KJV which has the original text before modern day English took over for simplicity and in some areas original meaning was lost.

Investnow2017:


I have no reason to doubt you on those claims. But of all books that exist, there is only one that is inspired of God, the Creator of the Universe and the Most High over all the earth and that is the BIBLE. It is the book i can trust to tell the truth about where i am coming from, where i am in the stream if time and where i am going. A book that can interprete itself, that is the wonderful book, the Holy Scriptures, the Bible.

My brother, forget the Bible.

Look at supposedly educated Nigerians arguing over useless details based on the fable story called the Bible.

None of them are aware that Christianity is nothing but the worship of the Sun.

The 12 deciples of Jesus is the twelve signs of zodiac.

Hence, Christians day of worship is "sun's" "day" or Sunday!

It is sad indeed to see a generation of Nigerians being totally oblivious to the fact that the Bible story is 100% man made, designed to control their minds and steal their commonwealth.

Sad indeed

The simple truth is that, what ever problems you have with Catholics, you may end up dying all by yourselves. Wrong interpretations of the Bible today by so many church's pastors have caused the heresy. They lie for people to be deceived. Too bad...

Nauttyprof:


Matthew 1:25 clearly tells us that the Virginity of Mary ended after the birth of Christ

Since she started fucking upandan after Jesus birth, why do people call her Virgin Mary

Syncan:




You are just going in circles. The use of brethren for relatives is indisputable in scripture, secondly I have already shown the mother of those mentioned from scriptures. I repeat, no where in scripture will you find it those people called "Children of Mary", NO WHERE.

I never said Joseph had any other Children before Jesus, don't know where you got that from. Those people mentioned are children of Cleopas, some theologians say he is a brother to Joseph. Scripture didn't say exactly who he was, but must be a relation.

You talk of Joseph voicing out complain, well he was planning on how to send Mary home, have you forgotten? There's so much speculations in your post, let us stick to what is revealed.

We would not go into all this if you stuck to what is revealed. What is revealed is clear: Mary had other children after giving birth to Jesus. Matthew chapter 1:25 clearly says that Joseph marriage to Mary continued after the birth of Jesus.

Remember that when Mary was bethrothed to Joseph they had no knowlwdge what was going to transpire. They got on with the intention to consummate the marriage afterwards.

You are giving the impression that leaves Joseph out of the equation. Can you tell me please: why was Mary engaged to Joseph to marry. So they wanted to marry and not have children? Was that a common practice among the Jews?

Joseph had intercourse with Mary as his own wife after the birth of Jesus. That is the revealed truth. Stick with it.

There is no room for assumption. Luke called Elizabeth cousin of Mary; that historian could have simply referred to Elizabeth as sister and yet he did not.

Joseph's complaint that you referred to was not like I NEVER WANTED TO HAVE A CHILD WHY DID MARY BECOME PREGNANT? His complaint was that he had never had intercourse with Mary why would she get pregnant? That incident was to show that Mary was pure, a virgin while courting Joseph. But her virginity ended, according to Matthew chapter 1:25 when she had Jesus and her marriage to Joseph continued.

MARY NEVER REMAINED A VIRGIN AFTER THE BIRTH OF JESUS, THE SAVIOUR OF THE WORLD.

Nauttyprof:


Assumptions again. The Bible stated what was clear for anyone to read.

Matthew 1:25 talked about future sexual intercourse after the birth of Christ. So, there was no assumption to the first bold texts. The virginity of Mary ended after the birth of Christ.

In all, the Bible remains the sole authority.

Someone quoted the bible for you to read and you call it assumptions that he should quote the scriptures. That is called prejudice.

Emyogalanya:
IMAGINE HOW YOU REASON YOU MEAN FOR 12 WHOLE YEARS HE WAS JUST LOOKING AT MARY WITH EYES

So you think the womb where the Holies of Holies, the Lord of Host dwelt would not be consecrated for God alone

miraclejoy:

mat1:25 said 'But he had no sexual relations with her before she gave birth to her son son. Joseph named him Jesus'

So tell me where bible said she had intercourse with Joseph.

Remember Ezekiel prophecy Ezekiel 44:2

How is Ezekiel chapter 44:2 related to Mary being wife of Joseph? Or are you saying that she did not continue to be Joseph's wife after giving birth to Jesus?

Mt 1:25 And he knew her not till she brought forth her firstborn son: and he called his name JESUS.

Simply means Jesus conception was not by man. It means that Joseph was not the biological father of Jesus for emphasis sake

brainpulse:
They had their children after God used them as vessels.

Or a carpenter after working for a whole day, we see his wife and will not want to have intercourse with her or you are saying Joseph was a mastubator

Hmmmmmmmmm what a confused religion